Retributors vs. Exorcist

[Xenos Hunter D]

Right, so far my list looks like this;

 

All/Most squads have Vet Sisters of varying setups, depending on points-limit.

 

Living Saint / Heroine (Blessed Weapon, Book, Cloak, Jump Pack, etc).

Heroine on Foot (Storm Bolter with various extra goods {Like Book, etc})

(x4) x10 Battle Sisters Squad, with Rhinos.

- (x2) Flamer, Heavy Flamer

- (x2) x2 Meltaguns

(x2) x10 Battle Sisters Squad - Can be combined into a 20-woman squad for a Firebase.

- Storm Bolters

- Heroine of Foot usually goes in here.

(x2) x5 Seraphim Squads

- Flamers

- Living Saint / Heroine usually goes here

Dominion Squad

- Immolator with Multi-Melta

- x4 Meltaguns

(x2) Exorcists

 

I have no Elites yet (I'm aware), mainly 'cause Celestians aren't that great. I might put in a batch of Grey Knight Termis at some point. But, not now. I'm thinking of getting a third Heavy Support. Are Retributors worth it? Or shall I put up with cries of 'cheese!' and just get that third Exorcist?

[boreas]

A third exorcist is good, for sure. But if it becomes your "standard" setup, people will start acting accordingly and it will lose some efficiency. Putting a squad of retributors with 4 heavy bolters can cause quite a firing lane and will take down lots of key elements in the opposing team (elite infantry being the best target).

 

Phil

[Coppella]

Yes, Retributors are worth it. 2 Exorcists are good, 3 are, meh. For close to the same amount of points, you can take Rets which are so much better at mowing down infantry at long range. You always have a fixed number of shots, which is indeed a lovely thing to have when the Exorcists start rolling 1s and 2s for # of shots.

[SJumppanen]

Yes, Retributors are worth it. 2 Exorcists are good, 3 are, meh. For close to the same amount of points, you can take Rets which are so much better at mowing down infantry at long range. You always have a fixed number of shots, which is indeed a lovely thing to have when the Exorcists start rolling 1s and 2s for # of shots.

 

Agreed. Only reason not to get Retributors is that at the same point cost you can get bigger Troop squad. Both attract enormous amount of fire and that is how i use them both.

[Melissia]

I use a squad with four heavy bolters regularly, because I want to be able to adapt to all comers-- including that Ork army with 180+ greenskins in it. Why yes, I do want 12 s5 ap4 shots in one turn from a single squad at 36" range (second longest range weapon the Sisters have), not including normal bolter rounds.

 

Remember that you don't just want to design your list to be powerful against MEQ lists.

[jakehunter52]

Yeah dude, you are super stacked w/ anti-tank/ap1 weapons, getting the ability for your opponent to take a large number of saves, whether it is MEQ or Orks or whatever, is invaluable. 4 HB set up in a building, doing divine guidance every round, oh yeah.....

[VetSgtNamaan]

I usually run with 2 exorcists and a 10 sister 4 hb retributor squad in my lists. They both have thier roles to play and I have found both of them to be quite worth thier points. Yep Divine Guidance and Retributors is made of win.

[DefaultOzUser]

I generally find it tricky to choose between an Exorcist or a Retributor squad when there is only 1 Exorcist on the table already... In lower lists, I can usually deal with Tanks with my Girls, but an Exorcist is defaintely needed to suppliment... Two are the preferred, but Three is a little over the top - once again, especially in an all-comers list... Just the other day, after 3 turns vs a 'Nid army, there wasn't any Big Ones left to shoot at - there's nothing more disappointing to have 2 Exorcists firing at Gaunts, Stealers and Gargoyles for cripes sake... After 2 Exorcists, get the Retributors.... Give them some extra Bodies for both Divine Guidance and Soaking up wounds... You might not need to use Divine every turn - or even at all against some opponents - but the fire you can put down is immense... I really can't do any more here than echo what everyone else has said :)

[Xenos Hunter D]

Give them some extra Bodies for both Divine Guidance and Soaking up wounds... You might not need to use Divine every turn - or even at all against some opponents - but the fire you can put down is immense... I really can't do any more here than echo what everyone else has said ;)

 

With that, and what everyone else has said (thanks guys/girls!), what's a good setup? Six in an Immolator? Or Ten with a Rhino? Or just have them all on foot to shoot on the first turn? I'm liking a squad of six (4 Heavy Bolters, Vet, Imagifier), but that leaves no ablative models, but it does give me a chance to field another Immolator as a Transport.

