Chaos Math

[Gold Raven]

I'd posted a lengthy bit on numerology in the 'Missing Legions' thread. I'll duplicate the post below.

 

Well, I'm not as familiar with the Chaos powers as other readers and players might be, so what I'd like to do is start the ball rolling on a thread about the math of Chaos. As an example, I'm reading 'Flight of the Eisenstein' right now and have made a couple of observations so far regarding the number 7. Nurgle's number.

 

Death Guard is the 14th legion, 14 being 7x2.

Mortarion's personal bodygaurd (2 of them) are required to stay within 49 paces of him at all times. 49 is 7 squared.

 

1. Dark Angels. Some Fallen, some not. 1 is a fairly unspectacular number, so there's not a lot to do here.

2. ??? First Prime Number. Factor of exactly half of all numbers.

3. Emperor's Children. Chaos, specifically Slaanesh who's number is 6. 3 is half of 6.

4. Iron Warriors. Chaos. 4 is the first 'square' number and the second non-prime number.

5. White Scars. Prime number.

6. Space Wolves. While loyalist, 6 is the number of Slaanesh.

7. Imperial Fists. Prime Number, also the number of Nurgle.

8. Night Lords. Chaos. 8 is both Khorne's number and the points in the symbol of Chaos. 8 is 2^3

9. Blood Angels. Loyalist. 9 is the number of Tzeentch. 3^2.

10. Iron Hands. Loyalist. First double-digit number in the Arabic numerals. Has prime factors 5 and 2.

11. ??? First prime number past 10. 11 has no factors below it, and is not a factor of any number between 12 and 20.

12. World Eaters. Chaos, Khorne, who's number is 8. I can't find a simple relationship between 8 and 12, though.

13. Ultramarines. Loyalist. 13 is the sum of the missing legions 2+11.

14. Death Guard. Chaos, Nurgle, who's number is 7. 7x2 is 14. 7^2 is 49, which is the number of paces within which Mortarion's personal bodyguard (2 of them) must stay.

15. Thousand Sons. Chaos, Tzeentch, who's number is 9. 9 and 15 are not related by any immediate simple mathematic operation. But then, Tzeentch doesn't follow rules like that. Has prime factors 3 and 5.

16. Luna Wolves/Sons of Horus/Black Legion. Chaos. 16 is the highest binary number in the range of numbers 1 to 20, specifically 2^2^2. Also 2^4, with 4 being the number of Chaos gods.

17. Word Bearers. Chaos. Prime number.

18. Salamanders. Loyalist. 18 is 2x9(Tzeentch), but also 3x6(Khorne). Has prime factors 2 and 3.

19. Raven Guard. Loyalist. Last prime number in the set.

20. Alpha Legion. Chaos. Alpha is first, 20 is last. 20 has 2 and 5 as prime factors. 20 is 4x5, the number of undivided legions multiplied by the number of god-specific legions.

 

Its really interesting to see how the numbers play out.

 

Primes: 2, 3, 5, 7, 11, 13, 17, and 19. Of those, 2 are Chaos, 2 are unknown, and 4 are loyalist.

 

2. Every Chaos legion (except 1K Sons, Word Bearers) is related to the number 2, as well as the respective Chaos numbers. 3 is half of 6. 4 is 2 squared. 8 is 2 cubed. 12 is 6 doubled. 14 is 7 doubled. 16 is 2 to the fourth power. 20 is 2 with a zero added on. 15 and 17 are the only Chaos Legions not related to the number 2. Loyalist legions that have a relation to 2 or a Chaos number include 6, 7, 9, and 18. Of those, 6 and 9 (half) have notorious geneseed abnormalities. Additionally, all of the binary numbers between 1 and 20 (2,4,8, and 16) with the exception of 2 are Chaos Undivided. Word bearers number is technically the sum of 2^3 and 3^2, but that's a bit of a stretch.

 

3. Of those numbers that are a multiple of 3, exactly half are loyalist and half are Chaos.

 

5. Of those numbers that are a multiple of 5, exactly half are loyalist and half are Chaos.

 

7. 7 is loyalist, 14 is Chaos. Again, exactly half.

 

Numbers with Square Roots: 2 are Chaos, 1 is loyalist. The Chaos are, surprise surprise, both multiples of 2.

 

Numbers that are square roots: 1 unknown, 2 Chaos.

 

The sole number that makes absolutely no sense is 15, but then the Lord of Change is prone to playing outside of the established rules.

