Post Nephilim Black Templars - State of the Chapter 2022

[Tokugawa]

BT received some buff in new patches, though not as huge as Necrons or DG. 

 

New CP system made batallion gold, and BT already playing that way. Less starting CP means less "luxury" relic/WLTs on characters, but Helbrecht and Grimaldus(he doesn't give ridiculus 12VPs in assassination secondary now) don't need additional CP investment. There are still some missions need you having units out of your deployment zone to generate CP, so 1 forward deploying unit is a must. 

 

Almost all the factions have exclusive secondaries rewritten, and these are not "up to 1" now. "Allow Not the Worship of Unclean Idols" now scored at end of our own turn, with CORE and chaplain models, which turn it into a playable secondary from joke.  

 

On points cost, no big changes for BT. Primaris crusaders now have free power sword and fists, which made them the best 10men/10+men troops unit of all marines. The question is still "whether taking 10+ men unit in troops slots"?

Edited July 31, 2022 by Brother Adelard

[Medjugorje]

I think everything you said is true to 100 percent. I think in competitve games at least 2 crusadersquads and Helbrecht + Grimaldus are MUST TAKES.

What really makes me angry is that GW decided to reduce points for so much units for SoB and Sanguard altough they are one of the best factions out there and Sword brethren in the far lower ranks are overlooked completely. Our crusadersquad was better then our SB. I really dont get GW.

 

Allow not the worshop of unclean is strong now. Because we do just have Core units and chaplains in our army... and we need just 3 times to achieve and we have 12 points.

Thats great. 

[Tokugawa]

12 minutes ago, MEDJU said:

I think everything you said is true to 100 percent. I think in competitve games at least 2 crusadersquads and Helbrecht + Grimaldus are MUST TAKES.

What really makes me angry is that GW decided to reduce points for so much units for SoB and Sanguard altough they are one of the best factions out there and Sword brethren in the far lower ranks are overlooked completely. Our crusadersquad was better then our SB. I really dont get GW.

 

Allow not the worshop of unclean is strong now. Because we do just have Core units and chaplains in our army... and we need just 3 times to achieve and we have 12 points.

Thats great. 

 Sword Brethren should have all the non-hammer melee weapon upgrades for free. New CSM chosen has it for free, now DG plague marine even have things like flail for free. 

[Medjugorje]

I dont know if that would be the best solution for sword brethren because everybody who build them with chainwords would be .... you know.

 

I think they should give them additional rules. 

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

They are are fine as is but free power weapons would be great. Chainswords aren’t that great versus AoC now.

[Medjugorje]

but a better weapon should be more expensive. How should people feel when they build chainswords on them but they have no benefit. Not even that they are cheaper.

 

SB should cost 19 points. They trade their specialrule + 1 attack + weapon options VS Troopchoice + Obsec

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

They are a great fluff unit for sure .

[Tokugawa]

CP becoming more expensive meaning our points-purchased relic bearer upgrades more valueable. Since indirect fire weapons nerf and AoC, opponents have much lower chance to remove your Eradicator/Inceptor unit in early game. I think Crux could be passed to melee units now. Is champion of feast still worth its cost?

[Medjugorje]

its one CP for +1 to hit and +1 attack all the time and one wound

[Sete]

On 6/25/2022 at 1:10 AM, Tokugawa said:

Primaris crusaders now have free power sword and fists

Can the initiate use the Power Sword or just the Sword Bro? 

(I have been away from the hobby since November due to my new neophyte) 

[SkimaskMohawk]

I played a game on Sunday against a friend's WS list he made to ring for a tournament, though it was for nachmund so it was pretty in optimized.

I took oath, banners, bathe your blade. List was the two named characters, Tannhauser chaplain, chief apothecary, thss terminators, double redemptor, attack bike, and two units of assault Centurions with hurricanes and flamers. And assault intercessors for troops.

Uh, AoC felt strong on the units when combat doctrines didn't cancel them out. Helbrecht got punked by an invictor, but the lone Centurion seargent solod the other one. Terminators got the charge on his unit of terminators turn 2 (Grimaldus run, triple push, canticle of hate) and then rolled through his support characters the next turn. Basically sealed the deal, and it was called at 54-12.

Centurions hitting at -5 are annoying for anyone hoping for AoC to provide durability.  Getting them in cover is also a frustrating experience for ranged attacks. The special characters help take pressure off the warlord traits and stuff, but between champion of the feast and an extra trait or two you can still expect to start the game with 1 or 2 CP.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Sword is just for bro.

[Tokugawa]

Just read the copy. "Allow not" give you 2VP per object, not 4VP per turn.  It is just an arguably weaker "shock tactics". 

