Chaplain Vasilev Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Hello, This may be a dumb question but what did the Chaplains preach about during the times before the Big E became a god? I am having a hard time understanding why the legions killed their chaplains if the were not preaching the word of the Big E being a god. Thanks Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
jipimus Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 The chaplains where charged more with the physcological well being of the battle brothers ensuring that imperial truth was adhered to and as an advisor to senior officers as they didnt fit into the normal line of command which is why I beleive that the traitor legions killed them off. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1957996 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Broken Knife Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 The Chaplain edict came about after Magnus had been warned to stop the research into the use of psykers in the legions. The Chaplains were to monitor the well-being of the brothers and ensure that any psykers did not use their powers. The idea came from the Chaplains in the Word Bearers - who had (unknown to E) alread fallen. They didn't worship anyone/thing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1958001 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirax Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Most Legions didn't have Chaplains early on, they came about, as previously stated, after the Council of Nikea. Magnus was warned about using (forbidden) Psychic Powers and they were introduced using the template that the Word Bearers had produced: A semi-religous leader who would inspire the main foot-soldiers of the Great Crusade. The Word Beaerers originally used them to preach about how divine the Emperor was, before the Big E disowned him because of it. Gave him a nice clip round the ear, he did. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1958109 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imriel Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Hello, This may be a dumb question but what did the Chaplains preach about during the times before the Big E became a god? I am having a hard time understanding why the legions killed their chaplains if the were not preaching the word of the Big E being a god. Thanks Not to nit pick, but even in "modern" 40k the Chaplains don't preach the divinity of the Emperor. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1958777 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Sasha Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 As an atheist father who has godparents for his son, I view the role of a chaplain in a similar way as his godparents: an advisor, confidant, confessional and friend on all matters spiritual, not purely, or even necessarily religious; another guiding voice that is not shackled to the more responsible and cautious guidance that is traditionally given by your parents. Chaplains, to me, embody the spirit of the Astartes: strength through purity, purity through cleansing martial endeavours. Someone to advise you when you come over all vegan and buddhist: "Go and hit somthing alien, mate, it'll do you a world of good". I've got a question: How do you become a chaplain? Is it something you pledge to at an early age, and devote your career to, like a techmarine, or is it just a decision by the captains when a new one is needed as to who best fits the role from the various grizzled veterans? Is there a training program, devotional path or set of oaths? Do they retire, or just fight until killed? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1958795 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tank18 Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 The first chaplains enforced the Imperial truth, that there were no gods and science was the answer. As for becoming a chaplain i believe that the existing chaplains pick the most fervent battle brothers to be trained as a chaplain. I dont think they would pick from scouts as a chaplain because a chaplain is expected to be a fierce warrior who leads from the front and who excels in close combat, using the croziuos, annd i dont think scouts fit the bill. The short story know thin enemy from the book Let the Galaxy Burn has a small part that leads me to believe this. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1958834 Share on other sites More sharing options...
lee265 Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 First chaplains in chapters are battle leaders they are to offer support and guiadance to astarts, next they watch for chaos taint, they help with recruiting in a few chapters, they maintain some of the chapters most valued traditions in some chapters, there actually are chapters that now have the chaplains preach the divinity of the god emperor of mankind though even in 40k it is rare. originallychaplains were to monitor legions about the edict of nikea and were based in part on the word bearers chaplains "irony". lastly chapter chaplains pick who takes the place of a fallen chaplain in some chapters they even groom there succesors. and then there ar Dark angel interogator chaplains which are a little diffrent hope that helps. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1958836 Share on other sites More sharing options...
bystrom Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 I think the chaplains were the most loyal to the Emperor, which was why they were killed off when the legions turned. I don't have any proof though. Just the fact that they're there to stop sorcery should be enough to kill them off, as sorcery is too close to working with Chaos. As for chaplains, I'd say they follow similar principles to how techmarines are chosen. They become apprentices, as tank18 says, upon showing that they're worthy candidates, tested and taught, until they come to the rank of reclusiarch. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1959337 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob_Loken Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 I always assumed that it was similar to the way librarians, techmarines and apothercaries are picked. That the new marine (though there's nothing to say it couldn't be a scout/neophyte) that shows an affinity with machines goes on to become a techpriest and the one with psyker abilities goes to the Librarium and the one who displays a talent in medicine goes to the Apothercarion. Similarly the one with the righteous fervour is sent to the Reclusiam. I'm sure I read that somewhere (could have dreamt it though). It's an interesting question that's got me thinking now I've never read a huge amount on how they train up chaplains. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1959649 Share on other sites More sharing options...
