angels of death Posted September 29, 2008 Share Posted September 29, 2008 hi, i was wondering why they made the lost and the damned unnoficial does anyone know? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rain Posted September 29, 2008 Share Posted September 29, 2008 Because they were an eye of terror campaign list that relied on the old chaos codex for some of its entries and is therefore now defunct along with the aforementioned old chaos codex. That said, the pdf of the rules was floating around one of GW's sites and you could probably still field them in friendly games. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1709496 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drudge Dreadnought Posted September 29, 2008 Share Posted September 29, 2008 Does anyone know if there has been mention of bringing them back except based off the new chaos codex? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1709526 Share on other sites More sharing options...
angels of death Posted September 29, 2008 Author Share Posted September 29, 2008 i have not heard anything but god i hope they do Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1709531 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playa Posted September 29, 2008 Share Posted September 29, 2008 Hey, Does anyone know if there has been mention of bringing them back Jervis thinks he already has - with that laughable 40kA Datasheet. X- D The closest I've seen is the Astronomi-con version (PDF DL!): http://www.mts.net/~xian/astronomi-con/web...he%20Damned.pdf HTH Playa Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1709545 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fallen angels Posted September 29, 2008 Share Posted September 29, 2008 does that list mean that i can play lost and the damned in GW tornament? without having to ask permission? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1709547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drudge Dreadnought Posted September 29, 2008 Share Posted September 29, 2008 does that list mean that i can play lost and the damned in GW tornament? without having to ask permission? No. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1709551 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fallen angels Posted September 29, 2008 Share Posted September 29, 2008 man i was getting excited Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1709619 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ju'kosian Posted September 29, 2008 Share Posted September 29, 2008 There's a datasheet for them If I'm not mistaken.. but that's all.. They are probably lost in the warp, maybe we'll see them again in a new chaos codex.. but I would not get my hopes up.. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1709676 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fallen angels Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 it doesnt matter i guess im happy with my fallen angels Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1710575 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth the Dark Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 Its just kind of sad how GW can just screw so many people by getting rid of armies. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1710647 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 Its just kind of sad how GW can just screw so many people by getting rid of armies. Well they've made a huge mess of chaos (and with that LotD). But s/m's got a great new codex :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1710669 Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tiger Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 hi, i was wondering why they made the lost and the damned unnoficial does anyone know? People were having far too much fun with them and not buying Space marines, and GW don't like it when a: people have fun and b: people don't buy marines Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1710866 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nihm Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 hi, i was wondering why they made the lost and the damned unnoficial does anyone know? People were having far too much fun with them and not buying Space marines, and GW don't like it when a: people have fun and b: people don't buy marines A reminder, The Bolter & Chainsword promotes constructive discussion about all aspects of the Warhammer 40,000 hobby. As for why LotD aren't valid any more, my guess is they simply didn't sell very well. They were a small sub-list sprung off of C:CSM and were never intended to be fully supported. I do feel that it was a very characterful addition to the 40k universe and I hope to see another iteration of the LotD, in the future. The whole image&concept of a few traitor Astartes leading a corrupt planetary defence force is appealing to me. :P My 2 Kraks Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1710879 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dammeron Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 The Lost and the Damned were a fun variant list introduced exclusively as a reference to the background and to let those who like to go a little wild with their modelling free reign. As we well know by now, GW no longer produce army lists with reference to background. If anything, the game mechanics are becoming increasingly divorced from the mythology on which they are purportedly based, to the extent whereby they are so arbitrary one is forced to introduce the principle of "count as" as standard rather than as an optional and creative extra. We have also learned that GW no longer produce rules for armies that do not have established miniature lines. In point of fact, recent lists have gone out of their way to ham-string the appeal of traditional units in certain armies (REF: Chaos Space Marine Dreadnaught) so that people will opt for the newer alternatives (Defilers, Terminators, Possessed boxed sets). This will, however, change as it has before when GW finally cottons on to the fact that it is actively alienating a goodly proportion of its formerly paying customers. The situation we are mired in now is basically the same as that following the shift from Second to Third Ed: lots of somewhat ill-conceived and evidently unplaytested army lists being churned out to meet the demands of a new edition, hap-hazardly fixed by the introduction of "alternative" and variant army lists (which Jervis Johnson et al originally advertised an ambition to do away with). The only difference this time is that the promised variant lists are apparently coming in the forms of complete codicies for which we will no doubt have to pay through the nose for as opposed to articles such as the Index Astartes, which originally appeared in White Dwarf. Personally, I still stand by the belief that EVERY chaos force you could think of (from those of the original Traitor Legions to more recently turned Renegades, from The Lost and the Damned to Daemon Hordes) could be represented by a single, well conceived and adaptable army list, and I'm working on an example thereof at present. True, t'were such a tome to be published with all of the rules and necessary background material, it would be quite large for a codex, but so what? I wouldn't begrudge paying through the nose for a hardback, "Realm of Chaos" style army book that comprises Chaos in its all singing, all dancing glory, especially considering the truly lamentable standard of the piece-meal seperate codicies (Codex: Chaos Space Marines and Codex: Chaos Daemons) we have been provided with thus far. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1710885 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dammeron Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 As a possible alternative to the Lost and the Damned list, you might try using the Imperial Guard or even Ork codicies to represent them. Alternatively, in friendly games simply adapt the existing Eye of Terror army list to fit with the current Chaos Codex (annoying that these theatrics are necessary, but any port in a storm, eh?). