Rumors Some new 10th edition insight, take with a grain of salt.

[spessmarine]

58 minutes ago, Nephaston said:

It could also be someone having a laugh, because it seems to me just the right balance of ridiculous and plausible.

apparently it is from /tg/ so fistful of salt doesn't even begin to cover it
hopefully fake because nids already seemed like their redesign was a nod to the zerg, don't need to make it so blatant with the Norn-Maleceptrix idea

Edited February 9, 2023 by spessmarine

[BrainFireBob]

6 hours ago, Interrogator Stobz said:

Yep same here. Very disappointed.

 

You really don't need T if you have multiple W.

If I can reliably drop a 500kg steer with a bolt action rifle I can drop an unarmoured Astartes with two decent hits (one to each heart or lung etc.).

There is no normal scenario where normal 1 wound infantry can survive to fight after one 'proper' hit with even standard earth weapons (the exception being there are heroes that walk amongst us ofc. They have multiple Wounds they don't not get hurt). A glance/finger off/meat only hit counts as a miss, which is included in the hit roll. Granularity in toughness is not needed for them.

This is why Kill Team is so intuitively awesome, it lets Wounds show how Tough/Resilient something is, only armour and cover stops damage occurring.

Astartes etc. with their granular 2 Wounds can keep fighting after taking a normally lethal hit from a D1 weapon like my metaphorical bolt action/Lasgun, but will die/be incapacitated to a heavier weapon hit like they should. Only his armour should make that less, so AP definitely needs a look at as discussed at length by many here and in RL.

 

Good luck to GW with that OFC; without an index level rewite all the stats being in the dexes makes that hard as hell. Probably why this part of the rumour is most likely debunked.

That doesn't represent the difference between a multimelta (large heat blast) and a flashlight.

 

The guy firing it isn't any better with aiming (to hit roll), but the possibility of a meat shot or lost finger is reduced with the multimelta- it's too large of a blast , if it hits at all, it's far more likely to do something. 

 

Spiking wounds to incorporate toughness reduces the ability for small arms to outright kill things.

 

I'm not saying that T is perfect, but it does represent something meaningful not represented by To Hit or Wounds. 

[-DonCorleone-]

1 hour ago, ThePenitentOne said:

If those Tyranid rumours are true, I'm worried about all the models I can't afford disappearing. Like if the Maleceptor 2.0 replaces the existing Maleceptor, that's gonna suck, because I love that model... And since I'm not planning on playing 10th, I want the Maleceptor to continue to be available- I bought the 9th ed Tyranid dex so that I can build a 9th ed army in another 5 years or so when I can afford it... But by then, the models I need to do that may not even exist. 

 

 

I doubt that the ranges from the 2014 refresh will get replaced. I think only Termagants, Hormagaunts, Genestealers, Carnifexes, Lictor, Biovore, Pyrovore are likely to get updates. Although, I could see Gargoyles get an update with more weapon options.  Raveners could see an update, but realistically I see GW just adding numbers to the sprue and reboxing them, as they are still very good models.

[Nephaston]

26 minutes ago, spessmarine said:

apparently it is from /tg/ so fistful of salt doesn't even begin to cover it
hopefully fake because nids already seemed like their redesign was a nod to the zerg, don't need to make it so blatant with the Norn-Maleceptrix idea

A good planetoid of salt then. Though admittedly the Instigators at least sound plausible if one imagines them as mini Tor Garadons to the Aggressors Mini Calgars.

[Harleqvin]

On 2/8/2023 at 9:45 AM, TheMawr said:

 

Everything that contradicts is very easily explained by being both true though.

 

Actually the only thing vague/contradicting imho is that they make it sound as if the Lion is a 10th edition release, while still calling AoO 5: the Lion.. thats an extremely unlikely situation. But its not clear wether that is meant how its written.

It's not entirely out of the realm of possibility for them to make a book giving a bunch of lore not having the datasheet/rules for the model everyone is thinking is going to drop with it. Especially if it ends up being true that the next month the new edition hits and invalidates all army books before the new edition with new Indexes.

[BeatTheBeat]

50 minutes ago, spessmarine said:

apparently it is from /tg/ so fistful of salt doesn't even begin to cover it
hopefully fake because nids already seemed like their redesign was a nod to the zerg, don't need to make it so blatant with the Norn-Maleceptrix idea

…you do know that Zerg are based off Nids originally right?

