OverchargeThis!

Does anyone know the rationale behind the decision to remove heavy weapons from basic line infantry squads? We've had them going to at least 3rd edition. These squad have never had much capability, but now that the heavy weapon option has been removed, they don't seem to be capable of much at all. At least with 3 squads when they had heavy weapons, you had some mass going down range. I usually took lascannons in my squads, with autocannons going into my heavy weapons teams. Now they're just useful for holding objectives and move blocking. I suppose it can be said they're forcing a move to elite infantry (kasrkin and scions) to get some capability on the table.

The youtuber was pretty good. However, the analysis was flawed. The Demolisher had MM sponsons and the Vanquisher had HB sponsons. They should both have been configured for anti-armor (MM sponsons on both) for the analysis to be more meaningful.

15 with creed in the back field on an objective giving orders. You get the additional order, vox, and extra ablative wounds. One valid use-case.

Any issues keeping those heavy weapon teams alive? Surprised to see no scions and just one kasrkin squad. I believe the current iteration of guard gets rid of heavy weapons in standard squad. Huge loss/big mistake. What were they thinking? Thanks for posting this. Helps out alot.

That's a lot of basic infantry. What other infantry do you use, and what does that overall list look like? Sounds like the 15-man squad, while an interesting exercise in possibilities, does not work in practice. Based on yours and the post above, it seems there are use cases for 10 man and 25-man squads, but not 15. Thanks!

Do you bother with giving basic line infantry orders (besides maybe the move/move/move or the one that gives +1 OC)? Asking because my lists all have a command squad or character in a chimera, primarily as a means to give orders while reasonably well-protected. That might be waste of points.

GDS, what role do you give to your basic line infantry? Does your infantry-based combat power tend to be focused into Kasrkin/Scions?

waha-pedia has updated the Astra Militarum with information from the new codex. Looks to me like the Krieg are the best basic infantry, based on their squad leaders being able to take power weapon/plasma pistol, having a medic, and a few other things. Looking at combined squads, however, I like what Cadians can do. If you combine a 10-man Cadian squad with a 5-man Cadian Command Squad, you can build it this way, as one example, for 130 points: 2 models with power fist and plasma pistol 2 plasma gun 1 melta gun The command squad will have a medic that can restore D3 non-officer platoon models per turn. The unit gets sticky objectives and cover to ranged fire if within range of an objective. NOTE: Not sure if the medic's ability extends to the rest of the combined squad. It specifies platoon command squad, but things tend to apply to whatever units a character is attached to. I don't see any sense in taking a 25-man platoon given the limited options Cadian sergeants have. The extra veteran that can be configured for melee makes up for the Cadian sergeant's limited equipage. The unit can benefit from an order each turn, in fact can provide one to other units if they're within range. The question is, is it worth it for 130 points. The lists I've built put a command squad in a chimera and line squads on foot. Command squad typically shoots two special weapons through the top of the chimera and gives an order. It's 150 points for a dual heavy flamer chimera and a command squad with 2 PG and 1 officer with power fist and plasma pistol. I can make that work for 150. But for 20 points less, I get the combined 15-man unit. Thoughts?

Thanks for the comments. Reinforcements stratagem sounds good. I thought they FAQ'd that it can only be used once per game. Perhaps this has changed in the new codex. I'm surprised GW nerfed HW Teams to the point of unusable. They were fine in regular squads. HW Teams are fine offensively, but lack survivability. I would have made them 3 wounds and 4+ saves (as the crews are behind the 'mass' of the weapons, giving them some protection). As mentioned, I replaced 3 HW Teams with a Vanquisher. All good I suppose. When I get my two tauroxes and another Russ done, I will try out the list.

Born Soldiers, or whatever it will be called in the new codex. Lethal hits on 6's.

