A SW rule viewpoint

[Beef]

Never mind all that What really amazes me is that a DA player suddenly pops up in here the second somebody even mentions them. They must have them little crittors hiding around the fang spying on us. Send out the wolves to sniff them out.

 

As for the original post If i ever come across a player like that I would just tell him where to shove that. Then cuss him a bit about being a prat and find another player. If i could not find another player i would give him the worst game of his life. (not by beating him but by being that annoying player everybody hates)

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

@beef: well, if you played Dark Angels, wouldn't you want to know how a REAL Space Marine fights?

 

wolf lord kieran

[flintlocklaser]

Never mind all that What really amazes me is that a DA player suddenly pops up in here the second somebody even mentions them. They must have them little crittors hiding around the fang spying on us. Send out the wolves to sniff them out.

 

Not at all. I've lost track of how many times I've said in this forum that I'm sitting on about 2000 points worth of 13th Company models, just waiting to see if GW disappears them when the new dex comes out or not. I've posted in this forum off and on, and I've always been reading it since if GW is stupid enough to remove the 13th Co. list I will end up fielding them using 'normal' Wolf rules with a 13th paintjob, so I'm also trying to get a handle on 'normal' Wolf tactics and lists. So like it or not, I'm here in the Fang, waiting patiently with the rest of the Greybeards for the new dex. If you're upset with me being here now, you're going to be positively sick of me when the new SW dex finally hits, because then I'll be posting in here a LOT. So relax and have an ale. Just don't bogart my Kriek.

[B_Steele]

We Blood Angels stop by occasionally, too...just to see the fireworks and perhaps paint a portrait of it later.

 

It is so difficult to quite get all of your drool and spittle quite right in oils, though.

 

On topic though, in my local area we are moving to try and get the tourney organiser to force ALL codices to use the most recent definition of any same-named wargear/vehicle trait/etc. So far it is going over pretty well and doesn't seem to change much except for eliminate new-player confusion.

 

Now...

 

*grabs charcoal pencil and sets up easel*

 

...please continue. :P

 

-Bry

[Roland Durendal]

Kinda funny that the BA's are having this same debate on their forum as we speak...i.e. following your rulebooks stats for certain weapons/upgrades

 

Its causing a big tadoo over there (and sort of in the DA section too) as most people are split as to whether certain pieces of equipment take stats from the new C:SM or the parent Dex. I know with regards to DA it was pretty much answered as "take from parent 'dex" as thats what the FAQ says, but for BA's its different. Main issue apparently is the CML.

 

Sorry that was neither here nor there.

 

To get back on topic....someone so obstinate as to refuse the ruling of the most recent and up to date FAQ is not someone worth playing

[Roguemarine]

I had this happen to me as well at the last open tourney i went to. The guy was playing with his brand spanking new "live" SM book, and then i went to shoot the assault cannon on the LS's i had he immediatley said you have to use your own wargear section, and then made me shoot 3 shots with NO rending the rest of the game...rather than argue this i simply let the guy believe he had me beat, then the 10 termies all Charmed up with lightning claws tore through the rest of his army...literally, there are still pieces of it for the carrion birds.

[Wolf89]

I had this happen to me as well at the last open tourney i went to. The guy was playing with his brand spanking new "live" SM book, and then i went to shoot the assault cannon on the LS's i had he immediatley said you have to use your own wargear section, and then made me shoot 3 shots with NO rending the rest of the game...rather than argue this i simply let the guy believe he had me beat, then the 10 termies all Charmed up with lightning claws tore through the rest of his army...literally, there are still pieces of it for the carrion birds.

 

Done like a true wolf. :D

 

I don't know why this is still debated by others who think they're smart saying "haha your AC is heavy 3 without rending... :D ", they just don't read the codex and know nothing of what they speak. As always the answer isn't hard to find, page 2 of C:SW should do nicely... ;)

 

-edit-

 

I mean if they pull that kind of crap, then just max out on plasma and enjoy not overheating, using the summary as they do for assault cannons, getting a wolf totem, fang of morkai, and last (but I'm sure there's more I just want to get my point across) but certainly not least... our power weapons (fist, frost axe, power weapon) allow NO SAVE (this includes invulnerable as it says NO SAVE)...

 

I think they'll see that this is a battle they won't win...

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

"like a true wolf..."

 

hell no! if some bag of douche wants to rules lawyer me to give himself a advantage, i will fight him to the last wire, if this means i have to go above the tourney runners head and call GW then i got my cellphone on me and i hope he is prepared to get whooped on the rules and on the table.

