Chaplain Erasmus Posted April 6, 2008 Share Posted April 6, 2008 Ever since the new Chaos codex came out, I've seen a resurgence of Raptors in people's Chaos lists. Now, I don't think Raptors are a bad unit at all, but I'm puzzled by this sudden resurgence, firstly, because in the old codex, Raptors never tended to feature so much, and secondly, because the Raptors in the current codex aren't NEARLY as good as they were in the old one (Hit and run being the awesome rule that it was). I'm no Chaos player, so clearly I'm missing something.... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khestra the Unbeheld Posted April 6, 2008 Share Posted April 6, 2008 Given the options available, it's either semi-cheap upgradable Raptors or not-so-cheap upgradable Bikes. Chaos gets hammered in the Fast Attack department. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1536942 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tfcdogbert Posted April 6, 2008 Share Posted April 6, 2008 They are cheap, have lots of mobility, are highly upgradeable and effective, lethal on the charge, get lots of shiny options cheap meltas and flamers and the speed to get them where they will hurt. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1537007 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nihm Posted April 6, 2008 Share Posted April 6, 2008 Ever since the new Chaos codex came out, I've seen a resurgence of Raptors in people's Chaos lists. Now, I don't think Raptors are a bad unit at all, but I'm puzzled by this sudden resurgence, firstly, because in the old codex, Raptors never tended to feature so much, and secondly, because the Raptors in the current codex aren't NEARLY as good as they were in the old one (Hit and run being the awesome rule that it was). I'm no Chaos player, so clearly I'm missing something.... Did you take the lower price into account ?They now cost 9 points less per model and are no longer restricted, so the 'Legions' can now field them as well - under Codex: Spiky Marines. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1537016 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cale Posted April 6, 2008 Share Posted April 6, 2008 They're just like Assault Marines but two points cheaper. They don't have ATSKNF, but they do have one higher leadership. In addition, they can take Meltas, which is awesome. The new raptors no longer pay too much for a pair of neat, but ultimately insufficient abilities. Now they are nuch cheaper and just about as effective as they were before. Raptors should be more popular now than they were. They're just better. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1537189 Share on other sites More sharing options...
OverchargeThis! Posted April 6, 2008 Share Posted April 6, 2008 10 guys with PF a melta and a flamer, led by a character with LClaws is a very fast-hitting, capable, cost-effective unit. With MoK, the hit has hard as blood angel veteran assault squads. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1537210 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tfcdogbert Posted April 6, 2008 Share Posted April 6, 2008 I can testify to this, without the lightning claws but with IoK i wiped out an interrorgator chaplin with all the bells and whistles and his bodyguard of 4 men. on the charge with my unit of 9 men. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1537251 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted April 7, 2008 Share Posted April 7, 2008 well considering your unit costs more then 4 sm +chappy it would really suck[suck like well repentia or something] , if you didnt wipe a unit thats less then you . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1537687 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaos strong Posted April 7, 2008 Share Posted April 7, 2008 The deep strike then 2 meltas to a tank is also pretty damn nice. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1537697 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tfcdogbert Posted April 7, 2008 Share Posted April 7, 2008 well considering your unit costs more then 4 sm +chappy it would really suck[suck like well repentia or something] , if you didnt wipe a unit thats less then you . Nope its less, i dont have the angels codex on me, but the termies are 160 pts for 4, the interrogator chaplin is at least 100 points with terminator armour if i remember... so its a total of 260, (possibly more, depending on the armour's cost). My unit weighed in at 260 pts for Aspiring champ, fist, 8 men, Icon of Khorne, Melta and flamer. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1537755 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted April 7, 2008 Share Posted April 7, 2008 ok taking that back ,so he plays a chaplain with terminators in a DA list . considering the lack of attacks and the cost of DA termis , they do cost more . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1537795 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roultox Posted April 7, 2008 Share Posted April 7, 2008 How often can you get a unit of 20 marines 12" a turn across the field of battle? The only unit capable of doing that would be Raptors. A side note, the icons that make raptors flexible along side the two special weapons would put them on par with genestealers in some cases, perhaps even giving them an edge over most jump-pack marines would have for roughly the same cost per marine vs their comparison. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1538158 Share on other sites More sharing options...
