I love my Wolves...

[lunchb0x]

I play in a league and its 1850pnts...and even in the smaller games...I tend to lose every game...not by a lot mind you...but a loss none the less.

 

At the local store, Z games in WA, there are alot of great players...not just in personality but in skill. 99% play tourneys all the time, and same lists are used in normal games. Very competitive players, but great guys to play against.

 

Granted I have been playing 40k/Wolves since 2nd, though I am 26, but I just cant seem to do well with wolves and the new rules. ( I haven't played wolves in about 3 years now, took a break from gaming...so be kind )

 

I dont know if its that I am still stuck in the 2nd edition mind set of friendly armies or what...but I think my list(s) just are not up to snuff. I normally play old school Space Wolves style, defensive with a touch of offensive. I like to have the counter ability play in my favor, and I use bolters for all that they are worth. Maybe I am not aggressive enough with the army?

 

Main armies at the store are the following :

 

Marines/Chaos Marines

ORKZ

Imperial Guard

 

 

 

My current army rough run down is :

 

1 wolf lord or Rune Priest

 

1 wolf Guard Battle Leader

 

1 Ven.

 

1 6man x2 p.weapons + 1 melta wolf guard with P.fist and wolfy bits (Grey Hunters )

 

1 10 man x 2 p.weapons + 1 plasma +1 melta + wolf guard with p.fist and wolfy bits (Grey Hunters )

 

1 9 man + 1 melta + 2-3 power weapons + wolf guard with p.fist and wolfy bits ( Blood Claws )

 

1 4 man + leader + 2 h. bolters + 2 plasma cannons ( Long Fangs )

 

1 4 man + leader + 2 m.launchers + 2 lascannons ( Long Fangs

 

1 Rhino

 

1 Razor Back ( not sure what load out, but most likely heavy bolters )

 

1 4 man + 4 bolters/meltas + melta bombs + frags + wolfy bits + p.weapons ( Wolf guard bodyguard )

 

I am hoping someone can offer up some suggestions or changes I should make to the list, or maybe even my play style? Add more squads? Drop more squads? One of the fellow wolf players suggested running bigger and more hth bodyguard squads.

 

 

I don't want to give up my wolves, but damn I Am tired of losing.

 

Help?

[Bran Scalphunter]

Hmm.. I'd say drop the WGBG and take more footsloggers. Troops win the game in 5th and it gives you more men to attack the enemy. And try varying your tactics. The Orks can't be handled the same as Marines or even IG, so you gotta be able to deal with all of them. Best of luck Wolf Brother, hold true and firm.

[lunchb0x]

What about adding a whirlwind to the mix, as well as another Grey hunter squad? or more razorbacks?

 

With the current list i pop armour no problem, just I cant seem to handle other marines or the hordes to well...

[Bran Scalphunter]

More groundpounders then. Add plasma and flamers to your packs instead of meltas and take more Hunters.

[lunchb0x]

I think I will go that route...hopefully that will help out.

 

I post up some results and what not down the road...but like to see what others have to say as well...

[Yeti]

Space wolves definatly benifit from being used aggressively in 5th edition and the scoring dynamics mean that you have to be able to get your troops out onto the board to claim objectives. The emphasis on troops means that Grey Hunters are much more important in this edition. Equipped with bolters and a plasma gun, a squad of grey hunters is one of the best objective holding units in the game.

 

Changes to the vehicle damage rules also made vehicles much more resilient, so if you have some, go ahead and field them. I'm a big fan of mech lists and the changes in 5th were great for my army.

 

With regards to your specific list ...

- I'd drop the Heavy bolter/Plasma cannon Long fangs in favor or some armor. You can field two Preds with autocannon/HBolters for the price of that unit and have points left over. Sure, not the same AP, but the volume of fire is much greater.

- Have some dedicated objective holders. Minimalist grey hunters with bolters and a plasma gun. Sit them in cover on/near an abjective and watch the enemy try and dislodge them. I run two units of 10 at 1850 and they're very rarely let me down.

- Generally speaking, try to get more focus into your units. No use adding all kinds of "wolfy bits" if you won't use them. A few points here, a few points there ... you've got a few more guys on the table, and that is usually more important.

 

Hope this help. Don't give up either. I've made a few "returns" to the gaming table over the years myself and once you get the hang of it, the wolves rarely let you down.

[Jonny Wolf]

Brother,

drop your Long Fangs, get razor backs with Laz or Plasma Guns for your Grey Hunters instead. Start there.

