Death Guard Tactica

[Evil Homer]

@ Ashe Darke

 

Couple of options:

(1) Termicide units to nail the medusa's

(2)Oblits to nail the other armor

(3)outflanking or infiltrating (or both) chosen

 

Any or all may work for you.

[Ashe Darke]

The whole point is to try and do it using DemetriiTZ's style of play/list which is what I use. I do appreciate what you're trying to say but your options aren't really on the table. I'm looking for different tactics not different lists as this is my tournament list I'm building not something that changes dependant on who I play. I've not lost with this list but I'm looking for tactics to allow me to do better with what I have. This isn't just for me, this is for anyone using this playing style who comes across an army like this as it would be nice for them to know what to do. I understand that maybe I'm doing the best I can and there's very little I can do but I was just seeing if someone else had some insights on tactics for the situation.

 

Termicide is risky as there's a good chance I'll deep strike off the board or onto hit units. He sets up his Medusas quite far back and behind the Chimeras so to get a clean shot I need to be on the other side of the Chimeras and that's landing between them and the board edge.

 

Oblits aren't in the list, as I've explained this is trying to make the most of a list that doesn't use them. If we're sticking very true to the fluff then they shouldn't be allowed Oblits anyway.

 

Can't infiltrate with Plague Marines.

[Requiemnex]

I do not play deathguard but recently picked up to boxes of plague marines to see what all the fuss is about... Man you took a jack hammer and hit the nail on the head. This is an amazing tactica and I found it to be VERY useful. You have made me re-think my champ/fist in my plasma squad... Still up in the air about it but man.. This allowed me to re-think my use of plague marines....

 

I play against space wolves and so I am not going to be the one charging very often because of their counter attack rule.

 

Thanks a ton!!

[incinerator950]

The whole point is to try and do it using DemetriiTZ's style of play/list which is what I use. I do appreciate what you're trying to say but your options aren't really on the table. I'm looking for different tactics not different lists as this is my tournament list I'm building not something that changes dependant on who I play. I've not lost with this list but I'm looking for tactics to allow me to do better with what I have. This isn't just for me, this is for anyone using this playing style who comes across an army like this as it would be nice for them to know what to do. I understand that maybe I'm doing the best I can and there's very little I can do but I was just seeing if someone else had some insights on tactics for the situation.

 

Termicide is risky as there's a good chance I'll deep strike off the board or onto hit units. He sets up his Medusas quite far back and behind the Chimeras so to get a clean shot I need to be on the other side of the Chimeras and that's landing between them and the board edge.

 

Oblits aren't in the list, as I've explained this is trying to make the most of a list that doesn't use them. If we're sticking very true to the fluff then they shouldn't be allowed Oblits anyway.

 

Can't infiltrate with Plague Marines.

 

I understand what you're getting at, alot of people who play 40k think a majority of their problems can be fixed when facing people is to change their lists because the game's tactics revolve around units instead of strategy.

 

Sorry I can't help you though, but good luck. This post is also probably late.

[Evil Homer]

@AD- your desire to not adapt a list to a new opponent is troubling. The CSM dex is crippled from the get go. The gaurd armies are are talking about, meched melta spam, multiple medusa's, PSB's builds, are all fairly common. DZ's initial list was indeed written when the old guard dex was current. Most decent gaurd armies are going to tear it apart (from a pure list standpoint). They can fit to much Anti-tank in for so little cost. The key to that army was you opponent not being able to handle both the Land Raiders and the T5 guys inside. Guard doesn't care about either. To much cheap low ap, to much cheap high strength.

 

Not wishing to adapt a list in light of the current game is asking for trouble. Lists evolve and change over time, while the tactics on a 40k table are relatively stable. There is just not much you can do with those raiders if the guard player can nail them early. You give the medusa's nice targets to shoot at and the LR has such a large body that even the scatter is not that scary.

 

Tactically if you insist on running that style list you have a few options. (1) start off the table, roll on 12" and pop smoke. You deny him a turn of shooting and by a second turn of cover saves. (2) Run the choo-choo train with Land Raiders leading and the DP's behind them, along with smaller mech elements. (3)Be willing to sac 1 LR to get the other, and other units, into position.