teh_perfesser Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 They now cost 9 points less per model and are no longer restricted, so the 'Legions' can now field them as well - under Codex: Spiky Marines. -_- I'd almost spend the 9 points to get hit and run... if any unit in any codex should have hit and run it should be Raptors. Yeah, the extra Raptors you can now afford for the group probably makes up for it, but I still dislike the loss of fluff here. I guess it also helps balance the field and make bikers more attractive, but if bikers aren't attractive, shouldn't they adjust bikers rather than Raptors? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1539317 Share on other sites More sharing options...
darth_giles Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 Yeah, the extra Raptors you can now afford for the group probably makes up for it, but I still dislike the loss of fluff here. I guess it also helps balance the field and make bikers more attractive, but if bikers aren't attractive, shouldn't they adjust bikers rather than Raptors? Fluffnote- those of us who played CSMs who turned to Chaos after the heresy would've had the normal contingents of assault marines, Storm Bolter rhinos, and the like. So having 0-1 Raptors didn't exactly make sense. Just like the dreadnoughts going nuts all of a sudden- it was like when they went to chaos someone decided to dump a barrel of spiders inside each one. And how the heck are we supposed to get new Rubric marines anyway? Or is it just a case of some new host putting on the pants and having them run off with him inside them? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1539606 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khestra the Unbeheld Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 And how the heck are we supposed to get new Rubric marines anyway? Or is it just a case of some new host putting on the pants and having them run off with him inside them? That one's actually answered down in the Tzeentch forum. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1539680 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senseilord Ashahara Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 Raptors? They look cool and chicks dig them. Thats why everything else gets done. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1540002 Share on other sites More sharing options...
krispy the klown Posted April 9, 2008 Share Posted April 9, 2008 Raptors? They look cool and chicks dig them. Thats why everything else gets done. hey baby wanna go for a ride on the raptor train Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1540013 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Senseilord Ashahara Posted April 10, 2008 Share Posted April 10, 2008 well I'd have to clear it with the wife..... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1540548 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheex Posted April 11, 2008 Share Posted April 11, 2008 Why are Raptors popular? 1. Mobility is key, nowadays. If you want to get to assault, you need to do it fast. Berzerkers and footslogging CSM are simply too slow to reliably reach combat. 2. Cheaper than before, and cheaper than their Imperial counterparts. This speaks for itself. 3. They can take special weapons in addition to their BP+CCW. Hooray for a free extra attack! 4. They can be given any Icon of Chaos. One of their biggest benefits, I find, is the ability to take objectives quickly and easily. However, come v5 this may no longer be the case, since only Troops choice infantry units will be able to take objectives, so we might see a reduction in the number of Raptor-heavy armies out there. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1541387 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muskie Posted April 11, 2008 Share Posted April 11, 2008 Conversion options. Some people do stuff just because it looks cool, then they find out later if it actually works in a game. I tend to fall into that category. I got more ideas than opportunities to play and playtest. I hope to do more, but my time is always going to be limited and I should be studying right now... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1541396 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodHand Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 Of course the real beauty of it all is that they don't have to be undivided anymore. Slaaneshi Raptors rule! http://members.lycos.co.uk/crimsonpilot/RaptorChamp1.jpg Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1545633 Share on other sites More sharing options...
teh_perfesser Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 I now have a favorite Raptor model. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1545723 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrainFireBob Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 1) Adding Marks to make the unit customizeable to the army was a real boon, that more than makes up for Hit & Run (IMO). 2) Raptors were the "almost good enough to take" unit of 3.5. They were just too expensive versus their survivability. Basically, the reason no-one really takes bikes. Nice, but you need a big squad for them to work, and big squads are too expensive. You'll pay that price for termies, because they have 2+/5+ and powerweapons all around. Not for a unit that's just CSM- that can charge in addition to moving 12". Now they're affordable. 3) Well, really, you shouldn't need 3, 1 and 2 cover it. They were too expensive for their survivability before, now they're priced right- oh, and they're upgradeable with Marks? That's no-brainer. They're assault marines, but better. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1545886 Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkiraCho Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 cheaper, slightly more effective, everyone can use it, nuff said Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/133438-raptors-why-so-popular/#findComment-1545895 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.