Brainstorming for my Raven Guard Successor!

[CantonWC]

Hey everybody,

 

Longtime lurker here, only recently signed on so I feel I might as well introduce myself before I launch into this thread. I’ve known about the Warhammer 40k universe for quite a while, but it was the Dawn of War game by Relic that really introduced me to the universe, and since then I’ve been a huge fan. Unfortunately I haven’t really involved myself in the wargaming aspect of the WH40k universe, being a poor college student and all, but I hope I can at least get into the modeling aspect of it sometime in the future. Now, as many of you probably know Relic Entertainment is going to release Dawn of War 2 very soon, Feb. 23rd to be exact, and I thought I might try my hand at my own Index Astartes so I have a little bit of back story for my Marines when gaming online. I’m a fairly decent/avid writer and love doing stuff like this, although I never seem able to finish them. I really want to try and see if I can make a proper go at this, and if it works out well I might follow up with a more detailed history or some short fiction.

 

Basically the way I hope to structure this thread is as follows: at regular intervals (1-2 weeks) I’ll be making a post in this thread addressing each of the major sections for my Chapter, like gene-seed, home world, combat doctrine, all the normal stuff, and maybe some minor stuff too like Chapter markings, symbols and whatnot. Anyone’s free to make suggestions or submit feedback. I don’t expect anyone to write this for me, but I would appreciate a good idea or a bump in the right direction when I’m stuck. Ideally that’s how it’s going to work, but intervening factors like school and personal life will probably slow things down a bit. And of course I want to spend as much time as is needed on each section, to make sure I really nail it and have a good idea of where I am going.

 

Now I’m no fluff guru or anything like that, otherwise I wouldn’t have made this thread, but I’m already pretty familiar with most aspects of the WH40k universe. I don’t have a lot of sources with me like Codexes and whatnot, but I can access them and will be referring to them where needed. In particular this site here is a pretty great resource, so kudos to you guys. I’ll mainly be asking questions, I think, about some of the subtler points not necessarily addressed by the fluff.

 

Index Astartes: Dark Swords

 

GENE-SEED (1/12/09)

 

So, I guess this is really where I should begin. I think that, in my heart of hearts I’m absolutely going through with a Raven Guard style Chapter, but for the sake of completeness I’ll briefly detail my other option, Ultramarines, if anyone wants to comment on that. For various reasons I’m going to discard most of the Progenitor Legions; they either have their own established plot points that I don’t want to muck around in, or their themes aren’t particularly appealing to me.

 

So, the Ultramarines are kind of like the “realistic” choice: they are the most respected Chapter, the purest gene-seed and all that jazz. No one’s going to raise a fuss if the High Lords of Terra found yet another Ultramarines successor. On the other hand, I’m kind of at a loss as to providing a specific reason for why the High Lords would commission the founding of a Raven Guard Successor, since at least some people in the right places would likely know about the Raven Guard’s damaged gene-seed, if not the reason for it. I’ve thought about pushing the date of their founding back as far as Third Founding or something; maybe no one had yet caught wind of the debasement of the RG gene-seed? Or maybe the High Lords wanted to commission a RG Chapter specifically for the infiltration and lightning strike skills they would likely inherit for dealing with a specific crisis? I dunno, I’m honestly at an impasse.

 

Now, if I go the Ultramarines route, the primary drive in their story would be how they eventually arrived at a more Raven Guard style of fighting (since I love them so much :P ). Maybe they train under the Raven Guard themselves or an RG successor, and gain great respect for their covert, high-mobility style of warfare. Or, they fight a foe like Alpha Legion, who of course don’t have a fixed, rigid doctrine, and despite themselves they adopt some of the same tactics to better fight such enemies in the future. Or they suffer a Crimson Fists style disaster and are forced to fight in a covert manner for the sake of survival. I don’t find this kind of story very compelling though, I can't think of anything else at this time to hook in the reader.

 

Overall I’m much more interested in the Raven Guard gene-seed and the impact this could have on a Successor Chapter. I mean think about it; the RG’s genetic debasement isn’t like the Blood Angels’ Black Rage, which is pretty bad or even worse, but they manage to turn it into a strength on the battlefield. Or the Space Wolves, where the Canis Helix is just part of them and their culture, for lack of a better way to explain it. Corax chose to use those zygote-acceleration techniques to rebuild his Legion despite the potential consequences. Maybe he didn’t have a choice in the dark days of the Horus Heresy; if he hadn’t his Legion might not have survived the war. But to be a RG Marine, to know that your own Primarch had done this terrible act to the Legion gene-seed, effectively crippling the potential of his future progeny, that must be a very heavy burden indeed.

 

I guess that’s part of the reason why I like Raven Guard. They’re cool, they’re stylish and they’ve got Shrike, but I would imagine that their genetic legacy is always hanging over them; that’s my interpretation anyway. Corax isn’t portrayed as some hard man like Russ or a golden boy like Guilliman. He’s full of guilt and shame. His most notable actions during the Heresy were the Istvaan disaster, and this terrible act of desperation, whether by choice or necessity, that resulted in the Weregeld abominations. They’re a legion of underdogs in my book.

 

Now of course it’s likely that only the Chapter Master, veterans and senior officers would be privy to this shameful secret. But I think that the frontline grunts can figure out easily enough that their gene-seed isn’t “right.” Maybe they can’t run as fast, push themselves as hard as their fellow Astartes. Maybe they can’t heal their wounds as well with their Larraman cells and are nicknamed “bleeders,” or they get dizzy easier with an inefficient Lyman’s ear; something that would never happen to the Ultramarines. Maybe they spend longer amounts of time under the care of the Apothecaries, being pumped full of drugs and chemicals to correct imbalances in malfunctioning organs. Maybe they see their friends die because their bodies just can’t take it. From reading their Index Astartes I never got the impression that the RG was especially zealous or fervent like some other Chapters. If they don’t necessarily turn to the Emperor or Corax in their times of doubt, who can they turn to? Would they perceive Corax differently than other Chapters would their own Primarchs because of what he had done, and would that affect how they view their world? How does a Chapter deal with the idea that maybe they’re “damaged goods,” inferior Marines? How do they rise above those doubts? That’s the reason the RG are so compelling to me, and why I want to explore an RG Successor Chapter.

 

I suppose this is an odd way to end a first post, but I wanted to also post a clip from “Batman Begins” (minor spoilers I guess):

 

The Will to Act

 

This clip, in addition to being a great scene, is also important to understanding how I tend to interpret the Raven Guard and where I intend to take an RG Successor because I have drawn a lot of inspiration from it. The idea of rising above one’s limitations, having the will to keep going in spite of those limitations.

 

(Apologize for weak thread-fu, I'm still not familiar with some of the fancier thread options and code tags and trying to figure out how to use them).

