Assassins...

[Uncle Mel]

I like the assassins, i almost always use a callidus. however like everyone else, i feel they should get a bit of extra oomph. frags for assaulty assassins, better odds against cover for the vindi, etc

 

this has got to do with the fact that gaming conditions have changed since 3E and the assassins have not been kept up to date ( like all wh/dh stuff). everytime someone reminds me of this fact, i just think "just a couple more years.."

 

Mel

[Toogeloo]

What more could I want?

 

Frag Grenades.

 

This.

 

I don't think allowing the Vindicare to ignore all saving throws, wound on a 2+ or Turbo-Penetrate every turn would be a very good idea; don't forget that his rifle is AP2. A round that ignored cover saves would be cool though, as would something to replace the defunct Fast Shot special rule.

 

For as much as a Vindicare costs, none of that is broken. Yes, his Rifle is AP2, but it also only fires once a round and only if the Vinidcare didn't move. The Vindicare is extremely easy to kill if and if the opponent is letting the Assassin live for longer than 2 or 3 turns, then that is his fault.

[GodwynDi]

I have to agree with just the minor tweaks, callidus, eversor, and DC can charge into terrain and not attack last. Also, unlimited special ammo for the Vindi, but alter the Turbo-Penetrator, and, although extremely unlikely, have them spell out how it works on a monolith.

[Yeril]

A lil story about the other two temples

 

Vanus temple is only mentioned in name, Vanus means "Nothing", I like to think of them as where Eversors are Masters of Kill everyone everywhere, Vindacres are Kill one person and let everyone know ect. the Vanus are masters of the "What? What do you mean hes dead, we dont have any problem with him, why on earth would we send an assassin at him? infact we have never even heard of the fellow!"

 

Venenium (Sp?) Are masters of poison, a notable story is of an Assassin sent to kill a evil tyrant overlord of a world, only to get caught in the warp on the way and stuck for 30 years. When she arrived at the planet the tyrant was long dead and had been replaced by a council of 200 members. Since the planet was still anti-imperium the Assassin just shrugged and went to work with her poisons, ended up killing every single one of them via a contact poison placed on their seats.

[Chengar Qordath]

I would think that the Vanus temple would be more about making people disappear. That would be rather intimidating if one day an enemy of the Imperium just disappeared with no explanation and was never found again. Assuming I'm right about their role, I could also see a Vanus assassin being used for targets who need to be interrogated before their execution. No idea how that kind of assassin would work on tabletop though.

 

A Veneum assassin would be fairly simple to model in tabletop; just give all the assassin a decent set of weapons with the Poisoned (2+) USR.

[Vedrial]

I would think that the Vanus temple would be more about making people disappear. That would be rather intimidating if one day an enemy of the Imperium just disappeared with no explanation and was never found again. Assuming I'm right about their role, I could also see a Vanus assassin being used for targets who need to be interrogated before their execution. No idea how that kind of assassin would work on tabletop though.

 

Vanus Assassin

 

Points: 150

 

Wargear: Tranquilizer Pistol, Antipsychotic Barbs, Stealth Suit.

 

Stealth Suit: See Vindicare Assassin entry.

 

Tranquilizer Pistol: Fires drug-laced darts that temporarily incapacitate the target. It uses the following profile:

 

Range: 12" Strength: X AP: - Type: Assault 1

 

If the target is hit by the Tranquilizer Pistol, it must immediately take a Pinning Test at -3 Ld.

 

The Tranquilizer Pistol grants an additional attack in close combat like a pistol.

 

Antipsychotic Barbs: The Vanus Assassin counts as having a power weapon. If an enemy takes an unsaved wound from the Vanus Assassin, it must immediately take a Pinning Test with a negative Leadership modifier eqaul to the amount of saved or unsaved wounds caused by the Assassin.

 

Special Rules

 

Fleet: See Warhammer 40,000 main rule book.

 

High Value Target List: The Vanus Assassin has the preferred enemy universal special rule against any Independent Character or Upgrade Character.