 

Ultimately I honesty feel you have to adapt strategically by changing the list. The Nid codex by all accounts is going to require radical rewrites of many lists, much as the Guard book did. My guard laugh at land raiders, and I don't run medusa's. I run manticore's and vendetta's, along with melta vets.

 

The chaos LR lists are mediocre at best, beginning with the land raiders themselves. PM are the best or second best thing in the book but LR's suck you ability to really make use of them right out of a list. While Oblit spam is boring, it is effective, and will give many armies a real headache. In a balanced all comers list both are quite effective.

[Ashe Darke]

Yeah nids will potentially require a re-think, but so far all other lists haven't been a problem. And seen is this is a tournament list I can't tailor it for this one guard list, then leave myself open to everything else where the previous one worked so well. So you can kinda see why I'm not so keen on radical changes. The times I've played the list I've not lost because I played better tactically and after more games I think I know what I need to. You go for the sneaky win where you might have taken a pounding but you still win by technicality. This has worked so far but I don't know if it will hold forever.

 

Taking oblits means my guys will be on foot meaning they're more likely to get mushed by Medusa's surely?

 

I've had a few ideas, slow playing is one. You get as close as possible and then try to open up as many Chimeras as possible while the Princes take out the Medusas. The squads can't take out the Raiders and once the men have spilled out then you tie as many of them as possible in combat. It's a bit death or glory though.

 

Your options sound like what I've considered or do but I keep a squad in a Rhino back to hold an objective, carefully placed out of LOS.

[Evil Homer]

Let me start with something I wrote for a blog I post on...

 

Its pretty rudimentary by I needed to write down and really conceptualize how I approached the game.

 

Table control begins prior to deployment. In any given scenario based game there are a minimum of 2 and maximum of 5 objectives. The 2 scenario game can be insta-draw but I’ll address that in the scenarios section.

 

You get to place objectives so does your opponent but you alternate placement. This gives you the opportunity to being controlling the table by dictating where play will happen.

 

In most multiple objective placement games play centers around a rough triangle with 12” sides. Careful placement on your part will include placing objectives in terrain. Because objective placement alternates you get a chance to make sure the triangle happens.

 

That triangle is the key to making this work. Basically you drop onto the triangle and hold your ground. The triangle limits the scope of your play, lets you concentrate your forces, and forces the opponent to play at you rather than you at him.

 

Let’s talk about objectives for a minute. If there are five objectives on a table how many do you to control to win?

 

Answer: 1 more than your opponent. How that does matter?

 

When you look at objectives on the table you need to identify straight away which ones you are playing for. Sanctjud over at 40k online had an interesting tactica a year or two ago that addresses this. When looking at objectives you need to decide how many to control, how many to contest and how many to cede to your opponent. If you try to play for all 5 objective in a 5 objective game you will get strung out an be unable to concentrate forces so, all due credit to Sanctjud when put a matrix together, I don’t remember if this one is the same as his but this is how I make that decision:

 

#objectives Control Contest

 

2 1 1

3 2 1

4 2 1

5 3 1

 

So in a 5 objective mission I pick 3 objectives I will control. I will cede 1 to my opponent straight away, and work to contest the other if I need to.

 

In a four objective mission I will pick 2 to control and look to contest 1 more. I will cede 1 to my opponent.

 

You get the idea. This idea of playing the game in a limited scope is the genesis of this defensive idea.

 

Anyhow by playing the game in a limited scope you maxmize your firepower. This really works for my list as I run multi-rhino triple vindi. Most marines armies excel at 12-24 inches and DG are no exception. If anything they are even better at that range.

 

If you move to oblits, then the PM go into rhinos. I solved my issues by moving into rhino's and taking vindicators. I play a table control game with my DG.

 

-EH

[Warmaster Phthisis]

I've been playing an aggressive, fluff-based, DG army for a while now. I'm about to rebuild the whole thing from the ground up. Before I spend my hard-earned money I want to get my list tweaked. I've got questions about two units.

