New IG Codex. How are you going to cope?

[Marek Grimfang]

Ive been back and forth through the new IG Codex and can only think "Man, thats alot of Tanks!"

 

I look at my list and available models, painted or otherwise, and Im struck at how much more Anti-Tank we are going to have to become.

 

2-4 half decent AV tanks per game was one thing, but in a decent sized IG List, 9 Tanks, in three Heavy SLots. And some of them look down right killer.

 

The Leman Russ Punisher with all those shots, 20 I think, Im seriously concerned now. At my local Bunker the other day, one of the IG players who Ive seen play against Wolves before and usually loose, basically said, he can now make an

Anti-Wolf list. Also Templar for that matter, all the 15+ Troop choices can now get mowed down with a few fell sweeps of the dice.

 

So, some advice on how to catch up?

[WG Vrox]

I put together a one Wolves answer to alot of tanks, it's being fast and flanking which takes advantage of side armor and line of sight. The title is called "1750 Fast" in the Army List section. Not sure if it will do anything good, but it's a heck of a balanced list effort.

 

WG Vrox

[Dread Wolf Master]

never really had a problem with armor. Just load ur army with meltas and lascannons, a few plasma guns is fun too, but then you loose the true grit special.

[Jarl Kjaran Coldheart]

drop pods.

 

all those fancy tanks wont be worth didly with GH packs coming down with melta guns. use the DP for cover against the majority of the army, and fry the giant tin can.

 

just remember to apoligize to russ when you destroy one, it's named after him and all.

 

WLK

[Ullr Direfang]

i think i will do what i have always done, play a more normal list. yes if i know that i am playing guard i tend to put a little more anti tank in it for the LRBT, but for a tourny list i would probably not change much. i think people are getting all worked up about the guard getting tons of tanks, but the cost of a tank hasn't changed much. yeah there are some really killer tanks out there, but they cost more. the "artillery" tanks cost lots more for less, IMHO. basilisks are crap now, medusas are good but they cost more, and to get the better ammo, it cost even more, not much but enough to throw my lists off. the other artillery has limited ammo as well. chimeras cost less, but it's a chimera, plasma guns can pop them. and if someone takes 9 tanks, with out sponsons costs 1350 points, so it is a huge amount of points, so there wont be much of what guard is going to be even better at now then they ever were before: shooting, with the to load platoons up with more heavy weapons then they can take on a tank, i wouldn't be surprised if one only sees a few tanks, the way i run mine and most people i know that play guard run theirs as well.

 

+++EDITE+++

spelling

[whitewolfmxc]

how is basilisks crap now ? i haven't read the new dex yet

[JEFF4i]

Scouts, Drop Pods with Dreds/Units with Melta and Plasmas. Best part, anyone who actually takes nearly 9 tanks will be spending so many points that if it's capture and control, he's screwed.

[Ullr Direfang]

how is basilisks crap now ? i haven't read the new dex yet

 

Basilisk:

Earth shaker cannon: S9 AP3 Range 36"-120(or 240)" Barrage, ordinance

hull heavy bolter

(potential other basic stuff: smoke, etc. but i forget)

 

so for the cost of what every one used to pay for a basilisk, 125 points, you get the basilisk with some extra stuff and indirect fire ONLY. and not that people didn't do this before, but you have to put your bailisk on a table corner so it will be effective, which means that people will learn this and counter it quick. the 36" minimal range is horrible, it is half a normal table. so i think it will only be seen in apoc.

 

i plan to run my company command, 2-3 platoons (i need to work points out) 1-2 veteran squad, 1 storm troop squad, maybe some ogryns, a medusa, 2 leman russ, and maybe a the attack version of the gunship there, there might also be a couple chimeras thrown in there. so i will still be the ground pounder guard army,with some armor.

[whitewolfmxc]

Why indirect fire only ? it is both barrage and ordnance , it can chose to fire in what mod isnt it ? (but then again LOS)

 

anyway for my wolves , theres always gonna be at least 1 drop pod with Bjorn with a plasma cannon or a squad of grey hunters with melta guns

[Yeti]

Bah ... don't get all worked up. The may have a lot of tanks to choose from, but they are all more expensive too. If anthing, the new IG codex has pushed it more towards a horde army by making basic troops cheaper.

 

To be honest, the only one that really gets me worked up is the Colosus ... S6, AP3, No cover = a lot of dead SWs. But it's arty ... so it's not mobile and it's armor is crap. The other one that's potentially dangerous is the LR Exterminator ... but with plasma cannon sponsons and some kit ... it's around the same price as a Land Raider.

 

A simple solution ... Land Speeder Typhoons. Speed, range and flank shots will make short work of tanks and then you can switch to Frags and take out the hordes.

[Long Fang]

Not to worried myself, I used to facing 2 defilers + a vindi , my 1750 rounded list has mm attack bike, plasma cannon/ml dread, greyhunters in razorback with melta, dp ven dread, dp grey hunters with melta. And of course powerfists liberally scattered about :) Will see how it goes but no immediate changes planned.

[Ryzouken]

*starts working out a 1500 point IG list with 7 Valkyries*

 

(innocently) what? They're my Garm (or any other SW loyal planet) air cav force, mounted in Valkyries to avoid getting bogged down in snow and mud.