[VetSgtNamaan]

1750 Pts - Witch Hunters Roster

 

HQ: Canoness (1#, 141 Pts)

Frag Grenades; Blessed Weapon; Cloak of St. Aspira; Jump Pack; Litanies of Faith

 

Troops: Battle Sisters Squad (10#, 159 Pts)

Bolter (x8); Meltagun (x1)

Veteran Sister Superior Bolt Pistol; Eviscerator

 

Troops: Battle Sisters Squad (10#, 159 Pts)

Bolter (x8); Meltagun (x1)

Veteran Sister Superior

Bolt Pistol; Eviscerator

 

Troops: Battle Sisters Squad (10#, 159 Pts)

Bolter (x8); Meltagun (x1)

Veteran Sister Superior, Bolt Pistol ; Eviscerator

 

Troops: Battle Sisters Squad (10#, 159 Pts)

Bolter (x8); Meltagun (x1)

Veteran Sister Superior Bolt Pistol (x1); Eviscerator

 

Fast Attack: Seraphim Squad (10#, 255 Pts)

Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Twin Bolt Pistols (x9); Jump Pack

Veteran Sister Superior

Frag Grenade (Squad); Krak Grenade (Squad); Simulacrum Imperialis; Bolt Pistol (x1);

Eviscerator; Jump Pack

 

Fast Attack: Dominion Squad (7#, 264 Pts)

1 Canoness @ 84 Pts

Frag Grenades; Krak Grenades; Bolt Pistol (x1); Brazier of Holy Fire (x1); Litanies of Faith

4 Dominion Squad Flamer (x4)

Veteran Sister Superior Bolt Pistol; Brazier of Holy Fire (x1)

Immolator @ [65] Pts

Twin Linked Heavy Flamer

 

Heavy Support: Exorcist (1#, 135 Pts)

Heavy Support: Exorcist (1#, 135 Pts)

Heavy Support: Retributor Squad (10#, 184 Pts)

Bolter (x5); Heavy Bolter (x4)

1 Veteran Sister Superior Bolt Pistol; Close Combat Weapon

 

Total Roster Cost: 1750

 

Here is the list I like running with. It does have a little bit of everything though I am thinking now it might need more anti-tank given the current changes to the vehicle rules.

[Coppella]

My Retributor squad setup is somewhat different than most.

8 Sisters: VSS w/ Storm Bolter, 4 Heavy Bolters, 3 Bolters.

Tons of fire power, good amount of bodies to soak up wounds, and not that expensive.

[mercenary]

With that, and what everyone else has said (thanks guys/girls!), what's a good setup? Six in an Immolator? Or Ten with a Rhino? Or just have them all on foot to shoot on the first turn? I'm liking a squad of six (4 Heavy Bolters, Vet, Imagifier), but that leaves no ablative models, but it does give me a chance to field another Immolator as a Transport.

 

Setup depends on how you want to use your squad. If you use divine guidance on this squad (I personally don't), then obviously the larger the squad the better. If you are just using them for the heavy bolters, then 6-8 is good, obviously 6 if you want to take an empty immolator to run around and burn stuff. Book is all you need for your vet.

 

If you want a really specialised squad against Eldar, then attaching a DH Inquiistor with Pyscannon, Null Rod, and Targeter really helps with those pesky Harlequins and allows you to measure range which is nice.

 

In larger point games, the third Exorcist really becomes essential, as the sisters don't have any alternative to long range anti-tank weapons.

[NaZ]

with the transport rules being what they are, the exorcist as a transport has another added bonus. you can transport around an inquisitor if you run one. (assuming you're not doing the shooty build) that way they can have an immolator ride instead of a rhino or chimera

 

NaZ

[Toogeloo]

@NaZ: I assume you mean immolator above?

 

 

In low points games, I never run Retributors. They are more fragile than twin Exorcists and overall do about the same casualties. Imagine if you will, against a MEQ opponent...

 

One squad of Retributors with 4 Heavy Bolters. Fire's 12 shots usually, sometimes more if the enemy is within 24" range, but assume long range only. 12 shots fired, 8 shots hit on average. Of those 8 shots hit, about 5 will wound. Of those 5 wounded, MEQ have armor saves. Assuming averages, you will only kill 1-2 models. The squad can only threaten Rhino's and Razorbacks for tanks, unless you take a Multi-Melta or two, which then reduces the amount of wounds caused and the range at which they are caused. The squad cannot move or else it cannot fire, and any transport purchased for them is a weak 11 armor max.