[Ryzouken]

Land Raiders fix orks good.

They're also not half bad against other armies, but you can practically obviate the Orks chances of winning by running your units in Raiders in all but the most unlikely of scenarios. This is especially true if you're careful in your play and maintain good fire discipline.

 

Guard and Marines are ickier, but again, assault elements (Blood Claws) in Raiders are a good place to start. And try to keep your HQs hovering right around 100 points each. I run 90 point WGBL's primarily, subbing in the Ven Dread only if I have spare points.

 

Some gameplay notes: I almost never deploy. This is because normally my army is only about 4 reserve rolls away from arriving, but also because in almost every scenario you have more to gain by not deploying than by deploying. This is even true of playing against Demons, but be careful not to fall into the trap of trying to out deepstrike a Demon force.

 

But yeah. Mech up, preferably in Land Raiders and pitch those Long Fangs. They've never been a cost effective selection. (they may actually be the main reason you've been losing!)

[Valerian]

I don't want to give up my wolves, but damn I Am tired of losing.

 

Help?

 

lunchbOx,

 

I've written a fairly extensive guide here: Valerian's Guide to Army Building, that might offer some insight.

 

One thing that I can point out in your list is that you do not have very much mobility. Because 5th edition scenarios are generally objective-based, it is important that you have inherent mobility in your force to allow you to maneuver against your opponents.

 

Best of luck,

 

Valerian

[WG Vrox]

Suggestions that keep most of you models

 

 

1 wolf lord in Runic Armor

 

1 wolf Guard Battle Leader In Runic Armor

 

1 Ven. Not sure how you have him setup but should work either way. Just make sure to keep moving him toward the DP for support if CC oriented or providing the DP fire support if not.

 

1 Pred /w AC/HB Spons

 

1 Whirlwind

 

1 4 man + leader + 2 m.launchers + 2 lascannons ( Long Fangs )

 

1 6man GHx Plasma Gun + 1 P.fist in RB w/HB (Grey Hunters )

 

1 8 man GHx 2 p.weapons + 1 plasma +1 melta + wolf guard in TDA with p.fist and wolfy bits, runic charm in Drop Pod W/ WL HQ

 

 

1 8 man + 1 Flamer + 2 power weapons + wolf guard with p.fist and wolfy bits W/WGBL HQ

 

2 AB w/MM

 

Didn't run the numbers, but should be pretty close to working in that range, The DP is the key to this list, Drop them right in front of the biggest ugly your oppenent has, these guys may take some hits, but I assure you they will hold. Keep allocating wounds first to the HQ w Runic Armor and WGPL TDA. they will give you the edge you need to survive.

 

WG Vrox. / Wolf Brother

[lunchb0x]

I fully appreciate everyones help and input! It has broken the cobwebs of army building cleaned out...and I am actually thinking of my lists.

 

It is nice to hear more people voice the mech set up! Ive been a fan of that since ...well forever!

 

Ordering Plasma gun bits from GW, and I think I am going to drop 1 squad of long fangs.

 

What about similiar list, but razor backs for all grey hunters, as well as 1, 4 man long fang squad with 2 las-cannons and 1 heavy bolter?

 

As well as cut back on the "wolfy-bits" for my WGL ?

 

- L toda B toda X

 

PS.

 

By the way what entry do we use for Rhino/Razor Backs? I admit I havent looked for it on here, but I Am a bit confused as to what costs we use...points from the wolves codex and armoury from the wolves? or wolves price and marine cost upgrades? or all from marine upgrades?

[clanfield]

build a 750 pt list keep the toys to a minimum (power wepons plasma pistols etc)

then from there build up to 1500-1800

 

the core force is your main element the rest is added fun and a second hero to make legal max on men min of stuff

 

id use

 

wgbl, frost blade ,bolt p, belt of russ, frag ,wolf tooth necklace

wolf priest standard kit + frag ,wolf pelt

 

troops

1x 10 grey hunters -bolters -plasma gun

1x 9 blood claws 2 power fists -rhino(add wolf priets)

1 x10 grey hunter pack 2- power fist -melta (dread hunters)

 

edit we use the codex space marine rhino /razor back bits

1 x 10 grey hunters bolters plas gun

1 x blood claws 2 power fists -rhino(add iron priest)

heavy

longfangs x5 2 ml 2 las c

pred destructor las canon pods

vindicator (for fun)

 

elite

ven dread (i like assult canon power fisty)

iron priest (to control 2nd blood claws)

