Maladon Posted May 4, 2008 Share Posted May 4, 2008 I'm so getting tired of the constant opponents not reading people's codices at all(concerning terminators and assaulting after rapid fire weapons) and the daemon weapon debate(that seems to be endless)- Rant on and off. So would it be better to not even spend the points on a daemon weapon for chaos lords? cause of the problems with the daemon weapon and the arguements about supposing not being able to carry more than one two handed weapons? OR should I be waiting on the FAQ to see if that question is answered for me. Cause after the game I played yesterday, I'm seriously considering not using daemon weapons at all on lords. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperialis_Dominatus Posted May 4, 2008 Share Posted May 4, 2008 Oh. You're not talking about game effectiveness. If it's causing trouble... jeez. The people you play with seem to be the problem. If they can't read your Codex, as clear as the section about weapon selection and rules is, and figure out what a Daemon Weapon does and how you can use it, they need to... figure something out. My best advice would be to speak clearly and slowly, like you would with someone who didn't know English. Yell if necessary. Hand motions optional but recommended. Then again, my experiences with those kinds of people have only gotten weird looks. Might want to see who else posts. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1561819 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maladon Posted May 4, 2008 Author Share Posted May 4, 2008 What gets me, is people are under the assumption that the old 3rd edition and 4th edition armoury rules still apply and nothing in this list says it does have that limitation..... and it irratates me to no end.... And if it was illegal to use that combination it should have be writing in the sections right? :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1561848 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted May 4, 2008 Share Posted May 4, 2008 Use whatever the f@#$ you want to use, and d@#$ everyone else. All you have to do is explain: there are no 1-2 handed limits anymore, haven't been since the Eldar codex. It's not in the main rulebook; it's codex by codex. End of story. Or, just stop taking a bolt pistol, combi-bolter, and daemon weapon; drop the combi-bolter. That has to be the only thing causing problems, as there's no other way to take three weapons. If you are going to handicap your lord simply because somebody else doesn't know rules yet, then my gawd man. That'd be like me not using landspeeders because some people are still hung over from maybe 2nd or 3rd edition telling me that 1) they're open-topped, and 2) they're always visible and never have LOS blocked because they are always "flying high," and I want to avoid those arguments for the sake of game speed. They don't have to know your codex; they only have to know how it will crush them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1561920 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarkApostle Posted May 4, 2008 Share Posted May 4, 2008 Also, if it really was illegal (as I can add it's not) point out the standard Chaos Marines entry for them. Bolt Pistol, Close Combat Weapon AND a Bolter? Well, would be logical if the Lord can do the same combo, right? ;) TDA Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1561926 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavenTalon Posted May 4, 2008 Share Posted May 4, 2008 I do not own a single codex other than mine (C:SM). It is always nice to have an opponent bring their Codex with them so that we can clarify the rules together before the battle. This usually completely eliminates those troublesome in game questions where someone exclaims that "had I know that [unit x] could do [action y] I would have played it completely differently!" Do not limit yourself. Just make sure your opponent knows something like that before the game so it does not become an issue. And if your opponent does not ask, it is at least partially his fault. I always ask if there are any funky rules that a regular old Space Marine player might not know. I hope this is helpful. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1561928 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted May 5, 2008 Share Posted May 5, 2008 use whatever you want. don't let their ignorance stop you. just show them the C:CSM or something. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1562329 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nihm Posted May 5, 2008 Share Posted May 5, 2008 use whatever you want. don't let their ignorance stop you. just show them the C:CSM or something.Agreed, it is in the Codex and written plain as day, otherwise, if they want you to adhere to an old restriction that is now gone -what's going to stop you from using bonuses like the old Legion rules and vet skills? ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1562441 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maladon Posted May 5, 2008 Author Share Posted May 5, 2008 I think he was mad, my chaos lord with took out a entire deathwing squad! ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1562588 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokunator Posted May 5, 2008 Share Posted May 5, 2008 Or you could also point out that the aforementioned 2 weapons rule was never part of the basic rulebook in any edition of WH40K. It was only introduced in certain Codices (Eldar for example never had it, as only Farseers and Warlocks could choose their weapons and their entries said pick two. Nor is it in the Necron book due to utter lack of weapons options). So if it is not in your Codex, you don't have to adhere to a rule which was retarded in the first place (never heard of shoulder straps?) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1562869 Share on other sites More sharing options...
x_beowolf_x1 Posted May 5, 2008 Share Posted May 5, 2008 I agree, SHOW THEM YOUR CODEX!!!!! Seriosly, theyre probably just pissed that all of a sudden CHAOS RULES!!!! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1563041 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperialis_Dominatus Posted May 6, 2008 Share Posted May 6, 2008 Seriosly, theyre probably just pissed that all of a sudden CHAOS RULES!!!! Because our last Codex wasn't overpowered in the least. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1563076 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leethal Posted May 6, 2008 Share Posted May 6, 2008 If they are being ignorant, sarcasm is the best way to handle it. Give them that little ray of hope before you snatch it away and shove it down their throats. If they don't like your weapon choices, they should have stayed off the table :P Its not like you have 3 Sniperfexes :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1563135 Share on other sites More sharing options...