 

HOME WORLD (1/16/09)

 

Alright, so my University's Internet was completely screwed up for most of today, but now that it's back I can finally post my little meditation on the Home World section. Well, not little... I hadn't planned it to be as long as the huge chunks I've written before, but it didn't really turn out that way.

 

The Home World heading is kinda misleading however; early on when I decided to take up this project, I decided that the Dark Swords Chapter would absolutely be fleet-based, no ifs, ands or buts, so I haven't really given any thought whatsoever into creating a home world. I think that fleet-based meshes perfectly with my Chapter’s attitudes and philosophy. In particular I am inspired by a quote in the 5th edition Codex entry for Shrike, the RG poster boy and his 3rd company: “They go wherever they are most needed, not to battle zones where Imperial commanders struggle to contain the Ork menace, but to worlds whose populations have been abandoned to their fates by an overstretched and uncaring Imperium. Shrike and his men are legends on these worlds, as revered as the greatest heroes of old.”

 

So Shrike is evidently one of those old-school hero types. Saving the weak and helpless, sticking it to the bad guys and so on. That’s not to say other Space Marines aren’t old-school heroes too. But the Imperium is a pretty harsh place, as pointed out so many times before, and nice people tend to have short life expectancies. I’d imagine that most Space Marines, given the choice of the objective or the civilians, are going to go for the objective. Sacrifice a few to save the greater whole. Shrike wouldn’t think that way. He’ll make every effort to save those who cannot save themselves, not because it’s tactically viable but because it’s the right thing to do. I suppose that even after all the psycho-conditioning and harsh training, that Space Marines still do retain some semblance of humanity, but that’s a question a more knowledgeable person can ponder for me ^_^

 

Anyway, my Dark Swords will follow in pretty much the same vein. They’re a pretty pragmatic folk – I’ll be returning to that word a lot to describe them. They understand perfectly well that there’s a million, a million billion worlds out there and only a million Marines to safeguard them. So they take to the stars to better respond to emergencies. There are also some nice aesthetics that can be associated with fleet-based: a kind of freedom, of mysteriousness and not being burdened by the greater Imperium. If they don’t like the lip the Inquisition is giving them, they can just pack up and leave.

 

Of course that doesn’t mean they once had a home world however. I’ve been playing around with the idea that they initially have a home world, but it is destroyed by those nasty Eldar. It would be either Biel-tan coming to claim the Dark Swords' Home World, which is actually a Maiden World, or some Ulthwé Farseer has some vision that the Dark Swords will pose some kind of threat to the Eldar or the galaxy at large. The destruction of the Home World/Fortress Monastery along with maybe half the Chapter would give a reason for why they're fleet-based in the first place, and a chance to have a blood feud with a regularly recurring antagonist. Although everything, including this plot thread, is subject to change or removal.

 

Going fleet-based does raise up some issues, so I’ll cover them briefly:

 

Recruitment: This doesn’t really worry me. Most other famous Chapters seem to do fine with their recruitment. In particular the Black Templars, who have five to six thousand Marines, don’t seem to have any problems finding suitable recruits. The Dark Swords will have the opportunity to select the best recruits from a wide variety of worlds, with the usual preferences for death/feral worlds. Candidates will be screened based on the usual stringent requirements, with an added emphasis on personal initiative, ability to improvise and problem solving skills.

 

Training and Logistics: So, I’m not really familiar with the specific capabilities of Battle Barges and Strike Cruisers, other than the information on this site, which is admittedly somewhat vague. So if anyone here is fairly knowledgeable about how these vessels work, I would be appreciate it if you could enlighten me ^_^ Basically, since they’re a fleet-based Chapter, the vessels need to be self-sufficient; everything a home world and fortress-monastery could offer need to be on the vessels themselves. Training grounds (and a wide variety of environments too), chapels for the spiritual needs of the Dark Swords, an Apothecarium, Librarium, workshops and armories for producing weapons; so I'm not positive if I need to add a line on how the vessels are all extensively modified or whatever. I’ve read up once or twice on “forge ships,” which could be handy for my Chapter to have. Then again a forge ship would be like putting all your eggs in one basket, and I don’t think the Dark Swords would tolerate such a tactical liability, unless the forge ship was the most heavily armed and armored vessel in the fleet.

 

There's also the issue of how the Dark Swords resupply. I guess they stop by Forge Worlds every so often; could someone help me out here?

 

Fleet Size and Composition: I’m thinking the Dark Swords are going to be founded around M37; a “middling” Chapter, not too young, not too old. So no fancy toys or flying super-fortresses. The Chapter fleet is probably going to be a bit bigger than most; but at the same time I’m positive that the Dark Swords would be a “small” Chapter; losses are going to be harder to replace than with other Chapters, since I'm assuming that the amount of viable, mutation-free gene-seed they have in stock will be less than other Chapters, and also because the number of recruits coming in will likely not be consistent. I'm figuring an average of about 700-900 fighting men, not including senior staff and specialists, depending on battlefield losses and the above factors. Especially rough battles could push the Chapter to 600 or even 500 men.

 

The Chapter fleet itself will probably consist of one battle barge (a suitably intimidating name to be thought of later), about 6-7 Strike Cruisers, and numerous support/escort vessels. Ideally each Company would have its own Strike Cruiser so they can act independently, but I don't think I want to be pushing the envelope. I can't always have my cake and eat it :P

 

Segmentum: I haven’t really decided yet if the Dark Swords are really free-spirit types that will just go wherever the urge takes them, or if they’re going to patrol a specific segmentum. After having reviewed the handy list in the DIY guide, I’m thinking that Segmentum Ultima would be a good choice, as it’s the biggest segmentum and has a wide variety of enemies to fight. In particular there’s the Tau, who I absolutely despise, so any short fiction I write will probably feature the Dark Swords slaughtering the little upstarts in droves; I’m going with a gut feeling that my Chapter will be really anti-xenos for some reason.

 

That's it for now. There's so many questions, and so much to write, and I haven't even started yet ^_^ Please, please make comments and criticisms. Every post will contribute to making this Chapter more fleshed out and able to crush the enemies of Mankind.

 

CHAPTER ORGANIZATION (1/24/09)

 

So, I think, in opening this section, that I really do have to hand it to ol’ Roboute Guilliman. Even though everybody hates him and his Ultrasmurfs for being prats (or at least it seems that way :lol: ) he was still a pretty smart guy. I’m talking about the Codex Astartes of course; it lays out a fairly rational and well-thought out method of organization, and I don’t see any need to radically diverge from the Codex out of necessity. There is also, I think, a need to respect Corax, who was himself a supporter of the Codex; hence the Raven Guard adhere closely to its force organization and really only differ in terms of their tactical application. That being said, I’ll keep my options open.

 

I think it will be easiest if I just run straight down the list, from Chapter Master to Neophyte. I think that, barring any changes that may result from some epic campaign or life-changing event, all the usual leadership and specialist positions should remain as they normally are.

