Maladon Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 Okay from what I've been reading about the 5th edition rumoured rules on Force weapons, if I read them right(which I doubt) that a MoS Sorceror with lash and a jump pack is going to be a nasty character.... basically its now giving blissgiver to a lash character....ouch and limburger! Hell even Tzeentch sorcerors are going to be nasty in 5th edition. Thoughts or rants or not wanted flames or trolling. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nicolas Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 What is this rumor? I have yet to see any change in the Force Weapon rule from any rumor section or any pdf that I have seen, what it looks to me is that it is just a clearer version and in the main rules of the weapon instead of each person codex. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1521988 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 Okay from what I've been reading about the 5th edition rumoured rules on Force weapons, if I read them right(which I doubt) that a MoS Sorceror with lash and a jump pack is going to be a nasty character.... basically its now giving blissgiver to a lash character....ouch and limburger! Hell even Tzeentch sorcerors are going to be nasty in 5th edition. Thoughts or rants or not wanted flames or trolling. what you never thought a Lash sorceror ruled all already? :lol: but anyhow, i think an Independent character like that is going to be great in next edition. sure they can be targetted, but not if hidden behind/inside a unit. to be honest, while everyone and their dog dislikes "hero-hammer", i actually like a powerful character rampaging through and army. its fun to see! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522016 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 You neglected to say how the force weop will be any different in 5th ed. then it is now. So I don't know what to rant, flame and troll about :tu: . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522047 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maladon Posted March 18, 2008 Author Share Posted March 18, 2008 You neglected to say how the force weop will be any different in 5th ed. then it is now. So I don't know what to rant, flame and troll about :tu: . Well way I heard it(haven't seen it since nobody's sharing) force weapons are instant kill weapons without taking a psychic test to do so, basically blissgiver without the random number of attacks! No does anyone actually have the PDF that can confirm or debunk the rumour I heard? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522050 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maeklos Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 What I'd heard was that Force Weapons no longer exist in that grey area outside of insta-kill weapons and firmly have the Instant Death rule, which makes models that are immune to Instant Death now immune to Force Weapons. But from what I understand, you still have to test for the power to work. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522057 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soulmage Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 What I'd heard was that Force Weapons no longer exist in that grey area outside of insta-kill weapons and firmly have the Instant Death rule, which makes models that are immune to Instant Death now immune to Force Weapons. But from what I understand, you still have to test for the power to work. That's what I've heard as well. Unfortunately, the best use I've ever had for a force weapon is killing a tooled up Daemon Prince. Now that force weapons are being considered "instant kill" IMO it renders them pretty worthless. Yeay yeah, there are other things you COULD use them against. . . but in hundreds of games in 3rd and 4th edition, I've generally only seen it work against tooled chaos characters and an occasional night bringer. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522066 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 from what i read, the PDF states Instant Death and a force weapon to be one and the same. thats going to be a rule in the rules. now if we take a look at Force Weapons, they inflict instant death on a model with more than 1 wound on a successful Psychic test. therefore it wont be automatic, but still pretty good against most models. however, things immune to instant death would therefore be immune to all its forms. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522077 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maeklos Posted March 18, 2008 Share Posted March 18, 2008 however, things immune to instant death would therefore be immune to all its forms. And that's kind of the problem. Things that could do with a Force Weapon to the head (daemon princes, carnifeces, etc) are usually Immune to Instant Death....rendering Force Weapons useless. Which means that your next best target for a Force Weapon are going to be the "medium-big guy"....SM Chapter Masters, IG Heroic Senior Officers, Autarchs, etc. And rather than popping the points for a Force Weapon, you're almost just as good going with a power weapon or - even better - a lightning claw. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522088 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 I don't know that a force weop was actually ever ment to be different then insta-kill. I think it might have just been worded differently. So it's possible that they are making it they way they always ment it to be. As for not being worth taking, if the upcoming s/m dex follows the chaos dex then librarians will get a FW for "free" and not have an option for other weops. In most situtations it is the same as a PW but sometimes you might get the benefit of insta-kill, so I guess that makes it slightly better then a PW. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522210 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Umm...yeah.... Force weapons are not different other than their added disability. >_< Theyre worse in 5th ed. now. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522214 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfalypse Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Actually there is very little change from what the weapon did before to what its going to do in fifth for most sorcerers. Insta kill vs auto death thats a downer in my opinion, the psychic power section of 4th said that you can only use one power a turn unless otherwise stated so its not like you can lash and then use the force weapon so no change there. You have to remember there are alot of things that are pretty much immune to insta death. Tyranid for example, guard just dont have enough two wound models usually for it to matter, and a hood can block the force weapon attempt along with the eldar anti psy power stuff. Where the force weapon is gonna rock is on a tzeentch sorcerer with warptime, they are going to be able to reroll hits/wounds and then use the force weapon if needed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522264 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitadelArmyGuy Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Which means that your next best target for a Force Weapon are going to be the "medium-big guy"....SM Chapter Masters, IG Heroic Senior Officers, Autarchs, etc. Umm...yeah....Force weapons are not different other than their added disability. >_< Theyre worse in 5th ed. now. Quite succinct. Honestly if the new Space Marine codex comes out sans Adamantine Mantles, then I would almost argue that the rewording for Force Weapons was an anti-Space Marine ploy to get newer players to branch out into other armies-- Space Marines are notoriously un-protected against Instant Death and while each new codex that comes out features more and more Instant Death immune beasties/HQs, the notable exception is Space Marines in all their variations. The nerfing of power-fists will help on the other hand, so I suppose I'm not upset or flagging this for complaint: merely observing the fact Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522278 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaos strong Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 You neglected to say how the force weop will be any different in 5th ed. then it is now. So I don't know what to rant, flame and troll about . Well way I heard it(haven't seen it since nobody's sharing) force weapons are instant kill weapons without taking a psychic test to do so, basically blissgiver without the random number of attacks! No does anyone actually have the PDF that can confirm or debunk the rumour I heard? LMAO, this might be one of the funniest rumors i have EVER heard Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522319 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Humongous Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Funny? From what I've seen (which is that same PDF I'm sure anybody who cares to can get at this point) its pretty accurate rumor. The playtested force weapon rules make it slightly weaker (it only affects one wounded target, and only after a psychic test) than the Blissgiver but probably cheaper points wise (though hard to compare). however, things immune to instant death would therefore be immune to all its forms. And that's kind of the problem. Things that could do with a Force Weapon to the head (daemon princes, carnifeces, etc) are usually Immune to Instant Death....rendering Force Weapons useless. Which means that your next best target for a Force Weapon are going to be the "medium-big guy"....SM Chapter Masters, IG Heroic Senior Officers, Autarchs, etc. And rather than popping the points for a Force Weapon, you're almost just as good going with a power weapon or - even better - a lightning claw. Force weapons seem to be fairly cheap in the new chaos codex. I'd put their cost at 15-20 points, tops, though its rather hard to make a direct comparison. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522914 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaos strong Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 There will still be psychic tests for force weapon, its just going to have the instant kill ability, THERE WILL BE A PSYCHIC TEST FOR IT. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1522921 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Humongous Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Ah, yes. Yeah, the quote you boxed is just wrong- so wrong that I must have mentally corrected it. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/132086-force-weapons-in-5th-edition/#findComment-1523193 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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