=][= Codex: Adeptus Mechanicus =][=

[Brother Tyler]

srry to revive an old post but i was thinking.... why not make a petition for gw to make a new codex? failing that i think your on the right track. i would actually collect a A.M. force.

Recent discussion on this in the rumors section has indicated that GW is interested in the AdMech, but that they doubt that they'll be released by GW "proper" since there isn't room for them in the product line. We might see Forge World release AdMech stuff, though.

[death_incarnite]

Im pretty new to a m but i just wanted to throw some ideas out there for people to think about, first off one thing i noticed is i always here about the techmarines offering "enhancements to their fellow troops, so imagine a ig veteran squad that got some robotic eyes that added +1 bs, another thing is that i always here about this ancient technology that they have uncovered... well lets see it and another thing though is that from what i had heard about the tech guard they ssem like marine grade abilities but with something like carapace armour. once again though just throwing out ideas.

[Lord Norman]

There is a WIP A.M. codex in the works at thecodexproject.com. Check it out.

[rpnightsend]

So is this thread going to turn into a full rules development like codex unforgiven or the 13th company project? or will we just use existing codexes?

[Brother Tyler]

Okay, this project has been dead for some time, but I'm going to incorporate it into another project.

 

I'll be doing this in two ways:

 

First, I'd like to see suggestions on how existing codices can be used to represent an Adeptus Mechanicus army. There are already a number of suggestions, both in this discussion and elsewhere. The release of 6th edition may have changed the dynamics somewhat, however, so I'm interested in a re-look at all of the suggestions to see what has changed and how.

 

Second, I'm going to create an unofficial Adeptus Mechanicus codex (from whole cloth) that is compatible with 6th edition. I'm sure that it will largely be based upon Mr. Hucklebery's work, but we might update it a bit (we'll need some flyers, after all :D ).

 

And the larger project will be covered in another discussion.

[Skoby]

Personally I find Grey Knights to be the best match as a stand alone codex, specifically Corteaz lists. Henchmen warbands are great for representing retinues for tech adepts and magi. Warrior Acolytes and death cult assasins are both great value pointswise and despite the changes for power weapons can still be very effective. I will be running acolytes with bolters or storm bolters keeping them cheap and effective as the main bulk of my skitarii. I believe I've read somewhere that the AdMech have their own assassins but if you don't like that idea enhanced skitarii focused on close combat roles fits well. Jokaero make good artificers, servitors are an obvious choice, crusaders can be another specialised skitarii bodyguards, flagellants work fairly well as they are or as electropriests and demonhosts work well as skitarii with advanced or experimental bionics. The remainder (banisher, mystic and psyker) I'm not using and cant personally see a justification for but could work for more radical lists.

 

Outside of the henchmen you've got a few obvious choices, inquisitors and techmarines to count as magi and can both take some very exotic and effective wargear (rad grenades and psychotroke grenades seem great, conversion beamers can be great and all are an option to both, you can also take some interesting gear on inquisitors such as the plasma syphon). Assasins, dreadnoughts, storm ravens, land raiders and dreadknights all have their uses in a list and need no real justification. Personally I don't like the idea of including any actual grey knight units which does exclude about half the codex from use but I feel the options left give us more than enough variety.

 

Now the one big drawback with the grey knights is if you want to use allies since you can never get battle brothers, even so I think guard make one good option for allies giving even cheaper men (as tech-guard/light skitarii whilst the henchmen are personal retinue or veteran skitarii which goes some way to explaining why the two might not mix) and gives you access to valkyries/vendettas and tank squadren, but I'm sure someone can explain it better than I can as I've only really flicked through a store copy of the guard codex. The route I will be taking is allying with marines (iron hands), this allows some interesting combinations to compliment the grey knights codex and gives tougher troops and more vehicle options. From a marines perspective they get some very good value light troops and access to cheap power weapons.

