Chaos Ultra Assault Army

[Yukka]

Hi. I have been reading alot about the different options available to chaos, consulting my codex and purchasing many special weapons to equip my units as well as more marines.

 

I want to build a 2000 point army that can take on Land raider crusader heavy armies. I was considering various options an tactics and I really just need to ask some questions to get my head around some of the points not clear in my own head.

 

I am considering my main anti tank squad to be raptors, armed with melta guns. I think I would like to keep them out of the way and then jetpack them over the top of tanks to attack their rear armor. This wont be effective on land raiders but 2 melta guns in close range will be.

 

If I equip my raptors with melta guns and powerfist, can they fly 12 inches, fire both guns (and their bolters) and then assault the tank in CC? I am considering 2 squads of 5 raptors at first. 2 melters on each.

 

I am also considering placing 10 havocs in a land raider, armed with 4 meltaguns. These will be driven at the main opposing tank and they will assault from the land raider. Can the land raider move 6, then the troops disembark, fire all guns including meltas then assault into CC?

 

I also have plague marines. I read that these do not benefit from assaulting as much as they did previously and are better placed holding back than charging in. I can equip them with flamer/melta gun combos for this task or would they be better either left behind or given more meltas or plasma?

 

I have terminators. 11 of them in all, 5 plastic and 6 metal. I tried using them previously as deepstrike troops with plasma combi weapons and reaper autocannon but it didnt go well. When they deepstrike, can i assume that they can fire ALL their weapons (all plasma multis and the reaper) as they can usually move and shoot? I was thinking of placing them in a second land raider which would unload them after moving 6, they would then disembark, shoot everything then assault into CC.

 

I was considering 3 obliterators as a second heavy choice. I wouldnt deepstrike them but if i did, could they fire a volley of their las cannons on the turn they arrive?

 

I am considering chosen chaos marines also. I can put lots of heavy weapons in a squad and infiltrate them? Then I could also include them with 4 meltas making a great close vehicle destroying team - would these be better than havocs i wonder..

 

That leaves groups of standard marines with flamer and plasma combos, probably armed with melta bombs. i dont see alot of reference to melta bombs but they look so good for the 5 points, are people that worried about using them to assault tanks? In theory any squad assaulting a tank risks an explosion wiping out troops so melta bombs seem a no brainer?

 

 

Anyway, thats enough for now. I only ask so many questions as the last time i played, I couldnt use half my troops as i wanted to since i tried to move or shoot or assault at bad times tacticully.. any help on any single question would be great

[Brother Nihm]

Hello Yukka!

 

I am considering my main anti tank squad to be raptors, armed with melta guns. I think I would like to keep them out of the way and then jetpack them over the top of tanks to attack their rear armor. This wont be effective on land raiders but 2 melta guns in close range will be.

You don't really need to attack the rear armor, just get within 6 inches and let the melta rule work for you. (check in the rule book) :P

 

If I equip my raptors with melta guns and powerfist, can they fly 12 inches, fire both guns (and their bolters) and then assault the tank in CC? I am considering 2 squads of 5 raptors at first. 2 melters on each.

They can fire the meltas, and the bolt pistols and then assault in CC. This is also covered in the rule book by the way.

 

I am also considering placing 10 havocs in a land raider, armed with 4 meltaguns. These will be driven at the main opposing tank and they will assault from the land raider. Can the land raider move 6, then the troops disembark, fire all guns including meltas then assault into CC?

Yes they can but that setup is very costly (and cool) for what it can do.

 

I also have plague marines. I read that these do not benefit from assaulting as much as they did previously and are better placed holding back than charging in. I can equip them with flamer/melta gun combos for this task or would they be better either left behind or given more meltas or plasma?

I only ever place flamers on fast units (like Raptors) as footsloggers hardly ever get to use them. Plasmas is best for plague marines in my opinion because combined with Feel No Pain you got yourself a rockhard unit able to bring on the hurt.