 

One slight change though; since the gene-seed is extremely unstable, the Dark Swords need to be especially mindful of the health of the Chapter, so there will be extra Apothecaries attached to each Company. At least, say, 3 Apothecaries, as decreed by Chapter Master such-and-such at such-and-such time, although in practice there are about five or six per Company, with the 1st Company having 8-10. At least one Apothecary will always be on hand for operations involving two to three squads; more Apothecaries are assigned to larger operations, obviously. I would say that each Dark Sword marine would be worth about 2-4 other marines from other Chapters in terms of the “cost” of replacing him in the event of his death; as a result the Dark Swords tend to be overly cautious, taught never to needlessly waste themselves in battle. The Apothecaries have the responsibility of doing everything in their power to ensure that as few marines as possible die under their watch, and retrieving their gene-seed in the event of their death; although I’m not sure if they would take up squad-level leadership roles as well.

 

The 1st Company will also operate a little differently than the norm; let’s see if I can’t justify the operational change. First off, I never really bought into the idea that the greenest members of the Chapter, the Neophytes, are charged with Scout duty. Maybe reconnaissance and light skirmishing, sure, but not missions deep behind enemy lines with little or no support. Since recruitment rates are low, it falls to the Veterans to take up infiltration and covert ops work. To me this makes far more sense than sending in the new blood to do such things – assigning what I view as the most dangerous missions to the oldest and most experienced Marines. Now, I haven’t really been taking the time to do in depth research on special forces and all that, but the Veterans will essentially operate exactly like one would expect an elite Spec. Ops team would – but that’s for the Combat Doctrine section.

 

Companies 2-5 are the Battle Companies, and are organized in more or less the same way as any other B.C.’s; but instead of a 6/2/2 for their Tactical/Assault/Devastator squads, they have 5/3/2 or even 4/4/2. This is not because they are an assault-heavy Chapter (although they do tend to assault a lot) but because they see the unparalleled mobility of jump packs as a huge advantage. This would be an example of the differences in tactical application that the RG are so famous for. They’re not going to go “Okay, Assault squads assault.” Assault squads can be so much more than that – quick, impromptu recon, tank hunting, guerilla raids, or running cover while the Tacs and Devs reposition themselves.

 

Companies 6-7, 8 and 9 are Tac, Assault, and Dev Reserves, respectively. Right now I don’t see any reason to change up what the Reserves normally do, so they’re pretty much going to behave exactly like any other Reserve Company. I am considering cutting back on bikes, because I don’t really think of the RG as being very “bikey,” but I can’t think of any good reasons to exclude bikes.

 

Now here’s where things get a little sticky. Since recruitment rates are low, I would assume that there actually aren’t enough Neophytes to form a proper Scout Company. Hence why the Veterans do infiltration missions instead. Instead, the Neophytes are subject to training and augmentation until they become true Space Marines. Then, they are inducted into the Devastator Reserve, where they become part of the “bodyguard Marines” that stand around while the guys with heavy weapons do all the dirty work. If they make it through in one piece, they might become heavy weapons wielders themselves if they’re good at that kind of thing, or get promoted to Tacs – and so on to Assault and Vets. So then, there’s this theme where the younger Marines are handling heavy weapons (still under the supervision of a capable Sergeant) and being farthest away from the action. Then they get promoted to Tacs, who are more mid-range. Then on to Assault and finally Vets, who are fighting face-to-face with the enemy with silenced bolt pistols and black-painted combat knives. So as a Marine gets older, he gets closer and closer to the enemy. Not perfect, I’ll admit, but it’s the best I got :P

 

Moar C&C needed!

[Sigismund Himself]

Welcome to the B&C and to the Liber.

 

So far, you've got an excellent handle on the issues that confront the Raven Guard geneseed. The way in which a successor can view their Primarch is indeed an interesting idea, something that you can really build the chapter's personality on. In which way do you think your chapter viewing Corax?

 

I dunno, I’m honestly at an impasse.

You could make there no clear reason why the High Lords did it. Just offer various reasons why they would use it but just don't settle on one. If you use a later founding, you can suggest that it may have been an attempt to actually fix the geneseed's errors, that may have worked in some areas or has actually damned the chapter to a slow death. I'm actually brainstorming for my own RG successor at the moment so I've come up with similar questions myself.

 

For fancying up posts and such with BB Coding, this article should help you out.

[CantonWC]

The way in which a successor can view their Primarch is indeed an interesting idea, something that you can really build the chapter's personality on. In which way do you think your chapter viewing Corax?

 

Well like I said before, in the Index Astartes does not make out the Raven Guard to be foaming at the mouth zealots like some other chapters. They acknowledge the Emperor as the master of Mankind but little more, and accordingly they do not accord the same level of worship that other Chapters might. Perhaps this is because of a more formal relationship between the Emperor himself and Corax; more of a general and his subordinate than father and son. This is really just conjecture though, since the IA says so frustratingly little. So I have to play around a bit, figure what may be plausible and what’s not.

 

The RG still do revere Corax as a mighty leader who could make the hard decisions when he had to. So maybe it could be that same formal relationship, a general and his lieutenants more than Primarch and gene-sons. Even their sermons are given over to post-battle analysis. So clearly they’re not zealots. Maybe it’s my own preferences showing through, but one other thing that attracted me to RG was the fact that they seemed to be so different from other Chapters. They never really fit into the “Techno-Knight” thing most other Chapters have going on. They’re more like an elite-of-the-elite black ops, special forces breed of soldier. Disciplined, cool-headed and pragmatic, willing to do what is necessary to finish the job, as opposed to what is wanted. They’re not going to plant a banner into the ground and do last stands, even if they could afford to. So they sneak through the shadows. They weaken their foes through surreptitious means until they can’t defend themselves from one massive, well-coordinated strike. They apply the minimum force in precisely the right place to achieve the maximum effect. Other Chapters would condemn them for cowardice; the RG probably wouldn’t care, because to them duty to the Imperium comes before personal honor. Maybe, just maybe, they’re one of the few, maybe the only military force that can see past all the superstition and lack of common sense pandemic to the Imperium.

 

So to answer your question; It’s incredibly difficult to say for sure, based on what little the IA says. Corax will still be revered as the father of Chapter and a supreme leader; no one’s going to dispute his skill or tactical prowess. But given a more formal relationship, most of the ministering the Chaplains would do would probably be given over to addressing their maimed genetic state. If the RG aren’t as given over to their Primarch as other Chapters might, other values and beliefs will come forward. Maybe an emphasis on self-reliance, for example. If the gene-seed is damaged, maybe the Chaplains will downplay that aspect of the Marine and focus on something else, like the will to surpass the limitations the damaged gene-seed puts on him. Obviously gene-seed is still important; I’m doing my best not to cross any fluff lines ;) But if your gene-seed can only get you so far, something else is needed. Having a drive, the determination to surpass the limitations of the body, whether through greater tactical skill and battlefield savvy or technology or whatever. A weak gene-seed is no excuse for less than exemplar service to the Emperor.