 

First, I agree that Land Raiders are awesome, but I have a couple of issues. First is the confused combat role. Land Raiders are excellent transports and they are pretty good at busting enemy vehicles, but not both at the same time. I have three choices with a Land Raider: I can stay stationary and fire every weapon at the same target, I can move at combat speed and fire one lascannon or I can move at cruising speed and fire nothing. When on defense the answer to that question is easy, but when I'm facing IG or mechanized Eldar, it's not as clear whether I should be trying to take out vehicles or rushing. If I'm bringing a LR along with a bunch of Rhinos, then am obligated to rush forward along with them. Then after the squads are in assault, my lascannons aren't a part of my overall strategy any longer. Second is the points cost. In an army where I have to pay through the nose for everything I get my model count is usually dreadfully low. A Land Raider is a big chunk of points, points that could be used for a whole new PM squad or several vehicles.

I've been seriously thinking about not including Land Raiders in my army in favor of a pair of Predators armed with tl-lascannons and no sponson weapons. The points cost for two is only slightly less than a single LR and their front armor is almost as good. Each lascannon can pick separate targets, two tanks are harder to disable than one, and I can keep them firing even as my DG close on the enemy with haste. Can anyone explain to me why I would want to field a single Land Raider over two Predators as described?

 

My other question is about DPs. Everywhere I go I hear that twin DPs are the way to go. I'm not a big fan of using DPs because of fluff reasons, and I'm actually wondering how effective they really are. I'm running a Nurgle Lord with a Daemon Weapon and wings now and I've been somewhat pleased. I'm seriously considering adding a second lord with a Powerfist to my list. Yes, my Lord dies often, but every time I've seen a DP on the table I've seen him die too. Is there really that much of a tactical benefit of using a DP instead of a lord? The DP can get shot up crossing the table, but a Lord or Sorcerer can join a squad in a transport. Am I really crippling myself by not using a Daemon Prince?

[Evil Homer]

If it were me I would be tossing both LR's if your set on the fluff then I suppose you could run tri-las preds across all three HS slots. Mech the rest up in rhino's. What points value? I will assume 2k for the sake of discussion.

 

Demon Prince, MoN, Wings, Warptime. Your best friend. You get a couple of things from a DP you don't get from a lord. Toughness, Strength, 2d6 armor penetration, big huge target. See the strength is really in the PM's but if they are shooting at the DP then the PM get to hold objectives for a lot longer.

 

When paired with LR's it really becomes an issue. Do I shoot the LR's carrying something? Do I shoot the big ugly? It causes all kinds of targeting priority issues but that is predicated on there being something the LR that I need to stop from getting to my side of the table.

 

I have at least 3 big problems with Land Raiders in the CSM (1) Cost (2) they are a transport. pretending anything else is asking for trouble. (3) Better choices in the HS slots.

 

on point #2...LR's are transports that can shoot, not tanks that can carry troops. To run them as transports you need something to put in them. To justify the points outlay the soft innerards better be able to smash the other guy. It works the TH termies in the marines book because they can smash, alot of things, and you get access to the LRC. In the CSM its a another issue entirely. In the CSM you really only have 3 killy things to carry, Berserkers, termies and to a lesser extent chosen. You can carry PM's but why? You already pay a premium for the T5 and FNP, your going to pay again for a AV14 rolling bunker? Pass. Give me the rhino any time. If it gets popped I can always hide in the cover and go to ground if I need to. Now give me a landraider with Typhus and Abbadon in it and we'll talk.

 

The LR is entertaining but against quality lists and opponents I just don't see it working in a competitive environment often enough to justify the points. In a combined gods list it becomes a little different.

[Ashe Darke]

I've been playing an aggressive, fluff-based, DG army for a while now. I'm about to rebuild the whole thing from the ground up. Before I spend my hard-earned money I want to get my list tweaked. I've got questions about two units.

 

First, I agree that Land Raiders are awesome, but I have a couple of issues. First is the confused combat role. Land Raiders are excellent transports and they are pretty good at busting enemy vehicles, but not both at the same time. I have three choices with a Land Raider: I can stay stationary and fire every weapon at the same target, I can move at combat speed and fire one lascannon or I can move at cruising speed and fire nothing. When on defense the answer to that question is easy, but when I'm facing IG or mechanized Eldar, it's not as clear whether I should be trying to take out vehicles or rushing. If I'm bringing a LR along with a bunch of Rhinos, then am obligated to rush forward along with them. Then after the squads are in assault, my lascannons aren't a part of my overall strategy any longer. Second is the points cost. In an army where I have to pay through the nose for everything I get my model count is usually dreadfully low. A Land Raider is a big chunk of points, points that could be used for a whole new PM squad or several vehicles.