[Cmdr Shepard]

As I said in another topic I'm very interested in this project especially in finding a way to field an AM based on an existing Codex. Since I'd like to build a "legal" army to be used in any gaming event this is the best choice for me.

 

GK may not be the perfect choice for an Adeptus Mechanicus army. They are, of course, one of the most technologically advanced Chapter of the Adeptus Astartes but they lack the "mechanized glory" of the Omnissiah. :)

One of the most relevant aspect of an Adeptus Mechanicus force is, in my opinion, the presence of the very technolgy they produce on their Forge World. This means most vehicles and weapons not available to C:GK.

When I think about AM I imagine powerful "war machines". Inquisitorial henchmen are just a surrogate. Warrior Acolytes are far from Skitarii and the other models don't "capture" the "might of the Mechanicus".

 

Regarding the war machines I think the best choice to represent AM is via IG vehicles. After all those vehicles come from AM controlled Forge Worlds and they fit the Mechanicus military doctrine better than SM.

Remember AM is famous for marching to war with its Titan Legion, not for makinf pinpoint precision air drops behind enemy lines ;)

This choice will however produce a "fluff conflict". I believe BS3 is too low to represent the technological ability of AM personell not to mention that the "common" guardsmen don't possess the "enhancements" Skitarii do.

So an IG army may represent the Planetary Defense Forces of a Forge World or a World with a close relationship with AM. They may be a addition to an Explorator Fleet.

I thought to paint the vehicles with red and using the FW Iron Hands decals to put the AM logo on them.

 

However, as I said, IG won't allow to represent Skitarii ground forces. I believe Necrons may be a valid "count as " solutions. It would explain the Skitarii bionic modifications and the reanimation protocols are just a direct consequence of their enhanced resistence. An Overloard may represent a Magos while their weaponery represents some arcane tech available only to a small circle of the Mechanicus.

So IG+Necrons may be a solution.

 

Before going further I need to know if we can discuss non Power Armour armies in this section of the forums.

[Skoby]

You raise some good points but grey knights fit my idea of ad mech closer than guard especially with a jokaero to boost them so they're more like enhanced humans. Necrons could work and I've seen others have used their rules. Looking at the rumours chaos space marines could fit with rumours including warsmiths, cultists, demon engines and better dreads. Of course its all speculation until its released but it could be a good fit. Predators, dreads, land raiders, defilers (counts as knights) and other cool vehicles from forge world give plenty of cool toys and chaos marines or even cult marines could work well as advanced skitarii and obliteraters as praetorians. If rumours are right the codex could be here as soon as next month so will have to wait and see.

[Brother Tyler]

Well, my basic view of "counts as", especially with regard to the Mechanicus Project, is that multiple codices can be used. What I envision happening is that we'll have a page or two for each codex and will demonstrate how the various units available in the codex can be used to represent an AdMech force. Each codex has strengths and weaknesses and the choice will largely depend upon what the player would like to use. No single codex will be presented as the right way to represent the AdMech.

[*Furyou Miko]

I think that the best way to do AdMech would be to use the new Allies rules to your full advantage. Combine Imperial Guard or Grey Knights with (of all things) Necrons. Lords make excellent Adepts, while Crypteks are good as Magos with their little tricks (except Harbingers of the Storm which make excellent Lumen-priests). Warriors are effectively Marines in Carapace Armour with a bit of extra anti-tank oomph, and then Immortals are now good Up-gunned MEq.

 

The most recent Tempus Fugitives AdMech dex steals a load of rules from the Necron book as it is, including their very own Death Ray analogue, so I don't think the Night/Doom Scythe are too far off the mark for advanced AdMech skimmer-fliers. Tomb Blades are flying bikes. Lychguard would be a good rule set to use for Protectors, I think, but you could use Praetorians and pretend they aren't Jump Infantry. No real use for Scarabs in an AdMech list, but...

[Skoby]

Combine Imperial Guard or Grey Knights with (of all things) Necrons.