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1710929 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarulek Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 It's ironic how Forge World make such awesome Dread and Traitor models who can no longer be supported by (descent) rules. GW also released cool new models like possessed, spawn and -to a lesser extant- Terminator Lord and are all supported with horrible stats/special rules. But enough of that. I hope there will be a new updated codex soon with an option to include cultist/turncoats. Since all legions use them I suggest maybe a 0-1 or 0-2 rule and no limit for Alpha Legion players. And maybe a difference between cultist and turncoats like conscripts and guardsmen. Since cultist are more radical citizens who turned to chaos whereas traitors/renegades/turncoats were captured soldiers who choose worship above slavery. Anyone else love the FW Renegade models as much as I do? ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1711191 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarkApostle Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 Myself I recall there being something said about them not wanting to have army lists with choices drawn from more than one Codex, and the LaTD armylist quite frankly drew choices from 3 separate army books. Something with in their opinion (as I've understood) added alot of confusion. Myself I can sort of see their point, especially with the enormous task of having to go through three different books in order to find out what everything in the army does compared to (almost) all other armies who only needed a single book. This again is kind of falling on itself when looking at why the Space Wolves Codex still is official though since it relies on the 3'rd Ed Space Marine codex.. Anyway I would much hope and love a re-appearance of the Lost and the Damned. One can always dream right? :) TDA Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1711438 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leethal Posted September 30, 2008 Share Posted September 30, 2008 The Alpha Legion hid all the Lost and the Damned, as long with all the Legion traits, and veteran skills. They will re-appear in 6th edition. :) When the Alpha Legion finally infiltrates and assassinates Jervis Johnson, and replace him a look-alike servitor. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1711540 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hlakir Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 This again is kind of falling on itself when looking at why the Space Wolves Codex still is official though since it relies on the 3'rd Ed Space Marine codex.. It's a good point. But when was the last time you saw a Space Wolves army on the battlefield? I haven't seen them in years. :) At least we know they are getting a new codex in the near future. If they are to bring back the LotD it would have to be with a codex of their own. That would also mean that they need to make almost a whole new range of minitures (who would buy the codex if there where no models?).... so they essentially have to add a new "race" to the game (releasing a set with parts from different models to make mutants and telling us to convert the traitor guardsmen ourself might work for a campaign codex, but not for a proper one). And as we know there are other armies out there who are in more need of new codices.... Space Wolves and Dark Eldar for example (the later might need a whole new range of models as well). It would still be nice to get a LotD codex though.... perhaps they could push the Beastmen back into that list like they where in the first CSM codex. :) That codex was in fact as thick as the new Space Marine codex and included basically everything, but it was split into different army lists if I'm not mistaken. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1714819 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zealot Of Chaos Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 I saw one fielded in the GW Bath (UK) store recently, unfortunately as the Space Wolves guy was unpacking his army a couple of Ultramarine players started chanting "beardy... beardy" to which I temp allied with the space wolf player and brutally hacked down the smurfmarine players by stating that "ultramarines are so bland, really they are the emperor's retards and they all deserve to have plasma weapons tested on their faces" this also divided the GW staff and in the end the Ultramarines lost their argument (especially as the space wolves player tore his ultramarine opponent apart horribly) And Dammeron, I would love to see a thick tome of chaos goodness... so what army do you play (you slam down the tome on table creating a huge noise which puts the fear of the warp into all who are around)... with it being in essence similar to the last proper codex (the current one has to be a mistake therefore not proper) and have proper working 5th ed rules for the different legions (or at least the main ones like before), daemons, LatD and then a section for those who would dare to mix the 3 in an improper fashion.. you know who you are Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1714969 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 I saw one fielded in the GW Bath (UK) store recently, unfortunately as the Space Wolves guy was unpacking his army a couple of Ultramarine players started chanting "beardy... beardy" to which I temp allied with the space wolf player That is SO retarded that the UM players did that. I would have allied w/ the SW player and hacked the UM apart too. I don't think SW are bready (although alot of the figs do have beards :blush: ), they pay alot for some of the bonuses they get. My friend playes SW's (he's a fan of all things Viking) and he plays SW 13th Co., he has a hard time beating me and as often as not I slaughter him. Partly b/c he keeps making the same tactical mistakes (a yes I remind him that it might not be a good idea every time) but partly b/c SW and 13th Co pay so much for some of their stuff that's of little real advantage. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1715015 Share on other sites More sharing options...
daemon*hunter Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Pups are better then smurfs :D It would be good to have LaTD... Add some meat sheilds to my fledgling BL force :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1715080 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commissar Molotov Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 It's ironic how Forge World make such awesome Dread and Traitor models who can no longer be supported by (descent) rules. GW also released cool new models like possessed, spawn and -to a lesser extant- Terminator Lord and are all supported with horrible stats/special rules. But enough of that. I hope there will be a new updated codex soon with an option to include cultist/turncoats. Since all legions use them I suggest maybe a 0-1 or 0-2 rule and no limit for Alpha Legion players. And maybe a difference between cultist and turncoats like conscripts and guardsmen. Since cultist are more radical citizens who turned to chaos whereas traitors/renegades/turncoats were captured soldiers who choose worship above slavery. Anyone else love the FW Renegade models as much as I do? :D Well, there are the Vraksian Renegade Lists published by Forgeworld in IA5 and IA6. They do a good job of showcasing a traitor PDF force, and you can include some Traitor Marines. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1715085 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarulek Posted October 3, 2008 Share Posted October 3, 2008 Well, there are the Vraksian Renegade Lists published by Forgeworld in IA5 and IA6. They do a good job of showcasing a traitor PDF force, and you can include some Traitor Marines. You know, I might just do that :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/147405-what-happened-to-lost-and-the-damned/#findComment-1715101 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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