Dark Angel Successor DIY

[DarkGuard]

I've been playing with a DIY Chapter for a while, with a background revolving around them being Luna Wolf successors. However, after reading the excellent DIY Chapter Creation article here on B+C I've realised this was a rather silly idea (something I'd been in self-denial about). I've now decided to take heart from when I used to play Dark Angels, and name them as a Dark Angel successor. I've made some notes and ideas on the actual Chapter.

 

My idea for them is to have them as a rather old Chapter, probably about the time of the 8th Founding, and subsequently designated an Astartes Praeses Chapter. The Dark Angels were happy to have some of their geneseed taken, and sent a cadre of senior Marines from the Chapter to raise this fledgling Chapter in their traditions. This Chapter, in addition to its duty of an Astartes Praeses chapter (guard Eye of Terror) would also watch signs of any of the Fallen that may surface there.

 

The Chapter would have the same organisation as the Dark Angels, and up to half of the 1st and 2nd Companies would be held in reserve to react to possible Fallen threats. The other units would be used along with the Battle Companies in the frequent fights against Chaos, lest other Imperial forces accuse them of not trying their hardest in their duty by keeping their veterans from fighting. Each Battle and Reserve Company would also be rather self-sufficient so that they can spread out around the area and ensure no Fallen slip through their net.

 

These are the main ideas, although I am currently devising a piece of history where the Fallen managed to set a successful trap, resulting in serious damage to the Chapter, as leats half the 1st Company lost or having their TDA seriously damaged, and with at least 2 Battle/Reserve Companies near destroyed.

 

I will be writing up these ideas into a proper IA article when I have the time between painting and gaming, and would appreciate any comments that can be made.

 

Also, something else to condsider would be the name. As my last DIY Chapter was named the Shadow Wolves, I've considered calling them the Shadow Guard. More than anything this links in with their armour, which is predominantly a dark shadow blue colour (Fenris Grey/Shadow Grey). However, I do also like the idea of the Dark Guard, as this will also relate in small part to the colour scheme, while also tying them in a way to the Dark Angels. Any ideas?

[DarkGuard]

Bump. No ideas, contructive criticism in this idea for a DIY Chapter? Or is it a good idea and just needs me to flesh it out in a Index Astartes?

[Brother Hadafix]

It sounds good, but I really dont know enough about the DA to fully comment.

 

The Colour scheme sounds ok, I dont know why a successor would always be similar colours to there founding chapter.

 

Are you sure you want them mainly guarding the EoT? Why not fleet based and trawling whole systems kind of AL style? You could make the Chapter a lot darker that way.

[DarkGuard]

Are you sure you want them mainly guarding the EoT? Why not fleet based and trawling whole systems kind of AL style? You could make the Chapter a lot darker that way.

 

That is certainly a possiblity, having them fleet based. However, the Dark Angels themselves are fleet based, and so are a lot of their Successors I'd imagine. This allows them to quickly respond to hints of the Fallen. I want my Chapter to be a little different, and it makes sense that the Dark Angels would have a successor at the EoT in case some Fallen surface there.

 

I suppose however, they could still be fleet based and loosely guard it, with some patrols away from the Cadian Gate to look at some of the 'backdoors'. They could also have a reserve company that is able to react to threats outside the EoT but near the area.

 

One other reason why I wanted them as a Praeses Chapter is so that it become possibly a bit harder to maintain a Dark Angel structure with constant casulties, resulting in some more Codex tendencies ie. more veterans like the Sternguard, allowing me to use both the Dark Angel and Space Marine codices, but that is more a gameplay issue than a background issue :woot:

 

The idea for fleet based is a good idea, as even as a Praeses Chapter it allows them flexibility to react to Fallen threats. Thanks for your ideas and response.

[Chaplain Castus]

One suggestion i have, is to make sure you point out in your history bit, that the Dark Angels had shared the secret of The Fallen with your Chapter (or atleast the top leaders of your Chapter).

The Dark Angels just dont bust out that secret for any successor of their's (Let alone Marines of their own Chapter to boot).

 

Other than that, keep up the good work man B)

[Tyrannicide]

Well, as of right now I don't see anything substantially different between your Chapter and the Dark Angels. Obviously the idea of creating a Dark Angels successor is to include (usually) the Hunt for the Fallen, and the secrecy of your own inner circle. Currently the only thing that differentiates your Chapter from their primogenitors is that they're members of the Astartes Praeses. Congrats you and the other three-hundred Chapters that somehow fit into twenty available slots that are open for the job win. I really do like the idea of the Astartes Praeses, it's interesting that the Chapter dedicates most of its numbers to the safeguarding of the Eye of Terror region, but it has been so overused since its first mention that it's annoying by now. I think you could do a lot with this Chapter, and I really do look forward to reading your progress. I'll give you any and all feedback I have on your ideas if you'd like. B)

[DarkGuard]

One suggestion i have, is to make sure you point out in your history bit, that the Dark Angels had shared the secret of The Fallen with your Chapter (or atleast the top leaders of your Chapter).

The Dark Angels just dont bust out that secret for any successor of their's (Let alone Marines of their own Chapter to boot).

