ArmouredWing Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 It's a pretty simple question really, how much do you think an exorcist missile launcher should cost independantly of the (mobile) rhino chasis with the AV13 front armour? My main reason for the question is in preparation for planet strike. Not content with having to put up with boring old HB turrets for the 'forces of the imperium' I've got some left over exorcist pipes that I reckon would present a nice addition to the defensive capability of my sisters. With that being the case I'm after a ball park figure of how much the launchers would be worth in points when I swap the HB's for them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toogeloo Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I would guesstimate the Exorcist Launcher itself is an 80 point upgrade. I used the Space Marine Predator as the basis of the point cost for the Chasis and subtracted 5 points for the Assault Cannon. I took that value and subtracted it from the Exorcist's basic cost to represent the cost of the chasis being subtracted and that is how I got 80 points. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2011673 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Empty Bolter Clip Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 My initial thought... 85 points, simply the cost of a regular exorcist minus the cost of a rhino, but that sounds extremely expensive! Any idea of what the points cost/ratio would be for the standard HB turrets? What about the tarantula ones from forgeworld? Just looking for something to compare it to... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2011678 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmouredWing Posted June 4, 2009 Author Share Posted June 4, 2009 My initial thought... 85 points, simply the cost of a regular exorcist minus the cost of a rhino, but that sounds extremely expensive! Any idea of what the points cost/ratio would be for the standard HB turrets? What about the tarantula ones from forgeworld? Just looking for something to compare it to... Well, I was going to use the immolator HB upgrade as the points cost to deduct. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2011686 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodunius Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I would guesstimate the Exorcist Launcher itself is an 80 point upgrade. I used the Space Marine Predator as the basis of the point cost for the Chasis and subtracted 5 points for the Assault Cannon. I took that value and subtracted it from the Exorcist's basic cost to represent the cost of the chasis being subtracted and that is how I got 80 points. I'd guess about 50-60 pts, I think you've undercosted the Auto Cannon, but since Witch Hunters is a 3rd edition Codex they would have based it on the 3rd edition Predator which was 40pts more expensive than the current one. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2012131 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toogeloo Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Well are we guesstimating what the cost of the launcher was back in 3rd edition or what it would cost as an upgrade today? It's kind of sticky, but I would say currently the launcher costs 80 points by today's point costs due to the cost of the Predator Chasis. You can't subtract too much for the cost of the Assault Canon because then you start getting to close to actual cost of Razorback (+2 Front Armor has to be a fairly decent chunk of points too). Back in 3rd edition (I wasn't playing at the time), the points would likely be different due to Predator costs at the time, but are we looking for what the Launcher used to cost as an upgrade or current cost? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2012293 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodunius Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Back in 3rd edition (I wasn't playing at the time), the points would likely be different due to Predator costs at the time, but are we looking for what the Launcher used to cost as an upgrade or current cost? Exactly, the Witch Hunter codex is creakily obsolescent, the design team abandoned it two editions ago - its costs have not been amended to reflect changes to other lists. If your going to reverse engineer something you need to base it on how they built it, not how it was affected by changes made to another list 2 editions later. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2012375 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperator Mos Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Well if you're going to put it on a turret with the same AV then it shouldn't cost much less. The Exo launcher is a hell of a weapon... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2012392 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toogeloo Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Back in 3rd edition (I wasn't playing at the time), the points would likely be different due to Predator costs at the time, but are we looking for what the Launcher used to cost as an upgrade or current cost? Exactly, the Witch Hunter codex is creakily obsolescent, the design team abandoned it two editions ago - its costs have not been amended to reflect changes to other lists. If your going to reverse engineer something you need to base it on how they built it, not how it was affected by changes made to another list 2 editions later. Are you suggesting then that if a new Witch Hunter Codex were released today that the Exorcist would probably cost 100-115 points(based on your earlier post as well)? That would be a