 

all lowering yourself down to his stupidity does is empower him.

 

wolf lord kieran

[Wolf89]

"like a true wolf..."

 

hell no! if some bag of douche wants to rules lawyer me to give himself a advantage, i will fight him to the last wire, if this means i have to go above the tourney runners head and call GW then i got my cellphone on me and i hope he is prepared to get whooped on the rules and on the table.

 

all lowering yourself down to his stupidity does is empower him.

 

wolf lord kieran

 

Sadly GW can't do anything to the TO... I've already tried... :D

[Bobman]

I had a look through this thread and thought... If someone wanted you to use out of date rules in our codex couldn't you pull out the 2nd ed codex and say "ok". :D

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

to be perfectly honest, i am the rules guru of my local group, which is to say i usually find the FAQs first, read up on them, and gently correct what other people may be doing incorrectly. So i havent any real problems at the moment rules-wise. a few people that agree with me shake their heads, but our local gamers have been gaming long enough to know how stupid GW really is.

 

the only thing i find sad about the local gamers is the DA/BA/BT gamers are not pushing for the new stuff. they are angry, but unwilling to play the game "unfair" as they see it. i think they got shafted, and told them to upgrade their crap. but none of them have.

 

must be something in the water.

 

Wolf Lord kieran

[WolfLordLars]

I agree, going along with the BS of "you cant use the new rules" only empowers those guys. Fight it. Tooth and nail. If you MUST do it, use ALL of the rules from our codex, including costs for tanks and such. Like was said, they want to go there, we will go there and come back again. That should adjust any attitudes.

[Grey Mage]

*shakes head* I am SO glad that the people in my area are just happy Im not pulling out my eldar like I have been for the last two years. Won 2/3 of the tournies around here when I played them... so far with wolves its ~1/3. That and theres a black templar player and a chaos player who know the SW rules well enough, if not intimitly to say that IM not a lying bastard.

 

Id have to become very upset if they called me a lying bastard. My girlfriend my have to arrest me.

[Wolf89]

My girlfriend my have to arrest me.

 

With fuzzy pink handcuffs?... :whistling: sorry had to be said...

 

I agree that you shouldn't allow it, but I was merely saying that he beat the crap out of the guy even though he wasn't allowed to use the new rules... not that he should have allowed it to happen...

 

No one ever questions me on a Space Wolves rule, they just accept it and know that I wouldn't try to swindle them out of anything, that's not why I play, if I wanted to win all the time I wouldn't be having fun, you have to loose occasionally to keep things interesting and on your toes. I have to admit though, with wolves and 13th co. I have yet to loose in 5th edition, and I can tell you having the new rules didn't make a difference at all for me, only a few games have been with the new rules and I would have won with either rules choice.

[Sarael]

Normally, when I drop in via pods, I spread my army out a little so as to not annihilate my opponent's important units entirely. I'd rather just weaken everything a little, so he still has a sporting chance (I prefer to win in assault anyway). However, if I'd run into this player myself, I'd have done exactly the same thing: pod in, annihilate his command w/ plasma, and stare at him menacingly from across the table. I'd also have all my plasma turned to face his devs or assaults or bikes, or whatever was his next most prized unit, just before the end of my turn.

 

It's one thing to play with grace, and it's another to show how rude you can be when your opponent gives you a rude ultimatum. Extreme? Yes, but the other guy was asking for it. You don't drop down ultimatums on someone of "do this or I won't play" then expect them to play nicely, especially not when the army they're playing has the potential to wipe out half of yours from one-shot combi-plas on the turn they deep strike.

[Wolf89]

I highly recommend destroying things in their entirety because with high mobility lists they can deny your KP's and you have to spend extra turns and units killing off just one or two members of a squad or something, it's just not worth it.

[Grey Mage]

War is not always the way. Violence is not always the answer. When it is know this: if you it them, make sure they can never return the favor to anyone again.

 

With the way KP's work, never ever leave a wounded soldier behind. Many of my opponents make this mistake, especially with my eldar. First thing I do is remove that last model left in the squad, and maybe his buddy, to cover where my opponent will have to take a couple turns to get into line of sight. I always did in third and fourth for that matter for three reasons: 1) why waste their lives? 2) Why give my opponent the victory points? 3) They might prove useful later.

 

That last one is especially important this edition as that lone dire avenger/ grey hunter can hold a table quarter for me!