 

Other than that, keep up the good work man :D

 

Oops, really should have included that, I'll make sure I put that in the final writeup, thanks for the heads up.

[DarkGuard]

Well, as of right now I don't see anything substantially different between your Chapter and the Dark Angels. Obviously the idea of creating a Dark Angels successor is to include (usually) the Hunt for the Fallen, and the secrecy of your own inner circle. Currently the only thing that differentiates your Chapter from their primogenitors is that they're members of the Astartes Praeses. Congrats you and the other three-hundred Chapters that somehow fit into twenty available slots that are open for the job win. I really do like the idea of the Astartes Praeses, it's interesting that the Chapter dedicates most of its numbers to the safeguarding of the Eye of Terror region, but it has been so overused since its first mention that it's annoying by now. I think you could do a lot with this Chapter, and I really do look forward to reading your progress. I'll give you any and all feedback I have on your ideas if you'd like. :D

 

You raise some interesting points Darth Potato. If the Astartes Praeses has been done to death then I'll start to look at other possibilities. I've just looked at the Dark Angels Codex and discovered that the Guardian's of the Covenant are in the region of the Halo Stars, so it seems unlikely that the Dark Angels would need another Chapter there. Do you know of any other place that the Fallen may be more susceptible to congregate at?

 

Perhaps an idea to try and make them stand out is that they are aware of the Hunt, but will not pull all forces out of an active warzone to engage the Fallen unless the situation is stable, rather sending along elements of the 1st and 2nd Company backed up by a reserve. Kind of opposite to the Angels of Redemption. If it could work it would work better with the whole Chapter only working in a certain sector. The idea of Praeses could be used with this, unless you feel it would be better to leave that? Them being a young Chapter could also help establish that. I'd imagine that less equipment, less hunting?

 

What I suppose I'm looking for is a Dark Angel Successor that while participating in the Hunt realise that they must not do so recklessly ie. leaving Imperial Forces outnumbered, as this arouses suspicion and is not profitable to the Imperium in the Time of Ending. Perhaps having them with similar beliefs to the Angels of Absolution, in that the Dark Angels Legion were absolved of the sins of their traitorous brethren when they attacked and scattered them?

[Brother Hadafix]

Was thinking... if you want them in the EoT area and not doing the same thing as official successors, why not have them specialise in ship to ship warfare? You could also have "working closely" with the Imperial Navy in the area tracking "suspicious" naval activities, and less involved in land battles.

[Tyrannicide]

Okay.

 

So from your last post, I got your main focus. You'd basically like a more composed, vigilant Chapter, opposed to the Dark Angels and some of their other successors who can act on a whim, very recklessly. I like that and I think you could play off of that concept a lot actually. Right off the bat, I see these guys in more of a 'Salamanders' light, they seem to be more humanitarian than the other Dark Angels, though not soft in the slightest. I think you could base these guys anywhere in the galaxy, I'm just personally opposed to the Eye of Terror region since the Dark Angels are frequently seen around that area of space.

[Chaplain Castus]

One suggestion i have, is to make sure you point out in your history bit, that the Dark Angels had shared the secret of The Fallen with your Chapter (or atleast the top leaders of your Chapter).

The Dark Angels just dont bust out that secret for any successor of their's (Let alone Marines of their own Chapter to boot).

 

Other than that, keep up the good work man :)

 

Oops, really should have included that, I'll make sure I put that in the final writeup, thanks for the heads up.

 

Anytime :D I'm here to help!

[DarkGuard]

Okay.

 

So from your last post, I got your main focus. You'd basically like a more composed, vigilant Chapter, opposed to the Dark Angels and some of their other successors who can act on a whim, very recklessly. I like that and I think you could play off of that concept a lot actually. Right off the bat, I see these guys in more of a 'Salamanders' light, they seem to be more humanitarian than the other Dark Angels, though not soft in the slightest. I think you could base these guys anywhere in the galaxy, I'm just personally opposed to the Eye of Terror region since the Dark Angels are frequently seen around that area of space.

 

That's pretty much the character I wanted them to have, summed up better than I could have done Darth Potato.

 

I agree with you on the fact that there is a lot of Dark Angel activity around the EoT, with the Guardians of the Covenant in the region and I'm pretty sure that the Rock was recorded near the EoT in 998.M41. If you advise a different location I could follow Brother Hadafix's idea of having them as a fleet based Chapter.

 

Another idea for location may be to have them located in the galactic north of Ultima Segmentum, near the Storm of the Emperor's Wrath, or perhaps in the galactic north-east near the Ghoul Star, which I believe is an unknown region of space and could be the refuge of the Fallen.

 

One idea I like a lot though is the idea of basing them in the south of Segmentum Tempestus, by the Veiled Region, which is also an unknown region of space. This could also tie into the idea of a more humanitarian nature as opposed to other Unforgiven Chapters in that Hive Fleet Leviathon chose to attack the Imperium near to this area. It can be assumed that due to their more humanitarian nature, they are not pursuing the hunt as vigilantly as other Unforgiven Chapters due to the threat that the Tyranid invasion presents to the Imperium as a whole. They are loathe to leave worlds undefended in the wake of the invasion due to the fact that it will then gain momentum. A series of running battles, including ship to ship engagements results in losses to Chapter. With the diversion of the fleet to an Ork Empire (can't remember which one), the Chapter is able to regroup and start to rebuild loses while starting to mobilize stratagems which could slow and defeat the alien invasion.