I'm looking for comments on this list. Haven't played since 5th edition, and looking to get back into the hobby. I still need to purchase two tauroxes and a Leman Russ, but I have everything else. Here's the list. Comments follow. 2000 Point IG List 1 Ursula Creed (65) 1 Chimera (2 HF, 1 HS, 1 ATGM) (85) 1 5-man Tempestus Command Squad (1 Tempestor Prime PP, 1 Volley Gun, 1 PG, 1 MG, 1 Medic) (75) 3 10-man Infantry Squads (1 PG, 1 MG) (195) 1 10-man Infantry Squad (1 PG, 1 GL) (65) 2 Kasrkin Squads (Sgt with PW + PP, 2 PG, 2 MG, 5 Troopers) (220) 2 Tauroxes (Twin AC + SB) (130) 1 Field Ordinance Battery (2 LC) (100) 1 10-man Scion Squad (1 PF + PP, 2 MG, 2 PG, 5 Troopers) (130) 2 Leman Russ Executioner (Executioner Cannon, LC, 2 PC, Heavy Stubber, ATGM) (340) 2 Leman Russ Vanquisher (Vanquisher Cannon, LC, 2 PC, Heavy Stubber, ATGM) (290) 1 Rogal Dorn Tank Commander – Grand Strategist (Oppressor Cannon, Co-Axial AC, 3 Heavy Stubbers, 2 MM, 1 Castigator Cannon, ATGM) (280) 76 Infantry, 1 FoB, 8 Vehicles Total 1975 Creed and the Cadian Squad with PG/GL are in the chimera giving orders. I want to actually use the cadian infantry as much as possible, but they are movement blocking/objective holders primarily. Tempestus Command Squad and Scion Squad are joined and will deep strike. Kasrkins IMO fight better than Scions. They will try to defeat-in-detail threats (objective is to get local fire superiority to remove threats), combined with the scions, positioning the vehicles to block fire and make charges into them more difficult. The field ordinance battery once was part of a heavy weapons group that included 3 autocannon heavy weapons teams. But it occurred to me that I could get a second vanquisher for the cost of the heavy weapon teams, so I dropped them. They, the Dorn, and the Vanquishers can handle vehicle/monstrous creature threats well enough. The executioners... I took one of these in 5th edition when they were 245 points each. Worth it. Now they will be dual-use units whose main gun functions like the Redemptor's plasma gun. Very good against heavy infantry with a secondary anti-armor role. I have plasma cannons all over the vehicles. This and the two plasma executioner turrets are also there to bring down orc hordes. No overcharging required. They will also be good against those T6 3 wound marine infantry units (forget their names) and Terminators. I find lasguns and hotshot lasguns to be very good when combined with orders, so they are useful supplementary fire units. I have enough orders to give infantry but can only give vehicles three orders per turn. I find that to be a little short, but I don't think it's a fatal oversight. Comments welcome. Mind you, this is all theoretical. I was a competitive player from 3rd through 5th edition. I've been watching battle reports since 8th edition and painting again since about 2021, after a 10-year+ hiatus from the hobby. very happy to hear comments from casual as well as competitive players. I view this as a competitive list... Edit: I wish I had more Cadian squads. I think I'm light on infantry...

It looks like I will have to use the pauldron that came with the plastic kit. The resin arm looks like it has a bump on the end that is intended to fit into a hole in the side of the terminator armor. I removed the bump on the terminator torso and put a hole in at the same location, the fitted the arm on. It was too low. It's recoverable, but i will have to pull it out, redrill, and re-attach. Just a warning to everyone who intends to use this kit. I suggest you test-fit one and get the pauldron on, making sure its high enough to match the other arm. Then do the rest. I would rate this kit, given its sizing, as poor. Just FYI.

Sorry to keep hammering away at this thread, but has anyone noticed that the forge world arm and pauldron look small compared to the other arm? Is it just me? Did a get a mis-sized cast? I actually ordered two kits. They are both the same size. the pauldron looks much smaller than the one that comes with the box. Thanks.

Thanks again. Info has been very useful.

Thank you, Cadmus. Do you think chain fists are worth it? Thanks for the tip regarding the thunder hammer/power axe conversion. I may add lightning claws to two terminators and a T-Hammer to the sergeant. Please let me know your thoughts on chain fists.