x_beowolf_x1 Posted May 6, 2008 Share Posted May 6, 2008 Seriosly, theyre probably just pissed that all of a sudden CHAOS RULES!!!! Because our last Codex wasn't overpowered in the least. yea i was just about to say that chaos has always been pretty good. But hey, we're hardcore. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1563176 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rain Posted May 6, 2008 Share Posted May 6, 2008 If anything our recent codex has nerfed us, at least if you want to play straight up undivided, or almost anything but double lash princes with plague marines, and some other cherry picked units that go together like bread and battery acid. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1563190 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maladon Posted May 6, 2008 Author Share Posted May 6, 2008 If anything our recent codex has nerfed us, at least if you want to play straight up undivided, or almost anything but double lash princes with plague marines, and some other cherry picked units that go together like bread and battery acid. No mentioning the nerf bat, in my presence! I don't want to hear it anymore. change your tactics and stop whining! Back on topic- Though the opponent in that game though my terminator squad was fearless! I laughed at that one. Also in the game, it was the first time I used possessed... I rolled a 5 on their table and it took the opponent several turns to wipe out five possessed. ^_^ Though I now considering adding another 5 more possessed to the squad. My poor berserkers lost their rhino on his turn one, simple because I forgot to move them, in my turn. but at least they immoblized a dreadnought with krak grenades... I may have lost the last several games with chaos, but I won't give up on them and sell the army off! I'm considering a second csm squad with twin plasma guns, a havoc squad box set and adding the addition lascannon havoc and autocannnon havoc that I all ready have. and possibly the overpriced(in others opinion) dreadnought to my army to rotate around and try out. Thoughts, now.. Also was using a lashed sorceror with jump pack... he died horribly blissful! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1563431 Share on other sites More sharing options...
x_beowolf_x1 Posted May 7, 2008 Share Posted May 7, 2008 Exactly where did it get "nerfed"? Other than having the legion specific rules gone, and the chaos lord armory has dissapeared, I think chaos has gotten better... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1564000 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperialis_Dominatus Posted May 7, 2008 Share Posted May 7, 2008 All our HQ choices are harder to cheese out. Oblits were moved to HS where they belong. Plus they got toned down a bit. We can't have all infiltrating armies, or tankhunting autocannons, or Vet Skills in any form, really. No more :cusspwning daemons and their Daemonbombing. Iron Warriors... Nuff said. Dreadnoughts now will likely nail you with a plasma cannon every game (if you give them one... two CCWs for the win!). Spawn are now quite useless. Possessed didn't get nerfed, since their rules weren't spectacular in the 3.5 Codex; but they didn't exactly get a boost. Just a few nerfs. Admittedly, some things did get better. But these above are what could be called nerfs. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1564010 Share on other sites More sharing options...
x_beowolf_x1 Posted May 7, 2008 Share Posted May 7, 2008 eh, just a few excuses no matter what the rules, if your truly a good tactician, i think you can get away with anything Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1564110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted May 7, 2008 Share Posted May 7, 2008 Daemonbomb is still fully in effect. My opponents hate me for dropping 25 daemons on the second and third turns, sometimes the 4th. But they love the challenge. Honestly, often my Chaos Lord doesn't even see combat. He's tooling about in a rhino with a squad, or wandering around by himself. My Word Bearers have usually completely swept the field around the 3rd or 4th, and all he has to do is wave his big daemon stick around and look menacing for a couple turns. Kinda disappointing, since I want him to actually do anything, but the games that he does usually involve a slightly harder struggle. Such as a charging Ghazkull and mob(s). Meh, 20 games in and I haven't lost with Chaos yet. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1564131 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokunator Posted May 7, 2008 Share Posted May 7, 2008 Yes, the new Codex forced me to give up my cut-price S4 Ini 4 3 attacks Cultists and my all-infiltrating Alpha Legion and instead made me play with massed units of CSMs --------- AND I AM LOVING IT! But back to topic: If your opponents moan aout your combi-bolter and daemon weapon, ask them politely to show them where in the Codex (or any other book for that matter) does it say that a combi-bolter is a two-handed weapon? As a matter of fact, I can't see how anyone in TDA could fire a combi-bolter using 2 hands. Or clap hands for that matter :-) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1564275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maladon Posted May 7, 2008 Author Share Posted May 7, 2008 His excuse is the requiring two hands on the daemon weapon itself! @Seahawk- So the lesser daemon bomb works for you then? I'm considering 20 daemons myself. I have two spawn but I have used them yet, have had opponents use spawn against me, I hates them exspecially have the occasional bad dice roll and can't kill sh*t. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1564330 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seahawk Posted May 7, 2008 Share Posted May 7, 2008 Oh yes. Going by Word Bearers fluff, it's even tactically sound to throw them at things you don't want your CSM getting there hands messy with, like genestealers, dreadnoughts, harlequins, etc. They can hold up with their fearlessness for a few turns, whittling down the enemy. Or, throw them at something weak (guardsmen and tau spring to mind) and watch them churn through like a hot knife while the opponent frantically tries to deal with 20 new friends in his back line. When I used spawn, I used them in two groups of 3 each. They slammed into IG lines and totally dominated a flank by eating like 30 guardsmen. @tokunator: use daemon rules as your crazy cultists that suddenly pop up out of hiding next to your alpha legion overlords. Now all you're missing is infiltrate... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1564364 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maladon Posted May 7, 2008 Author Share Posted May 7, 2008 Okay soo two box sets of the wirey daemons with swords it is then.... Yes, I said wirey! :P But back on topic- should I continue to use a daemon weapon or just go for the cheaper and get a power weapon for my lord? Daemon weapons are huge hit or miss, more often than not its a miss and a wound for my lord. :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1564441 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokunator Posted May 7, 2008 Share Posted May 7, 2008 @Seahawk: I am actually very happy that I was 'forced' to play loads of Marines by the new book. I am loving (I know that to love is a stative verb and the only time it can be put into the continuous is if it stands for a physical action like s.., but I still use it) having 60 Power-Armoured Guys on the table and I am not missing the Cultists at all. As a matter of fact, since they were Delaques due to the snake motive and the cloaks, they have since then become a gang of Delaques again. I'd go for any Daemon Weapon other than Khorne. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/135556-power-weapon-or-daemon-weapon/#findComment-1564706 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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