Grimmwulf Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Hello Wolfbrothers, we are going to start a league here with about 10 players. everybody writes a fixed 500 pts list for the whole season. So i need a flexible list, but it has to fulfill some restrictions. no vehicles with armor total >33, no 2+ armor/inv save models, at least 1 troop choice, mhh i forgot about the others ^^ I really don't have many options under these restrictions. lets say i take a wolf guard as the cheapest hq choice, add a little equipment so that he will cost me around 80 points. two troop choices would be good to hold objectives, so 2 gh squads that is, together about 400 pts. so i will have awesone 20 pts left to play around with =/ maybe if i exchanged a gh unit with BCs i could at least get the points to buy transports....i hate our mandatory HQ choice in such small point games... any suggestions on what i should field? i really don't think i have many options here... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Howland Greywolf Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Yes. one pack of Grey hunters and a blood claw pack is the best investment. But I would go for a rune priest and give him a frost blade. then you can use his power to screen your blood claws. add a plasma gun to your grey hunters for those light vehicles and IC's. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1695817 Share on other sites More sharing options...
deedark Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Always feel more troops the better at 500pts Like the previous poster 1 of each of 2 x GHs maybe put a WGPL with one pack with a PF Flamer if you take BCs and Plasma with GH Maybe 1 rhino but at this level I'd go for bodies and some scouts for OBEL or inf D. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1695849 Share on other sites More sharing options...
muzzyman1981 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Well I originally tried starting with a 500pt army and pretty much chose 1 GH pack w/Wolf Guard Leader (2 PWs, WGL PF, Meltagun and Bolters)...1 BC pack with Wolf Guard Battle Leader (2 PFs, 1 PW) But thats me. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1696680 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfLordLars Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 ACK! Avoid the Rune Priest at all costs, ESPECIALLY at 500pts. Nothing but a point sink. The Wolf Priest is your best bet there, mostly due to the free 4+ save and power weapon. Fill the rest up with troops. MAYBE a Wolf Guard or two and Scouts, but mostly troops. Sucks the armor restriction prohibits dreads. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1696775 Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyInDeath Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 500 pts is really rough for wolves. You will end up more often than not either being against very mobile armies or very shooty armies, neither of which the wolves excell at around 500 pts. I would suggest one of the following to help with this. 1. a SMALL bike pack (probably 3ish bikers). This will give you mobility and the ability to get in the face of a shooty army in quick order, which would allow your GH to advance with much less molestation than they would have with out the bikers 2. Baring bikers, a small OBEL scouts would help you well against any shooty army you may find. Either way, as I said, 500 pts is rough on wolves. I think when I had to field a 500 pt list for an escalation map campaign, I got whooped for a long time with just straight GH units. I eventually scaled down those units to like 7 or 8 men with only a special weap and a PW. I then included a small pack of bikers and threw in a WGBL in there. It ended up winning me a few games that way. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1696850 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmwulf Posted September 17, 2008 Author Share Posted September 17, 2008 Thanks for the advice so far. I like the idea of a wolf priest, and i also think i will throw some bikes or scouts in. And yes, I too hate the armor restriction that leaves me without a dread... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1696898 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf89 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I played in a 500 pt campaign a few years back and the AV restriction all around was 46, so I could field my ven. dread as an HQ and it worked wonders (I think I gave him a plasma cannon or possibly the autocannon variant I don't remember which. Since this helps you in NO way you can just disregard that. :cuss I really think GH's are the way to go, 2 squads about 8-man strong is what you need, but if you need points for bikes (which I really think you should use in 500 points since the mobility, and horde controlling capabilities (flamers!)) they're great for that early on charge to help your more vulnerable units to get across the board without much worry. As for the HQ, I'd go with a WGBL in TDA with either an AC, HF, or even a CML (should be interesting to have in such a small game) and he can still be a beast in HtH. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1697156 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmwulf Posted September 17, 2008 Author Share Posted September 17, 2008 Unfortunately this doesn't helb me either, no 2+ saves so no TDA ^^ What do you guys think about putting the infantry in drop pods so i could maybe leave the bikes out and drop right into the enemy lines... not that i have anything to say against bikes but i'm really short on points :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1697315 Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyInDeath Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 no 2+ saves in this one Wolf :lol: try this one out: 3x bikers: flamer= 96 pts WGBL: pw, wp, combi flamer= 88 pts 8x GH: bolters x7, melta, frags, pw: 171 pts 7x GH: Bolters x6, melta, pw: 145 pts 500 pts on the button. