The_son_of_Dorn Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Hello all Now I am a big fan of Chaplain's ( giant well armoured super trained humans who can crush nearly any enemy with near unmatched zeal, but if it wasn't for the chaplians of the word bearers would the Heresey ever of ensued? I mean it was chaplians spreaders of the imperial butter like faith over the toast of the universe who corrupted Lorgar and turned Horus to strike his own farther down- so here is the irony - the preachers of the imperial faith creating the near total downfall of the imperium itself. How do you feel about chaplains and these circumstances - Let me know yall :) --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- :D Think. . . . . . when your in trouble. . . . . . . . what would a ninja do? :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
dark warmaster Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 aaaah i like what your doing here heretic but you dont fool me no. but i do see where your coming from it is quite ironic how the chaplains are the ones the imperium relies on to keep the astartes from heresy (besides the inquisition) are the ones that started the heresy. but then again it was only one chaplain......erebus Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2011262 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius The Dead Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I think that the Chaplains are a paradox in the early days of the Imperium. I say this because one of the first things the Big E did was to abolish religion or belief in any greater power. At the time of the great crusade everyone was an atheist(sp?) so chaplains didn't preach in the literal definition of the term. I think a good way to look at what they did is to look as some of the other assigned duties of an U.S. Army Chaplain. Not only do they tend to the spirtual well being of a soldier, they are the commanders eyes and ears on morale and fighting spirit of his unit. So with that being said crusade era chaplains monitered the morale and tended to the fighting spirit of the astartes. Thats just my take on the chaplains role. Now that I have run my jib about that let me address your intial question. I believe that the heresy would have still happened. The Chaos gods would have found another way without the chaplains and you really can't lay it all at Erebus feet. He was one cog in a much larger machine. I also believe that if you removed the Chaos Gods entirely the heresy still would have happened. If you take a look at all of the Primarchs that turned they almost all had some issue with the Emperor and just like any group of people who are wronged they will eventually say enough is enough. So to say that without the chaplains the heresy might not have happened is to take a narrow look at the heresy. While they might have been a factor, with or with out them it still would have happened, just not the way it did. These are just my thoughts, so take them for what they are. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2011319 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vash113 Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 The Chaplain's weren't the true unstruments of the Heresy, that would be Lorgar. He was the first Primarch corrupted and it was through him and the Warrior Lodges (not Chaplains) that his influence and manipulation spread. Erebus was his chief architect in turning Horus but he could have done that Chaplain or no. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2011356 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astalon Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Chaplains are just a source of spiritual and emotional solace and reflection for the marines, it does not mean it is contrary to the imperial truth. Nothing religious is implied by their position, apart from the misleading name. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2011376 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Master Tyrak Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 Erebus was his chief architect in turning Horus but he could have done that Chaplain or no. I thought Kor Phaeron had a hand in it too? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2011509 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_son_of_Dorn Posted June 4, 2009 Author Share Posted June 4, 2009 The Chaplain's weren't the true unstruments of the Heresy, that would be Lorgar. He was the first Primarch corrupted and it was through him and the Warrior Lodges (not Chaplains) that his influence and manipulation spread. Erebus was his chief architect in turning Horus but he could have done that Chaplain or no. a chaplain corrupted by a chaplain that is my point - your should read the paralell univere in the interlegionary wars - shows you how such a small change can make such a massive difference Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2011596 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Angel Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I think that the chaplins probably evoled from a kind of peer councilor and over watch position in the Emperor's armies. Think about what a normal human can stand in the way of combat and bloodshed. Now consider the the Marines had been doing this for hundreds of years already. At what point does it become 1 battle too many? I think they were supose to keep things like that from happening through tradition and by providing the means by which a battle brother could return to a calm and civil state after battle. Chaplins helped their brothers retain their humanity in the face of the fell deeds their work requied of them. Other wise the Legions should have quickly devolved into cold killing machines without concern for the carnage they left in their wake. Obviously this was not a totaly successful process. I think too in many ways they helped to keep each Leigions indavidual traditions alive and well as they do for the chapters today. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2011615 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 The Chaplain edict would have helped spread the Heresy, but also would have helped strengthen the loyalists resolve to their cause. In the end I think the chaplains were just a tool utilised by Chaos and if they did not exist another tool would have been used. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2012862 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 The Chaplain's weren't the true unstruments of the Heresy, that would be Lorgar. He was the first Primarch corrupted and it was through him and the Warrior Lodges (not Chaplains) that his influence and manipulation spread. Erebus was his chief architect in turning Horus but he could have done that Chaplain or no. a chaplain corrupted by a chaplain that is my point - your should read the paralell univere in the interlegionary wars - shows you how such a small change can make such a massive difference It has nothing to do with the fact that they were chaplains- it has to do with the fact that their primarch trusted them because they shared a calling, and were similarly dissatisfied. That being the case the primarch considered their words and then acted- they showed a path, but it was not their positions that started the heresy, it was Lorgars. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2013039 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted June 8, 2009 Share Posted June 8, 2009 no actually Lorgar was the root of the corruption. it happened during his 1 month self exile wherein he found the Chaos Gods and made his legion worship them and etc. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170281-chaplains/#findComment-2014658 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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