I've been seriously thinking about not including Land Raiders in my army in favor of a pair of Predators armed with tl-lascannons and no sponson weapons. The points cost for two is only slightly less than a single LR and their front armor is almost as good. Each lascannon can pick separate targets, two tanks are harder to disable than one, and I can keep them firing even as my DG close on the enemy with haste. Can anyone explain to me why I would want to field a single Land Raider over two Predators as described?

Okay so you want to keep your guys safe and the Raider is the best thing you have. You're AV14 all round. S8 can only glance and meltas not at half range need to get very lucky to wreck you. Lacannons are nothing to be scared of. They need 6s to penetrate, and that's assuming they hit. It's very rarely that a lascannon halts any of my plans. I tend to go with Daemonic Possession to ignore 1's and 2's which you'll see a lot of from glancing hits.

 

If it's a target you don't have to worry about charging into then move your full 12, you can always think about shooting once you've dropped your men off. But your first concern is closing the gap, you'll be tempted to move 6 and shoot. Don't. Your first concern is starting the grind of combat as soon as possible. It's also very psychological. Having most of your force with charge range in the next turn tends to scare the crap out of your opponent.

 

Now a list with something troublesome that you don't want to get near your marines, that's when you think about your guns. Eldar with their lance weapons or armies with ordnance, those are the kinda things you sacrifice a turn of moving to deal with.

 

Why you would want to take a Raider over 2 Preds? Ok well weapons wise you get more with the Raider, you also have a transport capacity in the form of a moving fortress (that also offers cover) which you can assault out of. This is one of the more important things. If you could assault out of Rhinos then things might be a bit different. The assault ramps combined with 12 inches of movement pretty much guarantees the charge. Combined with flamers and bolt pistols, that's one nasty charge. The Preds have 2 weapons between them and once they're gone they serve no other purpose other than potential units to contest while the Raider can lose 2 and still have a weapon left. They're weaker armoured and I assume used to shoot at other tanks. Well if you're in a Raider zooming towards them then it's not too much of an issue because of the slim chances of stopping a Raider. There's a few things that are good at stopping them. Lance, S9-10 Ordnance and Railguns and even the last isn't too bad if you can get a cover save (smoke launchers if you can't). So taking out enemy tanks isn't too much of a concern if they'll need to be very lucky to hurt you. Ideally they'll only be moving for 2 turns before you've dropped the guys off. One of which you'll have popped smoke in.

 

My other question is about DPs. Everywhere I go I hear that twin DPs are the way to go. I'm not a big fan of using DPs because of fluff reasons, and I'm actually wondering how effective they really are. I'm running a Nurgle Lord with a Daemon Weapon and wings now and I've been somewhat pleased. I'm seriously considering adding a second lord with a Powerfist to my list. Yes, my Lord dies often, but every time I've seen a DP on the table I've seen him die too. Is there really that much of a tactical benefit of using a DP instead of a lord? The DP can get shot up crossing the table, but a Lord or Sorcerer can join a squad in a transport. Am I really crippling myself by not using a Daemon Prince?

These guys are just nuts. I've played games where they have done all the work. The guys in the Raiders did sweet FA. The fact that you can get re-rolling hits and wounds generally needing 3's then 2's to kill most things is just amazing. You get 5 attacks on the charge and are initiative 5. So if you charge 10 Marines. You'll probably get 4-5 dead marines before they can touch you. And when they do they need 6's to wound you. I've had 2 full Dev squads with heavy bolters open up on one of my Princes only to take 1 wound off it. A game I played the other day he had god knows how many Tau firing on him and nothing happened. This isn't to say they're indestructible but they can really mess things up. Terminators are another good example. A 10 man squad will easily drop to 2 Princes with Warptime in a turn or two.

 

Why would you take 2? Because you can. And there are times when there's something nasty like a Wraithlord that one Prince can deal with but he'll take a pounding, but 2 will just crush. Two Princes are one of the dirtiest things you can field if you're Chaos. People know this which is why they get shot A LOT. Which might be why you've heard things like 'they suck, they just get shot'. This is where your Raiders come in. They provide mobile cover that you can hide your Princes behind and if they have wings then they can move at the same speed. This means they're also close to your troops to support them should they get in a bit of a tricky situation.

