greatcrusade08 Posted April 18, 2009 Author Share Posted April 18, 2009 I would also reccomend bringing Heavy Hellfire Bolters instead of missile launchers because you get more shots at 36" and you can bypass the high toughness of the power units. I discussed this in alot of previous articles and tbh with BS3 and small template these boys couldnt hit a barn door, infact in all the games ive used them they have never once hit on target... GC08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borinar Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 I will give you that however, I was thinking of a unit with Telion (using his BS with the HHB) I just did not state it. The model using Big T's BS and a heavy bolter will eat a C'Tan however, they will need support because it will take a couple rounds of shooting to get through the wounds and in that time the Deceiver for example can come up and push you off the table with a nice Morale Check (or Pinning Check which he can do to even fearless units) from 24" out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olesh Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Don't forget that any template has a base 33% minimum chance of scoring a hit, regardless of BS. You always have that 1/3 chance of rolling a scatter. A BS3 unit bumps that up to an average 45% chance of scoring a direct hit, and a 56% chance of at least hitting the model it's centered on despite scatter. That means that against an individual unit, at BS3 a small blast is better than a krak missile, and against groups the blast wins hands down. Individual experiences may vary, but the averages work out in favor of the hellfire heavy bolter - at least as far as hitting a single target, very slightly, and more dramatically in favor of groups. The AP3 of the krak missile has certain advantages to it, though, such as the ability to penetrate light armor. It comes down to determining what your army needs - if swarms are a problem, go with the heavy bolter. If marines or their equivalents are the weak point, go with the missile launcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted April 18, 2009 Author Share Posted April 18, 2009 Thanks for the imput guys, as far as VOE goes, against Ctan the HB and ML will both need a 2+ to wound and with the degree of scatter you may as well go for the 2+ to hit with the ML. Although this tactic is pretty good for culling tightly packed necrons with hellfire, and becuase there arent many priority targets for Telion except maybe Lord, then its a good use of his abilites. Ill add this one in, so gold star for you both :tu: GC08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Malachi Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 C'tan are T8, how is a krak missile wounding them on 2's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted April 18, 2009 Author Share Posted April 18, 2009 C'tan are T8, how is a krak missile wounding them on 2's? DOH, ignore my mad ramblings then, for some reason my brain was telling me T6....hmm meeds changing again. Thanks man GC08 Does anyone have any good tips for avoiding the scarab traps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Malachi Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Scarabs are T3 swarms, so templates and blasts do double wounds, whioe S6+ weapons kill them outright. So I guess a generic captain with relic blade could take a couple of bases out a turn, and the auxillery grenade launcher will do some damage pre-assault. It's an expensive way to take out a few scarabs but he can do damage to other things when he's done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olesh Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Scarabs are T3 swarms, so templates and blasts do double wounds, whioe S6+ weapons kill them outright. So I guess a generic captain with relic blade could take a couple of bases out a turn, and the auxillery grenade launcher will do some damage pre-assault. It's an expensive way to take out a few scarabs but he can do damage to other things when he's done. Krak missiles and krak grenades (like, say, on the bikes) will eat through them. Scout bikes with grenade launchers rapid firing should dismantle the swarm handily. If the swarm is tightly packed you could take a chance with a frag missile instead, but you'd have to hit 3 or more bases to make it worth your time to use frag instead of krak, which is hard to arrange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castus Xanthis Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Just throw a cc Scout squad at them, since they will probaby be turbo-boosting (giving them a 2+ cover save) shooting will largely be ineffective. If you can catch them in an assault then you will probably kill them. You strike first, hitting and wounding on a 3+ and they only have a 5+ armor save. They hit you on a 4+ and wound on a 5+ with you having a 4+ armor save. You should either wipe them out or sweeping advance them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Malachi Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 You won't sweeping advance them, since they're fearless, otherwise you're correct. The thing is fearless is explained in their codex, and it's different to the one in the BRB, so a necron player could argue that his fearless units don't suffer no retreat wounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted April 18, 2009 Author Share Posted April 18, 2009 Basically due to good cover saves its slice and dice then?... Anything in a scout army is pretty good vs S3 T3, i guess the key is to avoid getting outnumbered by attacks... Bikes could do well with T5, but im thinking we need to kill them off PDQ before the real nasties turn up, so yeah a ccw squad... OR LSS with heavy flamer to ignore cover... what kind of armour saves do they have??? GC08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Malachi Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 5+, nothing special. They aren't designed