Combat Squads in Reserve

[nighthawks]

This is inspired by this thread regarding combat squads and deepstriking from reserves using terminators' teleport rules. simillar questions have been raised recently with regard to transports, scouts, and in general, so I feel that it is a very good candidate for the Grey Area rules sticky.

 

the combat squad rules certainly do seem to be a grey area, with 3 different responses to the question in as many posts.

 

So, to all our great +OR+ forum rules gurus: How do you believe the combat squad rules work with regard to reserves? I'd prefer to not see this boil down to a debate. please do post substatiating reasons for your positions if they haven't been posted by someone else already. the results will be distilled into the most common methods and posted in the Grey Area rules sticky.

 

so far we have the following (OMG and Maligoare, please correct me if your position is not correct):

 

1 - (my reading) - Combat squads are determined during "deployment" - when the army is deployed. Those in reserve are broken down at this time as well - who goes in what squad is determined NOW. The reserves roll is made for the UNIT, but combat squads may enter play in different locations so long as they use the same means (Deepstrike, outflank, etc... as declared when being placed into reserves). Drop pod units are exempt and are rolled for as a unit and may declare combat squads, if desired, immediately upon disembarking.

 

2 - (proposed by Owl Moon Guy) - Combat squads are determined during "deployment" - when the army is deployed. Those in reserve are broken down at this time as well. The reserves roll is made for the squads separately as they count as separate units fro all game purposes.

 

3 - (proposed by Maligoare) - The unit is kept in reserve as a whole, determined at initial deployment. After a successful reserves roll for the UNIT, the decision to combat squad is made and the makeup of those squads is determined. Finally, the squads arrive from reserves, "deploying" via the means elected when placed into reserves.

[Legatus]

Maligoare has already provided the relevant quotes in his response.

 

From BRB page 94, "Preparing Reserves":

"When deploying their army, players may choose not to deploy one or more of the units in their army and instead leave them in reserves."

 

BRB page 94, "Rolling for Reserves":

"Once all of the units have been rolled for, the player pickls any one of the units arriving and deploys it, moving it onto the table as described later. Then he picks another unit and deploys it."

 

BRB page 95, "Deep Strike":

"Roll for arrival of these units as specified in the rules for reserves and then deploy them as follows."

 

So it is evident that a unit is not "deployed" when it is held back during the initial armies deployment, and is instead "deployed" when it arrives at the table.

 

From Codex Space Marines, page 51, "Combat Squads":

"The decision to split the unit into combat squads, as well as which models go into each combat squad, must be made when the unit is deployed. Both combat squads can be deployed in separate locations."

 

So a full tactical squad that is not deployed at the start of the game but instead held in reserve is not split into combat squads at that point, but remains in reserve as a full tactical squad. When it is successfully rolled for and arrives at the table, that is the point where the player can decide to split it into two combat squads instead of deploying it as a single full tactical squad.

 

Why are drop pods given as an exception? Because usually, at teh point the squad/squads enter the table they are considered to be two separate squads, and two separate squads would not be allowed inside a single transport. The drop pods are an exception and enter the table with the full squad inside, which then separates into two separate squads upon disembarking.

 

 

POSSIBLE:

Combat squads can be deployed in separate locations, so are separate squads at the point they move on the table. That means two deep striking combat squads (terminators or assault squads) would deep strike at different positions.

 

NOT POSSIBLE:

The unit is split into combat squads when it is deployed. Units held in reserve are not deployed. So it could not one combat squad be deployed at the start of the game while the other combat squad was held in reserve and arrived via outflank or deep strike.

 

AMBIGUOUS:

I am not sure whether a unit that used outflank and then decided to split into combat squads would roll for each squad separately on which side it could deploy. Personally I would tend to say that the whole unit that rolled once for reserve would also roll once for the table edge it was deployed from.

[bystrom]

What Legatus said, so 3.

[OwlandMoonGuy]

As stated, in the original topic and above, the strict RAW interpretation has been established.

 

Side Note: I really thought that GW had done away will all of the, combining units pre-game/rolling for reserves nonsense from 4th edition but here’s one last place where it’s still around. Apparently, Space Marines have the tactical flexibility to make last min squad size changes but are too inept strategically to do so with any forethought.

 

This is no longer a grey area from my take. -OMG

[nighthawks]

This is no longer a grey area from my take. -OMG

 

so, brothers, grey area or common misconception - i.e. reading 3 is correct?

[Grey Mage]

Id been reading it as 1 for a long time, but I believe that 3 is most like the correct RAW standpoint.

[SeattleDV8]

Agreed, between Maligoare and Legatus' well laid out arguments I am convinced that 3 is the correct reading.

[rat of vengence]

I'll have a peek at what's in Box 3.

 

RoV