He'Stan

[shrike22]

It says in He'Stan's entry that all unit in the ary lose the combat tactics rule and thunder hammerss count as master crafted all flamers, heavy flamers, meltaguns and multi meltas count as twin linked. I was ondering how this would work with Cassius and his combi-flamer, it could be a stuid question but i was just wondering.

 

 

Thanks for answering, when you do.

[Steelmage99]

By RAW, no.

[Cedric]

By RAW, yes.

 

A combi-flamer is still a flamer, although only with a single shot.

[Steelmage99]

No, a Combi-flamer is by RAW a distinct weapon (that happens to fire like a Flamer).

 

It is not mentioned in the list of weapons that is twinlinked by He'stan.

[Cedric]

Please read the Wargear section regarding combi weapons in the codex. It clearly says that combi weapons are both bolters and an additional secondary weapon. The secondary weapon in this case is a flamer.

 

Each (combi weapon) has been expertly converted to house another weapon, either a meltagun, plasmagun or flamer. This extra weapon carries only a limited charge [...]

[Master_Matteo]

it wouldnt matter either way, because his combi flamer is already mastercrafted.

[SeattleDV8]

Cedric is correct, combi weapons Are the same as the extra weapon( when firing in that mode).

[yergerjo]

Master-crafted allows you to reroll 1 miss (eg when you rapid fire), with Vulkan it's twin-linked which means you reroll all misses on the flamer template.

[Maligoare]

Master-crafted allows you to reroll 1 miss (eg when you rapid fire), with Vulkan it's twin-linked which means you reroll all misses on the flamer template.

 

Twin linking a template weapon allows you to re-roll failed to wound rolls. It's an interesting quistion what Master Crafting does for a template weapon. Would it be useless, or would it allow a re-roll of one failed to-wound roll in a similar way to twin linking?

[yergerjo]

re-roll failed to wound rolls.

 

Thats what I meant...sorry was early morning typing, hadn't had coffee yet.

 

It's an interesting question what Master Crafting does for a template weapon. Would it be useless, or would it allow a re-roll of one failed to-wound roll in a similar way to twin linking?

 

At worst, useless-At best re-roll 1.

 

I know that twin-linked blast templates get to re-roll scatter instead of wounds.

 

Personally, I'd let you re-roll the 1 on the flame template for master-crafted.

[Seahawk]

I'm gonna tack this one on here too:

 

Is his Gauntlet of the Forge twin-linked? By RAW probably not, as it is a Gauntlet of the Forge that fires with the same profile as a heavy flamer, not a heavy flamer by name. By RAI he definitely should be twinlinked...duh. Sorry if it was already elsewhere, but this was too convenient :).

[shrike22]

Thanks everyone, you have once again been helpful.

[nurglez]

Is his Gauntlet of the Forge twin-linked? By RAW probably not, as it is a Gauntlet of the Forge that fires with the same profile as a heavy flamer, not a heavy flamer by name.

 

his gauntlet of the forge "can be fired as a heavy flamer".

 

Hence, its a twin linked heavy flamer :D

[Roland Durendal]

Actually the issue of his gauntles has been debated endless on here earlier. And the general sticking point was "counts as" does not equal "is".

 

Ergo just because it has the same profile as a heavy flamer and fires like one, does not a heavy flamer make. Indeed someone emailed the rules boys this question along with the whole Sisters of Battle issue and the rules boy (though we loathe to listen to them) basically said no his gauntlet is not MC'd as it is not specifically mentioned as being one of the weapons that gets it (i.e. it is not a Heavy Flamer, Flamer, MG, or MM). As for the Combi-weapon, because it states that you fire the secondary weapon as per that weapons specific rules listed elsewhere in the codex (me paraphrasing cuz I'm too lazy to copy the exact wording), it would in fact, on the turn your fired the flamer, be MC'd.

 

Oh and if you were wondering what the rulez boy said bout SoB and He'Stan...he sided with RAI folks such as myself. I.e. no the sisters flamers and meltas are not MC'd. Search around, you'll find the thread on here somewhere

[maturin]

Here's the thread (one of them, anyways) mentioned above:

 

Vulkan/Gauntlet/Sisters Thread

 

I linked to page 4 of the discussion as Lagrath's answer halfway down the page convinced me. The debate rages on, of course. As Roland mentions, the debate centers on the phrase "This armored gauntlet can be fired as a heavy flamer."

 

For some people, this means it isn't a heavy flamer. For others (and as Lagrath argues) it means it IS a heavy flamer. I'm of the latter opinion - to me, the original phrase is a lot closer to "...is a heavy flamer" than the alternative "...fired as if it were a heavy flamer", or "...fired as a strength 5 AP 4 template weapon." Heavy flamer mentioned... so it's a heavy flamer.

 

 

But as always, the English language, and the rulebook grammar, is muddy. Deal. ;)

[yergerjo]

If you think of it in the "counts as" sense

 

Hi, I'm Billy Bob McBig-Hands, Chapter Master of the Redneck Rejects Space Marine Chapter. I "count as" Marneus Calgar with all the same abilities, stats, wargear, and "uniqueness". Therefore I am Marneus Calgar per RAW.