 

Now as for the higher ups, the ‘Inner Circle’ to use a Dark Angel term, views of Corax would likely be more divided. I can imagine the Chaplains of the Chapter debating endlessly on whether Corax’s attempt to artificially enhance the rebuilding of his Legion was in the right. Again not easy to say. Maybe some would walk away with the more positive conclusion, that this is Corax’s way of testing the true mettle of his sons. Others would take up the opposite tact; they are cursed and ill-fated, and Corax is to blame. I can’t imagine this position being popular though; a Chapter needs solidarity. Dissension in the ranks could destroy a Chapter more effectively than any outside enemy. Without more official fluff though, a lot of this is just shooting in the dark. It’s kind of cool to have a Chapter that’s undefined, but also sort of scary, cause you don’t know where the line is.

 

You could make there no clear reason why the High Lords did it. Just offer various reasons why they would use it but just don't settle on one. If you use a later founding, you can suggest that it may have been an attempt to actually fix the geneseed's errors, that may have worked in some areas or has actually damned the chapter to a slow death. I'm actually brainstorming for my own RG successor at the moment so I've come up with similar questions myself.

 

Hmm I don’t know if I’m cruel enough to actually condemn my Chapter to such an ignoble fate. Again maybe just personal preference. I think that thread is overused anyway; too many Chapters teetering on the brink of extinction or damnation or whatever. The Blood Angels probably have it worse than RG and they still seem to be pretty strong in the 41st millennium. The drive in the story would be in having that ignoble fate as the situation, but still having that ray of hope also, overcoming that adversity through their sheer determination to conquer the odds. I think the theme of having a choice to make one’s own fate instead of submitting to the one written in one’s own genes can and should be part of my Chapter.

 

Now if all else fails I can just make it so the records of their founding have been lost to time, but that’s being lazy ;) You are right though, that mutation can swing both ways, so perhaps some beneficial mutations can crop up to offset the negative ones.

[h6x6n]

First off, I'm going to say that I like what you have here. I like beefy IA articles, and you're in the midst of writing one that I see no problems with, only a few areas to resolve, and that's part of the love in the process, yea?

 

they’re one of the few, maybe the only military force that can see past all the superstition and lack of common sense pandemic to the Imperium

 

I love this sort of idea. I wouldn't be too exclusive about it, but the sense that they see the Emperor in more of a pre-heresy light is an interesting idea, although you'd have to make sure they at least went through the actions to please both the ecclesiasty and the inquisition. I'm not saying that they don't worship the Emperor, just that they see him...maybe more 50/50 than strictly the infallable holy excellent etc. etc. god-Emperor

 

A weak gene-seed is no excuse for less than exemplar service to the Emperor.

 

love this angle.

 

really I don't see much that needs to be fixed here, just tidied up, properly formatted, and formally written. I'm really looking forward to seeing this.

[CantonWC]

I love this sort of idea. I wouldn't be too exclusive about it, but the sense that they see the Emperor in more of a pre-heresy light is an interesting idea, although you'd have to make sure they at least went through the actions to please both the ecclesiasty and the inquisition. I'm not saying that they don't worship the Emperor, just that they see him...maybe more 50/50 than strictly the infallable holy excellent etc. etc. god-Emperor

 

You are correct in that regard. This is still the Imperium of Man, where being too different or willing to cross certain boundaries will mean an Inquisitor screaming 'Excommunicate Traitoris.' I think some of the most traditional and basic superstitions will remain in place - the Dark Swords will still see technology as akin to magic, leave all that stuff to the Techmarines, and so on.

 

Still, the RG are a little more 'secular' than most. They would be one of the first in line to affirm that the Emperor was a man - a great, almost godlike man, but a man. And unless he's sitting on his decayed rear in the Golden Throne having foreseen everything and prepared the mother of all gambits for a final victory, he was a man who made mistakes. The Horus Heresy still happened. He failed to be a father to some of his children and could not foresee that a full half did not have the mental discipline and will that he had. And he was crippled, not something that is thought of as the ideal fate for a god. If the RG are more inclined to see the Emperor through less rose-tinted glasses than most, would that affect their view of their world?

 

A quick question that occurred to me: since the Mucranoid is gone, and the Melanchrome malfunctioning, that would probably mean the RG and their Successors would need to take some precautions while operating in certain environments, such as space or planets with high levels of radiation. I'm not very familar with the technical details of power armor; would it be bending the rules too much to have the Chapter Techmarines sanctioning the addition of extra systems to the Chapter power armor? Such as a system that could mimic the Mucranoid, and maybe some other goodies like sound and heat dampening systems to aid in stealth. I'm having in mind the modular nature of the Mk 6-8 suits.

 

School is starting up again, ugh. I hope to have a talk on the Chapter Homeworld typed up and posted by the end of the week.

[h6x6n]

School is starting up again, ugh. I hope to have a talk on the Chapter Homeworld typed up and posted by the end of the week.

 

I feel you there. I am two days in and already have been assigned about 50 hours of homework

 

If the RG are more inclined to see the Emperor through less rose-tinted glasses than most, would that affect their view of their world?

 

I would think so. pre-heresy, the SM seemed to do what they did in service to the emperor because of his wisdom, believing that what they did was for the best interest of mankind. What they did was right to them because it served mankind, not the emperor. I think lacking some of that rose-tint would put their beliefs more towards that pre-heresy view instead of the post-heresy one where serving the emperor in battle is right because the emperor is divine.

 

Love what you've come up with so far.

[Marshal Rohr]

Sneaking through the shadows is a job for scouts, friend. Power Armor sneaks like a Mack truck glides.

 

You have really good ideas here, the geneseed angle is one that is not explored enough. The more conventional military approach is also a good one. You should do some research into SAS teams, Green Berets, Seals, that other really hard core UK SF unit, and CAG teams; and how, what for, and when they are deployed to give you some basics other than the overused loyalist alpha legion equivalent.

[CantonWC]

You should do some research into SAS teams, Green Berets, Seals, that other really hard core UK SF unit, and CAG teams; and how, what for, and when they are deployed to give you some basics other than the overused loyalist alpha legion equivalent.

 

Thanks for the tip.

 

Something occurred to me today when reading through the Raven Guard IA. According to the gene-seed section,

 

The genetic material of the Raven Guard was greatly damaged by the accelerated processes utilized following the Istvaan V Massacre. Much of the gene-stocks of the Raven Guard were lost or irreparably damaged and as such a significant portion of the Chapter’s genetic material comes from Terra.

 

So, my question is, what exactly does this mean for the RG? If mot of their gene-seed comes from Terra, does that mean that it is reasonably pure and free from mutation? Or did they just lose the capability to make gene-seed on their own and so had to rely on Terra? I would think that after ten thousand years the RG would be back on their feet and producing their own gene-seed again.