 

The wolves will need some serious considering, as I'm not too sure how one is to beat 50 guardsmen with hidden powerfists and the like. I'd argue pie plates, but Guard do that better than I. I could assault them, but... that's a lot of attacks at me.

 

Eww, with the number of lascannons they can have, I'm not too sure my trip Raider list will fare well.

[clanfield]

to quote mr conery "faith,skill and steel " :lol:

[williamdelgray]

Kill the Bane tank. Kill it first and hard.

[Marek Grimfang]

I think in larger point games, Dreads are going to play larger roles as moving gun platforms, more so than they already are now.

 

I dont have much experience with large horde armies like this. Previous Guard armies I moved in and basically wiped them out in HtH.

 

But joinging more than one squad together, that's alot of flashlight fire and Las Canons.

 

I think I'll be adding Long Fangs again in larger amounts.

 

Also, Preds are going to come into their own, more so than now.

[Yeti]

Large IG squads are a good thing for us!

 

Once they're merged they can't split fire or do anything independently. Also, you can only merge infantry squads. Getting into HtH still works ... even better! You'll kill loads of IG and won't take all that many more return attacks (you can only get so many within 2"). If they stick around, you won't get shot to bits in his turn, if they flee ... you can wipe out a whole lot of troops, maybe even enough to make back the BC squads points! :lol:

 

Long fangs are never a good idea vs IG ... too many AP3 pie plates flying around. Mech lists should do well though.

[Grimtooth]

The two games I have played against the new IG, I lost one because of a bad choice (bypassed two easy kill points), and I had one draw.

 

The draw was against a full mechanized guard. Something like 9 Chimera and two Devil Dogs. With my 13th Co (remember no vehicles), I killed/immobilized a decent portion of his army to stop their initial advance and wiped out a couple of his squads in close combat. On his rush attempt to claim my objective I popped three Chimera and killed all the troops choices inside while still holding the objective for a draw.

 

This is all running my regular 1750 list and not some tailored tank killing list.

[Grey Mage]

So question.... if an IG squad merges with another squad to make a new one, and you kill it... do you get 1 KP, 2KP or 3KP?

 

Id see it as being 2, personally.... but yeah.

[Ullr Direfang]

So question.... if an IG squad merges with another squad to make a new one, and you kill it... do you get 1 KP, 2KP or 3KP?

 

Id see it as being 2, personally.... but yeah.

 

I don't know if I missed it, but the only squads I remember being merged were the conscripts, which is nothing new because they always acted as one big unit. But like I said i might of missed it. But because of how they have set it up, I am sure that you will get as many KPs as the combine squads would count as. if not, every guard player will probably keep at least 2 or 3 squad groups.

[Long Fang]

Infantry can merge, i.e bog standard guardsmen, at the point x number of squads become one they now only count as one KP. This exact point in covered in this months/new White dwarf.

 

Long Fang

[Grey Mage]

Well that could seriously screw with a battle. Have to make sure you get every last one of the suckers in one shot I suppose. Dang it.

[Skirnir Ragefang]

Meh, the only guard guy i play will only use it to throw more infantry at me. He's an annoying sot to play against, his only way to play is have as much cheap guy as possible so the opponent can't kill them all. I try to play him not so often, because games against the players at my LGS are so much more entertaining.

I actually plan to start a Guard Army with lotsa tanks to fight alongside my wolves, ( I like tanks :P) so whatever will work against my Guard Army i'll blatantly copy.

 

Otherwise, bring alot of Melters mounted on Attack bikes and Cybots, some lascannons and OBEL Scouts with Meltabombs. Even your Footsloggers can scrap a tank with a power fist if it comes to that. Last game my Fenriswolves ripped of the Battle cannon of an LRBT.

 

And remember our new codex doesn't seem to be so far away.

[Bjorn the Fell-Handed]

Im looking forward to it; so far Ive only had the chance to destroy only a baneblade and 2 Russ in one game before with my 90 point pack of wolf scouts :P

Like has been said, tank heavy armies will cost the bomb in points, and thus mean they wont be able to take lots of shiny new gubbinz like valkyries. Valkyrie heavy armies just need some good lascannoning :P

 

Its a good codex, but for wolves I think it still will be defeatable. Big packs I think will make it harder to destroy them easily. BC's here I come :P

 

Bjorn

[Grey Mage]

Is there save still 5+ for the most part? Because if so Im not worried about the squads really. If they have more of them that gives them a better chance of survival, but if squad sizes are stillt he same for the most part... ie 5-10, then they can be killed without an issue.

 

Their tanks are mean... but from what Im hearing they are now more expensive? They already were pretty pricey... I thought they were getting a reduction in price. *Sighs*. If they are pricier then the points drop in the troops section will balance out for most gaurd armies.

[Skrubb]

you get the basilisk with some extra stuff and indirect fire ONLY. and not that people didn't do this before, but you have to put your bailisk on a table corner so it will be effective, which means that people will learn this and counter it quick. the 36" minimal range is horrible, it is half a normal table. so i think it will only be seen in apoc.

Good! Artillery pieces like that belong nowhere near the front. I will be happy to see them eradicated from normal games. I remember a battle report somewhere (probably WD), sometime where the basilisks were placed on a separate table, pounding the main table from a distance. That is how it should be.