for longetivity, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted April 18, 2009 Author Share Posted April 18, 2009 5+, nothing special. They aren't designed for longetivity, So any kind of flamer will help, plus they will die quick in assault.. But then for a necron player its kind of a catch 22. you have to move them very fast to get the added bonus for cover save, but then they will be left with no support from most of the army (bar destroyers), they will get blasted pretty quick... GC08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Malachi Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Nah, you can just run them from side to side of your army. Besides, they're a tarpit unit, it doesn't matter if they have no (or little) support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted April 18, 2009 Author Share Posted April 18, 2009 Nah, you can just run them from side to side of your army. Besides, they're a tarpit unit, it doesn't matter if they have no (or little) support. I understand now... However being tarpitted by a beatable unit does have its advantages against crons, you wont get shot and if he advances he close the gap.. And if you are fortunate enough to win assault in the necrons turn, you are free to charge his warriors in yours.. Ill write something up on these wont be a huge amount i dont think.. Any more tips on units i havent included.. are there any points that need covering or more details??? Thanks guys GC08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borinar Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Scarabs can turbo across the board for a 2+ cover so shure they are vulnrable to blast templates however they save like terminators and have 3 wounds each base. I would say flamers would help burn thier numbers as well as a sternguard special shot then engage with CC scouts. Best chance you have, these guys can tie walkers down and they can glance on 6's with the DF upgrade putting them at 16 points a base. Some people also stick destroyer lords in them to get extra wounds before you hit him and if he is using lightning field all the wounds you do to them in CC hit you back at str 3 as well. They are low tough so hit them with numerous attacks and deal with them fast because they will tie you up so that the rest of the army gets into the magic ra[id fire range or a Ctan can walk up and wipe you out. It should be noted that the destroyer lord is toughness 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foster Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Be wary of Necron lists that like to spam destroyers. My brother went up against a list that had 2x10 Necron warriors, a Lord on foot with ressorection orb and another Lord but mounted like a destroyer. The rest of the 2000pt list was comprised of a mix of heavy and light Destroyers, I can't remember how many there were but I think there was nearly 36 of them. Could someone with the Necron codex put a mock 2000pt list up pls. ;) Necron Lord with resorection orb Necron Lord with destroyer gravity thingy that makes it fast :D 10 Necron Warriors 10 Necron Warriors Rest are destroyers with mix of heavys and light weapons 2000pts Can someone would fill in the blanks pls ;) Anyway my brother lost due the the sheer volume of shooting attacks this army can dish out. Thier high toughness even had Orks having difficulty wounding these toys and that was if there was any Orks left to assault them. Man I couldn't believe it when he completly wiped my brothers Nob Bikers from the map in one round of shooting, but then again my brother did an Ork thing and put them right in front of the Necrons gunline. This Necron player deployed centre of the field with the Necron Warriors in the front to absorb charges. After a few turns of shooting the destroyers move to outflank, shooting at any assualting units left out in the open after destroying the warriors. Against a list like this you do have alot of advantages, infultrating will help to catch these destroyers on first turn denying thier shooting attacks. It's just a question of tying them up and finishing them off with fast assualt units. I wouldn't try to out shoot them becuase I don't think anyone can, their toughness 5 really can absorb alot of dakka. Hope to discuss this list further Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borinar Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 Lord Res Orb 140 20 warriors 360 Destroyer Lord 170 (165 max points available if 24 destroyers taken however, Lord + D-Body + Res Orb = 170 points) 15 Destroyers 750 (45 str6 ap4 36" shots) 9 Heavy Destroyers 585 (9 str9 ap2 36" shots) Total 2005 points Destroyer Wing Armies are nasty since they are relentless so they actually have a hidden 48" range on thier heavy weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castus Xanthis Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 Nah, you can just run them from side to side of your army. Besides, they're a tarpit unit, it doesn't matter if they have no (or little) support. I understand now... However being tarpitted by a beatable unit does have its advantages against crons, you wont get shot and if he advances he close the gap.. And if you are fortunate enough to win assault in the necrons turn, you are free to charge his warriors in yours.. Ill write something up on these wont be a huge amount i dont think.. Any more tips on units i havent included.. are there any points that need covering or more details??? Thanks guys GC08 They are necrons and thus count towards phase out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Malachi Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 Scarabs aren't necrons. They don't have that rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greatcrusade08 Posted April 20, 2009 Author Share Posted April 20, 2009 Thanks for all your help guys, proper article now up here. GC08 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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