=chaplain= Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 can someone help explain this rule to me i get the idea that if the land raider takes a crew stunned hit that the land raider can use its machine spirit and still move up to its maximum range it also says the vehicle can one weapon per turn < this is the bit where im confused does this mean that once i activate the machine spirit when i get stunned i can only fire on weapon? any help would be great. cheers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 The rule in Codex Space Marines is pretty clear, so I assume you are using the Codex Dark Angels? The rule in there is a little different. it also says the vehicle can [operate] one weapon per turn Actually it says the Machine Spirit can operate one weapon. Does that make sense now? But yes, when your vehicle is stunned it can only fire that one weapon allowed by the machine spirit. Next turn, when the vehicle is not stunned anymore, the crew can resume firing other weapons as well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1925895 Share on other sites More sharing options...
=chaplain= Posted March 22, 2009 Author Share Posted March 22, 2009 i see yeh thats made it alot clearer thanks alot! PS sorry fire the typo B) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1925910 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty the Pyro Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 also when the crew is not stunned, you can have the crew fire weapons at one target, and the machine spirit fire a weapon at a different target Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1926178 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Praeger Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 also when the crew is not stunned, you can have the crew fire weapons at one target, and the machine spirit fire a weapon at a different target And where do you get this rule from? Sorry to say but the weapon must still be fired at the same unit as the rest of the vehicle Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1926627 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grendelsbane Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 also when the crew is not stunned, you can have the crew fire weapons at one target, and the machine spirit fire a weapon at a different target And where do you get this rule from? Sorry to say but the weapon must still be fired at the same unit as the rest of the vehicle Check out page 81 and read about the machine spirit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1926644 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty the Pyro Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 also when the crew is not stunned, you can have the crew fire weapons at one target, and the machine spirit fire a weapon at a different target And where do you get this rule from? Sorry to say but the weapon must still be fired at the same unit as the rest of the vehicle Check out page 81 and read about the machine spirit. Indeed, thogh it should be noted that this is only for codex marines (and space wolves as they use the codex marine versions), not Dark templar, dark angels, blood angles, or which hunters. Deamon hunters also get this version of the machine spirit due to errata. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1926659 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaelion Hexis Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 If I may make a minor hijack to bring up another PotMS question that is nagging me. A vehicle using PotMS may fire one more weapon that it can normally. Does this mean that if it is in a position to fire all weapons, it may use PotMS to fire one weapon twice, at the reduced BS for the second shot? I don't play marines myself, but my opponents do. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1927428 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 No you can't fire the same weapon twice. The rules states one weapon more than you can normally fire, not a weapon more than once. And the examples given on p81 of the Codex specifies how this might work for you. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1927505 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chromedog Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Point to note is that SM machine spirits (and DH) don't fire at a reduced BS anymore. ALL shots from the vehicle's weapons are at FULL BS. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1927751 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty the Pyro Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Point to note is that SM machine spirits (and DH) don't fire at a reduced BS anymore. ALL shots from the vehicle's weapons are at FULL BS. indeed, it is only fired at reduced BS if your fighting Dark templar, dark angels, blood angles, or which hunters. and no it cannot fire the same weapon more than once, however it may still move, though not pivit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1928430 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaelion Hexis Posted March 25, 2009 Share Posted March 25, 2009 No you can't fire the same weapon twice. The rules states one weapon more than you can normally fire, not a weapon more than once. And the examples given on p81 of the Codex specifies how this might work for you. I tried arguing that one. They produced the following: If the vehicle is stunned, it may now normally fire no weapons, PotMS allows one. If the vehicle is in perfect condition it may normally fire all, thus it may fire one more. They use similar wording for firing a weapon of using smoke launchers. Being the only non-marine player in our little group I've gotten a little outvoted... Point to note is that SM machine spirits (and DH) don't fire at a reduced BS anymore. ALL shots from the vehicle's weapons are at FULL BS. Since my group seem intent on abusing the PotMS rules anyway, I may not share that bit of information with them. Hey, they should know their own armies :) Plus, if they are firing a weapon twice the least I should get is a reduced chance for it to hit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1929257 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty the Pyro Posted March 25, 2009 Share Posted March 25, 2009 No you can't fire the same weapon twice. The rules states one weapon more than you can normally fire, not a weapon more than once. And the examples given on p81 of the Codex specifies how this might work for you. I tried arguing that one. They produced the following: If the vehicle is stunned, it may now normally fire no weapons, PotMS allows one. If the vehicle is in perfect condition it may normally fire all, thus it may fire one more. They use similar wording for firing a weapon of using smoke launchers. Being the only non-marine player in our little group I've gotten a little outvoted... Well yes you can still use PotMS with smoke launchers that IS leagal. However you CANNOT fire the same weapon twice, it doesnt mater that PotMS lets you fire an extra gun, if you dont have an extra gun to fire, then so be it, if you have 5 gunners and 4 guns your not magicly going to be able to fire a weapon twice because you have an extra gunner. take a vehicle that has a defensive weapon like a rhino with pintal TL-bolter (I'm assuming your chaos sense you're here and not a marine player). "a vehicle that has moved at combat speed may fire a single weapon (and all its defensive weapons) pg 58 of the BRB. So fire that bolter twice, it is a single weapon, and it is also a defencive weapon. right? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1929295 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted March 25, 2009 Share Posted March 25, 2009 I tried arguing that one. They produced the following: If the vehicle is stunned, it may now normally fire no weapons, PotMS allows one. If the vehicle is in perfect condition it may normally fire all, thus it may fire one more. Er, PotMS allows to fire an additional weapon, not one additional shot. Firing a weapon twice is not an "additional weapon", since that weapon was already used anyway. There are basically three weapon allowances in the game: Firing all weapons, firing one weapon (plus defensives) and firing no weapon. With PotMS a vehicle would be able to fire: - one weapon instead of none - two weapons instead of one (NOT the same weapon twice) - all weapons If all weapons can be fired, then there is no weapon left that could be fired in addition to those already allowed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1929547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaelion Hexis Posted March 28, 2009 Share Posted March 28, 2009 I'm assuming your chaos sense you're here and not a marine player Nope. But I'll give you a clue, I mod the Inquisition forum :P Er, PotMS allows to fire an additional weapon, not one additional shot. Firing a weapon twice is not an "additional weapon", since that weapon was already used anyway. I will try using that wording, it helps. Thanks for that. I just happen to play against some of the biggest rules abusers this side of the segmentum. How much help this will do me on the other hand... :o Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1933105 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmongrel Posted March 29, 2009 Share Posted March 29, 2009 Nope. But I'll give you a clue, I mod the Inquisition forum :P Are Grey Knights not also space marines? Aw, now I'm splitting hairs. Sorry about your gaming group though, Marshal. You might send them on to the B&C to see reason? If any of them read this: Shame on you for taking two shots with the same weapon in a turn via POTMS, and welcome to the B&C. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/163840-power-of-the-machine-spirit/#findComment-1933767 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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