 

Imperial Guard and Necrons are desperate allies so would have to have the "one eye open" rule and do nothing 1/6th of the time. Grey Knights are allies of convenience as are chaos. Ive had a quick look at some necron rules and I'm surprised how well they fit, Im glad they got rid of we'll be back and the phase out, the new system seems very similar to the 3rd edition bionics. There is an interesting blog on the BoLS forums of admech meets necrons, which has some great looking units and uses servo skulls as scarabs and has some neat conversions (although some models are too recognisable as necrons for my taste... not that I could do better).

[clanfield]

i use the imperial guard codex and il run grey knight allies when iv built my knight probly use the troop choices as pretorians

not perfect but what can i say hurry up forgeworld:)

[Cmdr Shepard]

Combine Imperial Guard or Grey Knights with (of all things) Necrons.

 

Imperial Guard and Necrons are desperate allies so would have to have the "one eye open" rule and do nothing 1/6th of the time. Grey Knights are allies of convenience as are chaos. Ive had a quick look at some necron rules and I'm surprised how well they fit, Im glad they got rid of we'll be back and the phase out, the new system seems very similar to the 3rd edition bionics. There is an interesting blog on the BoLS forums of admech meets necrons, which has some great looking units and uses servo skulls as scarabs and has some neat conversions (although some models are too recognisable as necrons for my taste... not that I could do better).

 

I strongly believe Necrons are one the best the choices. IG is perfect for the vehicles and to represent the "Planetary Defense Force" of a Forge World. As you mentioned they are desperate allies. Keeping them at more than 6" to avoid the "check" is not difficult but the allied detachment's troops cannot score. If you already have a lot of scoring unit it may not be a problem, though.

 

My suggestion is two different armies: IG represents your Forge World Planetary Forces, or some military unit who joined an explorator fleet while Necrons represent your Army of the Omnissiah.

Now you can add GK as allies to represent some sort of different/special tech.

 

I think that the best way to do AdMech would be to use the new Allies rules to your full advantage. Combine Imperial Guard or Grey Knights with (of all things) Necrons. Lords make excellent Adepts, while Crypteks are good as Magos with their little tricks (except Harbingers of the Storm which make excellent Lumen-priests). Warriors are effectively Marines in Carapace Armour with a bit of extra anti-tank oomph, and then Immortals are now good Up-gunned MEq.

 

The most recent Tempus Fugitives AdMech dex steals a load of rules from the Necron book as it is, including their very own Death Ray analogue, so I don't think the Night/Doom Scythe are too far off the mark for advanced AdMech skimmer-fliers. Tomb Blades are flying bikes. Lychguard would be a good rule set to use for Protectors, I think, but you could use Praetorians and pretend they aren't Jump Infantry. No real use for Scarabs in an AdMech list, but...

 

There is an use for Scarab too. Consider them an advanced tech for the Dark Age of Technology designed to fight armored targets. I used Servo Skulls on a 40mm base to represent additional Scarabs. Thise Servo Skulls has been equiped with the anti-armour tech and the move quckly on the battlefield, guided by upgraded hardware. ;)

[*Furyou Miko]

Well, I had another idea. Maybe I'm crazy and just basing this off the weird way Techmarines work in the Dark Angels book, but how about using Dark Angels with Imperial Guard allies. Two DA HQ means two techmarines, then you get the two Techpriests from the Guard book along with a command squad or commissar. Guard squadron rules means that being the allies doesn't impact their ability to bring multiple cool vehicles, while Marines can be Protectors and Terminators can be Praetorians. Plus all those freaky Dark Angel techs like the shroudspeeder thing.

[Uaronain]

 I like the plain C:SM with IG allies.  The thunderfire cannon already has a techmarine and it could be used as the ad-mech thud gun. The C:SM also has the master of the forge w/conversion beamer or without who can have servators. With just the plain C:SM dex you have acess to up to 8 techmarines (overkill i know)  

Between Sternguard, vanguard vets, termies, dev squads, heavy weapon teams, rough riders, bikers etc you have a wide range of units to mix and match for an ad mech list while staying pure to the Imperium tech wise without going all weird with GK.