[Lemondish]

1 minute ago, BeatTheBeat said:

…you do know that Zerg are based off Nids originally right?

I personally hear brain bug and think starship troopers, so hopefully that's exactly what's coming lol

[DesuVult]

One part of the leaks keeps bugging me, it says the overlord is smaller than a thunderhawk but in the novels it is bigger.

[spessmarine]

6 minutes ago, BeatTheBeat said:

…you do know that Zerg are based off Nids originally right?

I dunno
 

old nids were like this weren't they, crotch mouths and all
zerg look like they had more in common with starship troopers from the get-go

 

[Orange Knight]

That list of units seems too good to be true.

 

Primaris Jump Marines, Scouts and Terminators in one fell swoop. The other units sound exciting also.

 

I hope that it's real of course.

[Mogger351]

Any idea if it's the same people who brought us the WE info?

[Burni]

Too much detail on too many different things. Lists like this are always fake/wish lists. There’ll be a post in a few days from someone saying they made it up.

 

There’s plenty on the list I want but I just don’t see it happening. 

[MARK0SIAN]

Assault marines with bolter gauntlets? Isn’t that just inceptors? 

[Mogger351]

Just now, MARK0SIAN said:

Assault marines with bolter gauntlets? Isn’t that just inceptors? 

I imagine them not being in gravis, smaller jump pack and being armed with basically pistols, whereas inceptors are bigger, bulkier and have a heavier gun.

 

Ofc it might all be made up.

[Captain Idaho]

It would be one hell of a boxed set if that were true... 

[Matrindur]

Quote

-THREE NEW BIG MONSTER KITS (They say that most Nid players like their big monsters)

Why would they name every unit and weapon but then only say three big monsters here? That sounds like "I can't think of any more names so I'll just write big monsters"

Edited February 9, 2023 by Matrindur

[Special Officer Doofy]

1 hour ago, BeatTheBeat said:

…you do know that Zerg are based off Nids originally right?

 

Nope, based off star ship troopers and the movies alien and aliens. They even quote aliens in starcraft "in the pipe, five by five". There are interviews with blizzard employees that go over things like this. Everyone in the hobby thinks anything remotely 40k is based off 40k. So much of the population here in the US have no idea what 40k even is. Everything in 40k is based on something else as well, and most things that seem based on 40k are more than likely based on the same source material that 40k borrowed from.

 

Just look at your 90s (second edition) tyranids. They look silly and not threatning. Plus most tyranids use weapons, like swords and guns back then. Starship trooper aliens, aliens from the alien movies and zerg (from starcraft 1, never played the second) don't use silly weapons, almost exclusively claws and talons with the occasional spit or butt cannon.

Edited February 9, 2023 by Special Officer Doofy

[MARK0SIAN]

42 minutes ago, Mogger351 said:

I imagine them not being in gravis, smaller jump pack and being armed with basically pistols, whereas inceptors are bigger, bulkier and have a heavier gun.

 

Ofc it might all be made up.

Yeah, it just seems too similar though, essentially two dudes flying around wielding dual pistol type weapons. 
 

All I want for Primaris Assault marines is basically regular assault intercessors with jump packs. In fact if they just sold the jump packs as an upgrade sprue I’d be happy.

[Orange Knight]

21 minutes ago, MARK0SIAN said:

Yeah, it just seems too similar though, essentially two dudes flying around wielding dual pistol type weapons. 
 

All I want for Primaris Assault marines is basically regular assault intercessors with jump packs. In fact if they just sold the jump packs as an upgrade sprue I’d be happy.

 

It could be more similar to the bolter on the Sanguinary Guard. They have a regular power armour gauntles with a bolter attachment. 

 

It does make sense for a high mobility flying unit. You'd need the use of at least one hand.

[Nephaston]

25 minutes ago, MARK0SIAN said:

Yeah, it just seems too similar though, essentially two dudes flying around wielding dual pistol type weapons. 
 

All I want for Primaris Assault marines is basically regular assault intercessors with jump packs. In fact if they just sold the jump packs as an upgrade sprue I’d be happy.

For jump assault we already know how they'll look, unless either GW or Saber forgot.

 

[Cyrox]

My guess is the the Jump pack marines will look the same as Titus in the Space Marine 2 game, just without the Lieutenant bling.