 

Is the genetic material from Terra pure? If so the new genetic material formed from the progenoid glands should be pure too right? Or is it still unstable? I have based my Chapter on the premise that the gene-seed continues to be unstable, so this little passage has gotten me rather confused.

 

My meditation on the Home World section for the Dark Swords is nearly complete and should be posted either tomorrow friday or on the weekend.

[CantonWC]

Home World section is now online and ready for C&C. Please comment, every post will only make the Dark Swords better. Only if my Chapter can not only survive the fire of criticism, but also grow stronger from it, will I judge them worthy of the Liber. Rising above limitation and all :D

[Commissar Molotov]

This is probably one of the best threads in the Liber in recent months. I like your thought processes and your writing style; I look forward to seeing where you go with your Chapter.

[Race Bannon]

So, my question is, what exactly does this mean for the RG? If mot of their gene-seed comes from Terra, does that mean that it is reasonably pure and free from mutation? Or did they just lose the capability to make gene-seed on their own and so had to rely on Terra? I would think that after ten thousand years the RG would be back on their feet and producing their own gene-seed again.

 

I'm far from the authority on the RG, but I too have delved deep into the RG IA as I wanted my DIY to mimic the RG. I made a different decision but I have my musing on the RG. No, the stock from Terra is tainted. I derive this because the Chapter still has to "tithe" material back to Terra, and this material is flawed. At the same time, only Terra is the source of material for the RG. This transfer may have been going on for thousands of years. But as described (thankfully) in the 5th edition rulebook: travel in the Imperium is dreadfully slow, with ships taking *months to years* getting between places. If they are unfortunate they may even arrive *before* they left(?!). This back-and-forth process may also have been "decreed" as SoP because of what Corax did to the gene-seed? Unsure, but Occam's Razor almost demands this to be true. I'll concede that the RG may have been developing their own methods of material replacement over 10 millenia, but what source would they have for this process, their own flawed material?

 

Is the genetic material from Terra pure? If so the new genetic material formed from the progenoid glands should be pure too right? Or is it still unstable? I have based my Chapter on the premise that the gene-seed continues to be unstable, so this little passage has gotten me rather confused.

 

I would postulate: no. As described above. And thus, I did not follow the RG for my DIY. :lol: But that doesn't mean their battlefield tactics, strategies and methodologies are singular to the RG only ... ever.

[CantonWC]

This is probably one of the best threads in the Liber in recent months. I like your thought processes and your writing style; I look forward to seeing where you go with your Chapter.

 

Well thank you sir for that. Coming from you that means a lot, what with your own Castigators being so well-developed (your Castigators thread is pretty intiimidating by the way). Truth be told though, your Castigators would probably despise my Dark Swords, as I perceive them to be opposites in a number of ways - the primary sticking point being the Dark Swords' debased gene-seed.

 

And thanks to Race Bannon for trying to make sense of the gene-seed problem - sort of.

 

I derive this because the Chapter still has to "tithe" material back to Terra, and this material is flawed.

 

Yeah but wouldn't this be the purest gene-seed they have? I mean, what I'm thinking is that they get some good gene-seed samples, but at the same time the rate of mutation is much higher than normal Chapters. Gah - this is really hard to answer because that passage is so damned vague, and I don't understand the specifics of gene-seed. Like when they say "damaged" or "mutated" or "unstable," is that the same thing or is it refering to different things?

 

This back-and-forth process may also have been "decreed" as SoP because of what Corax did to the gene-seed?

 

Well I wouldn't know about that. The guys in the know would of course know that the RG gene-seed has been damaged. But I don't think they would know that Corax specifically done something to it. If someone knew, they would ask questions, and if someone asked questions... I mean I would not at all put it past someone to order a purge.

 

Something else that occurred to me - if the RG still have their gene-seed supplied by the AdMech, then perhaps it is still basically good enough to use. It would be inferior to Guilliman and Dorn stock, but still functionally about the same. I dunno. I guess I'm trying to make sense of established fluff that I think can be contradictory at times. If the RG gene-seed is that bad, then I would think the AdMech would just withold it or destroy it; unless they do it out of respect for a First Founding Legion. Better for a Chapter to just die out rather than limp along. But then again, we also have Cursed Founding Chapters and the Blood Angels, that would also have to tithe gene-seed, and at least some of them are doing okay - or at least they not definitively listed as destroyed. Gah! See what I mean about contradictory fluff?

 

I'll concede that the RG may have been developing their own methods of material replacement over 10 millenia, but what source would they have for this process, their own flawed material?

 

Well, yes. If all they have left is damaged gene-seed, they'll use it I think. Duty still calls, and the RG must do what is necessary. This line of thought could easily be communicated to any successors.

 

But I could do this a number of ways. Maybe they will use only the pure gene-seed, and discard the ones too badly damaged to use? Or all of the gene-seed suffers from a degree of mutation, so they've got no choice. Or some "pure" gene-seed displays mutation later on and it must corrected by Apothecaries. But it can also go both ways - some Cursed Founding Chapters like the Sons of Antaeus (?) and Black Dragons have apparently beneficial mutations with no drawbacks. I haven't really thought about that as much because it could easily descend into the realm of gimmickry. But it's worth exploring.

 

More C&C needed!

[Race Bannon]

Now you have me in defense mode and that's a good thing because it's making me think about it again ^_^

 

wouldn't this be the purest gene-seed they have?

This suggests you think that the RG have some members who are better-off than others in gene-seed purity. At least it does to me. The IA says two things are missing from the gene-seed (can't recall off-the-top). To me, this suggests that THIS is the purest they can possibly have - for whatever reasons. Thus, the transfer of tithes to, and stock from, Terra do not have different varieties of purity. Almost 10K years later, the seed must have "stabilized" to have the flaws/instabilies/mutations/damages that are known: the ones described in the IA.

 

So, yes, the AdMech ARE providing gene-seed that is "good enough for government work" :P

 

To me, what is so bad about the RG gene-seed is what Corax did to it long ago. Such actions forced the situation to be what it is for the RG now: extreme control over the gene-seed. Thus, the RG cannot replenish it's ranks like the Ultra-seed users can ... because of the flaws made into the seed. Yay, Corax :rolleyes:

 

This does not mean to say that Weregeld show up anymore. But they DID. Doubt that they do anymore due to the controlling factor, but I concede that's conjecture on my part. As you say, the article is frustratingly unclear about the state of the seed now. But what they do say is that Successor Chapters didn't happen because of Corax's tampering. 10K years later may be a different story.

 

Ultimately, I'm saying, use the seed. It's got some flaws, but NOTHING like the Blood Angels or Space Wolves. The trick is explaining how the seed was allowed to be used by a different Chapter. The rest is explained because it would be the same problem the RG have: slow recruitment. That much is guaranteed.