 

In this instance the Chapter has gone from hunting to Chaos to being quite expert dealing with Tyranids. They haven't stopped the Hunt, but rather 'suspended' it to deal with a more imminent and pressing threat (but have some reserves in case some Fallen crop up in the area). The main point I can find against it is that a lot of Chapters that have tried to deal with the Tyranid threat have been near destroyed eg. Scythes of the Emperor. I suppose a good set of tactics and knowing where to pick your fights could avoid this though.

 

Is this feasible, or even a good idea?

 

Criticism and ideas welcome as always.

[Tyrannicide]

I think it's a good idea, definitely. I like the concept of 'suspending' the Hunt for the Fallen, and instead focussing on tracking and destroying elements of Hive Fleet Leviathan. Have you considered giving these guys a homeworld instead of being fleet-based? I'm curious as the homeworld aspect could add some more flavor to your Chapter, considering they recruit from the single planet. You could then incorporate more cultural influences. If not, your Chapter is still completely viable, as they once were dedicated to hunting the Fallen, and as a fleet-based Chapter they would have done so much better.

[DarkGuard]

Have you considered giving these guys a homeworld instead of being fleet-based? I'm curious as the homeworld aspect could add some more flavor to your Chapter, considering they recruit from the single planet. You could then incorporate more cultural influences.

 

I have considered that idea, and would also look into it. I'll need to try and find some decent maps with different sectors to have a look at that idea and where their homeworld is. If the homeworld is in Segmentum Tempestus, it is threatened by the Tyranids, much like how the Dark Angel's Plain's World was invested by a genestealer infestation. Their homeworld under threat would therefore mean that they would be anxious to destroy the Tyranids to protect the homeworld.

 

As for fighting the Tyranids, elements of the Chapter (say about 3 companies or so) could have been used in the defence of Tarsis Ultra, where one of the two tendrils of Leviathan was destroyed. If the homeworld is to the north, then the Chapter would satisfied that imminent threat to the homeworld would be stalled. After hit and run attacks on the 2nd tendril to the galactic east, aided by the 1st and 2nd companies which are adept at quick insertion, rapid action, and possibly rapid removal from the battlefield, Inquisitor Kryptman finally lures the Tyranid wave into the Octavius system, where they fight the Orks. The Chapter then look to rebuild and regroup, possibly having at least a 1/3 of the Chapter destroyed by the battles, maybe even 1/2? They re-fortify the homeworld, pick apart some splinters of the Tyranids while the main Hive Fleet is fighting the Orks, and perhaps then start listening out to rumours of the Fallen once again, while requesting aid from other Unforgiven Chapters if the Tyranids would strike again?

 

The homeworld could also be what makes them slightly more humantarian through its culture, otherwise I can't see much reason for them to pursue this behaviour, except for a slightly divergent view by the Captain of the Dark Angels who is sent to build and train the Chapter when it was founded.

 

Also, another question, any views on the two ideas of names? I'm rather partial to Shadow Guard but the Dark Guard sounds quite good as well.

[Apothete]

I have considered that idea, and would also look into it. I'll need to try and find some decent maps with different sectors to have a look at that idea and where their homeworld is.

 

The best map that I'm aware of online can be found here.

 

As for fighting the Tyranids, elements of the Chapter (say about 3 companies or so) could have been used in the defence of Tarsis Ultra, where one of the two tendrils of Leviathan was destroyed.

 

Actually, putting them somewhere like Tarsis Ultra is a prime example of shoehorning your Chapter into a conflict where the participants are already known. The Ultramarines and Mortifactors defended the planet with the help of PDF troopers and elements of the Deathwatch, but no other outside forces were involved unless you have a more recent source that I've missed.

 

More specifically, it was a surgical strike conducted by a Deathwatch killteam that managed to slow but not outright destroy whatever portion of Leviathan had entered that system. The losses were immense and the planet itself was eventually rendered completely uninhabitable by human life through a combination of Tyranid fauna overgrowth and the eventual arrival of the Iron Warriors. What salvation could be claimed was short lived and had little effect upon the advance of Leviathan as a whole.

 

If the homeworld is to the north, then the Chapter would satisfied that imminent threat to the homeworld would be stalled. After hit and run attacks on the 2nd tendril to the galactic east, aided by the 1st and 2nd companies which are adept at quick insertion, rapid action, and possibly rapid removal from the battlefield, Inquisitor Kryptman finally lures the Tyranid wave into the Octavius system, where they fight the Orks.

 

I advise against writing yourself into Kryptman's work, as well. Doing so suffers from the same sort of over-reach that your previous idea did, since it would involve remaking elements of the universe in a way that places your Chapter as being superior to others. If they were so great, we'd have heard of them already.

