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++Neurotyrant (and Neuroloids)++ We have a new unit of the week! and our first new unit of 10th. This week it's the brand new neurotyrant and his little friends. so give us your feedback! To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will the beta rules affect your list(s)? And at what points restrictions? What size unit? Will you be running multiple units? What Enhancements, Hyper Adaptations and Stratagems do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit? If so, how?- 24 replies
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Magnus the Red++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing Magnus the Red - the big bad overfiend of the Thousand Sons Legion. Clocking in at almost 500pts, this behemoth is a psychic powerhouse, however not seen on the table too often. Have you been using them in games, and how have you used them? Th Mauler fists in particular have great damage potential at D3+3, and with a move of 10", the fiend is capable of getting into combat. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Heldrake++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing theHeldrake - the speedy flyer available to CSM and Thousand Sons, this was in fashion for a while, but increasingly it seems the hell turley is no longer on the table. Have you been using them in games, and how have you used them? Th Mauler fists in particular have great damage potential at D3+3, and with a move of 10", the fiend is capable of getting into combat. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Vindicator++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing the Vindicator - not much different than the standard ordnance piece we know and love, but now with added 5++, the Vindicator brings some tough armour to the table, if you have the rerolls to make that gun reliable. Have you been using them in games, and how have you used them? Th Mauler fists in particular have great damage potential at D3+3, and with a move of 10", the fiend is capable of getting into combat. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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Good morning chaps, I'm currently replacing my old Death Guard army (played since 4th edition but did own the 3.5 codex) and I'm enjoying building the latest plague marine plastics. I'm not really sticking to the instructions as such, because the configurations therein are a little limited. I guess I'm a traditionalist in how I see my plague marines - bolters, plague knives and a few special weapons. I wanted to know about people's experience in using plague marines squads with fairly basic load-outs. I'm considering filling a battalion with the following: 10 plague marines: 2 melta guns, plague spewer, power fist, 7 bolters (strike squad) 10 plague marines: 3 plasma guns, blight launcher, 6 bolters (mid-field squad) 5 plague marines: power fist, 5 bolters (goal keeper squad) Not intended to be a full army list, but the basic core around which to build one. Are the squads listed above viable or do successful plague marine squads require those "new" close combat weapons to function in 9th edition? I've used trench fighters and virulent rounds in the limited amount of games I've played and enjoyed both strats.
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Tzaangors++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing the former key unit for most Chaos Builds, Tzaangors. Formerly a mainstay of lists for their numbers, killing power in melee and speed, we don't see them on the table at all now. We've gone from 30 strong fight again blobs of blue goats to nothing - is that because they got worse, other options got better, or both? How would you use Tzaangors in your lists? What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Daemon Prince++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing the former key unit for most Chaos Builds, the Daemon Prince. You don't see too much of this guy in Thousand Sons lists, despite being perhaps the best melee option available to us. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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Every day unveils a new boon for the dark angels - an apoc game last night, my opponents used some DWC's - as Alpha Legion, I have a lot of character assassination shenanigans, and the DWC rules allow you to ignore precision shots, strikes and the sniper rule. With 3 of the group playing DA's I need a work around - is there any way to get around it, or is the only way to kill all the companions? They can also take wargear to get an outrageous 4++ against shooting (10pts/model, I think a refractor field is 15pts for a 5++?). My first thought was lots of High S firepower - maybe a conversion beamer from 42+"away, maybe lots of breaching plasma, but then the 4++ comes into it. Is there a decent way to kill these guys to get at the juicy HQ choice, or is it best just to ignore them?