 

I've also noted that the 13th founding was the 'Black' founding, and that the 21st founding was a cursed founding. 13 is 6+7, and 21 is 6+7+8. So would anyone hazard to guess that something bad might happen after the 30th founding (6+7+8+9)?

 

So if you've noticed the use of numbers anywhere in relation to Chaos or the individual ruinous powers, I'd really like to hear about it. I haven't read my way through so much material yet.

[blamb]

4. Iron Warriors. Chaos. 4 is the first 'square' number and the second non-prime number.

second square. 1x1=1

[Sawtooth]

Nice :P

 

Also of note, the number 7 is considered holy, even perfect, in several religions. Does this makes the Imperial Fists the holiest legion? I think so :lol:

[Gold Raven]

4. Iron Warriors. Chaos. 4 is the first 'square' number and the second non-prime number.

second square. 1x1=1

 

You're right, second square. Second... there's that number 2 again acting as the Chaos enabler.

 

Nice :confused:

 

Also of note, the number 7 is considered holy, even perfect, in several religions. Does this makes the Imperial Fists the holiest legion? I think so ^_^

 

Yes, that's true. In an octal based numbering system 7 is the highest digit number. 8 in octal would be 10. Its the same value, just represented in a different way. The octal system has considerable bearing on music (from which the term 'Octave' originates) and architecture. And aren't the Imperial Fists the grandest of all military architechts?

[Terminator Tomatron]

I'd posted a lengthy bit on numerology in the 'Missing Legions' thread. I'll duplicate the post below.

 

Well, I'm not as familiar with the Chaos powers as other readers and players might be, so what I'd like to do is start the ball rolling on a thread about the math of Chaos. As an example, I'm reading 'Flight of the Eisenstein' right now and have made a couple of observations so far regarding the number 7. Nurgle's number.

 

Death Guard is the 14th legion, 14 being 7x2.

Mortarion's personal bodygaurd (2 of them) are required to stay within 49 paces of him at all times. 49 is 7 squared.

 

 

so the death guard were pretty boned from the start then really :unsure:

[Varath- Lord Impaler]

....=42

[Gold Raven]

....=42

 

If you must know, 42 would be Slaanesh crossed with Nurgle: 6x7. Its also 3+4+5+6+7+8+9.

[Sarael]

1 is a prime number. You can divide 1 by 1 to get a whole number (1). 0 is not prime for some reason, ask your college math teacher.

 

So, 2 is the second prime, and 2 * 2 = 4, the 2nd square...

 

And 2 turtle doves would kick the partridge out of the pear tree...

 

Something's fishy in the Eye of Terror... :P

[Gold Raven]

1 is a prime number. You can divide 1 by 1 to get a whole number (1). 0 is not prime for some reason, ask your college math teacher.

 

So, 2 is the second prime, and 2 * 2 = 4, the 2nd square...

 

And 2 turtle doves would kick the partridge out of the pear tree...

 

Something's fishy in the Eye of Terror... -_-

 

My college professors always said that 1 wasn't prime because it has a square root. 0 isn't prime because it isn't positive.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_numbers

 

Dark Angels, who are #1, present an interesting case. Here we have a Legion with elements that turned to Chaos, but the Primarch stayed loyal. However, there aren't many ways to apply the 'chaos enabler' (if that is what 2 does) to the number 1, unless we simply divide it into basic halves. 1/2 loyal, 1/2 Chaos. But we already know that the division isn't perfectly in half.

[blamb]

My college professors always said that 1 wasn't prime because it has a square root

You're college professors musn't be very smat than.

A prime number is something that can only be divided by 1 and itself. if you divide 1 by itself you get 1. if you divide 1 by 1 you get itself. 1 is a prime number.

[Wildfire]

....=42

 

6 x 9

[davidren2401]

8. Night Lords. Chaos. 8 is both Khorne's number and the points in the symbol of Chaos. 8 is 2^3

 

In the original chaos fluff (slaves to darkness) the Nigh Lords were Khorne's legion instead of the World Eaters.

[Brother_Soulrot]

For some reason, the combination of mathematics and extradimensional forces of evil in this thread reminds me strongly of John Carpenter's Prince of Darkness. Obscure film references aside, isn't it a bit of co-incidence that 42 is the meaning of life in Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy? Maybe the GW team are Douglas Adams fans or something.

