Doctor Thunder Posted October 28, 2008 Author Share Posted October 28, 2008 I'm just wondering about your particular interpretation of female marines, and why you chose to model them in that particular way. A fair question, deserving a fair answer. Actually, the current conversions are something of a compromise. I won't lie and tell you that I am 100% pleased with them, but I have to work within the skills and budget I have. My original attempt was similar to what you suggest. http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h261/DoctorThunder/Big%20Valkyrie%20Update/Comm1.jpg http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h261/DoctorThunder/Big%20Valkyrie%20Update/Comm5.jpg They had the benefit of being much slighter then normal marines, but they had the downside of being extremely different from regualr male marines, and I caught a lot of flak for that. In fact, the B+C mods closed down some of my threads because they claimed that they weren't marines at all. After that, I tried trimming down regular marine models. The problem is that it is a lot easier said then done. It is really hard to scrape and hack away at a marine model and end up with something that looks smooth instead of just something that looks hacked and cut with an exacto knife. (It made me realize why so many people do nurgle conversions. They are really easy to do and make look good) After that, I tried sculpting my own from scratch on an armature, which, I discovered, is currently beyond my skill level by about a million percent. After that, I looked into alternate models, and for a time I considered using these models with regular marine arms and shoulder pads: http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h261/DoctorThunder/INF280202.jpg The downside of these was that they are really expensive and, not being GW models, would invalidate me from taking them to tournaments, which was kind of a deal breaker for me, since I am a big tourney player. So, the current design was made by using green stuff to modify the current marine models. It has the advantage of not causing confusion because they look like marines, but the disadvantage is that they have the wrong silhouette. Now, if you ask me what I would actually like them to look like in a perfect world, it would be something closer to this: http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h261/DoctorThunder/Black%20Widows/img465e646bcd50b.jpg The problem is that the only way to pull that off would be to hire a professional sculptor to sculpt several of them in differernt poses and then cast an army of them, which would cost about $5000 dollars. (Even I have my limits) If I can figure out a cost-effective way to acheive that, you better believe that I will. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1749792 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Toddius Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 All you'd have to do is have the sculpter make everything modular. 1. Two different Heads 2. Upper torso 3. Lower torso 4. HtH left leg/arm 5. HtH right leg/arm 6. Shooting left leg/arm 7. Shooting right leg/arm Then use the salt dip technique to bend and manuever the limbs once they're casted and off you go. Some GS here and there to close gaps and you can pose them anyway you'd want. I know I know, it sounds easy enough in theory but I doubt it would cost $5000. Unless of course you count yourself as part of the labor cost. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1749801 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morte Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Whoever put together that female marine needs a prize. Thanks for the response Thunder! Very cool to have a peek into your thought processes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1749803 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shortsonfire79 Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 You know, looking at that last picture, it shouldn't bee TOO hard to pull off. Just chop of the belt, extend the mid section, extend the groin. And use the people's truscaling techniques to make the legs a bit lankier. Still easier said than done, I'll try it later, after my homework =-D Edit: Well, worked on the torso and crotchial area... You don't want pictures. Its bad. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1749805 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Thunder Posted October 28, 2008 Author Share Posted October 28, 2008 All you'd have to do is have the sculpter make everything modular. 1. Two different Heads 2. Upper torso 3. Lower torso 4. HtH left leg/arm 5. HtH right leg/arm 6. Shooting left leg/arm 7. Shooting right leg/arm Then use the salt dip technique to bend and manuever the limbs once they're casted and off you go. Some GS here and there to close gaps and you can pose them anyway you'd want. I know I know, it sounds easy enough in theory but I doubt it would cost $5000. Unless of course you count yourself as part of the labor cost. Well, my online club and I have financed several sculpting and casting projects for ourselves over the last couple of years. We've done female imperial guard and xenos cavalry, among other things, so I don't throw that number out lightly. The reason we were able to pull it off was because we had a bunch of people pooling their money together, so the costs were spread around. If I could find a couple dozen people willing to pool their money for something like this, we could probably pull it off, but, alas, female marines tend to be something of a rare taste among 40K players. (You are correct, however, Toddius, that by volunteering labor and using creative methods to limit the number of parts and the size of the molds, you can reduce the cost considerably) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1749828 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilnar Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 to be honest, if you were gonna do sculpts of female marines like that, id chip in for a load:B) still not tourny worthy tho:;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1750008 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Sensei Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Honnestly, I can't see how can you reach prices like 5k$ for such a project. Sculptors capable of such work are easy to find and a quality casting is not that expensive. That beeing said, I'm really not fan at all of female marines but you should carry on if this is the way you gave to your own hobby. DS Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1750033 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Chaplain Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 wow that sculptor female mini is really good (not a fan of the helmet though). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1750063 Share on other sites More sharing options...