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I thought I'd kick off some tactical discussions about the new codex - tentatively under the [Hivemind] heading (to maybe make them easier to find?) to help us get the most from the codex and win more games! This topic will cover general secodnaries for Tyranids, and also their new specific secondaries - let us know what you're taking, how well it's working, and how you're building your army to maximise these secondaries. Tyranids Specific Secondaries Summary: Synaptic Insignt (Direct copy from GT: Nachmund) - No Mercy, No Respite Kill 4, 3+ wound models in your turn with synapse creatures to get 3VP, max 12. Cranial Feasting - Purge The Enemy Kill characters and unit champions in melee with tentacle face beasties Spore Nodes - Shadow Operations Perform action with a Troops Unit within 6" of opposing DZ, 4VP each time. ------------------- My thoughts: Spore Nodes: Of these, this would seem to be the easiest to complete, with the others requiring specialised units (or luck) and to kill stuff in combat. Nodes competes with things like banners, nachmund data and homers. For us, this is strictly a better homers, and reduces the ramdom roll for nachmund data. If you were doing either of these, you can probably switch to nodes and have a lot of success! Feasting - to max this you need to kill the warlord in melee, get a reroll, then kill eight (yes, eight!) other characters or unit champions - all with tentacle units/genestealers. This is a very hard ask for me - the only instance I can think of picking this over assassinate would be if my opponent was fielding MSU (10+ weak units that all need to be in buffing range) and I was running a genestealer themed army. Synaptic Insight - If you have a shedload of synapse, then this might be doable, though it's also really dependant on your opponent's army, which is the downfall. If 2W models counted, but you needed to kill more, this would be ok, but against marines, unless they're running a pure gravis army, you'll struggle to score. If you're facing a buggy list, for example, you need to kill 2 buggys get get 4 synaptic tally, which is 4VP, which is better than the 2VP you get via Bring It Down...however BID can be completed by anything. How often are your synapse creatures going to be killing large models? Maybe this will change with the new heavy venom cannon, and a psychic heavy army might do wonders here!
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Sicaran Battletank++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing The Standard Sicaran - once an amazing unit seen in many lists, it's not seen too often now - do you have one and how do you run/use it? What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Von Ryan's Leaper++ We have a new unit of the week! Another new unit, the leaper. will it be bounding across your battle lines into your foes? Share your bio information with the hive. To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will the beta rules affect your list(s)? And at what points restrictions? What size unit? Will you be running multiple units? What Enhancements, Hyper Adaptations and Stratagems do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit? If so, how?
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Leviathan Dreadnought++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing Leviathan Dreadnoughts. A bit weaker than they were at the start of 8th where they seemed to dominate the game, these big beasties are still pretty strong. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Rapier Carrier++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing Rapier Carriers - these mini heavy weapons platforms pack a punch way beyon their size, and as ARCANA ASTARTES get a 5+ invulnerable save with us. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Rhino++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing Rhinos. Seen in all editions of the game, with varying usefulness, Thousand Sons Rhinos are maybe the best of the bunch with an innate 5++ and ability to get 2x inferno combi bolters, putting out 8 shots at range - almost the same as a small squad of Rubrics. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Land Raider++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing Land Raiders - formerly the most powerful tank in the game, feared by all and rarely used due to their points cost, Land Raiders are rarely seen as other things are so much bigger and scarier these days. 4 Lascannons and the ability to transport are things the Thousand Sons need, however, so how would you get the most from these, if at all? What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++FW Heavy Support++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week it's a bit different. We're too small a community to really discuss all these options individually without spamming the forum with 1-2 post topics, so lets take all the lesser-sed/owned options together and have a holistic discussion about Forge World/Imperial Armour Heavy Support choices in general, then we can split anything appropriate off into it's own topic. Please use this space to discuss the following units: FW Chaos Land Raider Achilles, FW Chaos Land Raider Proteus, FW Chaos Sicaran Punisher, FW Chaos Sicaran Venator, FW Chaos Vindicator Laser Destroyer, FW Chaos Whirlwind Scorpius, FW Chaos Deimos Predator What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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Right up you 'orible lot You know the drill! What do they do? What's good, what's bad, and how do we get the best out of the bottle janglers?!?