[Gold Raven]

In the original chaos fluff (slaves to darkness) the Nigh Lords were Khorne's legion instead of the World Eaters.

 

Good information. Interesting to note that of all the Chaos numbers, only Khorne's number of 8 is an actual Chaos legion.

[Mutt-Man!]

I hate to do this but...

 

1161837

LEBI911

 

911 spun 180 is 116, 11 minutes and 6 seconds is 666 total seconds, 9/11 tragedy linked to 666.

18 multiplied by 37 is 666.

1161837 Seven numbers, seven sins.

LEBI911 - numbers spun upside-down. A person named Lebi born on 9/11 is the antichrist.

 

An old theory, I came across the 18 multiplied by 37, (18 terminators with MoCU 18x37=666) Means 6 'Reapers' were avalible, with the chaos lord, the 7 dark ones, 6 reapers and the 'chaos' lord. Seems maybe it was accidental, but who knows.

 

The Lebi9/11 thing was just a way to consume my time in utter boredom.

[Gold Raven]

An old theory, I came across the 18 multiplied by 37, (18 terminators with MoCU 18x37=666) Means 6 'Reapers' were avalible, with the chaos lord, the 7 dark ones, 6 reapers and the 'chaos' lord. Seems maybe it was accidental, but who knows.

 

The funny thing about 666 though is that it is based upon a passage in the book of Revalation. Most modern translations that use the decimal system portray the number as '666'. However no one knows what language John saw when he wrote the numbers. Did he see a series of repeating symbols, each one representing 6 individually, or did he see an actual numerical value. For instance, 666 in Roman numerals (very common at the time) would be DCLXVI. 666 as an octal number would be 832. But even in octal, a set of simple repeating symbols individually valued at 6 would still be 6-6-6. 666 as repeated roman numerals would be VI-VI-VI.

 

I may take some time later this week to check some of the roman numerals I've seen in Space Marine art.

[red rob]

intriguing thread Gold Raven. keep up the good work

[Inquisitor Kravin]

You're college professors musn't be very smat than.

 

I wouldn't normally pick on people for things like this but since you're throwing around accusations of not being smart your use of "You're" when you mean "Your" is actually quite ironic! :teehee:

 

As to the question of one being a prime or not there's no definitive answer either way. In some contexts it could be treated as a prime element but for practical consistency the general rule when I studied maths was that a "prime number" had two distinct factors.

 

On the subject of 666. There was also apparently a Hebrew alpha-numeric cypher in which 6 = w so 666 = www which has led some to believe that in using the web as we are right now we are a part of "the Beast".

[Brother_Soulrot]

I wouldn't normally pick on people for things like this but since you're throwing around accusations of not being smart your use of "You're" when you mean "Your" is actually quite ironic! :pinch:

That is an English error and not a Math error though. A Math error would have been more ironic in this particular thread.

[Gold Raven]

Well, I rifled through C:SM today and found lots of Roman Numerals. Unfortunately most of them were in reference to squad number rather than anything else. I also checked the LBB, but the artwork was too small to make much out.

 

Would anyone with C:CSM, the BBB, or the individual chapter Codices run through the art for me? Just looking for Roman Numerals. Access to older artwork would also be greatly appreciated.

[MeatGrinder]

One is not a prime number, it can't be

 

a prime number is a number whos only factors are itself and one, therefore 1 is not prime as it only have one factor = 1

[TheDarkApostle]

3. Emperor's Children. Chaos, specifically Slaanesh who's number is 6. 3 is half of 6.

By the way, isn't the number 3 supposed to be the perfect number? Think I read it somewhere, can't remember though.

[Gold Raven]

By the way, isn't the number 3 supposed to be the perfect number? Think I read it somewhere, can't remember though.

 

I've never heard of 3 being 'perfect', but it is the number of the trinity. I'd imagine that Fulgrim saw himself, Horus, and the Emperor as a trinity of sorts. The three of them above everyone else.

[Warden of the Rock]

Ok thanks to you guys, I now have a headache.

[Inquisitor Kravin]

By the way, isn't the number 3 supposed to be the perfect number? Think I read it somewhere, can't remember though.

 

I've never heard of 3 being 'perfect', but it is the number of the trinity. I'd imagine that Fulgrim saw himself, Horus, and the Emperor as a trinity of sorts. The three of them above everyone else.

 

Should I be excited or worried then that my birthday is 03/03?! Perhaps it's why I felt the temptation recently to start collecting Emperor's Children.