 

I have terminators. 11 of them in all, 5 plastic and 6 metal. I tried using them previously as deepstrike troops with plasma combi weapons and reaper autocannon but it didnt go well. When they deepstrike, can i assume that they can fire ALL their weapons (all plasma multis and the reaper) as they can usually move and shoot? I was thinking of placing them in a second land raider which would unload them after moving 6, they would then disembark, shoot everything then assault into CC.

Break them up in smaller squads (2x4?) and lose the Reaper AC (too costly for what it can do) also leave out aspiring champions and just stick with Combi-Weapons and you may find them to be highly effective terror units.

 

I was considering 3 obliterators as a second heavy choice. I wouldnt deepstrike them but if i did, could they fire a volley of their las cannons on the turn they arrive?

Yes, Deepstriking vs shooting is also covered in the rule book.

 

I am considering chosen chaos marines also. I can put lots of heavy weapons in a squad and infiltrate them? Then I could also include them with 4 meltas making a great close vehicle destroying team - would these be better than havocs i wonder..

With good deployment, most likely. Give them an icon and you can have them bring in Daemons to harass your foes.

 

That leaves groups of standard marines with flamer and plasma combos, probably armed with melta bombs. i dont see alot of reference to melta bombs but they look so good for the 5 points, are people that worried about using them to assault tanks? In theory any squad assaulting a tank risks an explosion wiping out troops so melta bombs seem a no brainer?

I only add melta bombs if I have spare points, a powerfist on the champ usually does the trick.

 

 

My 2 Kraks.

[Yukka]

thanks! i do own a purchased copy of the battle for mcragge mini rulebook, my own chaos codex and the 1999 edition 2 rules. ive had a little bit of a problem getting it all together but i think im nearly there. the last game i played was so horrific i had to ask someone to clarify.

 

i will have more questions but not right now. i also couldnt find a "noob" section on this forum so i made this topic rather than making a mess somewhere else..

[Yukka]

Is there any way that demons come in without using the reserve rules? the rules show no choice whether they come in or not - they just have to come in as soon as they can but i have seen people talk on the board as if there is a choice about when to bring them in. the same with terminators.

 

i deepstriked my dp, terminators and demons during my last game. the dp worked well as i could place him perfectly to use WoC on an entire squad assaulting my land raider. the terminators arrived so late in the game that they just landed and got pummeled by 6 tanks and died pretty instantly. the demons were handy as they got in halfway and got into CC with some marines but i had so many points in my terminator squad, it really messed my game up overall. my fault for giving too many options (and a mark) to the termies.

 

 

so im thinking havocs or chosen with lots of meltas, maybe a second havoc or chosen squad with assault cannons/heavy bolters, 3 obliterators, at least 2 full squads of plasma toting plague marines and a demon prince with wings and probably WoC. I dont fancy the lash because my enemy is probably going to keep his marines safely in razorbacks or land raiders most of the time. and 2 raptor squads with melter/flamer combos.

 

this leaves me making extra standard marine squads with plasma/melta combos, in rhinos with extra armor probably. ill work it out and the choices left once i see the points setup. the havocs/chosen choice will come down to whether i want the second squad of terminators. i dont see why i would choose havocs over chosen except the extra points per model.

 

ill make a list and link it to here. without being able to field razorbacks with las cannons, i feel that competing tank on tank isnt going to be the way forward. many men with nasty guns is the way <_<

[Yukka]

hmmm came up with this first one. i was happily making my perfect list from the above when i realised i was topping 2500 points so i had to tone it down a bit.

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...p;#entry1571133

 

 

Warhammer 40K Chaos Army – 2000 points

 

HQ

 

Sorcerer with Wind of Chaos and Wings

 

Troops

 

7 Plague Marines with 2 Plasma Guns in a Rhino with extra Armor

 

7 Plague Marines with 2 Plasma Guns in a Rhino with extra Armor

 

10 Chaos Marines inc Champ with Meltagun, Flamer and Powerfist in Rhino with extra Armor

 

10 Chaos Marines inc Champ with Meltagun, Flamer and Powerfist in Rhino with extra Armor

 

Elites

 

4 Terminators with 4 Combi Plasma guns and a Chainfist

 

5 Chosen with a Meltagun, a Flamer and a Powerfist

 

Fast Attack

 

5 Raptors including Champ with Meltagun, a Flamer and a Powerfist

 

5 Raptors including Champ with Meltagun, a Flamer and a Powerfist

 

Heavy support

 

Obliterator*3

 

 

Total = 1992

[davidren2401]

I dont see a whole load of Icons in this army, icons are the most useful thing you can have in a deep strike heavy army. Drop a raptor squad and add some icons, swap one flamer for a melta and beef the squad up with whatever points you have left.