voi shet magir Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 What? Who? Space marine religion has always been about the same thing: how great they are. They just give the Emperor a little credit for making them that way. I know there are guys on here who play high school football. The way you get performance out of people in any precarious situation is convince them they are way important and skilled and the entire universe revolves around their performance. Marines need to be convinced they are awesome and anybody who stands in their way needs to be shown up, or they won't jump out of the space shuttle so monsters can chainaxe them in the chest. The role of a discipline officer or chaplain is to maintain the function of a fighting body. They choose recruits, they punish deviants, and they get a bunch of kids psyched up to massacre some peasants. When they invoke the Emperor it is to make the mission relevant and convince marines that they owe somebody for making them what they are so they had better perform because it's prime time and they have ten thousand years of tradition and the savior of the species all hanging on their performance. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1959910 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 chaplains don't worship anything. they just maintain the loyalty of the legions. and BTW the emperor never became a god and he was never a god. the imperial citizens and etc. just believe him to be one but he never was and never will be one. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1960919 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dynamicspartan Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 Well not all the legions killed off their chaplains. By this I mean the Word Bearers. The chaplains were the most corrupt in the legion so they turned to chaos as dark apostles. Basicly the same as chaplains only on the side of chaos. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1963179 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucifer Fellblade Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 the imperial citizens and etc. just believe him to be one Isn't that pretty much the definition of a god? That somebody believes them to be so. As for chaplains, to repeat the earlier points, they didn't worship anything other than the imperial truth and loyalty to the Emperor's cause. As the most 'devout' followers of the Emperor in the legions they were mostly culled by the chaos legions if they didn't side with chaos, in the case that they did they probably just became normal chaos marine leaders of some sort. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1963334 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 the imperial citizens and etc. just believe him to be one Isn't that pretty much the definition of a god? That somebody believes them to be so. of course not. that is one part of the definition but not the whole thing. the said god has to be immortal and 'all powerful'. and i think they have to be present since the beginning of time or at least near that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1963353 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucifer Fellblade Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 the imperial citizens and etc. just believe him to be one Isn't that pretty much the definition of a god? That somebody believes them to be so. of course not. that is one part of the definition but not the whole thing. the said god has to be immortal and 'all powerful'. and i think they have to be present since the beginning of time or at least near that. So Slaanesh isn't a god? ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1963728 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deffskull Posted April 22, 2009 Share Posted April 22, 2009 I have always thought of chaplains as sorta Commisars (The Russian ones not IG). They keep commanders in check and will dispose of him in the name of the state. Just my thoughts. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1963979 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 the imperial citizens and etc. just believe him to be one Isn't that pretty much the definition of a god? That somebody believes them to be so. of course not. that is one part of the definition but not the whole thing. the said god has to be immortal and 'all powerful'. and i think they have to be present since the beginning of time or at least near that. So Slaanesh isn't a god? :D well i never did think of the chaos gods as true gods either :P but maybe 1 of the definitions can be overlooked ;) he is immortal and 'all powerful' and he is definitely worshiped :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1964447 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 the imperial citizens and etc. just believe him to be one Isn't that pretty much the definition of a god? That somebody believes them to be so. of course not. that is one part of the definition but not the whole thing. the said god has to be immortal and 'all powerful'. and i think they have to be present since the beginning of time or at least near that. so by this definition, neither the norse or greek pantheon were gods? WLK Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1964451 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticFox Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Whether or not the Emperor is a god has a lot more to do with whether he fits some objective definition of a god than anything else, and that's what would need to be decided before one can evaluate him. The ancient Greeks believed Zeus was a god and we don't. Was he actually a god then but is no longer, simply because nobody holds him to be one anymore? ...because if that's how you want to define it, that's fine but you would have to accept that godhood is a function of the worshipers, not the being in question. Then Apollo can be a god right up until Captain Kirk orders Spock to vaporize his power source with the ship's phasers. On the other hand, if godhood is a function of the nature of the being, then he is a god, or not, whether people worship him or not. So if the Space Marine Chaplains preach the divinity of the Emperor it's either because he's a god and they're wise enough to know it, or the Emperor is not a god and the Chaplains are either misled or using him as a focus to control the marines of the chapter (ala' the Bene Gesserit in Dune.) For those who do not preach the divinity of the Emperor their function is presumably the same as what it was in the days of the Legions. "Chaplain" was a title only and did not imply any sort of divine representation. For them, religion was replaced by Imperial Truth and taught almost as if it were a spiritual truth. That being the case, it makes sense for the traitor legions to get rid of them since Imperial Truth had become anathema to Horus and his followers, believing Imperial Truth to be little more than a way for the Emperor to clear the way to his own ascension to godhood. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/166289-question-about-chaplains/#findComment-1964930 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.