Grey Knight Campaign/Tourney Progress

[IraSummers]

My local store holds a regular 5 week campaign/tournament. I decided to mix it up and give some verity by bringing my Knights that I started a few months ago to the board. I started out planing to loose every game as many of the other armies are VERY powerful and as many of you know, we have a somewhat weak codex in comparison to others. There is some verity to other opponents in this, there are several space marine players (all codex), a friend using Guard with some sisters allied in, Orks, 3 tau (one of which is a friend using my Tau army) and some more stuff.

 

This past weekend concluded week 4, with one last game left to go, and I must say I am SURPRISED out of my mind!! I am in 3rd and am one of only two of the total 12 players that have not even had a single defeat. I have had 2 major victories, 1 minor and one draw. I am VERY impressed with my knights. It has nothing to do with luck either as most of my opponents have had a good deal of luck and I can rarely pass even 1/2 3+ anything.

 

Perhaps our codex is not nearly as week as some say it is. I have had 2 major victories over codex marines, one of which is a GOOD player that has won the last two tournaments.

 

Anyone else having this kind of success with the great Knights?

[jeffersonian000]

Show us your list.

 

SJ

[IraSummers]

Show us your list.

 

SJ

 

short response, haha.

 

Well, its 1500pts tourney this time. List looks like this:

 

HQ:

GM w/ phycannon and MC NFW

4 terminator ret, 1 with incenerator, 1 with TH&SS (I threw this in last minute to see how he would do, thus far he has been cannon fodder and never made a single swing with the TH as either the opponet is dead or he dies).

 

Troops:

Squad 1: 8 total members, justicar, incenerator, and 6 SB and NFW knights

Squad 2: Same as 1

Squad 3: 6 total members, justicar, 2 phycannons. This is the fire support squad.

 

Heavy support:

Brother Fidelas - Dreadnaught, heavy flamer, and multi melta. Extra armor and smoke

Dread - TLLC, DCCW, SB, Smoke, Extra Armor

Dread - TLLC, ML, Smoke.

 

 

The army is slow, but I use cover to advance and try to say away from heavy weapons. I like dreads, thats why I have 3. So far, my HQ unit has only been killed once, but I use them to draw some fire as the knights advance.

 

In the next codex I hope shrouding becomes something like a cover save or something, as rolling 3d6X3 after EVERY (except @ dreads) declared shooting slows things down a lot.

 

It's a little diffrent list, but it works in my opinion and it's fun to play. A HUGE difference over the style of play with my AirCav Tau.

[number6]

This looks an excellent list, overall, and resembles in its basic structure my common "smallish" GK lists. (i.e., GKTs for HQ, 3 units PAGKs, Dreads for heavy support)

 

However, you also include builds that I commonly dislike. In the context of your league/tournament, I'm curious to know how these variations have worked out.

 

1. Use of a GM. I think he's too points-heavy, as much as he does a nice job in most assaults. How necessary has he -- or more accurately, his superior Initiative and the force weapon -- been necessary?

 

2. Do you deep strike or footslog your GKTs?

 

3. Have the incinerators in your Troops GKs been important? I've never liked using them in footslogging squads, only when they're getting a ride in a land raider. I always prefer the points savings, stormbolter shots, and superior melee abilites when hoofin' it.

 

4. How effective has the multi-melta dreadnought been? Without a drop pod, it's difficult for me to see how most opponents would allow it to get close enough to do any damage. (My opponents never would!)

[IraSummers]

This looks an excellent list, overall, and resembles in its basic structure my common "smallish" GK lists. (i.e., GKTs for HQ, 3 units PAGKs, Dreads for heavy support)

 

However, you also include builds that I commonly dislike. In the context of your league/tournament, I'm curious to know how these variations have worked out.

 

1. Use of a GM. I think he's too points-heavy, as much as he does a nice job in most assaults. How necessary has he -- or more accurately, his superior Initiative and the force weapon -- been necessary?