[WolfLordLars]

War is not always the way. Violence is not always the answer. When it is know this: if you it them, make sure they can never return the favor to anyone again.

 

See my new sig quote (borrowed from Full Metal Jackie, late night radio metal DJ):

 

Violence. It might not be the answer, but it sure cuts down on the questions.

 

 

 

I eliminate entire units when possible. Especially if they can evade me (bikes/jump packs).

[Wolf89]

War is not always the way. Violence is not always the answer. When it is know this: if you it them, make sure they can never return the favor to anyone again.

 

With the way KP's work, never ever leave a wounded soldier behind. Many of my opponents make this mistake, especially with my eldar. First thing I do is remove that last model left in the squad, and maybe his buddy, to cover where my opponent will have to take a couple turns to get into line of sight. I always did in third and fourth for that matter for three reasons: 1) why waste their lives? 2) Why give my opponent the victory points? 3) They might prove useful later.

 

That last one is especially important this edition as that lone dire avenger/ grey hunter can hold a table quarter for me!

 

Exactly, I used this at the ard boyz holding one lonely objective with a hiding grey slayer, contested an objective with a lonely fenrisian space wolf... all while keeping them alive... perfect.

[Ullr Direfang]

well in the escalation league that is starting up here, i have bitten the bullet (putting of FOW for a few more weeks) and am going to buy the new C:SM. well i was in the store today, and the problematic guy up (he plays both smurfs and BA) i guess has been told that he needs to use his codex (PDF) for his BA not the C:SM (by the store owner). well i, fortunately, choose this time to ask the store owner about what the space wolves could use, so i would be "cheating", i want him to say yes or no. well the BA guy said i need to use it as written in my 'dex. i at this point pulled of the most recant FAQ and the little B&C FAQ by WolfLordLars (thought of saying "sheen-sparkle-sparkle", but contained my self) and gave it to the store owner. after he looked it over, he said i use equipment and vehicles, and upgrades from C:SM, but pay the points in my 'dex, except for the vehicles mentioned in the FAQ, i use the points from C:SM. i part i like was where he said, i use the points from my 'dex just for the vehicle, but it comes as in C:SM (ex. rhino 50 points w/ PMSB, smoke, SL) so that was cool. well the BA guy got so pissed he said he would never play his BA again, and switched his army to DE.

 

i'm not saying every BA/DA player is this way. the guy who got me into this forum, plays DA, still does, and wins with "sub-par" equipment. i wanted to make sure i would be fair, so i asked the person who would make those decisions, the store owner, that way i will always be backed up unless we both learn something new.

 

and if i hadn't beaten the guy into the floor once, when he made me use the stuff in the back of the 'dex, i might of been a little more pissed, but now i know i am in his head, and i love mind games.... :D

[WolfLordLars]

Awesome! Glad we could help!

[Wolf89]

Great stuff, I would push the issue about our Rhinos and Razorbacks, but it sounds like you've got enough of an advantage with getting your basic rules you should be getting anyways... :)

 

I've never seen a dedicated BA/DA player in my life, they always play at least one other army... for example, my good DA player also has necrons, tyranids, chaos, and eldar... as for my better BA player he plays tyranids, eldar and imperial guard as well... so your friend switching to DE sounds about right...

 

As WolfLordLars said, glad we could help. :wub:

[WolfLordLars]

To echo wolf... most DA/BA players tend to have second armies. There was one guy I remember who played BA and only BA, but he quit playing into 4th ed, and when I last saw him he had picked up another army (or turned his BA into a vanilla chapter?). Wolf players, on the other hand, tend to play few, if any, other armies. Usually something totally different from the wolves (Tau/Necrons/Eldar).

[Guest WG Vrox]

Wolf players, on the other hand, tend to play few, if any, other armies. Usually something totally different from the wolves (Tau/Necrons/Eldar).

 

Thats because slowly but surely all Nilla Marines models grow fangs, dawn pelts and get inducted into the ranks of the wolves. Resisting the induction of the wolf taint is a difficult thing to do.

 

Edit: Not Taint, bah trying to sell my Chaos army has infected my mind, I mean what Grey Mage says below, our glorious geneseed must be preserved and of course in dominite over others.

[Grey Mage]

Its not a taint.... the other marines dont become tainted?

 

Its just the Canis Helix finally activates, and so they hit puberty. Shortly there-after they go crazy for a bit, and then theyre adults and are allowed to drink alchohol and vote on who the next Wolf Lord will be.