helluva bargain. **(Sorry about Assault an Auto Cannon mix ups, I do that a lot for some reason)** Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2012482 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor Fox Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I've been noticing a trend of vehicles going down about 30 to 60 points in newer codices, at least transports particularly. The other vehicles seem to be getting cheaper as well, but transports is really where I notice the point deduction. Chimeras as I run them are now about 50 points cheaper in the new IG Codex, Rhinos for SM are similarly discounted, as well as Razorbacks. Look at the price difference for Sisters Rhinos and Repressors in the IA2 document. Of course, the Exorcist stayed relatively similarly costed in IA2... so the discounting may just be on any vehicle with a transport capacity. Heck, even Valkyries got a lot cheaper when you compare them to their Apocalypse / Apocalypse: Reloaded values. Edit: As a note, said Valkyrie comparisons not only are about 40 to 50 points Cheaper, they also have more AV on the front and sides. Talk about a bargain! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2012493 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodunius Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Are you suggesting then that if a new Witch Hunter Codex were released today that the Exorcist would probably cost 100-115 points(based on your earlier post as well)? That would be a helluva bargain. Its a distinct possibility. Or possibly get a power increase of some sort - not that it necissarily needs it, but that certainly seems to be the way they are going these days (eg: Land Raiders staying the same price but getting a major boost with the Machine Spirit rule, the Leman Russes getting increase firepower and the main turret rule). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2012727 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Sasha Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 Seeing as in practice Whirlwinds and Exorcists are effectively artillery, they rarely get moved after set-up, they should really be out of range of being assaulted, and behind good cover, I would say that a launcher without the truck would barely be any cheaper. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2012736 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saxxon the Dragoon Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 if possible, you could customize the EX launcher with a very special tarantula base, because if your going to have it as a base defense, your going to need it on a turret mount, and the ex launcher is a hull mounted weapon, unless you plan on using the updated IA2 rules. i agree with the point cost being about 85 points, seems right for such a powerful weapon, but i would suggest reducing its range from 48" if i remember correctly, to wither 36" or 24" to stop your opponent from BAAAAWWWWWing, but that would almost defeat the purpose of it being artillery, even though its not an ordnance weapon. if you wanted to give it the full range, then i would suggest putting it to about 95 or 100 pts to keep it in check. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2012899 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmouredWing Posted June 9, 2009 Author Share Posted June 9, 2009 if possible, you could customize the EX launcher with a very special tarantula base, because if your going to have it as a base defense, your going to need it on a turret mount, and the ex launcher is a hull mounted weapon, unless you plan on using the updated IA2 rules. i agree with the point cost being about 85 points, seems right for such a powerful weapon, but i would suggest reducing its range from 48" if i remember correctly, to wither 36" or 24" to stop your opponent from BAAAAWWWWWing, but that would almost defeat the purpose of it being artillery, even though its not an ordnance weapon. if you wanted to give it the full range, then i would suggest putting it to about 95 or 100 pts to keep it in check.Hmmm, I'd have to disagree with rating it as expensive as 95-100pts, maybe 80pts but I'd even say that's a bit steep (was thinking more like 75pts). The thing is that part of the reason why the exorcist is such an effective weapon is the fact it can move 6" and fire D6 times, effectively giving it a 54" range. Additionally being able to place it behind cover and move it to ensure that some of the more deadly weaponry lack a LoS can be equally important. For me part of the effectiveness is down to the mobility and I guess it's that I'm trying to place a value on. In relation to.... Seeing as in practice Whirlwinds and Exorcists are effectively artillery, they rarely get moved after set-up, they should really be out of range of being assaulted, and behind good cover, I would say that a launcher without the truck would barely be any cheaper....again I'd be inclined to disagree with any statement that compares an exorcist with a whirlwind. Whirlwinds can supply indirect fire right across the table without having to break from cover. They can hide and fire turn in turn out if they can get away with it. The exorcist however needs LoS and it's that which makes it vulnerable. There's no 'jump-shoot-jump' option for it, once in the open it's a serious bullet magnet and it takes some very careful placement to ensure that you present AV13 to the biggest threats on the table. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/170310-exorcist-launcher-points-cost/#findComment-2016261 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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