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Chaos Contemptor Dreadnought++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing the mainstay of many tournament lists for the past year, the contemptor dreadnought. We mainly saw this with dual volkite culverins, but how would you use yours? What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Malanthrope++ We have a new unit of the week! Having already discussed all units in the standard codex, we're moving on to Forge World datasheets. This week it's the big floaty poison gas-bag, the malanthrope. In early 8th ed, this beast was a must-take, giving -1 to hit on everything within 6 inches, being Synapse, a cheap HQ with CHARACTER protection and giving army wide rerolls, all for under 100pts, however brought essentially zero killing power to the table, being exclusively a support unit. Since then, he's been almost doubled in points, and will now cost you about the same as an unequipped Hive Tyrant, and as such has altogether disappeared from tables. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use it? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will the beta rules affect your list(s)? What size unit? Will you be running multiple units? What Hive Fleet Traits, Adaptative Physiologies and Stratagems do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit? If so, how? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play Over to you. Tyranids Unit of the Week Index
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++Dimacheron++ We have a new unit of the week! Having already discussed all units in the standard codex, we're moving on to Forge World datasheets. This week it's the early 9th edition hotness the Dimacheron. With good movement, quasi jump infantry, good melee and an invun, with the ability to gain a 5+++ this big beast has seen a lot of activity of late, however may have fallen out of favour due to the recent points increase. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use it? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will the beta rules affect your list(s)? What size unit? Will you be running multiple units? What Hive Fleet Traits, Adaptative Physiologies and Stratagems do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit? If so, how? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play Over to you. Tyranids Unit of the Week Index
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++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week++ ++Infernal Master++ New codex, new discussions about units! As we already have in other faction sections, this is the Thousand Sons Unit of the Week series, where each week we select and dissect a datasheet found in the book, and discuss how we use the unit in-game, favoured loadouts and combos, essentially how to use these units best. What have you found that works, and what doesnt? Please try to stick to the idea of making the unit in question work, as opposed to pointing out other units that might do a better job - we'll get to those in time! This week, we will be discussing the newest unit in the codex, the Infernal Master - sorcerers that make dark pacts with daemons, summoning them in battle to harass their enemies, support their allies and tell them of events yet to happen, these guys have some serious potential in game. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use the unit? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will you be running multiples? What <GREAT CULT>, loadouts, spell relic and Stratagem support do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit, and if so, how? Are you building as a damage dealer or buff-provider? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play How have they fared for you in-game? Over to you. ++Thousand Sons Unit of the Week Index Link++
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++Tyranid Prime++ We have a new unit of the week! Having already discussed all codex and Forge World datasheets, we're working our way back throgh some of them. This week it's the Tyranid Prime. Previously discussed under the same topic as the Tyranid Warriors, the Prime is sufficiently distinct enough to deserve its' own topic. What are you thoughts, and how best would you use them? To compliment a list, or to build a list around? Will the beta rules affect your list(s)? What size unit? Will you be running multiple units? What Hive Fleet Traits, Adaptative Physiologies and Stratagems do you prefer and how much does it depend on the above choices? Are you buffing this unit? If so, how? Uses in Matched, Narrative and Open Play Over to you. Tyranids Unit of the Week Index
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So I feel compelled to make this topic, and I'm a bit surprised I haven't really seen it yet. While I do enjoy my Ultramarines, my longest standing army going back decades is my chaos collection. In playing my Ultramarines it's been a continual tug of war between enjoying the benefits of the new rules, while shaking my head in dismay at what we (chaos) have had released over the last 3 months. I came to the conclusion that things aren't going to change any time soon for Chaos. We had a warning when GW clearly stated... this is not a new Chaos codex, it's meant to be a compilation of the relevant data sheets. So be that as it may, we have to come up with some clever, hard hitting ways of fighting back. I truly don't feel we're anywhere near on equal footing, but even so I do think we have certain advantages to leverage. Perhaps one of the biggest of these advantages is the amount of "Infantry" I'm seeing for Space Marines. I think Chaos is good at killing infantry overall. I know that's going to get heavily skewed with Iron Hands which I believe will be one of the easiest 'go to' armies for competitive play. And in that case we'll see a lot of Leviathans, and survivable vehicles that can really take a beating. I'm starting to think we need to reduce the quality of shooting, and increase the volume of it. Most of the 'good' infantry is multiwound. Intercessors, White Scar bikers, Ultra Aggressors, Centurions, etc, etc. The vehicles? I think we need to focus on Mortal Wounds. Plenty of them. I anticipate (fingers crossed) that Psychic Awakening will give us greater leverage into that area but for now we have to assume we'll be relying on smite. Unit wise: I just bought two more boxes of Havocs. I still have fun with the Oblits, but the Havocs are a better buy in my opinion. They're easier to hide, and to duplicate. They move faster, and aren't nearly as expensive. I still am relying heavily on Chaincannons. For Vehicles. I really don't know right now. I'd like input. I have recently pulled all my (3) Lord Discordants. They've been dying so easily lately, and I can't seem to get real mileage out of them, but they are a fistfull of great attacks against the right units.... Vehicles. Is this the best solution? What are you guys thinking as far as keeping up with the loyalists?