 

 

 

fast

attack bikes x2 -2 multi meltas

 

any odd points us for toys/wolf guard

 

so the blood claws are a distraction speed up and engage enermy troop choices to disrupt there plan the attack bikes hit there tank assets

the grey hunters seize objectives except the dread hunters which hit dreads and the back up the blood claws

long fangs and pred are pounding what may once the enermy heavy wepons are done with,the vindi is suporting the assult troops

the iron priets is a independant char so he can control a pack of blood claws allowing some control of the charge / counter charge

 

iv not costed this as im at work but its about 1500pts and iv yet top loss with it hope it helps

[LPetersson]

Everyone has already said what I would've said, so I'll just join the chorus that chants: plasma plasma plasma...

Only yesterday I played against a Wolf Brother (We pretended it was a training exercise in the fang after one spilt the others ale ;-]) and the plasma guns in my Grey Hunter squads made a huge difference. I did roll a couple of 1s, but I always saved, so that was ok ;)

 

I've never played against orks, but I'd say that against MEQs, get plasma guns and against IG bring a whirlwind or two (Hell, bring 3 if you have them just for kicks). I use them with varying success against Eldar.

 

Against orks (With the caveat that I haven't played against them) try a redeemer full of BCs and a Wolf Priest. Those flamestorm templates makes my tummy tingle and my enemies weep rivers of blood ;)

 

Also, to make sure I get the objectives, I tend to bring two squads of 6 Grey Hunters with Bolters/Plasma Gun purely to seize and hold objectives...

[Wena]

I say add at least one Land raider and a Typhoon Speeder...

 

I play in a league and after my 6th game I'm 6-0 and am 1st place out of 24 (5 complete massacres, the first one I didn't massacre because the opponent gave up round 5 and I didn't realize VPs made a difference in the league).

 

I run 2 land raiders (reg and LRC) in my 1750 list. I wouldn't run any Long Fangs at all (and yes - I have 4 Plasma Cannon, 4 Lacannon and 4 Missile launcher plus MM and HB sitting in the box).

 

Also, where are your termy WG? In TDA with Runic Charms? Space Wolves have the best termies in the game...

 

My two cents (probably not worth that even! ;) )

 

Wena

[Demogerg]

I say add at least one Land raider and a Typhoon Speeder...

 

I play in a league and after my 6th game I'm 6-0 and am 1st place out of 24 (5 complete massacres, the first one I didn't massacre because the opponent gave up round 5 and I didn't realize VPs made a difference in the league).

 

I run 2 land raiders (reg and LRC) in my 1750 list. I wouldn't run any Long Fangs at all (and yes - I have 4 Plasma Cannon, 4 Lacannon and 4 Missile launcher plus MM and HB sitting in the box).

 

Also, where are your termy WG? In TDA with Runic Charms? Space Wolves have the best termies in the game...

 

My two cents (probably not worth that even! :lol: )

 

Wena

 

im not a fan of the speeder, too weaksauce imo, but i got 1st place (3 tabled opponents) at my last 1850 tourney with a list that had....

 

 

land raider crusader

--loaded with WGBL

--loaded with 14 blood claws, 3 powerfists

--loaded with 1 WGPL w/ powerfist

normal land raider (going to swap for a redeemer next game, i much prefer inyourface style mech)

--loaded with 11 blood claws, 3 powerfists

--loaded with 1 WGPL w/ powerfist

Rhino

--loaded with 9 bolter armed grey hunters

--loaded with Ragnar Blackmane

(this unit is awesomesauce for holding objectives, just sit and doubletap, if they assault you, you can elect to not use true grit and your bolters to 3A on the countercharge)

Venerable Dread

Wolf scouts w meltabombs

--WGPL w/ powerfist leading wolf scouts

 

 

the only problem i run into is when there is 4 or 5 objectives on the table, you either have to table them, or play Very defensive.

 

 

EDIT: oh, and one of the great things i find with this list is that shooty armies have a tough time deciding what to hit, you can hide the rhino behind the land raiders if need be, but 90% of the time they will waste shots into the land raiders.

 

i also run it as 3 separate detachments usually, with the dred and rhino going one way (scoring mobile unit, good at shooting, close combat, and antitank) and depending on the mission each of the land raiders will go their own ways, (tough, antitank close combatty units) and the scouts act as an artillery hunter group. (they popped 4 IG tanks in 2 turns in my last game, i love double assaults)

[MechSpacewulf]

I am sort of repeating what DEMOGERG said, here is a list that I have been doing well with. Found this guy on youtube NFTF who calls all the Blood Claws in a raider crusader with Rune Priest and Wolf guard a BESERKER BOMB and if the Orky's pack in tight I can eat through half their army while my troops hold objectives. This list below is 1800ish but can easily be upped 50 points and the GH's can be turned into 2 units with drop pods if you have a lot of objectives or Rhinos/Razorbacks, I am finding they need protection to keep them in the fight. The bikes are fun to hold back and use to reinforce when a flank is failing or to shoot in and contest at the last minute and they are as tough as nails... but remember, take the Army you want and like and get these guys into HTH ASAP and the results should be better. I have only been playing a little over a year and have lost a great deal in my learning process however I am now considered a threat amongst 20 year veterans who can not wait for my new dex, they think the Wolves will become just like basic marines however one of those guys plays Chaos and they look and play a lot like Wolves so go figure... LOVE MY VINDICATOR... has only not got his points back once. I even hold him in reserve to mess with the other guys, the VINDI has been the reason for a few of my recent victories and of course a Glorious Death when I loose.

 

Good luck WOLF BROTHER, this forum has been great in making me a better Space Wolf, it will help you too...

 

1 Rune Priest @ Pts

True Grit; Runic Armour; Runic Charm; Wolf Pelt; Lightning Claw (x2)

1 Belt of Russ @ [] Pts

1 Chooser of the Slain @ [] Pts

1 Runic Armour @ [] Pts

1 Runic Charm @ [] Pts

1 Wolf Pelt @ [] Pts

 

14 Blood Claws Pack @ Pts

Bolt Pistol (x8); Close Combat Weapon (x12); Frag Grenades; Flamer; Power Fist (x3); Wolf Guard Leader

1 Wolf Guard Leader @ [] Pts

True Grit; Runic Charm; Lightning Claw (x2); 1 Elite Elite

1 Master-Crafted Weapon @ [] Pts

1 Runic Charm @ [] Pts

 

1 Land Raider Crusader

 

Rune Priest, BC's in land raider

 

1 Venerable Dreadnought @ Pts

Assault Cannon; Dreadnought CCW; Heavy Flamer; Drop Pod

1 Drop Pod @ [55] Pts

Deathwind Missile Launcher

 

1 Wolf Guard Battle Leader on bike w/PF

3 Blood Claws Bike Pack @ Pts

Close Combat Weapon (x2); Unit on Space Marine Bikes; Power Fist (x1); Power Weapon (x1); Flamer

1 Space Marine Bike @ [] Pts

Twin Linked Bolter

 

1 Wolf Guard Battle Leader @ Pts

True Grit; Runic Charm; Wolf Pelt; Power Fist (x1)

1 Belt of Russ @ [] Pts

1 Runic Charm @ [] Pts

1 Wolf Pelt @ [] Pts

 

8 Grey Hunter Pack @ Pts

Close Combat Weapon (x6); True Grit; Bolter (x5); Plasma Pistol (x2); Power Fist (x2); Flamer; Wolf Guard Leader; Rhino

1 Wolf Guard Leader @ [] Pts

True Grit; Runic Charm; Power Fist (x1); Storm Bolter

1 Runic Charm @ [] Pts

1 Terminator Armor @ [] Pts

1 Rhino @ [] Pts

Searchlight; Smoke Launchers; Storm Bolter

 

WGBL, GH's in Rhino

 

1 Vindicator @ Pts

Demolisher Cannon; Searchlight; Smoke Launchers; Storm Bolter; Dozer Blade; Pintle-mounted Storm Bolter

[Jonny Wolf]

Try this list:

 

Rune Priest, FB, SS, Bike, WTN, WP, Runic Charm, Runic Armor, Bike

 

WGBL, FB, SS, WTN, WP, Runic Charm riding in with

11 Blood Claws w/ 3 Power Fists and a Flamer -

Riding in a Drop Pod

 

Venerable, AC, EA, Heavy Flamer

Drop Pod, DW Missile Launcher

 

IronClad, Heavy Flamer

Drop Pod, DW Missile Launcher

 

IronClad, Heavy Flamer

Drop Pod, DW Missile Launcher

 

6 Man GH Pack two Plasma Pistols, Melta, two Power Fists

Razor Back

 

6 Man GH Pack two Plasma Pistols, Melta, two Power Fists

Razor Back TLLC

 