[CantonWC]

This suggests you think that the RG have some members who are better-off than others in gene-seed purity. At least it does to me. The IA says two things are missing from the gene-seed (can't recall off-the-top). To me, this suggests that THIS is the purest they can possibly have - for whatever reasons. Thus, the transfer of tithes to, and stock from, Terra do not have different varieties of purity. Almost 10K years later, the seed must have "stabilized" to have the flaws/instabilies/mutations/damages that are known: the ones described in the IA.

 

Okay, so i guess what you're saying is that the RG gene-seed is relatively "pure" now? See the thing is that Dorn has two zygotes missing too, but their vaunted purity is one of their selling points. I dunno, I'm still of the view that RG stock still has a higher rate of mutation even "today."

 

This does not mean to say that Weregeld show up anymore. But they DID. Doubt that they do anymore due to the controlling factor, but I concede that's conjecture on my part.

 

Whoa there, I'm pretty certain that the Weregeld incident was a one-time episode. Although that's not to say I can revisit that legacy again. Corax after all decreed that the secret of the Weregeld should NEVER be known to outsiders. If a Weregeld mutation shows up again, the Chapter's cover could be compromised. Then, I don't know. I'm sure that mutation is just as good a reason as heresy or any other to purge a Chapter.

 

Ultimately, I'm saying, use the seed. It's got some flaws, but NOTHING like the Blood Angels or Space Wolves. The trick is explaining how the seed was allowed to be used by a different Chapter. The rest is explained because it would be the same problem the RG have: slow recruitment. That much is guaranteed.

 

That is the trick. I'm getting pretty frustrated by this, almost seriously considering crossing into "lost Chapter records, Dark or Cursed Founding hinted at" territory. Which isn't necessarily bad, but it can very easily descend into gimmickry, which I don't want.

 

 

I've been hit by a bad case of drinking and a sudden bolt of inspiration, more to come.

[Race Bannon]

Hmm. Yes, the gene-seed is as pure as it's going to get, yet not in the truest sense. So they can't spit acid or sleep-something. and their skin grows pale. Really, is that it?! That is prettylight in comparison to the Blood Angels.

 

The Weregeld: oops, my bad. Let's simply ignore that part in my ramblings. :blush:

 

The only explination I can consider to explain the RG's seed use is simply a matter of choice on the part of the High Lords or AdMech (whomever makes that decision). Maybe as a "test" of the gene-seed. Maybe one founding was determined to use all the stocks equally due to administrative concerns (:huh:). But the processes the RG are facing must be the Dark Swords as well: slow recruitment/low initiation numbers.

 

That may sound "too easy" or even circumstantial. But I would rather see that than going the "lost records" route. not that that is a bad thing either but that must be a workaround.

 

Again, I'm recommending that the RG's tactics can be copied ... if not their gene-seed.

[CantonWC]

The only explination I can consider to explain the RG's seed use is simply a matter of choice on the part of the High Lords or AdMech (whomever makes that decision). Maybe as a "test" of the gene-seed. Maybe one founding was determined to use all the stocks equally due to administrative concerns (). But the processes the RG are facing must be the Dark Swords as well: slow recruitment/low initiation numbers.

 

That may sound "too easy" or even circumstantial. But I would rather see that than going the "lost records" route. not that that is a bad thing either but that must be a workaround.

 

I agree. I think my best option is to go with Sigismund's suggestion, with a little compromise. Maybe a vague record of the Chapter's beginnings, and some Imperial Scholars offering various reasons for the Chapter's beginnings. I'm actually considering doing two things: a regular Index Astartes, which will be fairly short, because it is an "outsider" view of a fairly secretive Chapter. And an "Insider Astartes" containing first hand accounts of the history of the Chapter. Of the two, Insider Astartes is obviously going to be longer, require far more thought. but it's a labor of love, and I'm up for it.

 

Of course slow recruitment will still figure into the Dark Swords "culture" - I will make the case for them to truly become the best of the best to compensate. but I will discard any notion of the Dark Swords getting their stock from Terra. They will absolutely not tolerate anyone having a stake in controlling their gene-seed - if they have to go it alone, they go it alone.

 

Again, I'm recommending that the RG's tactics can be copied ... if not their gene-seed.

 

no, I can't do that :rolleyes: For reasons outlined above. I would bore you to death with a list of all the reasons why I picked RG, but it will suffice to say that the RG just haven't been explored enough.

 

I'm going to sound extremely arrogant with this statement, but I must be frank - browsing through this forum, a lot of the DIYs posted, for lack of a better word, suck. There's too much focus on making a story, on gimmicks and plot hooks, but there's no base for the Chapter to stand on. Hence the reason I made this thread - I must first make a very strong framework for my Dark Swords before I delve into story and fluff.

 

The RG are ideally suited for this - an extra layer of psychological depth provided by a tainted gene-seed that is rarely ever explored - except of course for the Blood Angels, but their gene-seed angle has to address the exact same thing over and over again. And of course the natural inclination for the RG to be a little more cautious, a little more contemplative - they're as much thinkers as warriors. Writing about how hard the Dark Swords are won't get them very far. i have to start with the basics - how they think, how they perceive their world, how they act on their views and principles. an account of the inner drama, the exploration of their collective psyche, can be just as compelling as a story of how grim and covered in skulls they are - combining the two will hopefully result in a perfect synthesis.

 

Ugh school - I'm falling behind and need to get back on the horse. I'm hoping to put up a Chapter Org. section by Friday or the weekend. Hoepfully it won't be long, sheesh.

[Sigismund Himself]

It would be either Biel-tan coming to claim the Dark Swords' Home World, which is actually a Maiden World, or some Ulthwé Farseer has some vision that the Dark Swords will pose some kind of threat to the Eldar or the galaxy at large. The destruction of the Home World/Fortress Monastery along with maybe half the Chapter would give a reason for why they're fleet-based in the first place, and a chance to have a blood feud with a regularly recurring antagonist.

I'd like to see how deeply this would affect the chapter. If the Apothecarium is lost with the Fortress Monastery, that would be a huge blow for the chapter. One that would be very hard to recover from at all. It's a bit hard to use such a plotline properly, because you don't want it to overwhelm the rest of the IA but you don't want to make it too insignificant.

 

So, I’m not really familiar with the specific capabilities of Battle Barges and Strike Cruisers, other than the information on this site, which is admittedly somewhat vague.

There's this and this, which may help. There's also this PDF, which may contain some more little bits of information not covered in the two articles linked above. Apart from that, I don't know if there's much more out there.

 

There's also the issue of how the Dark Swords resupply. I guess they stop by Forge Worlds every so often; could someone help me out here?

If the Dark Swords have a particular area of space through which they normally travel, then no doubt a relationship might form between a local forgeworld and the chapter. They could exchange vows of protection (either to the forgeworld or to their explorator fleets) in return for goods and materials. Or have the forgeworld have ancient debts to the chapter (for saving the forgeworld from an enemy, finding an STC fragment or saving an Explorator fleet) that is repaid in supplying marines.

[CantonWC]

I'd like to see how deeply this would affect the chapter. If the Apothecarium is lost with the Fortress Monastery, that would be a huge blow for the chapter. One that would be very hard to recover from at all. It's a bit hard to use such a plotline properly, because you don't want it to overwhelm the rest of the IA but you don't want to make it too insignificant.

 

Whoa, I'm not interested in ending the life of my Chapter as soon as it begins ;) I hadn't thought about how the gene-stocks would be destroyed along with the Fortress Monastery. Gotta play around with my Chapter's origins around a bit more. I picked up the Chapter destruction thing from the very well-written Grief Bringers (?) IA, as it fits in well with the Dark Swords' theme of conquering the odds.

 

And thanks for reminding me about Battlefleet Gothic, totally forgot about that :lol: lots of information for writing up space battles, if I get around to that. As a fleet-based Chapter, the Dark Swords will likely see their fair share of space combat.

 

If the Dark Swords have a particular area of space through which they normally travel, then no doubt a relationship might form between a local forgeworld and the chapter. They could exchange vows of protection (either to the forgeworld or to their explorator fleets) in return for goods and materials. Or have the forgeworld have ancient debts to the chapter (for saving the forgeworld from an enemy, finding an STC fragment or saving an Explorator fleet) that is repaid in supplying marines.

 

Hmm, I'm not sure that will work out, as I haven't really decided whether or not the Dark Swords follow a specific patrol route. Ultima Segmentum is a pretty big place, but I think they would even cross over into other Segmentum if they think it necessary - they go wherever they want to, or wherever they are needed.

 

I'm thinking maybe a covenant of some sort, that would allow them to resupply at any Forgeworld they encountered. Either that or have them almost entirely self-sufficient, only needing to rest and refit once every few decades. The Black Templars don't seem to have any problems keeping themselves well-stocked - then again they are a second founding Chapter...

[ShadowClaw]

Had to post here: Great Material! This forum alone aided me in leaping most of my brainstorming moguls. I still have the same issues of "what does it take to authorize a new chapter", "How are new chapters actually instituted, and by whom"... But since everyone here seems to share in our curiousity, I dont feel so pressed about it any longer.

 

My questions are these (in reguards to my home system for the Shadow Claws) :

 

Are there any "out of work" forge worlds? Would these still have humans living on them?

 

The reason I'm asking this is because I was looking to have my Chapter be based off of a system of Worlds that are made of decaying sprawl. Limping foreward and teeming with life, but still a sad representation of it's former industry. The outlying worlds would be Lush jungle and forested worlds, wild and untamed. Used mostly for the raw materials that would fuel the now silent forges.

 

How frequently does militias take over worlds/systems in the 40k universe? Are they ever composed of rogue Imperial Guard detatchments?

 

This question is here because I was thinking of having my Chapter seeing it's first real recorded combat against humans. The shadow claw would descend from the smog choked sky to "Liberate" these worlds from unloyal human powers.

 

About the gene-seed: I always viewed the seed as flawed but still workable(Barring the aforementioned skin changeing/acid spitting). And even though there are many useful and nondamaged gene seeds out there in the universe: nothing can rival pride and tradition. Though the sons of Corax may not epidomize the purity of body and perfection of heredity as other chapters may- they have their place in the universe and still serve the emperor and his people. Using other great traits that you've hit on already: self reliance and confidence. Faith in one's battle brothers. The sons of corax fight the wars of the 41st millenium the same as the sons of Guilliman and with less genetic inheritance!

Remembering your earlier post of Corax, and thinking of his feelings of remourse and shame(related to his gene seed tampering)... I also think of how his pride would swell seeing the perserverance and capabilities of his chapter and their offspring.

 

Side Note:

I've been in about the same boat as you with my DIY Raven Guard with a lot of the same leanings. (In fact I was about to accuse you of listening in on me and my geek friends at the watercooler) I've been playing my RG based Chapter for about six months now and I couldnt see any reason to adjust my tactics. Between the fun and fluidity of the chapter's gaming, there's no going back!

[CantonWC]

Hey, thanks for the words of encouragement. Making a DIY Chapter is definitely not easy ^_^ If you don't mind, would you put a link to your DIY, if you have it here?

 

As for the questions... I'll leave that to the professional fluff gurus :lol:

 

About the gene-seed: i'm going back and forth all the time on the issue of the gene-seed. One way i could do it is to have a high rate of mutation, so the overall amount of pure, stable gene-seed is lower than in other Chapters - so the rate of recruitment is lower than in other Chapters. Or, the other way is to have all the gene-seed exhibiting mutations - ranging from relatively minor to life-threatening or even beneficial. This would neccessitate more Apothecaries to monitor the health of all Marines and correct imbalances, probably specialized treatment for each Marines. Or a combo of both, or something else.

 

Update for Chapter Org. section is about halfway done, should be posted friday night or the weekend.

[daggitkiller]

Hello,

 

I too have been working on a RG successor chapter and this thread has helped me out a great deal (although I know this wasn't really your goal :) ).

 

My take on the geneseed is that it is not as flawed as say the Blood Angels. Normal Raven Guard have suffered in that it is a major struggle to keep the geneseed on course and further spawnings (if that's the right verb for geneseed) are full of unusable ones. This is why they have to go to the AM for seed. And as they try to grow more, it keeps veering off course. I also think this makes even fewer marines "take." It takes so long for more geneseed to be gathered that few successor chapters have been able to be commissioned, not because it's been a disaster (like Space Wolves).

 

For my chapter, I'm going with successors being a rarity and even getting this one up and running has taken forever. As they've suffered losses, the replacements have come slowly and their numbers have dwindled, which has affected organization.

 

Anyway, thanks for posting, I have enjoyed reading. I should be posting mine soon and look forward to everone's feedback.

[CantonWC]

Chapter Organization section is now online and ready for feedback.

 

Damn, it's like 3:00 over here. I'm going to bed.

[kyng72]

If the RG gene-seed is that bad, then I would think the AdMech would just withold it or destroy it; unless they do it out of respect for a First Founding Legion. Better for a Chapter to just die out rather than limp along. But then again, we also have Cursed Founding Chapters and the Blood Angels, that would also have to tithe gene-seed, and at least some of them are doing okay - or at least they not definitively listed as destroyed. Gah! See what I mean about contradictory fluff?

 

The AdMech still has the gene-seed from the traitor legions in thier vaults, though they will NEVER use the traitor legions gene-seed to found new chapters. So even mutated gene-seed would not be destroyed but maybe locked up in a vault labelled DO NOT USE.

