Grey Mage Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 So are there any leadership modifiers in 40k outside of assault? Secondly does anyone know of any modifiers outside of leadership in 3rd edition? Secondly, does anyone know of any modifiers to leadership besides those for outnumbering in the assault phase from 3rd edition? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 There are none in the basic game rules, really, except for ordnance barrage, which will have the nit test for pinning with -1. There are a few codex specific rules, though, like the Tyranid psychic scream, a witchhunter psychic power, and a Blood Angels death mask IIRC, from the top of my head. Of course, the Imperial Guard get's certain bonuses from advisors or doctrines (close order drill). I am not sure I understand your second question. Was that a typo "leadership", or do you mean modifying any stat besides leadership? There are of course items and rules that modify stats of the model having them, but some items have negative modifiers on enemy. Carnifexes can get a biomorph that will reduce the WS of enemy models by -1, for example. There are a few rules that reduce the number of attacks, like tentacle whip, DE WHyches or Dire Avengers. Some rules increase or reduce cover saves. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1914820 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 It's an interesting question Grey Mage why did you want to know? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1914846 Share on other sites More sharing options...
nighthawks Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 there are also fists, relic blades, lances, and other weapons that increase/augment user strength, modify AP results, or modify armour values. lots of rule affect leadership stats, # of attacks, strength, initiative, or to-hit rolls. I'm sure there's a special rule out there that will modify any specific characteristic if you dig deep enough. but as isiah said - interesting question... what prompts it? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1915016 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 While there are modifiers to Leadership (like 'Souless') that will effect Leadership used in shooting, there aren't any more modifiers from shooting for shooting phase moral tests (unlike the penalties for being under half size etc in 4th). Basically is has made Stubborn (coupled with the rediculous penalties to moral CC can get) a lot more interesting / useful / powerful than Fearless. Especially when combined with ATSKNF. I find it strange there is absolutly no Shooting based penalties to moral, while CC can lavish massive uncapped penalties to the same roll. Strange and utterly unbalanced. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1915038 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 It's an interesting question Grey Mage why did you want to know? *EDIT: The second question was leadership modifications outside of the assault phase... sorry. * Well just next door there is something called the "codex leveling project". For the most part its upgrading the DA and BA and BT codices to be in line with the current costs and abilities of C:SM. Theres also a project running on this for C:SW. My personal feelings aside Ive decided to help with some input as constructively as I can. One of the older space wolf rules that hasnt been used in years is "No matter the odds" wich meant that a SW unit never took negative modifiers for being outnumbered in assault. As wounds were not negative modifiers in 3rd edition, only used to determine the winner it was in effect "stubborn" as Im familiar with it in the WFB rules. Ive put this idea forth to the forum, however its often just me and brother tyler in there. Hes asked me to ascertain whether or not there are other modifiers to leadership that would be included in this. Hes very big on not "developing" anything, and while I find it somewhat hypocritical in the context of this project Im doing my best to work within the project guidelines. So I thought I would ask our resident rules experts about this one, especially as my access to 3rd edition is the black book, C:SW, C:SM and C:Eldar. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1915477 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Some armies had access to rules that gave a further -1 penalty to losing opponents in combat. Blood Angels had teh Death Mask (which works differently now I think), Chaos 3.5 had daemonic visages, Necrons have a death mask thingie as well IIRC. Hive Tyrants and Zoanthropes can get a power that reduces LD of enemy units within 18". 4th Edition Space Marines had a psychic power that forced enemy units within 12" to pass a LD test modified by -2. Witchhunters (I think) have an inquisitor psychic power that forces an LD test on one uit within 18", and the test is modified by how much more LD the Inquisitor has than the unit (e.g. if a LD8 Inquisitor uses teh power on a LD 9 Marine unit, they get no penalty, but when a LD10 Inquisitor Lord uses the power on a LD9 unit, they get a -1 penalty). Ordnance barrage forces pinning tests with a -1 modifier. And of course, in 3rd and 4th Edition, units below 50% of their startung strength had an additional -1 midifier on all their morale tests. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1915523 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted March 12, 2009 Author Share Posted March 12, 2009 I suppose what Im really looking for isnt so much leadership tests, but morale checks actually. Though thank you very much for the 3rd ed reminders and the help so far. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1915713 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 I'd probably just have "No matter the odds" grant Stubborn. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1915866 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted March 13, 2009 Author Share Posted March 13, 2009 Well thats what Im proposing you see, I was asking about the leadership modifiers to see if any of them affect stubborn really. The more evidence I have the better I can make my case for it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1915994 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gentlemanloser Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Positives (like Sicarius' Rites of Battle) and Negatives (like Soulless) still modify the Leadership score used to take 'Stubborn' Moral test. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/162932-leadership-modifiers/#findComment-1916196 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.