Pre-Heresy in M41

[Lansirill]

Well, I did think about searching for 'M41' just in this forum, but it's too short of a search term. Really I was just wondering what the chances were of a pre-heresy or heresy-era marine, or more realistically a small squad of them, would be functional in M41. Why? I love me some Thousand Sons. I'd love even more to field a small squad of them (pre-heresy style) in a CSM army just to add a little fluff to the army. Really, I just think the heresy era has the most powerful fluff (which, well, I doubt is a very contentious claim) and I'd like to borrow a little bit from that for current era playing. Does that stink too much of 'lost in the warp' for people to accept, or does seeing a squad of (really any legion) done up in pre-heresy style usually make you ignore the fact that it's stretching the fluff like it's an S.Armstrong doll?

[Pig Of Sparta]

I really love the Heresey era fluff too :) and I absolutely adore the mkIII and mkIV patterns of armour however I'm not sure if you could get away with haveing a squad of marines survive from the 31st to the 41st millenium. The Horus Heresy books describe marines as being functionally immortal, (ie; aside from death in battle or a (very) serious accident they could live forever) Although whether they actually are or not is difficult to judge as the longest lived contemporary marine not wearing a suit of Dreadnought armour is Blood Angels Commander Dante (around 1000 years of age if memory serves me correctly) so technically some could survive if they'd had somewhere to hide for 40000 years or so. Cliched as it is I think that being stuck in the warp or marooned in a dead area of the galaxy would be the only way you could have marines survive for so long.

 

All the Thousand Sons who survived the razing of Prospero that weren't sorcerers were reduced to dust filled suits of armour by the Rubric of Ahriman. However that's not to say that there weren't any who weren't on Prospero at the time...

 

James

[drazz]

For the most part, I have to agree. there basically no way that a Space Marine/squad/unit could survive the time from pre-Heresy to "modern" 40k times. Something extraordinary has to take place for them to survive. And the most common is the Stay in the Warp. Time does not function the same, and its entirely possible that the warp still holds Marines/entities from times past. Quite possibly where some of the missing Primarchs are currently--after all, the warp would try to keep them from re-entering the standard universe.

 

Now, you could argue other reasons for pre-Heresy armor. A renegade Marine unit/company that reveres the equipment of the past, and the warriors that have used it (in some sort of ancestor worship faith) is pretty easy to imagine.

 

You could also argue that the gene-seed of any chapter can be gathered and used to create a whole new company. Its entirely feasible that someone out there (Fabius anyone?) haas access to the original Thousand Sons gene-seed and is rebuilding the regiment, under the direction of the Chaos lords.

[Vodunius]

The old Renegades supplement for Space Marine 2nd edition mentioned that due to the vagaries of warp travel even today the warp disgorges occasional vessels of traitor marines still fresh from the Heresy.

[Lansirill]

The old Renegades supplement for Space Marine 2nd edition mentioned that due to the vagaries of warp travel even today the warp disgorges occasional vessels of traitor marines still fresh from the Heresy.

 

So, it's cliched, but at least it's explicitly mentioned in the fluff. I suppose I can live with that. :blink:

[Terrible_Trygon]

Well a lot of Chaos Marines have survived the years. But they have added to their armour over the years, so it is a mix of marks. Simple fact is, even if you can survive 10,000 years of battle, chances are your Wargear won't.

[Sons of Horus]

are you forgetting that most Chaos space marines are 10,000 years old to begin with :D

most of them are veterans of the heresy.

[Grey Mage]

Eh, Id say go for it really. As noted warp currents and warp storms cause people to plop out all sorts of times and places.

 

Like the Ork who goes back in time and kills himself to get a copy of his favorite gun and some more boyz.

 

Or the Fallen DA who pop up all over the place from time to time... and dont have a clue what year it is. Let alone people like Cypher.