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This tactica is intended to give a broad overview to a Guard army, things like approach, structure and overarching strategies and tactics to employ and think about. It will not deal with specific tactics, wargear, lists etc - aiming instead to look at the larger picture. As such neither will it delve into rules which should give it use in 7th Edition and beyond. Author's Note This is not a master class by any means, nor is it the only way of doing things - just mine. You'll hopefully be reading quite a bit and learning nothing new, what I am aiming to do is outline what I have learnt over many years of relevant interests and experiences. By trying to break this down into the smallest parts I wish to help new recruits find their footing and hopefully give some fellow grizzled veterans a new angle to consider. Like Guilliman's tome in the Codex Astartes this is a living document so I welcome any additions or clarifications you may have. Index Imperialis The Emperor's Hammer - How the Guard works List Construction - What makes a good list? List Concepts - Strategies for tactics Metagaming - Metas and their impact Agency - Your opponent's influence Playing the Game - Tips and advice Closing - No examples! Index Auxilia Enemy Unit Types - Vash
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So I haven't had a chance to play against a pure Custodes army... in truth I only see one local player trying them that way, and the rest seem to be content making them allies with other armies. That's no surprise, but it's worth mentioning that it appears out of the gate Custodes are probably not seeing single faction competitive/semi-competitive play. I started thinking about making GK lists that would tackle Custodes best. For the sake of argument let's say we are talking mono-Gk vs. mono-Custodes. On the surface GK provide the 'magic bullet' against the mono-Custodes army... that being mortal wounds, and psychic powers. But I think it goes beyond that: - So we have psychic might. Unless the Custodes are exceptionally lucky using the odd trick in the codex, pretty much anything is going through. This helps with mobility against an army that has very little board coverage so something like Gate becomes more valuable here. - Mobility. GK have a lot of inherent deep strike. Usually we're struggling to keep something on the ground to make lists legit. On the ground we have a few choices with inherent speed where the Custodes seem to be heavily relying on bikes. Their bikes are amazing, and super cost effective, but that's the core of mobility plus their own flavour of termies. - Durability. I think to be fair the Custodes have it here... hands down. The numbers aren't going to be numerous for either force, and less so for the Custodes but at T5, plus the legion trait of basically a 4++ is nice. However in a lot of cases I will argue it can be negated, or not a factor. But it definitely helps, and I'd have to say there's probably not a lot of debate on this point. - Shooting. I think overall, and looking at unit options, the GK actually have more flexibility here. I think the stock shooting on the Strike is adequate, and you have some flexibility in the dreads, and definitely the Flyers. (I think a lot of GK players get a little caught up in elite units and Stormtalons / Stormravens are still decent choices). This essentially means GK -should- have the advantage in 'softening' up the opponent from range. Especially combined with deep strike positioning. So that leaves the Custodes specialization: - Close Combat. 8th is really weird for CC in my opinion. The more I engage in it, the more finicky it becomes... characters can be left in the cold, and interrupting can make a multi combat absolute hell for the player initiating it. With point 1 we could argue Thousand Sons could really excel there as well, but there is the problem of Close combat. I would suggest that GK force weapons are murderous on multi-wound, specialized units. I find the force weapons really come into their own here, whereas facing cultists, orks, etc, then they can feel frustrating. Of course Custodes hit like a gold brick, but in 8th it's really about the charge and I'd argue a lot of GK units can and do severely threaten the livelihood of any Custodes that get charged. Character wise Gk are no slouch here either. I mean I personally love Voldus for fluff reasons as well as game play, but Draigo is a beast, and we know how strong the Brother-Captain Dreadnights are. Let's be fair, almost 100% of soup lists that cherry pick GK take THIS unit. Do you think that wold change with Custodes? Perhaps a character on a bike, surrounded with Custodes bikes (detachment) will be the norm but for the sake of this argument, I don't know enough about all the choices Custodes have, but I still think GK have some of the most fierce, infantry based, characters in the game. I started to realize out of all the armies I play perhaps GK would present the biggest threat to Custodes.... What do you guys think?
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