 

You might also want to cut down the galaxy-spanning antics. Deploying across that large a gulf means that your embattled homeworld is going to be sorely hurting for reinforcements and in danger of being lost while Strike Cruisers are gallivanting off for months or years at a time. After all, the Mary Sue to end all Mary Sues lost an entire Company in the defense of their homeworld and just barely eked out the victory.

 

The Chapter then look to rebuild and regroup, possibly having at least a 1/3 of the Chapter destroyed by the battles, maybe even 1/2? They re-fortify the homeworld, pick apart some splinters of the Tyranids while the main Hive Fleet is fighting the Orks, and perhaps then start listening out to rumours of the Fallen once again, while requesting aid from other Unforgiven Chapters if the Tyranids would strike again?

 

I think you're vastly underestimating the effort required to "pick apart some splinters" when it took an entire Ultramarine Company, a sizeable force of Mortifactors, Deathwatch Marines that specialize in fighting Xenos, the PDF of a planet, and some very lucky work by a Magus Biologus to even slow down a few hive ships at Tarsis Ultra. Why would a single Company, or even two Companies, of your Chapter be able to do what it took so many of them to accomplish?

 

More importantly, even with the Tyranids bearing down, how are those initiated into the Inner Circle amongst your Chapter going to justify their ignorig the hunt for any measurable period of time? I doubt that the Dark Angels are going to take "but we were doing something else in the galactic east" as a viable excuse when you could have sent the forces which were engaged there to help combat the Fallen. To compound that, you're then going to go on and ask that others abandon their own vigils in order to come with your Chapter to fight the Tyranids?

 

The homeworld could also be what makes them slightly more humantarian through its culture, otherwise I can't see much reason for them to pursue this behaviour, except for a slightly divergent view by the Captain of the Dark Angels who is sent to build and train the Chapter when it was founded.

 

After the events on Caliban, I doubt that one could make it to command rank within the Dark Angels with any kind of doctrinal divergence that would make for this serious a shift in attitude. It's one reason that I abandoned using the Unforgiven as a basis for a Chapter.

 

Also, another question, any views on the two ideas of names? I'm rather partial to Shadow Guard but the Dark Guard sounds quite good as well.

 

I'm not a big fan of either, to be honest.

[DarkGuard]

Actually, putting them somewhere like Tarsis Ultra is a prime example of shoehorning your Chapter into a conflict where the participants are already known. The Ultramarines and Mortifactors defended the planet with the help of PDF troopers and elements of the Deathwatch, but no other outside forces were involved unless you have a more recent source that I've missed.

 

More specifically, it was a surgical strike conducted by a Deathwatch killteam that managed to slow but not outright destroy whatever portion of Leviathan had entered that system. The losses were immense and the planet itself was eventually rendered completely uninhabitable by human life through a combination of Tyranid fauna overgrowth and the eventual arrival of the Iron Warriors. What salvation could be claimed was short lived and had little effect upon the advance of Leviathan as a whole.

 

Fair enough, I wasn't thinking of having them as a major force, just supporting, but if the forces have already been listed I will keep them out of it.

 

I advise against writing yourself into Kryptman's work, as well. Doing so suffers from the same sort of over-reach that your previous idea did, since it would involve remaking elements of the universe in a way that places your Chapter as being superior to others. If they were so great, we'd have heard of them already.

 

I won't be having them working alongside Kryptmann. Rather, when i referred to Kryptmann was just fleshing out when the imminent Tyranid threat ended.

 

You might also want to cut down the galaxy-spanning antics. Deploying across that large a gulf means that your embattled homeworld is going to be sorely hurting for reinforcements and in danger of being lost while Strike Cruisers are gallivanting off for months or years at a time. After all, the Mary Sue to end all Mary Sues lost an entire Company in the defense of their homeworld and just barely eked out the victory.

 

Perhaps after securing the homeworld they move in some forces back into the area, while allowing the 1st and 2nd Companies resume the Hunt?

 

I think you're vastly underestimating the effort required to "pick apart some splinters" when it took an entire Ultramarine Company, a sizeable force of Mortifactors, Deathwatch Marines that specialize in fighting Xenos, the PDF of a planet, and some very lucky work by a Magus Biologus to even slow down a few hive ships at Tarsis Ultra. Why would a single Company, or even two Companies, of your Chapter be able to do what it took so many of them to accomplish?

 

OK then, noted as a bad idea, maybe having the near enough the entire Chapter active against one Splinter Fleet that is remaining?

 

More importantly, even with the Tyranids bearing down, how are those initiated into the Inner Circle amongst your Chapter going to justify their ignorig the hunt for any measurable period of time? I doubt that the Dark Angels are going to take "but we were doing something else in the galactic east" as a viable excuse when you could have sent the forces which were engaged there to help combat the Fallen. To compound that, you're then going to go on and ask that others abandon their own vigils in order to come with your Chapter to fight the Tyranids?