 

Heck, wouldnt it be something if a lost group of "Dusk Raiders" dropped out of warp around a planet they were sent to conquer, found out it was under imperial control, and that they werent welcome? Imagine how hard that would hit somebody, to find out that theyd found and lost their father and been branded traitors by their comrades and grandfather and everyone theyd ever known or cared about was gone, dead, or a betrayer... and that their descendants wanted to kill them.

 

*Head explodes*.

 

Great, now I want to write this, badly.

[nuclear.anxiety]

Heck, wouldnt it be something if a lost group of "Dusk Raiders" dropped out of warp around a planet they were sent to conquer, found out it was under imperial control, and that they werent welcome? Imagine how hard that would hit somebody, to find out that theyd found and lost their father and been branded traitors by their comrades and grandfather and everyone theyd ever known or cared about was gone, dead, or a betrayer... and that their descendants wanted to kill them.

 

*Head explodes*.

 

Great, now I want to write this, badly.

 

oh man! and the number of marines could potentially come close or exceed that of a chapter. Oh, and they'd be spreading the Imperial truth rather than the worshiping the Emperor stuff, so even if they managed to convince someone they were loyal, they'd still be heretics because they don't see Emperor as a god...

[Skirax]

I really love the Heresey era fluff too :) and I absolutely adore the mkIII and mkIV patterns of armour however I'm not sure if you could get away with haveing a squad of marines survive from the 31st to the 41st millenium. The Horus Heresy books describe marines as being functionally immortal, (ie; aside from death in battle or a (very) serious accident they could live forever) Although whether they actually are or not is difficult to judge as the longest lived contemporary marine not wearing a suit of Dreadnought armour is Blood Angels Commander Dante (around 1000 years of age if memory serves me correctly) so technically some could survive if they'd had somewhere to hide for 40000 years or so. Cliched as it is I think that being stuck in the warp or marooned in a dead area of the galaxy would be the only way you could have marines survive for so long.

 

All the Thousand Sons who survived the razing of Prospero that weren't sorcerers were reduced to dust filled suits of armour by the Rubric of Ahriman. However that's not to say that there weren't any who weren't on Prospero at the time...

 

James

They don't have to have survived that long, they could just be that era Mks of armour, like the ones in the Ultras second company page.

 

Also, you say you want to use these in a CSM army, is that Chaos Space Marines or Codex Space Marines? Also, you'd have to GS the little bunny ears on them ;)

[Terrible_Trygon]

are you forgetting that most Chaos space marines are 10,000 years old to begin with :)

most of them are veterans of the heresy.

 

Eh?

 

Well a lot of Chaos Marines have survived the years. But they have added to their armour over the years, so it is a mix of marks. Simple fact is, even if you can survive 10,000 years of battle, chances are your Wargear won't.

 

I was saying that the reason why Chaos Marines have such mixed wargear is because a lot of their original Pre-Heresy wargear might have been damaged beyond repair at some time. It is not to say some Chaos Marines have managed to avoid fatal wargear damage, but the majority likely haven't. It is why they have several marks of power armour making up their suits.

[lee265]

You want a chapter that fell out of the warp after 10,000 years go for it.

 

Or just have one that uses a lot of old equipment and has some sort of flaw alowing them to access the memories of previous marines to have it.

 

Or whatever other explanation you can come up with.

[Lansirill]

Also, you say you want to use these in a CSM army, is that Chaos Space Marines or Codex Space Marines? Also, you'd have to GS the little bunny ears on them :)

 

Chaos Space Marines. CSM -> C:CSM SM -> C:SM. :lol:

 

And, oh god, if I could go back in time I would make sure whoever made up those TS heads was never allowed to listen to the Bangles. I clipped and filled those things off all of my models for the squad except for the sorcerer. :huh: I'm actually thinking of painting up some of the tac squads from the AoBR boxes I have to be rubrics (after removing the aquilla.) The only things I really like in the TS box are the shoulder pads and bolters.

[Chief Librarian Benarius]

The Space Wolves thirteenth company is made up out of space marines that survived since the HH and are now in the 41 millenium.