 

GW like that kind of continuity across their IP 

 

Example of Jump Pack at 2:00

 

 

[Interrogator Stobz]

3 hours ago, BrainFireBob said:

That doesn't represent the difference between a multimelta (large heat blast) and a flashlight.

 

The guy firing it isn't any better with aiming (to hit roll), but the possibility of a meat shot or lost finger is reduced with the multimelta- it's too large of a blast , if it hits at all, it's far more likely to do something. 

 

Spiking wounds to incorporate toughness reduces the ability for small arms to outright kill things.

 

I'm not saying that T is perfect, but it does represent something meaningful not represented by To Hit or Wounds. 

Yeah, it actually does represent the difference. And I really hope that the rumour hasn't been debunked.

So, here goes my theory of why it could logically be introduced:

 

Unless you're a multi wound critter because you have two hearts etc. both weapons will kill you the same dead if they hit.

 

A superficial hit is merely that, it's a miss, regardless of weapon strength. Melta beams nick the same as bullets.

 

Once a substantial hit, that bypasses armour is scored, then damage is the only important factor.

Both small arms and special weapons are strong enough to wound everything humanish sized, even Primaris skin can't stop a rifle round, even knives cut them.

Humans, Post humans, Orks, Eldar, Small Nids, etc all will go down to a rifle hit or two once their armour is defeated. None are tough enough to ignore a substantial hit.

Toughness is irrelevant for the above examples.

Now Large and Monstrous critters, Vehicles and some very esoteric beings etc have both enough 'meat' in the form of wounds to soak up more damage, and in some cases be immune to some damage, hence the T stat remains for them in this rumour.

 

Harking back to and using your example for a second; the MM does enough damage to kill both a normal target and a multi-wound 'tough' guy; whereas a small arms weapon needs two or more hits for the bigger stuff. That makes the MM better, much better.

Toughness/resilience for normal human sized troops is best measured by how many Wounds a mini has, which is a direct measurement of their ability to continue to fight after losing a limb or huge important chunk of torso.

 

There would be no need to spike Wounds much if at all for 40k. Kill Team is a game of minis, it needs multiple wounds per mini to represent resilience/toughness (they still die fast too); 40k is a game of units, each has multiple minis to represent resilience; and Apoc is a game of detachments, it has multiple units to represent resilience. A unit of 10 Astartes in 40k has 20 Wounds that even a rifle will easily achieve and only their armour keeps them safe from damage, even knives kill Astartes. They are tough because they have two wounds, not because they are bulletproof. 

 

The Toughness stat was really important before multi wounds were a thing, but now it's redundant for many many units.

[Interrogator Stobz]

2 hours ago, Captain Idaho said:

It would be one hell of a boxed set if that were true... 

 

It completes the Primaris range takeover from FB units.

Makes sense and may even be related to the 'new way Marine books are coming out'.

Could support a separation theory.

[Blindhamster]

1 hour ago, Special Officer Doofy said:

 

Nope, based off star ship troopers and the movies alien and aliens. They even quote aliens in starcraft "in the pipe, five by five". There are interviews with blizzard employees that go over things like this. Everyone in the hobby thinks anything remotely 40k is based off 40k. So much of the population here in the US have no idea what 40k even is. Everything in 40k is based on something else as well, and most things that seem based on 40k are more than likely based on the same source material that 40k borrowed from.

 

Just look at your 90s (second edition) tyranids. They look silly and not threatning. Plus most tyranids use weapons, like swords and guns back then. Starship trooper aliens, aliens from the alien movies and zerg (from starcraft 1, never played the second) don't use silly weapons, almost exclusively claws and talons with the occasional spit or butt cannon.

Actually, they were, original StarCraft was going to be a Warhammer 40K game when originally being developed, then things fell through, and it became it’s own thing

[Captain Idaho]

11 minutes ago, Interrogator Stobz said:

 

It completes the Primaris range takeover from FB units.

Makes sense and may even be related to the 'new way Marine books are coming out'.

Could support a separation theory.

 

Don't get my hopes up, Brother. I always wanted Sicarius and Gabriel Seth to go "rogue", rejecting the Imperial leadership but fighting to protect humanity. 

 

Hell, we could even have a Codex Renegedes that covered rules for such modern Chapter, but the narrative could range from loyalist to piratical to Huron.