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1697333 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf89 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Unfortunately this doesn't helb me either, no 2+ saves so no TDA ^^ What do you guys think about putting the infantry in drop pods so i could maybe leave the bikes out and drop right into the enemy lines... not that i have anything to say against bikes but i'm really short on points :lol: If you can have drop pods why can't you take dreads, the dreads are less armor around. Unless you didn't realize drop pods are AV 12 around Grimmwulf? Sorry I didn't see the no 2+ save :P the best way to go is a wolf priest then, if not a WGBL with storm shield and frost axe. If not go with OnlyInDeath's list, it's probably something I'd use for sure. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1697346 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmwulf Posted September 17, 2008 Author Share Posted September 17, 2008 O sorry I really didn't know about the armor of drop pods. I never used them, i just plan to get some when the new ones come out. Thanks for your List Suggestion OnlyInDeath, I will try it out. Maybe I will be changing one Pack from GH to BC and buy a few goodies for the spare points, or just one or two more marines. Depends on what I'll get painted till the season starts, right now I only have a BC and a GH pack and the WGBL finished, at least of the units that i want to put in the list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1697743 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmwulf Posted September 19, 2008 Author Share Posted September 19, 2008 Another question came to my mind. what do you think is better, to put your PW/PF on the same model that carries the special shooting weapon or to another one? if both upgrades are on the same guy you could reduce the risk of loosing a weapon, but on the other hand one failed save and both weaps are gone. Opinions? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1699759 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf89 Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Another question came to my mind. what do you think is better, to put your PW/PF on the same model that carries the special shooting weapon or to another one? if both upgrades are on the same guy you could reduce the risk of loosing a weapon, but on the other hand one failed save and both weaps are gone. Opinions? I'm a fan of spreading my special weapons around, it also helps with ablative wounds and such. You do risk the possibility of loosing your special guys, but if you allocate wounds appropriately then you should actually save more special weapons than not. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1699766 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaotic Death Posted September 19, 2008 Share Posted September 19, 2008 Another question came to my mind. what do you think is better, to put your PW/PF on the same model that carries the special shooting weapon or to another one? if both upgrades are on the same guy you could reduce the risk of loosing a weapon, but on the other hand one failed save and both weaps are gone. Opinions? I think if you are going to use a PW, you should spead it around a little. But if you are going to use a PF, I would put it on the speacial weapons guy since you are not going to get the +1 attack for having two weapons, per 5th ed rules on PFs. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1699814 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonSTeR Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 no 2+ armor/inv save models, Is this an either/or scenario? If its a no "inv save" you have to rule out the Wolf Priest (which would be my first choice as well as all the other guys) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1700671 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfLordLars Posted September 20, 2008 Share Posted September 20, 2008 But if you are going to use a PF, I would put it on the speacial weapons guy since you are not going to get the +1 attack for having two weapons, per 5th ed rules on PFs. You cant put a PF/PW on a special weapons guy. You have to trade in your BP/CCW for the special weapon. You have to trade your CCW for a PF/PW. Therefore, if you trade your BP/CCW for a special weapon, you no longer have a CCW to trade for a PF/PW. Had to check the wording to be sure. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1700678 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmwulf Posted September 21, 2008 Author Share Posted September 21, 2008 Is this an either/or scenario? Yes, it is either or. so no 2+ saves of any sort are allowed (i hate some of these resrtrictions... i should field a 2+ save model anyway and tell them to stick their rules up their .... Like Russ said to Guillaume ^^) You cant put a PF/PW on a special weapons guy. You have to trade in your BP/CCW for the special weapon. You have to trade your CCW for a PF/PW. Therefore, if you trade your BP/CCW for a special weapon, you no longer have a CCW to trade for a PF/PW. I could have had the idea to check this myself *cough* Thanks for all your help and support again, brothers! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1702090 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf89 Posted September 21, 2008 Share Posted September 21, 2008 Yes, it is either or. so no 2+ saves of any sort are allowed (i hate some of these resrtrictions... i should field a 2+ save model anyway and tell them to stick their rules up their .... Like Russ said to Guillaume ^^) It's spelled Guilliman, no need to poke fun at the tactically handicap... we're all marines. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1702100 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted September 21, 2008 Share Posted September 21, 2008 For 500 points Id really want to run a Wolf priest.... but no invulnerable saves kinda tosses that one out eh? The Vendread is another good choice... but armor 34. *sigh* So.... 76- WGBL- Power Weapon, Boltpistol. Cheep HQ, but rather effective. Makes sense to lead a scouting detail. 208- 9 Greyhunters in a Rhino, BP/CCWx4, Bolterx5. Solid Troop choice, A mix of ranged and close so you always get some shots... Rhino works well with scout missions. 136- 8 Bloodclaws- 2 Powerfists. Some heavy CC Support. And unless theres something about Toughness 8 Creatures you might be facing a Wraithlord.. it pays to bring a couple fists. 80- LandSpeeder Tornado- Hunt down those artillery peices, 7 shots that can hurt any vehicle youll be facing, good scout fluff. 500pts. Thats probly what I would bring considering the limitations. Deploy with Landspeeder and Rhino under Concealment, have the Bloodclaws behind cover... Run the BC's up one side, with the rhino in the middle to Draw Fire. Send the Landspeeder out and around to hunt tanks or take shots at Heavy Weapons as needed... then turn on the infantry. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1702244 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmwulf Posted September 22, 2008 Author Share Posted September 22, 2008 Ok just to clarify this again, i talked to the guy who is responsible for the organisation, and here is a complete summary of the regulations: - 500 pts armies - At least 1 troop choice - Maximum is 1 HQ choice - No models with more than 2 wounds - No special characters - No 2+ Armor and no 2+ Invulnerability Saves (So a Wolf Priest would be ok) - No Vehicles with an armor Value total of 33 or higher - No Ordnance Weapons Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1702524 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfLordLars Posted September 22, 2008 Share Posted September 22, 2008 WP and GH Pack minimum, the rest is just extras. What models do you have to work with, and whats your goal with this? Do you want a lot of models on the table, or a smaller more elite force? Lots of big guns, or a balanced mix? I got my start on the 500pt level, and still like playing those games when I can. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1702537 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmwulf Posted September 23, 2008 Author Share Posted September 23, 2008 Ok, this is what i have to work with: 26 GH: 3 of them with PW, 1 PF, 1 PP, 1 Melter. I still got spare Meltas, plasma guns, PWs and PFs to equip some more 8 BC: 1 PF, 1PW. The same applies for those guys, i can still chance their weapons. Edit: One of them has a flamer 2 Landspeeders: 1 with HB 1 with Melta 3 Bikes 9 Scouts: 4 of them snipers, 1 ML, 4 BP + CCW A couple of Long Fangs: 4 ML, 2 PC, 1 LC, 2 HB Wolf priest WGBL A rhino and i will probably buy a drop pod or two, maybe another rhino. all my other stuff falls under the restrictions, i think (termies, LRC, Predator, Dreads...) And what i want is mostly a flexible force, since i will be facing a lot of different opponents. But considering the models i have i don't have too many options anyway i guess ^_^ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1702870 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmwulf Posted September 26, 2008 Author Share Posted September 26, 2008 Ok this is my List: Wolfpriest, PW, Amulet, Wolf Pelt 8 Bloodclaws, 2 PF, Flamer 8 GH, 1 PW, Melter 3 Bikers, Flamer No real tactics included. The boys will just rush forward, slaughter everything that is not hairy, drink loads of ale for the fallen and then hunt for wolves when everybody is drunk. Well, the bikers are meant to keep fast/shooty units busy until the other boys arrive and take care of the rest. The GH are meant go first, in case anything charges i want the counterattack goodness, and the bc will then join the fight to hopefully take enemy units out 1 after another. Do you guys think i should change the PW in the GH squad to a PF? i still have the points left... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1706613 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted September 26, 2008 Share Posted September 26, 2008 102pts- Wolf Priest- Auspex, Meltabombs, 198pts- 10 Grey Hunters- 2xPowerweapon, 8 Bolters. 150pts 4 LongFangs- 3x Missile Launcher 50- Land Speeder- Heavy Bolter 500pts. Landspeeder adds some extra firepower and can let you chase down units that like to hide *IE whirlwinds et all*, The Wolfpriest can start with either pack, depending on your tastes and then travel with the GH as they move up to kill. The Longfang unit should be able to mow down any vehicles you meet, tau battlesuits, and small tyranid creatures with ease. No 3+ wounds also means no toughness 8 so I figured Powerweapons over powerfists- more attacks. Leave them with boltpistols for the extra attacks on charge/countercharge. Meltabombs on the priest- just in case. The Auspex is cheap, and allows for a nice pregame snack against rangers, broodlords, and smurfscouts- Id expect to see all of the above. Not the most mobile army ever... but youll be playing on a 4'x4' right? And besides its not slow either... just average. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/146253-suggestions-on-what-to-put-in-a-500-pts-league-list/#findComment-1706636 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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