 

The Chapter is rather Dark Angel divergent, but it may still send some elements to help with taking down the Fallen. However, unlike the Angels of Redemption they won't extract all forces to chase a single Fallen, but rather send elements of the 1st and 2nd Companies. To do this they believe would be irresponsible, and the Imperium could still excommunicate them if withdrawing causes an entire area of space to collapse. Basically, they are a bit more cautious compared to the other Successors.

 

After the events on Caliban, I doubt that one could make it to command rank within the Dark Angels with any kind of doctrinal divergence that would make for this serious a shift in attitude. It's one reason that I abandoned using the Unforgiven as a basis for a Chapter.

 

Noted. Instead the culture of the homeworld, could lead to this idea of being more humanitarian. Perhaps it will give them a strong sense of duty to the Imperium. A belief system similar to the Angels of Absolution may be needed to help this idea.

 

 

In all, I can see it may be difficult to incorporate the Tyranids, perhaps due to the wanton destruction that precedes them. However, by making them fleet based, but still based in a certain sector or region, they may have just 'stumbled' upon the Tyranids after tracking down one of the Fallen. Help out a little bit with a splinter fleet and then move on and regroup. Or should I just avoid the Tyranids all together?

[Apothete]

Fair enough, I wasn't thinking of having them as a major force, just supporting, but if the forces have already been listed I will keep them out of it.

 

There are places where the fluff leaves gaps that you can exploit to your benefit if you're careful about what you write and how much credit you take. Some conflicts and factions within the Imperium lend themselves more to claims by an amateur author than others.

 

Not to brag on my own solution to the problem, but I made my Chapter a part of the Astartes Praeses and positioned them in a highly undeveloped portion of the galactic northwest so that they're easily involved in anything near the Eye of Terror but operate away from Imperial supply lines. They're not easy to spy on unless they let you near them because of their fleet-based organization, which makes their unorthodox belief system more easily defensible. Keeping your quirks out of the eyes of those who would judge them is a big part of surviving in the grimdark future. It's only possible because the Astartes Praeses have never been fully listed and have at least six Chapters which are not named explicitly, which combined nicely with the fact that the Rubicon Straits are basically untouched by Games Workshop's fluff writers.

 

I now have leeway to both interact with the defenses of the Scarum Subsector while also claiming things like border raids into the Eye, to say nothing of the vast swath of space which I could populate with just about anything I want.

 

The downside to this approach, and to anything that involves writing your own side of the untold stories in this universe, is that they might one day decide to release information that fills in a gap that you've chosen as your own. Tyranids might overrun the Straits, or some new alien menace erupt from previously unremarkbale worlds like the Necrons did, or the Eye might even expand and swallow the whole region I'd claimed as mine. They might name the rest of the Astartes Praeses, which would mean I have to rewrite things to bring myself back in line with canon.

 

It's a crap shoot, but I feel reasonably safe.

 

I won't be having them working alongside Kryptmann. Rather, when i referred to Kryptmann was just fleshing out when the imminent Tyranid threat ended.

 

Noted, but that's not how it read to me. Half of the trick is to figure out how to get others to see what you want them to in your writing, something which we all struggle with.

 

Perhaps after securing the homeworld they move in some forces back into the area, while allowing the 1st and 2nd Companies resume the Hunt?

 

I'm loathe to offer direct suggestions, but perhaps you could formalize the arrangement and make the First and Second Companies your Inner Circle and leave them to pursue the Hunt while the rest of the Chapter keeps up the public face? That would leave you with a sizeable presence which could include some veterans, able to respond to threats to the Imperium at large while you do your duty to the Unforgiven.

 

OK then, noted as a bad idea, maybe having the near enough the entire Chapter active against one Splinter Fleet that is remaining?

 

Here's the problem as I see it.

 

The Tyranids are an enormous threat in space, on the ground, and anywhere in between. Just their presence is enough to seriously disrupt astropathic ducts that allow for long distance communication, blind Navigators, and make anyone who knows about them so jumpy that you're going to be facing mass panic amongst the populace. Any casualties or failed defenses do nothing but reinforce the fleet through new biomass and more genetic material that can be used to perfect their warrior organisms, and even their own dead don't go to waste.

 

Let's say that your Chapter is stationed on planet where the Tyranid menace is soon to appear and that they're not too proud to ask for assistance from the Imperium, which would hopefully take the form of enough naval power to blockade their approach and thin the herd before it comes to a ground battle. Even in space, it takes a huge amount of manpower, material, and ordinance to make even a dent in the approach of a feeder fleet. You will lose ships and men, and unless you're completely counter to the experience of everyone who'd fought them so far, you will fail to keep them completely from making planetfall. Then it's up to whatever men you can muster alongside your Chapter to help you clear them away before spore chimneys and feeder stacks sprout and alter your biosphere enough that the native lifeforms never truly come back.

 

This could be a good angle for having a savage death world from which to recruit your neophytes, provided you have some way to fight the Tyranids to a stalemate that prevents them from overhwelming everything without also eradicating them completely. It could potentially be argued that a stalemate could be reached similar to the one on Armageddon, but that's going to take a lot of dedication and explanation to show how the fleet was stopped or destroyed without completely glassing the planet in the process.