 

His extra initiative has been excellent, with 5 attacks on the charge and killing any that he has only wounded it has been great. Only had the chance to use the force weapon once though, but I believe that won that game for me as my opponet was so dishearted that he just about gave up after that part. His BS 5 has been great as well, but the main reason is the 3 wounds. I never used to use him, but I've liked having 3 wounds. The BC does not really bring anything different to the table like a GM, and I feel that the GM brings alot of fear to the table, which if used right can be a powerful tool. I feel that that is well worth the points.

 

2. Do you deep strike or footslog your GKTs?

 

Footslog the whole army. I've too bad of dice rolls to deepstrike. I've tried it twice when I first started getting a feel for the knights (while before the tourny) and mishaped both times (and rolled a 1 and 2). I misshap a lot anytime I DS

 

3. Have the incinerators in your Troops GKs been important? I've never liked using them in footslogging squads, only when they're getting a ride in a land raider. I always prefer the points savings, stormbolter shots, and superior melee abilites when hoofin' it.

I dislike land raiders at all. They are alot of points for not a lot back. I keep my army tight and as one combined force and try to anticipate where my opponent will come from.

 

4. How effective has the multi-melta dreadnought been? Without a drop pod, it's difficult for me to see how most opponents would allow it to get close enough to do any damage. (My opponents never would!)

 

he has been quite effective, but not in the sence you'd think. I try to keep him covered and the TLLC/DCCW dread stay near by. An opponet will not rush to him as fast as he normally could. Keeping this group near my two assulting squads keeps danger somewhat at a far. Fidelis hassomewhat of a funny story as well. He is a major hearo of the army, and has done many things that should have been impossible through the many battles as well as surving strange and impossible odds. Most of the other guys in the tourney are pat of our regular free play days, so most have played my army many times. He always comes along :).

[jeffersonian000]

Cool list. I agree with Number6, although I'm a 'Raider player rather than a Dread player. I've had mixed results with deep striking my GKT's, so I can understand the desire to footslog. Personally, I'd drop the master-cafted from the NFW and upgrade the Incinerator to a second Psycannon, however, I'd assume you are using the models you have which is cool. As to Thunderhammers and Storm Shields, I'm having the worst luck with units surviving long enough in close combat to even get an Initiative 1 attack off, so I can totalling agree with you on your TH+SS guys poor preformance. Have you thought about Hammer Hand? For 10 points your GM adds an attack with all attacks at Str 8; yes, its not a power weapon, but it is a Brother-Captains best friend.

 

SJ

[IraSummers]

Cool list. I agree with Number6, although I'm a 'Raider player rather than a Dread player. I've had mixed results with deep striking my GKT's, so I can understand the desire to footslog. Personally, I'd drop the master-cafted from the NFW and upgrade the Incinerator to a second Psycannon, however, I'd assume you are using the models you have which is cool. As to Thunderhammers and Storm Shields, I'm having the worst luck with units surviving long enough in close combat to even get an Initiative 1 attack off, so I can totalling agree with you on your TH+SS guys poor preformance. Have you thought about Hammer Hand? For 10 points your GM adds an attack with all attacks at Str 8; yes, its not a power weapon, but it is a Brother-Captains best friend.

 

SJ

 

Actually, I took the Phycannon arm off the one terminator I had with it and put it on the Grand master. I prefer to keep the incenerator in the squad for hoard control and to give a good punch right before the assult. Also the master crafted has helped a few times, though I don't think worth it's points as most of my rerolls are misses as well. I don't like hammer hand as its only 2 Str higher and you give up power weapon as well as force weapon. Most tanks you encounter have AV10 rear, so with 5th we glance on a 4 in combat already.

[DevianID]

Congrats on your performance!

 

I also never used a GM until recently, but man those 3 wounds and force weapon are nice! Also, I agree with the flamer in the squad instead of the 2nd psycannon, and I have loved my THSS GKT for a while, as if I need a fall guy to take 4 rending hits from 17 wounds for example, hes the man! Though I do miss the storm bolter shots occasionally...

 

My question is, how has the 2 psycannon PAGK squad been? Would you trade the 2 psycannon squad for another 8 man squad with incinerator, assuming you had the 10 points to do so?

 

Also, was the missle launcher on the 1 dread ever more useful than just keeping the s10 ws5 power weapon the dread has? It saves 10 points, but regardless of points I have a hard time trading away the 2 ws5 s10 attacks for a single missile launcher. What was your experience based on the other dread that kept the DCCW?

 

And finally, in how many games has the grand masters psycannon been better than, say, another GKT (well 30 points versus 46, assume you have the 16 points from something, the master crafting maybe)

[IraSummers]

Congrats on your performance!

 

I also never used a GM until recently, but man those 3 wounds and force weapon are nice! Also, I agree with the flamer in the squad instead of the 2nd psycannon, and I have loved my THSS GKT for a while, as if I need a fall guy to take 4 rending hits from 17 wounds for example, hes the man! Though I do miss the storm bolter shots occasionally...

 

Haha, I know what you mean. He has yet to get into combat, at least for long. SS has done jack and by I1 gets around there is not normally much to kill with the I5 5 attack force weapon GM and other 3 attack I4 S6 terminators. He has been my fall guy recently.

 

My question is, how has the 2 psycannon PAGK squad been? Would you trade the 2 psycannon squad for another 8 man squad with incinerator, assuming you had the 10 points to do so?

 

The squad has done good and provided some good softening fire that I needed from time to time. But I do think that another 8 man with incenerator might do better as there is not THAT much fire power that comes from them. The Ignore Inv saves (along with over 1/2 the other GK rules) have not came into effect one in the tournament as no one plays demons and the one eldar player has his seer council on bikes so gets a 3+ armor. I am actually going to mess around with swaping that out and see if that works better. The overall idea is that the squad as it is very situational and needs to be used like a Dev/Purg squad, but does not have the fire power to deal with targets that the Dev could and so mostly ends up just contributing 6 Phycannon shots per turn to soften something up. Which I almost always miss with 3 and end up with 2-3 wounds, so possibly 1-2 kills per turn. Not as effective as I'd have liked. Not mobile enough for good scoring either.

 

Also, was the missle launcher on the 1 dread ever more useful than just keeping the s10 ws5 power weapon the dread has? It saves 10 points, but regardless of points I have a hard time trading away the 2 ws5 s10 attacks for a single missile launcher. What was your experience based on the other dread that kept the DCCW?

 

Ohh, the "allmighty hellfire dread". Everyone harps about that this is the dread Deamon hunters should be using. However, to be honest this dread is the largest failure in the entire list. I have so far destroyed one vehicle and done light damage to two others. He rarely ever moves and has only worked in blocking the opponet from deploying in a way I would not like by putting pressure on him with a lascannon. The TLLC and DCCW has done better, even in shooting. The missle has yet to do ANYTHING. 2 shots, one S9 and the other S8 just are not that scary for the points paid. I'd rather have another TLLC DCCW or MM DCCW dread. I'd love to have an AC DCCW dread but only with new AC rules :)

 

And finally, in how many games has the grand masters psycannon been better than, say, another GKT (well 30 points versus 46, assume you have the 16 points from something, the master crafting maybe)

The Master crafting is for the NFW, which has been handy. The Phycannon has been very effecting in softening up targets, and when I get close I learned a valuable lesson about the new marines voluntarily falling back by killing the majority of the squad with the BS5 phycannon shots and incenerator. I think I would keep it on him. Though having a better inv save on him I would like better. He brings some good mobile fire power to the table (better then then hellfire dread).

[ferrous]

His extra initiative has been excellent, with 5 attacks on the charge and killing any that he has only wounded it has been great. Only had the chance to use the force weapon once though, but I believe that won that game for me as my opponet was so dishearted that he just about gave up after that part. His BS 5 has been great as well, but the main reason is the 3 wounds. I never used to use him, but I've liked having 3 wounds. The BC does not really bring anything different to the table like a GM, and I feel that the GM brings alot of fear to the table, which if used right can be a powerful tool. I feel that that is well worth the points.

 

It sounds like you may have been using the force weapon more then once in an assault phase, you can only take one psychic test per round. Mostly only a bummer vs. nobs and the like, but great vs pricey heroes and MCs.

[Uncle Mel]

Well this would lead to think otherwise

 

 

Only had the chance to use the force weapon once though,