[miteyheroes]

Chaos Space Marines with Ork allies.

 

Chaos Space Marines have a techmarine-equivalent as an HQ option, or you can go for some sort of enhanced super-warrior (lord), or even a massive war machine (daemon prince), or so on.

Then you've got Hellbrutes to count as Robots in Elites, and Forgefiends/Maulerfiends/Defilers to count as larger Robots or Knight Titans or Stalk Tanks in Heavy Support.

Troops are Mechanicus Protectors - either plain CSMs, or something more exciting like Plague Marines or Thousand Sons.

Alternatively, you can have some sort of Skitarii-types using Cultist rules.

 

Then come the allies...

Orks again have a techpriest-equivalent HQ, the Big Mek.

Their Heavy Support gives you even more robots, either Deth Dreads or squadrons of 3 Killa Kans.

Their Troops give you feral skitarii, of the sort seen in Titanicus, using Ork Boy rules.

[Cmdr Shepard]

Hold on, fellow Tech Adepts. I read this month WD has a pic of a WIP Thallax model. That means the release of the model is not very far away. So everyone who want a "pure" AdMech army could play the Mechanicum army list from HH Betrayal and I'm sure we'll see a lot of new AdMech units/models as the FW HH series evolves.

[*Furyou Miko]

Did it look anything like these?

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v205/KaguraHakubi/IK%20and%2040K/My%20Projects/Thallaxi_zps79b181cf.jpg

[Cmdr Shepard]

I already saw you conversions Miko and they are nice. I think you will be able to use them even when FW will release the actual models. If you are curious to know if model from WD looks like yours you can find the pic by typing "Thallax White Dwarf" in google in click on the images button ;). You should find it in few seconds... I think it's still a "testing model", though...

[*Furyou Miko]

Oh gods Omnissiah that's so pretty...

[Cmdr Shepard]

Oh gods Omnissiah that's so pretty...

 

It's quite interesting... I hope it will not cost as much as 5 Terminators, though ;)

[*Furyou Miko]

Probably will. But touch wood I'll have money by then.

[Malach Adonai]

Gotta get me some of those Thallax models when they are put out on the site for sale.

I'm currently building a AdMech force and decided on the CSM codex. Cultists as basic Skitarii, CSM as Myrmidon units, 5 man Noisemarine squads with blastmaster for Myrmidon heavy units with archaeotech weapons, oblits as cybernetica constructs, and a few heavily converted forgefiends. Got about 1000p so far, and want to get a few more things for this list before adding the obligatory guard allies. Really looking forward to testing it on the battlefield.

I guess the biggest problem I have with using guard lists is A) You'll have to get a ridiculus amount of models, which can be expensive and time-consuming when you convert them or buy from Microarts, Blightwheel etc. B) They have few viable options to portray Myrmidon, Preatorians and all the other fun bastards the Mechanicus like to use, like the feral Skitarii we see in Titanicus.

[Uaronain]

It is not as expensive as you may think. I have a list of bits sites that will allow me to make custom tech guard plus a lil green stuff moulds and tentacle makers makes it a lot easier to customize your units. As a long time Templar player my zeal level is too high to ever use foul chaos or xenos crap

[dogfender]

I am recently thinking of adding some allied necrons to a gk admech list. The only issue is the necron transport doesn't really work with the imperium vehicles. That and the fact that unless I take coteaz I cant have a lot of basic skitarii troops, just a lot of specialized count as ad mech troops.

 

The reason why I like necrons is because of their alternative weapons that could make for some interesting ad mech tech. Once I can get over the design hurdle of how I want my skitarii to look I guess I can worry about the list. I am heavily leaning towards flagellant bodies, but again skitarii are suposed to be 'better geared' than guardsmen, seems odd they would cover up their gear with robes...