[Medjugorje]

our secoundaries has improved. But they were the worst of any faction in the game and now they are just "not good".

[Knight of Maccrage]

On 6/29/2022 at 5:51 PM, Tokugawa said:

Just read the copy. "Allow not" give you 2VP per object, not 4VP per turn.  It is just an arguably weaker "shock tactics". 

That was my take as well. I didn't really see why you would take it over shock tactics. Maybe there's some scenario where the cap matters? But you'd need to take 3 objectives from the opponent. 

 

I'm just planning on using 'bathe'

[Medjugorje]

23 hours ago, Knight of Maccrage said:

That was my take as well. I didn't really see why you would take it over shock tactics. Maybe there's some scenario where the cap matters? But you'd need to take 3 objectives from the opponent. 

 

I'm just planning on using 'bathe'

against some opponents which play more defensive its harder to get their objectives each round. So you have to overwhelm them in 2 rounds - then (when played well) you can get 6 VP for 3 markers. 

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I typically took:

Oath of the Moment

Assassinate

Engage on All Fronts

 

Now I’m liking Shock Assault. As long as we have access to good secondaries fairly easy to score that’s all that really matters.

 

Edited July 2, 2022 by Black Blow Fly

[Medjugorje]

I think Assassinate/destroy vehicles/destroy other models except vehicles, characters, monsters 

 

[Marshal Mattias]

On 6/30/2022 at 1:59 PM, Medjugorje said:

they were the worst of any faction in the game and now they are just "not good".

This seems a little hyperbolic and depressing, and without any data to support it then it's just a statement of opinion - lets focus rather on constructive discussion around the latest changes.

[Tokugawa]

In this new version, if a faction can't provide faction exclusive secondaries which often be thought about and picked by its playerl, that faction is undoubtedly "weak". 

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

We can use general, faction specific (BT) or Adeptus Astartes… that’s a lot of options.

[Medjugorje]

close to all factions are struggling right now. There are just a few with extremly potent secoundaries. I think we are on the same spot as before in comparison.

Other armies need its CPs more then we do.

[Tokugawa]

Templars won a 60 players GT:

 

https://web.bestcoastpairings.com/event-placings.php?eventId=b4PQwIkVN8

[Emperor Ming]

Possible to post the list?

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

++ Battalion Detachment ++

+ Agent of the Imperium +

Inquisitor: Blade of the Ordo, Inferno pistol, Ordo Xenos, Power sword, Psyker, Stratagem: Arbiter of the Emperor's Will, Xenos - Esoteric Lore, Xenos - Psychic Veil

+ HQ +

High Marshal Helbrecht

Primaris Chaplain:
Exhortation of Rage, 6. Canticle of Hate (Aura), Chapter Command:  Master of Sanctity, Litany of Hate, Stratagem: Warlord Trait, Warlord, Wise Orator

Primaris Chaplain: 
1. Litany of Divine Protection, Litany of Hate, Rites of War, Stratagem: Hero of the Chapter

+ Troops +

Crusader Squad:
. 4x Initiate: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Boltgun, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Sword Brother: Bolt pistol, Boltgun

Crusader Squad:
. 4x Initiate: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Boltgun, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Sword Brother: Bolt pistol, Boltgun

Incursor Squad:
. 4x Incursor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades, 4x Occulus bolt carbine, 4x Paired combat blades
. Incursor Sergeant

+ Elites +

Apothecary:
Chapter Command:  Chief Apothecary, Selfless Healer, Stratagem: Hero of the Chapter, Stratagem: Relic, Teeth of Terra

Bladeguard Veteran Squad: 
Icon of Heinmann
. 2x Bladeguard Veteran: 2x Frag & Krak grenades, 2x Heavy Bolt Pistol, 2x Master-crafted power sword, 2x Storm Shield
. Bladeguard Veteran Sergeant: Heavy Bolt Pistol

Judiciar

Terminator Squad:
The Crux Obsidian
. Terminator Sergeant
. 7x Terminator w/ Chainfist: 7x Chainfist, 7x Storm bolter
. Terminator w/ Heavy Weapon: Chainfist
. . Cyclone Missile Launcher and Storm Bolter: Cyclone missile launcher
. Terminator w/ Heavy Weapon: Chainfist
. . Cyclone Missile Launcher and Storm Bolter: Cyclone missile launcher

Vanguard Veteran Squad:
Fist of Balthus, Jump Pack
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran Sergeant: Astartes Chainsword, Power fist

Vanguard Veteran Squad
 Holy Orb, Jump Pack
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Lightning Claw
. Vanguard Veteran Sergeant: Astartes Chainsword, Power sword, Stratagem: Revered Repositories, Sword of Judgement

++ Total: [103 PL, 2,000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)