 

Kidnap: Anytime during the turn of the player controlling the Vanus Assassin, the Assassin may attempt to kidnap an enemy Independent Character or Upgrade Character that the Assassin is in base to base contact with. When attempting to kidnap a target, the Assassin and its target each roll a 2D6 and their Leadership value (after modifiers) to this number. The target then subtracts D3 from its number. If the Assassin's number is higher, both the Assassin and its target are removed from play as casualties. If the target's number is higher, only the Assassin is removed from play as a casualty.

 

If the target is pinned, then it is automatically successfully kidnapped, and both the target and the Assassin are removed.

[SoulReaver296]

what about an "accident" assassin? like bridges falling with troops on it, tanks sabotaged, rations tainted, ammunition stores destroyed, that kind of thing?

 

EDIT: Like what DevianID suggested

[Chengar Qordath]

The Vanus Assassin Vedrial wrote up has potential, though I'm unsure the Antipsychotic Barbs would work; normally pinning doesn't happen to units that are already in close combat.

 

A sabotage-based assassin could work; I'd say -1 to all reserve rolls, and the ability to put traps in terrain similar to an SM Scout Bike Squad's Cluster Mines (though presumably nastier). The assassin itself should be fairly weak; his strength lies in nasty surprises, not personal combat.

 

Here are my current thoughts on a Veneum temple Assassin:

 

Cost: 115 points

 

Wargear: Veneum Temple Needle Pistol, Toxic Fang

 

Veneum Temple Needle Pistol: While the needle pistol is a reasonably common weapon, those wielded by the assassins of the Veneum temple are exceptional in quality. Th Veneum Temple Needle Pistol uses a reinforced needle designed to pierce armor, and is coated with extremely potent toxins known only to the Veneum Temple. It fires with the following profile:

Range 12" Strength: X AP: 4 Type: Pistol Poisoned (2+)

 

Toxic Fang: The Toxic Fang is a power weapon with the Poisoned (2+) universal special rule.

 

Special Rules

 

Toxic Blood: Operatives of the Veneum Temple have been so heavily exposed to various poisons over the course of their duties that their very blood has become a leathal toxic substance. Any model that makes a successful close combat attack against a Veneum assassin takes a wound on a roll of 4+, with saving throws allowed as normal.

 

Poison Immunity: As a result of their constant exposure to toxins, the Veneum assassin is immune to all known poisons. Any weapon with the Poisoned Universal Special rule uses its strength as normal. Poisoned Weapons without a strength value do no damage to Veneum Assassin.

[Vedrial]

The Vanus Assassin Vedrial wrote up has potential, though I'm unsure the Antipsychotic Barbs would work; normally pinning doesn't happen to units that are already in close combat.

 

A sabotage-based assassin could work; I'd say -1 to all reserve rolls, and the ability to put traps in terrain similar to an SM Scout Bike Squad's Cluster Mines (though presumably nastier). The assassin itself should be fairly weak; his strength lies in nasty surprises, not personal combat.

 

Here are my current thoughts on a Veneum temple Assassin:

 

Cost: 115 points

 

Wargear: Veneum Temple Needle Pistol, Toxic Fang

 

Veneum Temple Needle Pistol: While the needle pistol is a reasonably common weapon, those wielded by the assassins of the Veneum temple are exceptional in quality. Th Veneum Temple Needle Pistol uses a reinforced needle designed to pierce armor, and is coated with extremely potent toxins known only to the Veneum Temple. It fires with the following profile:

Range 12" Strength: X AP: 4 Type: Pistol Poisoned (2+)

 

Toxic Fang: The Toxic Fang is a power weapon with the Poisoned (2+) universal special rule.

 

Special Rules

 

Toxic Blood: Operatives of the Veneum Temple have been so heavily exposed to various poisons over the course of their duties that their very blood has become a leathal toxic substance. Any model that makes a successful close combat attack against a Veneum assassin takes a wound on a roll of 4+, with saving throws allowed as normal.