[Ensis Ferrae]

i did some thinking on the purity of the Raven Guard geneseed last night, and came up with the thought that there still is some pure GS out there.... My reasoning behind this is that the legion wasnt wiped out at Istvaan, just very nearly... i was thinking that if the RG was about 90k strong, then under 10k walked out of istvaan, or was not present due to other duties. since we know the RG ethos is using as few men as possible, to strike the weakest area, where the most benefit will be brought with minimal risk to those few men, this means, at least to me, that the legion would almost NEVER be deployed as a whole, and that portions of it would be sent out on missions by themselves, or be sent to crusade with another legion, whatever the excuse may be. As an example, say that 3,000 ravens were able to get away from istvaan with their lives... that means that there would be at least 3k 'perfect' specimens of GS. some of those would of course, die from wounds, or be interred into dreads. this isnt to say that corax didnt use some of THAT stock to do his experiments on as that is entirely plausible as well..

 

i just think that even with his experiments, there was still some perfect seed around in the legion/chapter... and that this over time, could/should have made it over to the admech, for replication or whatever, thereby allowing over the span of 10k years, the infiltration of "purer and more stable" geneseed.

[Commissar Molotov]

Well thank you sir for that. Coming from you that means a lot, what with your own Castigators being so well-developed (your Castigators thread is pretty intiimidating by the way). Truth be told though, your Castigators would probably despise my Dark Swords, as I perceive them to be opposites in a number of ways - the primary sticking point being the Dark Swords' debased gene-seed.

 

An interesting viewpoint to be sure - especially given that in some ways your Chapter is shaping up to be similar to the Castigators! The increased attention given to maintaining and preserving the quality of gene-seed, the role of the Apothecarion and such shows that if you go too far in one direction you start coming back on yourself. ;) Despite being seeming opposites there are a number of interesting thematic similarities.

 

Would the Castigators despise the Dark Swords? Probably, but then I wouldn't want to meet a Castigator in a dark alley! They'd likely look down on all Chapters of the Raven Guard line for having debased their gene-seed and squandered their gene-seed, a precious gift from the Emperor. From a Castigator point of view, the Corax line is disadvantaged, having to work to overcome their inherent weaknesses. Moderate Castigators might respect them, but would certainly celebrate their own gene-line. :)

 

- My thoughts with Raven Guard Chapters is that, similarly to Chapters from the gene-line of Sanguinius, they would be more prevalent in earlier foundings. As the millennia progress, the proportion of new Ultramarines successors increases per founding, I figure. Earlier Chapters have the advantage that the full implications of the gene-tampering, etc might not have fully been realised. I always found IA: Raven Guard to be a little ambiguous as to whether Corax's experiments into the Weregeld actually happened before or after the Raven Guard legion split. I think you'd have to examine IA:RG carefully, line-by-line, to ascertain the truth. If the experiments were after, then it would suggest that the Black Guard/Raptors/Revilers would have far better gene-seed than the Raven Guard (we can assume.)

 

The other option with Chapters that have "undesirable" gene-seed is to have them spawn from the Cursed Founding, but then you'd have to invest time in coming up with a curse. It could easily tie into the ideas you have about rising above limitations, though. What strikes me as most interesting in a successor Chapter having to deal with debased gene-seed is their relationship to their Primarch; what precisely their view of Corax would be. I'd think that a Chapter with an ambiguous view towards their Primarch would be very interesting. Too many Chapters revere their Primarchs as demi-Gods, and a more pragmatic, morally-ambiguous slant would be much more 'real', and potentially far more interesting. It could also serve to differentiate them from other Raven Guard Chapters.

 

To my mind, the Age of Apostasy really cuts the ten thousand-year history of the Imperium in half. Also, consider that there have only been five Astartes Foundings since the Age of Apostasy, so it's difficult to call a Chapter created in M37 a 'middling' Chapter. I mean, sure they have something in the order of four thousand years of history, but... I suppose I see 2nd-19th Founding Chapters the "earlier" ones. Numerically, of course, Chapters around the thirteenth Founding would be in the middle.

 

I watched your clip from Batman Begins with great interest. It certainly has a lot of analogous potential for the Astartes. Rā's al Ghūl plays an interesting character - I can certainly see Liam Neeson as a Scout Sergeant! The development of Batman, the assumption of that personality is interesting when considering the development of a Space Marine. An interesting quote in that clip is 'you must become more than just a man in the mind of your opponent'. Psychological warfare is a key tool in the Space Marine's arsenal - hence why many of them wear bright colours to announce their arrival to the enemy. Of course the Raven Guard and their ilk take a slightly different tack, but their methods of war emphasise their superiority in the minds of their opponents, and it's something valuable indeed.

 

The will to act - the willingness to change the destinies of an entire galaxy, to fight against the darkness and restore the Emperor's realm. It's a powerful motivator - and it shows an interesting insight into the views of your Chapter. I would encourage you to look at 'Beliefs' over 'Homeworld' and the like. The Beliefs section is the heart of any good DIY Chapter. It's where your focus should be.

 

--

 

Being fleet-based makes the most sense for the Astartes. If you think about it, Space Marines take the top... well, for the sake of argument assume they take the top ~5% of a planet's population. Each Chapter would have its own criteria, whether that's strength-at-arms or biological compatability. Due to the recruiting practices of the Space Marines, their recruits never have children. In a sense, the Space Marines actually degrade the quality of the gene-pool by taking the best specimens. By travelling from world to work, the Astartes would be able to take a few recruits without damaging the "ecosystem" and would be able to leave planets "fallow" in order to let them repopulate. Of course, it's one of those things that we as fans of GW would usually cheerfully ignore - a universe with robotic walking undead gives can be allowed to stray a bit from "reality". With that said, your Chapter could recruit from multiple worlds to ensure that it gets the best candidates (genetically) that it can.

 

I would suggest that your Chapter has a general area in which it operates - doing so would enable it to maintain oaths and contracts with the Adeptus Mechanicus on particular forgeworlds. The Adeptus Mechanicus is not a homogenous entity; it's divided into factions and different Forgeworlds will often maintain different beliefs as to the Omnissiah and the like. You could look at having Serfs maintaining "Chapter Keeps" so as to safeguard a region of space and provide a flow of recruits/stockpiles of ammunition.

 

I agree that your Chapter likely would be under-strength, especially if they've resolved to try to keep your Chapter as genetically pure as possible. In times where the Chapter is drastically reduced in size, what would happen to your depleted Reserve Companies?

 

I think your organisation makes a great deal of sense - I can understand the Veteran Scouts, and the Blood Angels are noted to also utilise veterans in their Tenth Company. Obviously the Space Wolves also have their Veteran Scouts. It certainly works. With regards to your 4/4/2 organisation, Insignium Astartes does not that the Codex allows for some rearrangement as long as Tactical Squads are still in the majority (or, at least, not in the minority.) When you talked about mobile asasult squads it made me think that it's a shame you can't have assault marines with bolters - that would be a neat image, squads moving rapidly to provide fire support.