6 Man GH Pack two Plasma Pistols, Melta, two Power Fists

Razor Back LC w/ TLPG

[OnlyInDeath]

HQ:

 

Vendread: 225

MM, SB, EA

Drop Pod (DWML)

 

WGBL: 118

Frostblade, AC, TDA, WP

 

Wolf Priest: 108

Usual Gear, WTN, WP

 

 

Troops:

 

2x8 GH packs: 444

melta gun, PW, PF,PP, 6 bolters (each pack)

Drop Pod (each)

 

2x8 GH packs: 400

PG, PW, 7 bolters (each pack)

Drop Pod (each)

 

Elites:

 

Dreadnought: 165

TLHF, HF, EA

Drop pod

 

Dreadnought: 185

TLHF, HF, EA

Drop Pod (DWML)

 

Ironclad Dreadnought: 205

Heavy flamer, Heavy flamer, Seismic hammer

Drop Pod (DWML)

 

Total:1850 exactly

 

 

Still loving this list and still working on tryin to get it build up. But yeah, with proxy play testing, this list has torn apart anything its come across. you just gotta play it smart to each unit's strengths. But against most armies w/ any troops deployed, 2x twin linked heavy flamers, 4 heavy flamers outta 3 drop pods (with either GH's or a BS2 MM toting vendread), your opponent will find a good chunk of his troops dead in 1 turn.

[chillin]

Speaking as a chaos player that plays against SW's alot (sometimes getting an oponents view helps), lose those long fangs. They force you to pay for that character that really doesn't do anything for the squad.

Also I'm I missing something or do you have several squads with no transports ? The SW's excel at hth put it's too easy to shoot them up, slow them down, or get the jump on them, if they are footslogging. You need some LR or LRC's and rino's or RB's. All of your squads should be mounted or droppodded.

[JCarter]

Johnny Wolf's mech force is great; you can't go wrong with a force like that.

 

Try to make the objective placement as dense as possible, when they're close together, armies with small numbers of units are better off. If your scenario calls for advancing into the enemy's terrain, consider locating any of your optional objectives in his space. Against firepower, keep the troops in the R-backs as long as possible; they'll suffer less from hits on the vehicle than from being out in the open.

 

Sometimes you have to play for the tie. If the winning conditions call for holding too many objectives, or the objectives require too much over-the-table-movement, figure out what is the minimum you must do to deny the enemy a victory, play for that and take advantage of enemy errors.

[lunchb0x]

I think i am going to go mech, along with some bikers, and a whirlwind razorback combo...maybe two whirls or two razorbacks....dunno yet...got do some more planning.

 

Thanks to everyone for their help and input!

 

Its given me new faith in my wolves :P

[Corpse.]

Might I redirect your potentially 15-size melee loving squads here?

 

You would enjoy this tactic, (or more) if you gander for a bit. Give your blood claws some meat to grind. Reasons to run large units without transports (spendy spendy transports abd fast attack with devs with no extra bodies). I hope for your codex update soon brothers...

[dietrich]

My current army rough run down is :

1 wolf lord or Rune Priest

1 wolf Guard Battle Leader

1 Ven.

1 6man x2 p.weapons + 1 melta wolf guard with P.fist and wolfy bits (Grey Hunters )

1 10 man x 2 p.weapons + 1 plasma +1 melta + wolf guard with p.fist and wolfy bits (Grey Hunters )

1 9 man + 1 melta + 2-3 power weapons + wolf guard with p.fist and wolfy bits ( Blood Claws )

1 4 man + leader + 2 h. bolters + 2 plasma cannons ( Long Fangs )

1 4 man + leader + 2 m.launchers + 2 lascannons ( Long Fangs

1 Rhino

1 Razor Back ( not sure what load out, but most likely heavy bolters )

1 4 man + 4 bolters/meltas + melta bombs + frags + wolfy bits + p.weapons ( Wolf guard bodyguard )

Here's my random musings.

 

In fifth edition, you need:

1. Dedicated Anti-Tank : One or more AP1 weapons; Long-range or speed/durability or both

2. Mass Infantry Killing: Templates; Cover-save ignoring

3. Troops must survive: Pass morale checks and regroup; Survive long-range shooting; Survive assault

4. Troops must be mobile

5. Redundancy

 

Having said that, the SW codex some really good stuff, and some junk. Load up on the good stuff, ignore the junk, and take a decent amount of troops.

 

Now, try to fit your army into the Fifth Edition list I gave you.

