Chaos Dreadnoughts...

[Vomikron Noxis]

Greetings brothers, I've recently managed to get hold of the very cool Rogue Trader Chaos Dread, and have given into the temptation of including it in my army. This is directed at those of you who actually use Dreads, if so how do you make them work in terms of weapon options and tactics? I dont want to hear that Dreads suck and I should take something else, but rather how to make them work on the battlefield!

[Zeller]

*Dismissive hand* Dreads don't suck.

 

I used a dread with ML and TL-autocannon. I ran it right next to my entire army, my terminators even! Yes, I have lost marines from the Dreadnought but it was what...1-2 marines a game? I'm ok with that. The marines provide close combat support and plasma weapons. I'm sorry I don't have any kind of complex tactic for the dreadnought but I keep it simple. Frankly I find the 'Crazed' special rule fun and spicy.

 

I use my dread to move up with the infantry and provide the heavy weapon support. He takes out light tanks, heavy infantry, and any targets of opportunity. He is a fun unit.

[Rahveel]

people who say dreads suck are silly.

 

my preferd configuration is 2 ccw's to minimize the downsides of his random nature, but he can do well with most loadouts.

[the jeske]

the problem with the dreads is not the fact that they may shot your own troops , but the fact that in a world of random game lenght , they may stop and do nothing for a whole turn . now there are other units in the game that dont do something for a turn or two [drop poders , outflankers etc ] , but unlike the dreads when they come on the table they actually do something or put preasure on the enemy [they may not wipe a 10 man squad , but if not countered they may charge next turn or shot again etc]. dreads are nothing like that [unless they are plasma canon armed but then the problem of hiting your own troops becomes actually real]. they just dont have enough fire power , they are too slow as counter units [+you never know if all of the sudden they decide to stand and shot instead of tar piting some unit] and even if they get in to hth , the number of attacks [+the fact that fist exist and kraks are free for a lot of armies] they have dont make them the best unit for that.

 

sure one could run them alongside a LR [in bigger points as both the 1750 and 1850 pts LR rush build is very short on options and free pts] , but thats taking a 250+ tank + unit transported by it to use a very sub par option.

 

 

all in all , there are just better anti meq/anti tank /anti horde in the dex , but the fact that there is a chance you cant control the unit for a turn , land the unit a nice place with possessed and spawns.

[Vomikron Noxis]

Yep, while I'm sure that is all true, I love the model, and I WILL be using it, and so I'm interested in the best ways to make it work (though I certainly agree with you on its shortcomings, I dont consider the Dread to be a complete write off like some players seem to!)

[the jeske]

well either you go the gamer way and then there are better options in the codex or you go the dread fan way and then you dont care how effective they are . the main problems with dreads that aside for a list that spams MC [defilers dreads and DPs] there isnt much you can do with them and even in that list they are carried byt the other choices and the whole build works around the inabilty of a lot of "fluff" sm armies to deal with more then 3 such targets[just like a chaos demons army]. the random factor makes it impossible to make combos or support formations with them , as it takes too much effort to even do one thing with them [ you cant even count on them to keep up with transport] you always have to use another unit to babysit them .

[Berserker Doug]

I don't have my codex in front of me but, If you can keep dread on one side of no LOS towards you army the crazed shooting thing could only be directed to the enemy I believe.... Correct me if I"m wrong. I've wanted to field a few, witnessing first hand just how destructive those suckers are.

[CastratedCow]

This seems a good place to toss this question out there...

 

If the dread can draw LOS to something but can't hit it due to range, does he still have to waste a turn shooting his guns in the air?

[mightygoose]

no you treat it as the frenzy option, and vice versa if its immobilised

[Berserker Doug]

i think if us chaos players could take drop pod options for our dreads, they would be 100x better. but then of course it might be cheap if they assault next turn with blood frenzy....... (oooo very graphic images) ;)

[Bonham1963]

CSM needs a cheap plastic model. They aren't a tournament unit, as there are more stable units that do their job. Dreds are fun in a 'fun' game, as are possessed and chaos spawn, but hard earned money can be directed to reliable rhino transport, lots of troop choices and cheap HQ's, IMHO. When the new $30.00 plastic dreads make an appearance, then I'll play them occasionally in a fun game.