 

Poison Immunity: As a result of their constant exposure to toxins, the Veneum assassin is immune to all known poisons. Any weapon with the Poisoned Universal Special rule uses its strength as normal. Poisoned Weapons without a strength value do no damage to Veneum Assassin.

 

I like the idea. It incorporate just about every aspect of poison that 40k offers. And the Toxic Blood is a nice touch.

 

In defence of my Antipsychotic Barbs, there's really nothing that makes pinning and close combat incompatible. There's just the fact that only ranged weapons cause pinning currently. Going to ground in melee would effectively be the same as going to ground in the shooting phase. The pinned unit still cannot do anything on it's next turn. The purpose of the melee pinning is to give the Assassin a chance to kidnap the enemy, since kidnap can be used at any time during the controlling player's turn.

[Chengar Qordath]

In defence of my Antipsychotic Barbs, there's really nothing that makes pinning and close combat incompatible. There's just the fact that only ranged weapons cause pinning currently. Going to ground in melee would effectively be the same as going to ground in the shooting phase. The pinned unit still cannot do anything on it's next turn. The purpose of the melee pinning is to give the Assassin a chance to kidnap the enemy, since kidnap can be used at any time during the controlling player's turn.

True; there's nothing in the rules that says a melee weapon can't cause pinning, it just hasn't been done before.

[antique_nova]

I've got a couple of suggestions to give assassins a bit more worth on the table.

 

Firstly, 'Eternal Warrior' across the board. There's nothing worse than having 100pts (give or take a few) nailed in one go before they've even had chance to do any damage. Add this and each wound is a wound regardless of weapon S.

 

Then for each individual;

Callidus - Make it that 'A Word In Your Ear' is not restrained to just your opponents force within their deployment zone. Open it right up so that she can either be used to move enemy units 6" where ever they are deployed, including infiltrators, but also make it possible for her to move friendly a unit 6" if desired. Fluff wise itcould be justifiied through her feeding the allied force with inside intelligence.

 

Eversor - I'd agree that he deserves to get his 2 shots back and thats just the start. For me the Eversor should represent the closest thing to a khorne berserker that can exist in theimperium without being purged. So, lets get 'Feel no Pain' added in there, after all, he's so drugged up to the eyeballs he's not going to feel an awful lot of pain if he's hurt.

 

Vindicare - This is a bit of a tough one as I don't agree with giving unlimited special rounds to him, it would defintiely make him overpowered and the turbo penetrator would pretty much be the no brainer choice turn in turn out. I think a little bit of a subtle touch is required, such as master crafting his weapon or giving him BS6. All you need is that reroll to make the difference because it's when he misses that he fails to get his points back.

 

Finally, I've never played a culexus so couldn't make a definitive comment but considering the influx of psykers there's got to be a place for him, however it does need to be a bit more universal to appeal to players.

 

i have just seen this reply and skipped the rest so sorry, but the eversor does have TWO SHOTS, he is so fast that he always counts as if he has not moved, even when he has. and in the rules when you stand still and shoot with a pistol you get two shots. so wala thers the two shots mate.

also vindicare should have unlimited ammo, it seems bizzare not and i like the idea of eternal warrior and feel no pain for the eversor, except against force weapons which seems about right.

thanks

antique_nova

[Chengar Qordath]

i have just seen this reply and skipped the rest so sorry, but the eversor does have TWO SHOTS, he is so fast that he always counts as if he has not moved, even when he has. and in the rules when you stand still and shoot with a pistol you get two shots. so wala thers the two shots mate.

Might want to double-check your 5th edition BRB; pistols only get one shot now, regardless of moving/standing still.

 

Now, one could argue for two shots because the Eversor's special rule specifically mentions that "it may always fire twice" under RAW, and there's a very good arguement to be made under RAI, but the direct reading of the rule says that Eversors only get one shot since 5th edition.