[Tokunator]

You mix your weapons quite a lot (i.e. one flamer and a meltagun per unit) this is not the best thing to do. As you are forced to shoot all weapons in one unit at the same target, you will always waste a large amount of weapons because they can't affect the target (flamers against tanks...) and they do cost points.

 

As you are playing a rather mobile army, I would assign dedicated roles to each unit (i.e. 10 Marines with 2 Flamers and a Champ with Fist to drive-by flame infantry or disembark and volley-firing infantry and units with 2 meltas to take on tanks)

 

You seem to be a bit paranoid against tanks, especially Land Raiders. In my experience, you won't see many of them in 2000 or less points unless your opponents really like them, as they are not that point-effective. If you want real tank killers, take 3*1 Obliterator (as singles, they can engage multiple targets and 3 rolls for deep strike per turn mean that you will be less reliant on dice rolls to get them in time) and 3 terminators with combi-meltas. 105 points for 3 Terminators are not the world and they can be dropped next to a tank with good chances of hammering it.

 

 

And you should really get some icons. Plague Marines only pay 5 points for them and your chosen should at least hold an Icon of chaos glory to call in reinforcements.

 

 

To answer the Daemon question: Yes, they have to deep-strike and you need Icons to deploy them. No Icons, no daemons.

[chillin]

I disagree w/ melta/flamer not being a good combo for csm squads. I think it's good as it makes a jack of all trades unit. I agree that it is not a good way to equip raptors. Raptors should speciallze more , either 2 flamer or 2 meltas. Since your sorc has WoC I would go with flamers, b/c that makes 3 flamers in the raptors in the raptor unit. I have done this several times, and w/ prober template placement most units hit w/ 3 flamers do not survive, pwr armor or not. 5 raptors is too small though.

Chosen are no good outfitted that way either, give them a couple of plasmas and lose the champ.

In your orig post you were way to focused on LR's, like you were going to build an army around fighting them. But actually, over all your army in pretty well balanced.

[Gideon Bane]

Minor nitpick, 1999 would have been a third edition codex, the first incarnation thereof. The 2nd 3rd edition chaos 'dex was published in 2002 IIRC and the 4th edition version has a 2007 publication date. The Chaos 2nd edition codex was published in the very early 90s around the same time as the Eldar one (~1994)

[Yukka]

aha i was refering to the actual 40k rulebook - i still might be wrong but the date is 1999 and there are quite a few differences from the condensced rulebook i bought.

 

i have the last 2 chaos codexs as well now. just grabbing anything at the moment just for background.

 

on a side note, my entire army is currently soaking in a big container of brake fluid, ready for the remodelling and repainting i plan on doing. taken everyone points of view on board now - i got to be careful as my current foe (ap2) has started posting on here so i dont want to start tipping him off on my army list :P

[chillin]

on a side note, my entire army is currently soaking in a big container of brake fluid, ready for the remodelling and repainting i plan on doing.

-

I hope your plastic models are not in the brake fluid, it will dissolve them and the surface will get all pitted and bumpy. !!!

If they haven't been there too long this might not have happened yet, but if you don't take them out it will.

Strip plastics in pine-sol or simple green never petrol products.

[Inquisitor Kravin]

aha i was refering to the actual 40k rulebook - i still might be wrong but the date is 1999 and there are quite a few differences from the condensced rulebook i bought.

 

The differences will be because your 1999 rulebook is obsolete and no longer valid! 1999 is the 3rd Edition which became obsolete in 2004 with the release of the 4th Edition rulebook, of which the BfM mini book is a condensed version.

 

Both of your existing rulebooks will become obsolete next month with the release of 5th Edition.