[Berserker Doug]

CSM needs a cheap plastic model. They aren't a tournament unit, as there are more stable units that do their job. Dreds are fun in a 'fun' game, as are possessed and chaos spawn, but hard earned money can be directed to reliable rhino transport, lots of troop choices and cheap HQ's, IMHO. When the new $30.00 plastic dreads make an appearance, then I'll play them occasionally in a fun game.

 

No joke sir. what I may end up doing is taking a loyalist dread and put some chaos stuff on it and make it look evil.....

 

metal models hate me

[Chaos Terminator Nero]

i have a black legion dread with a plasma cannon and a close combat weapon with built in flamer. i am mid campaign and my dread rolled insane 4 times in a row he destroyed a whole squad a reduced another to 50%. now i march the beast beside my landraider as none of his weaponry can make much of an impact. but if he was fitted with lasconnons he would be marched along beside a 5 man csm squad. i found that its a risky choice but then again its all on the roll.

[MojoJojo]

I just started (3 days ago) a chaos space marine force. Started out the the battleforce, added a box of 10 CSM's, 10 Berserkers and lord in Termi armor. Was really looking at either the Defiler or a Dread. At first glance the d6 roll to see how he behaves could wind up biting me in the backside, but I was thinking of fitting him w/ 2 CCW's and the flamer option. Just making sure that there is nothing near flame template range (other than vehicles w/ armor that is), 5 attacks (on the assault) at ws4/I4 seem to be a pretty convincing factor in taking him. I was really impressed w/ the mortis TL Auto Cannons I ordered for 2 of my loyalist dreads, so I started looking at the Nurgle Dread. Looks like an incredible model, and yeah, he will probably cost around $70 total w/ the 2 CCW arms.

[infowar]

Just bought the metal chaos dread, and I am definitely happy with it. I like a nice, heavy model with the more "baroque" chaos styling. I really am not concerned about game performance as much as I am inspired to field a great looking model. Besides, in a dice based game you should always expect the unexpected-- I am not a big fan of statistically derived army lists I guess.

 

I would have rather paid less for the model, of course, but I will miss a lot of GW metal stuff, like the dreadnought.

[Brother Blackbone]

I hate mentioning things that begin like, "my buddy.." but my buddy is running two last princes and two dreads with extra CCWs. He is loving them.

 

- Blackbone

[DracoDarco]

i personally use the loyalist dread from assault on black reach, and it hasn't let me down once and with only a multi melta its well worth the points. It will usually be useful if you run it up blasting. Also the crazed rule just adds to the fun :tu:

[theredcorsair]

It;s just a little random and risky. Anyways you could take an oblits instead and still have alot of killing power

[AekoldHelbrass]

As for me, you will never take dread and will expect him to play some important role in your strategy. You can take it as support, as nail for enemy's ass... And playing lower than 1250 points and lower it is small space for support.

[Dark Disciple]

Well I used to run a Plamsa Cannon, flamer dreadnaught in my old Black Legion Tournament list. Yep I really did say torunament. And to be Honest I never once had a problem with him. Use Terrain to block his line of sight, failing that just make sure that he can see the enemey at all times.

Your other option if you want to play it safe would be to arm him with a second close combat weapon and replace his origeonal with a missile launcher. That way you can frag your own guys and use Kraks on their MEQs.

I'm glad to see someone using a dread though. I wish you good luck with him!

 

Disciple

[Roultox]

I owned 4 dreads once upon a time in 3rd. Back then, it was the same rule. I thought, "Gee, glad they made these models pewter, I wouldn't feel better if I wasn't allowed to drop them, these things are tough". Then when 4th rolled around, I used a few from time to time in their melee configurations, it was fun. In 5th, yar, melee makes it as the cheaper dreadnoughts of the game. Slap I2 dreads, slaughter I4 wraithlords if they get the charge, and run run run.

 

I like them, packing 3 defilers and 2 princes along with a measly greater daemon. I dont like the name 'zilla, thats for 'nids, I prefer "Kong List".

 

Dreads have a place in my lists, just not with any guns bigger then TL-bolters.

[minigun762]

Bringing this back to life because I don't want to start yet another Dreadnought topic.

 

With the understanding that Dreadnoughts are at best, a subpar unit, I was thinking of a particular configuration that might be semi-useful.