 

What else? They're Monstrous Creatures so they get 6+2D6 armour pen and ignore armour saves. That in itself is just amazing. You can rip through normal guys, termies, tanks all with ease. In fact I think 3 Princes with Warptime could take out a Wathound with slightly above average rolls. They're Eternal Warrior as well. If your Lord fails an invun from a powerfist he's toast.

 

I personally feel that the optimum load out for HQ choices is 2 Princes with Mon, Wings and Warptime. That's 175pts each for a beast of a unit. Other options to you are things like Nurgle's Rot. Not something I'd personally go for but I'm just one voice and there are many other people will testify to it's uses.

 

I wouldn't say you're crippling yourself by not taking a Prince but it's widely believed by many that the Lord is the weaker of the HQ choices. If you can hide your Prince behind a Raider and get him into their lines safely then you're laughing. And it's pretty easy to do.

 

I recommend them both based on my experience, they're good in your army and fun to use but essentially it's up to you. If your mates have and Raiders or Princes you can borrow then give it a try and see what you think. I hope that helps ;)

[Evil Homer]

As as aside...Nurgle's Rot may come into its own in a month or so. I may have to dig my DG out to see, but the new nids are supposedly going to be able to put alot of t3 on the table for cheap. DP don't really like to get bogged down.

[W. Balmephinstein]

That was seriously some awesome advise and I'm putting together a Nurgle DP w/wings right now. I'll purchase my second one in a week or so. I've never really ran Princes before due to my old DG tactics of just playing nothing but defensive army lists. But with 5th edition, a lot of the old drawbacks (no good long ranged weapons for death guard) are out of the window. Thanks a lot for the help and advise.

[W. Balmephinstein]

Hey guys,

I was trying to put together a decent 2000 point army list after reading the facts on the first page of this and wanted your opinion.

 

HQ : 1 DP w/ MoN, Wings, Warptime (fly swatter)

 

Troops: 1 Rhino w/ twin linked bolter carrying 10 Plague Marines (no weapon upgrade or champ) (fly paper)

2 Rhino's w/ twin linked bolters carrying 6 Plague Marines w/ 2 melta guns and champ w/ powerfist and twin linked bolter (scalpel)

1 Rhino w/ twin linked bolters carrying 9 Plague Marines w/ 2 plasma guns and a champ with a power fist and combi-plasma (Large Rocks) *for holding*

1 Land Raider with a combi-flamer carrying 9 Plague Marines w/ 2 flamers and a champ w/ powerfist and twin linked bolter

 

Heavy Support: 1 Defiler w/ reaper autocannon and twin linked flamer.

 

That comes to 1992 but don't really see where to throw in another 5-8 points.

 

I figured I have two scalpel squads to take apart tanks and high toughness characters, 1 fly paper squad to rush up and get problem units into combat so that the prince can rush into those combats and mop up, 1 erosion squad in a land raider that also has a flamer (3 flamer shots in 1 turn) and 8 more double tapping bolters or single tap pistols to wear at large, medium to low toughness squads.

 

Let me know what you all think :-)

[Ashe Darke]

Why all the extras? You have about 55 points of upgrades on stuff that in my opinion isn't needed. Twin-linked bolters on Rhinos and Champs are cheap but realistically do you need them? Will they really be all that useful? The Rhino comes with one already and when you put them on all your Rhinos it builds up.

 

I don't know about the differing squad sizes either. 7 seems to work and you're fall either side of the magic number. Maybe you have used them before and this works for you but 7 tends to be fine so trying squads of 7 might free up some more points to give you more room to try different things. Unless of course you've ran out of stuff and added them in to fill in the gaps.

 

Why do you need 9 guys to hold an objective? If they're in a Rhino then they're relatively safe. Placing your objective behind a building that blocks LoS and then them on that objective should mean you're holding all game. I assume the plasmas are there in case something nasty comes along. AV14 will be an issue for that unit for last turn contesting. Personally I'd go with Meltas but maybe you wanna stick them on an objective out in the open and shoot from the hatch.

 

Not keen on the Defiler either but it's your army and you might just be working with what you have. Personally I think they work best as a combat build, they come with fleet and will mash basic troops. They're big, not easy to hide and weak armoured.

 

I personally like Daemonic Possession of my Land Raiders, very handy. Extra Armour is also good if you just want to transport your troops. I'm also partial to Dozer Blades but that's because I like to just go straight through cover as it's quicker.

 

If possible I'd go for a 2nd Prince but again you might not have the model.

 

 

I wouldn't personally get too hung up on scalpel/fly paper stuff. If it helps you to think about it that way then that's great but make sure you know what each of your units are capable of and what they work well against. The metaphor is just a guide, not something to swear by.

[W. Balmephinstein]

Thanks again. Freeing up those twin-linked bolters and defiler left me with a good amount of points. I haven't placed them yet but was thinking of moving a vendicator up with the rhino and land raider geared for assault. As a way to dwindle whatever unit I'm moving towards with my main assaulting PM's (the flamer rhinos and the 10 man rhino) towards?

I figured 10 in the assaulting groups would be more useful than just 7, especially the no champ group meant to hold up their units until the DP arrives, but I'm going to try bumping them all down to 7. I've seen a lot of people swear by our old *magic* number, I guess 5th made me a bit greedy w/ points.

I don't have a 2nd Flying DP model just yet but will soon and will update the army list with one.

I'll update it all and get a game in with it and let you know the results.

[Ashe Darke]

Yeah I wasn't sure what the 10 man squad was going to do what with having no special weapons at all. If I had them I'd use them to support your other units, say you come across something that one squad can't deal with on their own or they get charged while already locked in combat and need support.

 

Vindicators work best when there's more than one, and usually with Daemonic Possession. Obliterators are another good option.

 

I hope it all works out :)

[DemetriiTZ]

Bump, in case any new Nurglings missed this on Page 2. Feel free to post your experiences with the new Tyranids, Space Wolves, and Guard in the meanwhile. :)

[Lord Rao]

I've only had one 2000pts game against the new Nids, but on the whole I'm kinda underwhelmed by them. They certainly haven't significantly increased in strength (which is actually a good thing if you, like myself, hate Codex creep). It might have been his army comp and his inexperience at using this new dex, but we both studied the new dex long and hard. They can field greater numbers for the same points as before, but what they get still has great trouble taking on your PMs, DPs, and LRs. The big guys are harder to get above T6 now, which really helps us. The fact that genestealers are now harder to get a 4+ Save has been widely documented on many of theboards but really is quite significant when you unload on them with bolters etc.

 

The tactics you (Demi) give for Orks basically apply to the nids, too: LRs and flamer spam, unload, assault, mop up. Anything within synapse range is still immune to fleeing as before, but the big guys are easier to take down. Make them your prio - once they're gone the rest is basically just mopping up. Even Tyranid Warriors will have trouble going toe to toe with PMs.

 

I tried out a list with a single DP and Typhus, just to shake things up and see how Typhus the Monster-Killer would get on. Well, he really comes into his own here, his Manreaper is just ace against the MCs, especially the ueber big ones like Trygons (I hate those). With the Wind of Chaos and Nurgle's Rot powers he can easily (easily!) get rid of swarms, too. Nothing spectacualrly unexpected, if anything it's nice to see the old tactics still more or less applicable.

 

That's just my 2cts so far.

 

 

LR

[Giga]

My nurgle army is still far from tabletop-playable, but I've played against the new nids with my vanilla marines, and I gotha say that they look to be less dangerous to the nurglites as they were in the old codex.

 

For one, they don't have frag grenades, so PM can safely take an assault from most nid organisms by simply sitting in cover and having a powerfist.

 

Meltaguns, lascannons, and powerfists now instant-kill many of the tyranid gribblies, making obliterators even better and making defilers much much killier.

 

The broodlord can no longer be singled out in close combat, but then it no longer has armor-ignoring attacks and has stopped being a HQ choice. Real nice.

 

 

 

 

Hive guard are going to be annoying as hell, as they pop rhinos with impunity. Likewise, zoanthropes are going to have a field day destroying any vehicles, so that's gonna be something plague players are going to have to neutralize fast.

 

The swarmlord, while quite dangerous, isn't actually going to be such a big deal against a nurgle army, I think. Kill his guards with plasma, melta, and lascannons, and assault the swarmlord with dual warptime daemon princes, and that should be the end of him. Swarmlord strikes first, but his str is 6, so he'll hit 3 times and make 1.5 wounds on a T6 daemon prince. Considering swarmlord+guard cost 460 pts, that's a really good deal.

