Guilliman a better Warmaster?

[Octavulg]

The 3e codex turned me off, personally. The way that scribe was so far up Calgar's rear power armor access and repair port bothered me. :sick:

 

But I digress.

 

Ironically, a number of Ultra players don't like Sicarius that much, or don't like the way he was portrayed in the recent codex. :P

[Alkana]

The 3e codex turned me off, personally. The way that scribe was so far up Calgar's rear power armor access and repair port bothered me.

 

The scribe was probably paid to do that much sucking up.

 

Ironically, a number of Ultra players don't like Sicarius that much, or don't like the way he was portrayed in the recent codex.

 

Odd. Maybe he's not Ultramarine-y enough? I honestly think he's one of the ideal Space Marine commanders. He has an impressive tally of victories, but there are still stories of his defeats, unlike with Guilliman or Calgar. He actually uses sense in his battles instead of relying on his plot armor to save him.

[Octavulg]

Actually, they mostly seem irked by the whole "oh, he's so awesome Calgar's gonna pick him over Agemman and then they'll FIGHT" thing. Some because they know Agemman'd smack him around like the young upstart he is, others because Ultramarines don't do that sort of thing.

 

Which I kinda agree with, honestly.

[Alkana]

That'd be great. I bet their successors would jump into the fight. A few years afterwards, the remaining Ultras are sent on penitent crusades, while many of their successors are either destroyed, excommunicated, or facing similar punishments.

 

Which sounds better, "The Sicarius Heresy", or "The Agemman Heresy"? I'm leaning towards Sicarius Heresy. He'd make a fine addition to the ranks of the traitor marines. It'd be funny if he ended up joining the Alpha Legion.

[The Emperor's Champion]

My stance on that whole matter is:

 

A] Sicarius looks to be the favored son from a seeming outsider's perspective (the way it's written).

 

B] The same outsider assumes results based on what seem to me to be incorrect assumptions about Agemman.

 

C] Agemman acts as the protective older brother to the other Ultramarines and it seems to me he'd be content with his position even if Sicarius were to become Chapter Master instead of him, rather than getting jealous.

 

D] Sicarius has some sort of weird conspiracy theory surrounding him that seems to come purely from the wild imagination of players rather than any written source.

 

E] Agemman could probably give Sicarius a good smack down if he were so inclined.

[Captain Idaho]

I dislike Sicarius because he feels like Wolverine from the Xmen. A recent addition that has sort of taken over because he is fashionable and became the focus point for the entire of the organisation. Most people with little experience with them consider him as the example to judge them all yet he was never supposed to be anything other the maverick that adds spice and character to them.

 

And Sicarius is not in depth enough for me but, like TEC said, Agemman is the bigger brother of the Chapter (read "consequences" for the little info on him) and has the role of regent of Ultramar and 1st Company Captain after the biggest disaster to ever befall the Chapter (note I said Chapter not Legion - That would be Calth...), filling in the boots for the deceased Invictus etc...

 

That is fluff that has been left by the way side for this quick win character. Shame on GW.

 

I understand why people would dislike this sort of thing, but that is not the fault of the Ultramarines themselves. If you dig deep enough there is plenty of little plot twists and interesting tid-bits within the Ultramarines collective fluff, but it is presented poorly by GW unfortunately.

 

@ Octavulg: I think we (me?) got our wires crossed somewhere along the line. I know that I sometimes have read replies you have posted and taken them as a little patronising sometimes and an attack on the Ultras, yet reading your reply here, complete with smilies I re-read your last post from a different perspective and realised I have taken you a little wrong.

 

I'm man enough to realise when I have been wrong and apologise for taking things the wrong way in the past (as I suspect this has happened before). Maybe in future we should both ensure we supply plenty of smilies in our posts so no-one gets the wrong idea with the interpretation intended from our Posts? :)

 

In my defence, I have taken alot of flak from Ultras haters over the years and sometimes it is easy to get defensive, as some of the other Ultras here could probably testify to. I'm probably guilty of lumping you in with some of the ignorant posts of others which is unfair.

 

Clean slate?

 

P.S. Still don't agree with your interpretation of the Ultramarines, but that is what the topic is for eh!

[Octavulg]

I just now realized you said smilies. I thought it said similes and was trying very hard to figure out where I'd used some. :devil: That makes a lot more sense...

 

That is a good idea. Very good indeed. :P

 

More smilies, from now on. Be careful, 'cause there's a smiley limit.

 

I admit, I have been known to be patronizing and argue for the sake of arguing. However, generally, I'm not trying to attack anyone or anything in particular. Just trying to keep things interesting. However, I do generally try to hold opinions which can be supported by evidence. ;) Whenever you get concerned about these things, do what I do:

 

Take a deep breath. Exhale slowly. And say, with fire in your eyes, "Someone is wrong on the Internet."

 

Perspective will be immediately restored. ;)

 

Clean slate?

 

P.S. Still don't agree with your interpretation of the Ultramarines, but that is what the topic is for eh!

 

Indeed on both.

 

EDIT: Actually, our interpretations of the Ultramarines as a chapter are probably similar. Our interpretations of Guilliman and of how the Ultramarines fit into the Imperium seem to be less so.

 

EDIT 2: I have a gift for understatement. ;)