 

Now two Exorcists operating in tandem. Averages 7 Missles between them and 4-5 hits of those 7 missles, and of those hits, they wound on 2's. So you will likely be killing (AP1) on 2's barring cover and invul saves. Now the real kicker is, if you fire this at a squad with a T4 multi-wound model (Captain, Chapter Master, Chaplain, Librarian, Master of the Forge), they likely die instantly if they ever fail their save, and with a range of 48" you should be able to widdle down those squads easily before they become threatening. The exo's are mobile so they can move and shoot, but shooting from inside cover is usually best, and they have a 13 front armor so they can't be taken down by anything with less than 7 strength in a straight fight no matter how many times shot.

 

 

In higher point games, the use of Retributors actually makes more sense since there will be less stuff in Transports and the need for versatility increases. One thing that Retributors do have going for them is they are less noticable than the Exorcists. Many opponents will ignore Retributors all game long if there is an Exorcist or two on the board.

[Chengar Qordath]

Well, as others have pointed out Retributors are a much better against non-MEQ armies than against MEQs; against armies like Eldar or Tau a heavy bolter wounds on a 2+ and denies any armor save, which makes the 12 guaranteed shots from Retributors far more valuable than the uncertain number of Exorcist shots.

[Toogeloo]

But you shouldn't be tailoring your list to be dependent on the foe you are facing. The Exorcists are good against all, the Retributors are only better against Nids, Guard, Tau, Orks, some Eldar and some Dark Eldar. With the new SM:C and all the variants like DA, BA, BT, and SW, and the Chaos armies, the AP1 Exorcists excel and are still the better choice since you are more likely to encounter these armies, especially in tournies.

[boreas]

Even then, against Nidzilla, exorcists will be better... Hence the importance of a varied list! I'll personally almost always go for a retributor squad (4 HB) over a third exorcist... Even more so that my "organ players" seem deaf or just plain stupid and insist upon shooting 1-2 missiles per turn and then fail to hit...

 

Phil

[WAR]

The last game I played using my sisters I had 10 retributors with 4 heavy bolters and a vss with an auspex and a bolter

auspex turn caused to pathfinders to die from heavy bolters, turn one Killed two warwalkers and by the end of the game caused two wounds on the wraithlord with help from DG

[OrdosInquisition]

I'd go with the squad of Retributors over the Exorcist. Particulary seeing as you use a Dominion Squad consisting of four Meltaguns and a Multi-Melta mounted Immolater, I mean with two other Meltaguns in troop squads I think you have more then enough Anti-Armour.

Not to mention that a line of Heavy Bolters is pretty good at exploding troop carrying Rhinos.

The Retributors would balance out your current force better and I think you'll find for something that looks to be a little overpriced, namely the Retributor squad, is well worth it in the end. If you've ever had the dilemma of not quite being able to reach the opponent to fill them full of divine guidance with your rapid fire or your partially out of range from long Bolter range, more often then not the Retributors can take that shot for you, also, given the range of Sisters weapons, this is the longest firing weapon we can throw on infantry.

A third exorcist is just not worth it in your current list, take the Retributors, they'll serve you well.

[Eltnot]

Your list looks quite large, roughly 2000 points I'm guessing? Some people have said you have plenty of anti tank and that you shouldn't take the third exorcist based on this. I disagree somewhat.

 

You do have a fair amount of melta weapons, but they are all clumped together. Your dominion squad is nasty if it makes it near a tank or monstrous creature, but I doubt you opponent is likely to let it do that easily. In fact it's probably one of the major targets to kill, and being only six strong, it isn't hard. Same goes for their Immolator transport.

 

After killing this unit, I need only disable two rhinos and your anti tank is now mostly reduced to the two exorcists. Versus armour 13 and 14, these will have great difficulty coping.

 

My suggestion is to either spread out your meltas amongst your squads more to give you more options when one unit gets taken out.

OR

Take the third Exorcist.

[ArmouredWing]

Even then, against Nidzilla, exorcists will be better...

Absolutely!

 

My last nid game I faced 2 HTs+guard (giving them retinue cover save) & 3 Carnifex and the combined firing of my 3 exorcists with some support from my PC servitor stripped the guard away from the tyrants and then started on the carnifex. The result was my opponent having his first game where he lost his entire synapse for his gribbles. I took some pretty heavy losses but the end result was a draw with KPs being equal all round.

 

Now to put 3 exorcists into context, it took them 3 rounds to do knock out the TG and then start laying into the other MC's (killing a Carnifex in the process). The following game for the nids was against a rail gun heavy tau force who failed to remove the TG's even though they maintained fire through the entire game.

 

Exorcists are a game winning choice, it's a no brainer and if you field 3 you can even out thhe bad rolls that can affect their performance if you have 1 or 2.