Dedicated anti-tank? Some meltas and the long fangs. Not good enough.

Mass Infantry Killing? Some heavy bolters, but no flamers.

Troop survivability? They're SWs. They have a 3+ save and T4. They can survive assault. Personally, I try to make sure every unit has Ld 9 either by giving them a WGPL or an IC. But, you're looking good in this department, but playing SWs, you always should.

Troop mobility? Two transports. Not enough.

Redundancy? Some, not too bad.

 

Now, onto your list. The HQs look fine. I don't like taking a wolf guard bodyguard in power armor, which is what I think you have. They're too many points for what you get, just attach an IC to a unit of grey hunters. What is the Ven Dread armed with? Personally, I think a Plasma Cannon and Heavy Flamer are the best, but depending on the rest of the list, other options work. I think you have too many toys for the Grey Hunters. The Blood Claws - I would give them powerfists, drop the WGPL, and put an IC with them. Personally, I don't care for BCs on foot or a rhino. They're an assault unit, but slow - they can't move 12 inches in the rhino and assault out of it. Without a big threat range, they're not that big a threat. Put them in a Land Raider, or take bikers, or drop them. Long Fangs - I don't think they're worth fielding. They're expensive, are heavy support choices, and in fifth, aren't as durable as most vehicles. Now, compare your list to mine, which I pulled out a RTT win with.

 

Ven Dread w/ Plasma Cannon, Heavy Flamer

Battle Leader on Bike – Frost blade, meltabombs

Battle Leader in PA – Frost blade, meltabombs with 4 terminators with runic charms and (2 assault cannons and powerfists, 1 combi-plasma and power weapon, 1 combi-flamer and power weapon))

4 Scouts with meltagun and plasma pistol

7x Grey Hunters in pod - 1 meltagun, 1 power weapon, bolters, WGPL with combi-flamer, powerfist and runic charm

8x Grey Hunters in pod – 1 meltagun, 1 power weapon, 1 plasma pistol, bolt pistols, WGPL with combi-flamer, powerfist and runic charm

8x Grey Hunters on foot – plasma rifle, bolters, WGPL with combi-flamer, powerfist and runic charm

1x Attack bike w/ multi-melta

6x Blood Claw Bikers – flamer and 2 fists

1x Whirlwind

1x Predator (autocannon, heavy bolters)

 

Now, the Tourney Organizer ruled that Rhinos and Razorbacks were 50/70 points, otherwise, I would have mounted the two drop pod squads in rhinos and gone with a 6-man squad with plasma rifle and power weapon in a razorback. But, the list won, so I can't complain too much.

 

Anti-tank. The Predator and Ven Dread can take on light mech. I have 2 meltaguns on foot. The terminators have two assault cannons (plus a one-shot plasma rifle). And the attack bike (which, if I had the points, I would have take two).

Anti-horde. Flamer on the bikes. Combi-flamer with the termies. And a Whirlwind. And all the packleaders have combi-flamers.

Troop survivability. probably the same.

Mobility. The drop pods give me some initial mobility, the bikes are mobile. Rhinos would make the list more mobile, but I didn't think the 50-point rhino was worth it.

Redundancy. Some redundancy, but not as much as I like.

 

If you want some more help fixing your list, feel free to PM me. A lot of it comes down to - what else do you have in your collection and how much extra money can you spend? Dropping a couple land raiders into the list makes a huge difference, but it also runs you $100-110 US.

 

My first suggestion is to drop the long fangs and pick up some more vehicles. After that, I'd look to BC bikers and attack bikes and SW scouts. What do people fear in a SW army list? Terminators, scouts, and BC bikers - at least based on my experience. GHs are a great troop choice, but it's easy to add too many bells and whistles to the unit. Personally, I like an 8 to 10 man pack, a meltagun or plasma rifle, a power weapon, bolters, and a Pack Leader with a combi-flamer and powerfist. Maybe a plasma pistol. If you take 2 power weapons and 2 plasma pistols, that's 40 points. If you do that in two units, it's 80 points. A predator with autocannon and heavy bolter sponsons is only 85 points. I'd rather have the Predator.

[chillin]

Might I redirect your potentially 15-size melee loving squads here?

 

Large footslogging squads are nothing but template bait.

[JEFF4i]

Might I redirect your potentially 15-size melee loving squads here?

 

Large footslogging squads are nothing but template bait.

 

Until you put them in a Land Raider Crusader.

 

I love my Wolf Priest with 15 Blood Claws in that thing.