 

Noted. Instead the culture of the homeworld, could lead to this idea of being more humanitarian. Perhaps it will give them a strong sense of duty to the Imperium. A belief system similar to the Angels of Absolution may be needed to help this idea.

 

You could always go for the arrogance angle and have it only be the Marines who haven't been initiated into the Inner Circle who guard the Imperium, while those who have crossed over are divided into strike teams to hunt the Fallen and aid the other Unforgiven.

 

In all, I can see it may be difficult to incorporate the Tyranids, perhaps due to the wanton destruction that precedes them. However, by making them fleet based, but still based in a certain sector or region, they may have just 'stumbled' upon the Tyranids after tracking down one of the Fallen. Help out a little bit with a splinter fleet and then move on and regroup. Or should I just avoid the Tyranids all together?

 

The Tyranids are not necessarily a terrible idea in and of themselves, and I think you could successfully work them into a Chapter concept. However, you need to work them in. It's not going to be an easy thing to do when the typical Imperial response seems to be Exterminatus on worlds that even seem tainted.

[lee265]

couldn't you just make one of the reserve companies a battle company with its own strike cruiser that deals with the fallen, perhaps your chapters main goal mutated from finding the fallen to finding some artifact that relates to before the fall of Calliban. Or instead of a relic just one particular fallen one. also make the home world whereverand send them with crusades to reclaim space incase a fallen is there.

[DarkGuard]

There are places where the fluff leaves gaps that you can exploit to your benefit if you're careful about what you write and how much credit you take. Some conflicts and factions within the Imperium lend themselves more to claims by an amateur author than others.

 

Not to brag on my own solution to the problem, but I made my Chapter a part of the Astartes Praeses and positioned them in a highly undeveloped portion of the galactic northwest so that they're easily involved in anything near the Eye of Terror but operate away from Imperial supply lines. They're not easy to spy on unless they let you near them because of their fleet-based organization, which makes their unorthodox belief system more easily defensible. Keeping your quirks out of the eyes of those who would judge them is a big part of surviving in the grimdark future. It's only possible because the Astartes Praeses have never been fully listed and have at least six Chapters which are not named explicitly, which combined nicely with the fact that the Rubicon Straits are basically untouched by Games Workshop's fluff writers.

 

I now have leeway to both interact with the defenses of the Scarum Subsector while also claiming things like border raids into the Eye, to say nothing of the vast swath of space which I could populate with just about anything I want.

 

The downside to this approach, and to anything that involves writing your own side of the untold stories in this universe, is that they might one day decide to release information that fills in a gap that you've chosen as your own. Tyranids might overrun the Straits, or some new alien menace erupt from previously unremarkbale worlds like the Necrons did, or the Eye might even expand and swallow the whole region I'd claimed as mine. They might name the rest of the Astartes Praeses, which would mean I have to rewrite things to bring myself back in line with canon.

 

It's a crap shoot, but I feel reasonably safe.

 

The Astartes Praeses was my original idea, but it seems that it has been done to death. Furthermore, there is a lot of Unforgiven activity in the region, so its unlikely they would require another Chapter.

 

I do like the idea of your own Chapter, would be an interesting read. You do raise a brilliant point though about conflicts with Games Workshop canon, but I'd imagine thats something that all DIYers need to compete with.

 

Noted, but that's not how it read to me. Half of the trick is to figure out how to get others to see what you want them to in your writing, something which we all struggle with.

 

I've never been too good a writer at getting a point across, but I'll try to improve for when I complete the write-up.

 

I'm loathe to offer direct suggestions, but perhaps you could formalize the arrangement and make the First and Second Companies your Inner Circle and leave them to pursue the Hunt while the rest of the Chapter keeps up the public face? That would leave you with a sizeable presence which could include some veterans, able to respond to threats to the Imperium at large while you do your duty to the Unforgiven.

 

I like the idea. Basically as you said have the unitiated guard the Imperium and be loathe to abandon missions, and while the 1st and 2nd Companies hunt the Fallen. However, as the Fallen don't always surface, and that there may be a long period when nothing is heard of them. So then I would have elements of the Inner Circle Companies fighting with Battle Companies, while some are in reserve. When the Fallen are located the reserve Inner Circle Companies are sent after the Fallen, while only those 1st and 2nd Company forces are extracted from any warzones. Is that basically what you are saying?

 

Here's the problem as I see it.

 

The Tyranids are an enormous threat in space, on the ground, and anywhere in between. Just their presence is enough to seriously disrupt astropathic ducts that allow for long distance communication, blind Navigators, and make anyone who knows about them so jumpy that you're going to be facing mass panic amongst the populace. Any casualties or failed defenses do nothing but reinforce the fleet through new biomass and more genetic material that can be used to perfect their warrior organisms, and even their own dead don't go to waste.

 

Let's say that your Chapter is stationed on planet where the Tyranid menace is soon to appear and that they're not too proud to ask for assistance from the Imperium, which would hopefully take the form of enough naval power to blockade their approach and thin the herd before it comes to a ground battle. Even in space, it takes a huge amount of manpower, material, and ordinance to make even a dent in the approach of a feeder fleet. You will lose ships and men, and unless you're completely counter to the experience of everyone who'd fought them so far, you will fail to keep them completely from making planetfall. Then it's up to whatever men you can muster alongside your Chapter to help you clear them away before spore chimneys and feeder stacks sprout and alter your biosphere enough that the native lifeforms never truly come back.

 

This could be a good angle for having a savage death world from which to recruit your neophytes, provided you have some way to fight the Tyranids to a stalemate that prevents them from overhwelming everything without also eradicating them completely. It could potentially be argued that a stalemate could be reached similar to the one on Armageddon, but that's going to take a lot of dedication and explanation to show how the fleet was stopped or destroyed without completely glassing the planet in the process.

 

Perhaps the Chapter have just caught one of the Fallen in that region of space, and a splinter fleet from the first tendril approaches the system. Being stubborn and as humanitarian as they are, they request reinforcements from the rest of the fleet and attempt to hold ground, while securing a save passage for the Fallen to safety. The Battle Companies would basically attempt to hold off the Tyranid threat while the Fallen is secured. This way a get a brush with the Tyranids, while hopefully not loosing the entire Chapter. The homeworld could then be in a similar region of space, hence why the reserves are able to get to the scene quickly.

 

You could always go for the arrogance angle and have it only be the Marines who haven't been initiated into the Inner Circle who guard the Imperium, while those who have crossed over are divided into strike teams to hunt the Fallen and aid the other Unforgiven.

 

A reasonable idea. I quite like it. However, as stated above I may keep some of the Inner Circle Companies attached to Battle Companies to lend their considerable experience and equipment, they're not always hunting Fallen, only when they hear word of them. This Battle Company attachment can be explained through an armoury style approach with heavy tanks.

 

The Tyranids are not necessarily a terrible idea in and of themselves, and I think you could successfully work them into a Chapter concept. However, you need to work them in. It's not going to be an easy thing to do when the typical Imperial response seems to be Exterminatus on worlds that even seem tainted.

 

A good point, and I don't want to seem lazy :D . Perhaps what I'll do is I've stated earlier above, returning from a mission with the Fallen and finding them in the way of the Tyranid threat. Even if they did know the Tyranids are in the system the Inner Circle wouldn't want the Fallen to die to the Tyranids. With the Tyranids bearing in on the forces, I'd imagine (and hope) the Imperium would prefer to pull one of its Space Marine Chapters out of the conflict before trying an Exterminatus.

 

Thank you everyone for your replies. I'm compiling these ideas as a plan for the final write-up of the IA, and your help has been brilliant.

[Brother Hadafix]

I think I got a bit lost in the make up of ideas.... Are you still going with the Fleet Based concept or Home World?

 

If going Fleet based, take a look at the BT and IF for ideas on how to bring this in to fluff. Easiest one for what your proposing would be a Fortress Monastery being on the planet in question.

 

Other than that, I havent really anything to add.

[Apothete]

The Astartes Praeses was my original idea, but it seems that it has been done to death. Furthermore, there is a lot of Unforgiven activity in the region, so its unlikely they would require another Chapter.

 

If you boil things down enough, it's likely that every idea has been done to death. Just find something that you enjoy writing about and which might be interesting to others, then do your best to flesh it out in a way that isn't immediately derivative of everyone else.

 

You could reduce my first Chapter to a soundbite description by calling them cyber-shamanic Imperial Fist wannabes that follow the borderline heretical Gethesmene/Polypsykana doctrines, using the cover of the Eye of Terror to pursue the latter goal under the guise of freeing oppressed worlds. Yes, they're Astartes Praeses, but I haven't heard of any other Chapter that does exactly what they do, in the same combination of traits.

 

I do like the idea of your own Chapter, would be an interesting read.

 

I have several projects in the works right now. They'll be linked in my signature as they reach a point where I feel comfortable advertising them outside of the Liber.

 

Feel free to take a gander.

 

I've never been too good a writer at getting a point across, but I'll try to improve for when I complete the write-up.

 

Putting your material up on the Liber can be a wonderful help if you're willing to accept the criticism and advice of others, or it can be a nightmare if you come here with goals other than the intended purpose of the board. I've seen several people immeasurably improve their starting concepts through taking advantage of the resources available here, myself included.

 

The most important thing I can pass along is something that an old writer told me when I was still very young, which is that many authors treat their projects too much like their children. You have to be willing to kill it if it needs to be done, because sometimes there are things you come up with that just won't work out. Maybe you have to split an idea off and use it later, maybe you have to drop it entirely, or perhaps it just needs to be tightened up and polished until the flaws go away.

 

Is that basically what you are saying?

 

Pretty much, yes.

 

Perhaps the Chapter have just caught one of the Fallen in that region of space, and a splinter fleet from the first tendril approaches the system. Being stubborn and as humanitarian as they are, they request reinforcements from the rest of the fleet and attempt to hold ground, while securing a save passage for the Fallen to safety. The Battle Companies would basically attempt to hold off the Tyranid threat while the Fallen is secured. This way a get a brush with the Tyranids, while hopefully not loosing the entire Chapter.

 

The only modification I would suggest to that idea is that you have your Chapter arriving in response to a call for aid from a conventional force that's preparing to face an incoming splinter fleet. That would give you the resources to fend off the brunt of the attack and to show the divide between the two elements of the Chapter easily, with the sworn Inner Circle breaking off to capture the Fallen before the Tyranids can get to them while the remainder of the deployed force moves to support the defenders.

 

This Battle Company attachment can be explained through an armoury style approach with heavy tanks.

 

I'm not sure I follow you here.

 

Are you suggesting that they would be an adjunct like the armor is in the Codex poster boys? If so, how do they either cover for having understrength Companies or having more Marines than they should?

 

Perhaps what I'll do is I've stated earlier above, returning from a mission with the Fallen and finding them in the way of the Tyranid threat. Even if they did know the Tyranids are in the system the Inner Circle wouldn't want the Fallen to die to the Tyranids. With the Tyranids bearing in on the forces, I'd imagine (and hope) the Imperium would prefer to pull one of its Space Marine Chapters out of the conflict before trying an Exterminatus.

 

If Exterminatus was declared on a world, it would be because there's no hope of successfully defending it against the Tyranids. The likely course of events would be to evacuate as many men as possible so as not to waste them, to let the Astartes know to be off planet or manipulate them to deploy themselves elsewhere, and then to drop some cyclonic torpedoes on the surface so that all biomass is scoured away and thus deny the hive any food. This is an extreme last measure, since it also denies the Imperium a useful world.

[DarkGuard]

If you boil things down enough, it's likely that every idea has been done to death. Just find something that you enjoy writing about and which might be interesting to others, then do your best to flesh it out in a way that isn't immediately derivative of everyone else.

 

Putting your material up on the Liber can be a wonderful help if you're willing to accept the criticism and advice of others, or it can be a nightmare if you come here with goals other than the intended purpose of the board. I've seen several people immeasurably improve their starting concepts through taking advantage of the resources available here, myself included.

 

The most important thing I can pass along is something that an old writer told me when I was still very young, which is that many authors treat their projects too much like their children. You have to be willing to kill it if it needs to be done, because sometimes there are things you come up with that just won't work out. Maybe you have to split an idea off and use it later, maybe you have to drop it entirely, or perhaps it just needs to be tightened up and polished until the flaws go away.

 

Some brilliant advice thank you Apothete.

 

The only modification I would suggest to that idea is that you have your Chapter arriving in response to a call for aid from a conventional force that's preparing to face an incoming splinter fleet. That would give you the resources to fend off the brunt of the attack and to show the divide between the two elements of the Chapter easily, with the sworn Inner Circle breaking off to capture the Fallen before the Tyranids can get to them while the remainder of the deployed force moves to support the defenders.

 

Good idea, I like it. So in essence as the Chapter goes to a distress call from another Imperial Force they also receive word that there is a Fallen in the area, but away from the assault. Perhaps this knowledge can come from the Dark Angels or another Unforgiven Chapter, or the Chapter finds it out themselves. Loathe to divert all forces from helping in fend off the Tyranid threat, and not wanting to face any negative repercussions should they not respond to the distress call, they divert the 1st and 2nd Companies to the planet with the Fallen, while sending the rest of their forces to combat the Tyranid threat. As you said thhere is then the divide between duty to the Imperium through the Battle and Reserve Companies, and also loyalty to the other Unforgiven Chapters in sending two Companies to capture the Fallen (although it might make more sense if it was half of each Company in a Strike Cruiser, 50 Terminators and 50 Bikers should be enough to subdue a Fallen unless there is a very large group of them, or if they have an army).

 

One question though, can ships still receive communications while in the Warp?

 

I'm not sure I follow you here.

 

Are you suggesting that they would be an adjunct like the armor is in the Codex poster boys? If so, how do they either cover for having understrength Companies or having more Marines than they should?

 

What I'm trying to express here is that when the Fallen haven't been heard of, elements of the 1st and 2nd Companies will be assigned to different Battle Companies that are in active service, much like how tanks such as predators will be assigned. I believe this is kind of how it works in standard Codex Companies, though feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

[Cpt_Reaper]

Woah...My DIY Chapter was once called the Shadow Guard. But I changed it to Angels of Shadow with reference to the novel "Angels of Darkness". Also a DA successor. Just had an idea...want to combine our Chapters' fluff.

[DarkGuard]

Woah...My DIY Chapter was once called the Shadow Guard. But I changed it to Angels of Shadow with reference to the novel "Angels of Darkness". Also a DA successor. Just had an idea...want to combine our Chapters' fluff.

 

Interesting proposal, but I'd like to create my own unique Chapter. Thanks for the idea though.

 

If you have a problem with me using Shadow Guard though because it's in your Chapter fluff and then they changed it to Angels of Shadow I will consider adopting a different name like Dark Guard. But thanks for the head up.

[The 13th Goat]

Both Dark Guard and Shadow Guard seem somewhat lazy names. Just because their Dark Angels don't mean every successor chapter is all cloak and daggers. I would recommend a re-think on the name.