[juggernot]

well, the only encounter i can add was a couple of Sundays ago, i played against them and the player had his two lictors try to attack my plague marines. even though he went first he only took out one guy out of nine. and my plague marines wiped them from the board. on the other side he threw his genestealers against my teammates seer council, none of the seer council died and the genestealers lost combat and ran off the board, i dont know if it made a difference but he was using the new genestealers that he gets to run for their benefits.

[DemetriiTZ]

Bump. :P Keep updating this with new information and battle reports, folks. I've not forgotten about it.

[SCOOBYSHAG]

I think I'm going to try something different. Instead of running 4 units of PM (at 1750/1850) I'm going to run 3 units of PM and a single unit of Berzerkers.

 

I think the unit of Berzerkers give an awesome offensive assault element to the PM nature of being tough and defensive. Plus it adds to unit priority confusion. With a DP or two, a unit of Berzerkers, and 3 heavy choices the PM's will be largely left alone to secure objectives (which the majority of games include).

 

What do you guys think? It's a theory, maybe I'm wrong?

 

In fact I am thinking of going one step further and substituting Khârn for a DP and maybe grabbing a Raider for the Berzerkers. Something like this:

 

Prince, Nurgle, Wings, Warptime 175

Khârn 165

 

4 Terminators 3xCombi-Melta,1xHeavy Flamer 140

 

7 PM, 2xMelta, Icon, Rhino 221

7 PM, 2xMelta, Icon, Rhino 221

7 PM, 2xPlasma, Icon, Rhino 231

7 BZ, Champ w/Fist 187

 

Vindicator, Possession 145

Defiler/2 Obliterators 150

Land Raider 220

 

This list may make the Berzerker unit w/Khârn in a Land Raider too big of a priority. I could throw the Berzerkers/Khârn in a Rhino (to keep their profile down a bit) and trade in the Raider for a couple Obliterators or a Predator (TL Lascannon, Heavy Bolters, Possession). Something like this:

 

Prince, Nurgle, Wings, Warptime 175

Khârn 165

 

4 Terminators 3xCombi-Melta,1xHeavy Flamer 140

 

7 PM, 2xMelta, Icon, Rhino 221

7 PM, 2xMelta, Icon, Rhino 221

7 PM, 2xPlasma, Icon, Rhino 231

7 BZ, Champ w/Fist, Rhino 222

 

Vindicator, Possession 145

Defiler/2 Obliterators 150

Predator, TL LC, Heavy Bolters, Possession 155

 

This leaves me 25 points to play with

[DemetriiTZ]

How many games versus Chimera / Pie Plate IG Spam have you had?

[SCOOBYSHAG]

If your referring to me, not too often. Mostly MEQ

[nurglez]

Had a game vs my friend's imperial guard army, 1500 points, my army was: warptime winged nurgle prince, 4x7 pm, 2 with champion, fist, combi flamer and 2 meltas, 1 with just 2 melta, and 1 with 2 plasma, 3 rhinos, 1 landraider with possession and a vindicator with possession.

 

His was command squad, vendette with 3 twin las with a veteran squad, storm troopers, few imperial guard squads with meltagun, 3 guys with autocannons, a demolisher and a leman russ.

 

Know his imperial guard list isnt optimised or totally overpowered, this is a good thing for me :P

 

game was 2 objectives in our deployment zones respectively, and we had a long table edge each, this game took place on 4x4 foot cos both of our objectives were on one side of the table. i went first, charged all my things forwards (using the plasma rhino empty to protect my vindicator+, and the plasma squad stayed on my home objective. he killed my poor landraider with his demolisher, and i returned the favor with my vindicator, alot of foot slogging later and at the end of turn 6 o had only 8 plaguemarines left over 3 squads, while he had 9 veterans, a leman russ and his vendette, but as 1 of my plaguemarines was contesting my home objective, and 2 plaguemarines were sat king of the hill on his, i just won :D

 

Imperial guard so far are rather nasty, but for them to get most of their toys they do seem to lack infantry, My friend did use to use 3 leman russ in his force but hes trying out some new armies, i have mentioned to him that some of the other artillery is alot nastier, so im sure he will use it eventually, but im allready thinking of replacing the landraider with a rhino for the squad and 2x3 termicide.