st.germaine Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Doc, as you know I am a fan of your work and as usual this is a very sharp figure. I understand your explanation but I think you (and other readers) may want to consider something that I've said in defense of your figures on other forums (I may have said it here at B&C as well, I don't recall). The scale/style that GW uses has been described at various times as "Heroic 28mm" with the heroic term referring to both an increase in scale from actual 28mm and larger than normal proportions. The exaggeration of certain aspects of anatomy, as well as weaponry, has been criticized for a long time but it serves a purpose particularly for female figures. Distinguishing between properly proportioned males and females is pretty simple when held in your hands but on the tabletop at ranges of 4-6 feet not so much. The exaggeration of the female anatomy on GW's female figures across the Warhammer and Warhammer 40K lines makes it very easy to determine which figures are female. While it is true that power armor would completely obscure the presence of female breasts, the Sisters of Battle figures and your female marines need the clearly unnecessary exaggeration of their armor to make them more visually distinguishable on the tabletop. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1750152 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Thunder Posted October 28, 2008 Author Share Posted October 28, 2008 While it is true that power armor would completely obscure the presence of female breasts, the Sisters of Battle figures and your female marines need the clearly unnecessary exaggeration of their armor to make them more visually distinguishable on the tabletop. Very good point, germaine. Thanks for bringing it up. :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1750365 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuchinawa Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Possibly. I was thinking it might be fun to do a female version of Pedro Cantor. Is her name going to be Summer perchance? Nah bad joke Nice Marines I was tempted to make one myself after seeing yours, but I never thought I would do it justice, so I let the pros handle the female marines. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1750945 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terminatorinhell Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 woah where is that one non GW model from? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1750949 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hajime Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 *snip* Now, if you ask me what I would actually like them to look like in a perfect world, it would be something closer to this: http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h261/DoctorThunder/Black%20Widows/img465e646bcd50b.jpg The problem is that the only way to pull that off would be to hire a professional sculptor to sculpt several of them in differernt poses and then cast an army of them, which would cost about $5000 dollars. (Even I have my limits) If I can figure out a cost-effective way to acheive that, you better believe that I will. :lol: How did you get that one, is casted or a sculpt. Oh I am interested Female guard? Could you PM me about that a bit I love know some details. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1751152 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newtype Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 Good day Doctor Hammer I have been following the female marine thread for a while, and your conversion of the Games Day figure is great. And the whole Black Widows chapter is a wonderful concept and well executed. All I can add is keep it up! I have done a marine scout conversion by switching out the head for a womens' head from another mini, and I think it turned out fine. Seeing some of what you have done has got me to thinking about trying to do a power armoured female marine. So thanks for the inspiration! Keep it up, Newtype Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1751166 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Thunder Posted October 29, 2008 Author Share Posted October 29, 2008 Thanks, Newtype. :D woah where is that one non GW model from? It's a Pan Oceana Marine from Infinity. Really high quality minis and an excellent skirmish game. How did you get that one, is casted or a sculpt. It's not mine (unfortunately) Someone sculpted it and posted pics on CoolMiniorNot.com years ago and I saved the pic. It was sculpted at 48mm scale (40K is 28mm) otherwise I would have tried to buy it off him. ;) Could you PM me about that a bit PM sent. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1751255 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Hereticus Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 Probably because thats how GW do their Sisters. And just like martial arts chest protectors for women, power armour is likely to be shaped to fit the female form, not just squish their extra bits into a guys chest plate so the feel like they are having a 24/7 mammogram Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1751275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
rat of vengence Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 They are his marines, and if he likes breasts too, who is to argue... RoV Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1751529 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Thunder Posted November 19, 2008 Author Share Posted November 19, 2008 She's all done now. Enjoy. http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h261/DoctorThunder/Black%20Widows/DSC01424.jpg http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h261/DoctorThunder/Black%20Widows/DSC01425.jpg http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h261/DoctorThunder/Black%20Widows/DSC01426.jpg http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h261/DoctorThunder/Black%20Widows/DSC01427.jpg Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/144703-games-day-mini-coverted-to-black-widows-female-warlord/page/2/#findComment-1777163 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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