For 105 points, the same as a Termicide squad, you could get a Missile Launcher/Heavy Bolter squad.

 

My main logic with this config is two-fold

1) The main flaw of the "safe" 2x DCCW combo is that you're relying on a walking unit to get into assault and that might take forever so you really need some kind of ranged attack to have any kind of impact on the battlefield.

2) The Heavy Bolter/Missile Launcher combo is basically 0 threat to your own troops if they're in a Rhino as you can fire Frags and S5 will only ever glance it (even then its unlikely). However against enemy infantry 2 blasts and 6 TL shots can put the hurt on a squad. In essence this gives you a mobile long range gun platform once you're Heavy spots are taken without breaking the bank.

 

EDIT: Deployment-wise, I think putting him by himself on a lone flank would be perfect. Just keep terrain between him and your troops and treat him as a cheap fire support unit. We have to remember that if you're smart, you can always get the Fire Frenzy to work for you and 2x the shots can help murder a squad or light vehicle.

 

2nd EDIT: There is also the Plasma Cannon, same cheap price and more of a threat, but I'm scare of AP2 blasts hitting my own guys. Again might be useful if you can deny LOS

[GunnarRedsun]

Ok, i ALWAYS run a dread. Especially in my fallen. Heck, my khornate sisters have 3. i outfit with 2 dccws, sometimes with a missle launcher. personally, i don't care if they don't do anything for a turn or two. heck i hope they do. there is a reason for it, while i always run them. they die. they do, and it makes me kinda sad (as i do love the models), but when they die, that means something else ISN'T being shot, and thats well worth 100, 110 points. because most of the things my opponents throw at them for a turn or two are expensive enough, and could damage me enough, that they are totally worth it for the distraction. and when they do get in, its awesome. great there are powerfists, but every vehicle falls to power fists, plus the dread strikes first. with 2 dccws it can at least screw up a squad before that. yes there are krak missles, but wouldn't you rather have krak missles at a big distraction than my men. but thats me.

 

now as far as running them, what i usually do is to have the dread in front of a unit or two of fire support squads a little bit, like noise marines or 1k sons, and march forward, and pray for the it to blood rage. if it fire frenzies, thats ok, as it will likely be shooting at the enemy, if it does nothing special, all the better. on the first turn i run if able, and always try to keep the dreads in front. the reason is they will likely be shot to crap and blown up. good, as my men are now in good positions to shoot, and if not, then they are safe (well maybe) in combat, and will tear up there. the only time i have problems with mine are when i tried the plasma cannon, missle combo. that just blew me to crap, but that was also last edition.

[the jeske]

there is a reason for it, while i always run them. they die. they do, and it makes me kinda sad (as i do love the models), but when they die, that means something else ISN'T being shot, and thats well worth 100, 110 points.

I can take a termicide squad for that . it will just as well draw fire away and its more killy.

[GunnarRedsun]

personally, i find 1) the termicide sqauds don't live long enough (but thats me), and 2) dreads are bigger. Bigger mean scarier. i always make sure my dreads are big, converted, monstrosities. why is this? because it catches peoples eyes, and simple psychology says that when done properly, this simple element makes them infinitly more distracting than terminators. can the termicide squads be more killy at range? yes. in combat? hell yes. but the dread is scarier, and when used right (i.e. converted and played up) can spur the migdela (god my spelling is off, the animal part of the brain, you know the instincts) to kick in, and the other person to want to kill it. it makes people attack the dread more. more shots, heck sometimes from units that have almost 0 chance of hurting it. and that is great. Sun Tzu tells us that wars are won and fought not in the field of battle, but in the hearts and minds of the men fighting them. and in 40k, by the players playing. i find many games are done before set-up is finished. why? because i can oft times tell how scared certain people are of certain units (like say my blood claws, or dreadnoughts) and can easily play off this. and thats why i play dreadnoughts. its the psychology of it man, and that seems to be an element so many people don't get. i suppose thats how so many games. For some reason people get scared when kroot stop at 6 inches or less and rapid fire, or plague marines just charge recklessly into combat, or havocs have the mark of khorne. anyways, i hope you understand better why i do this, if not i'll gladly explain more and better, well...at least after some food and caffeine, my blood sugar is all off right now :lol: