Ideaus Posted July 18, 2009 Share Posted July 18, 2009 there are to seperate rule sets for the harridan, 1st - Apocalsypes - in apocalsypse the harrdian just move at 24"so is a fast gaguatuan creature 2nd - WH40K - Where you would use the IA-Vol 4 rules where it is a flyer and uses the flyer rule in that book the IA books are designed so that you can use these beast in normaly games, Apocalsypse rule are a simplyfied version to make the more complicaes game easier. that my opinoin anyway Argh, the typos! The pain, the pain of it all! Why would you use the Flyer rules in a normal game of 40k? The board probably wouldn't even be big enough for a Thunderbolt to move around on. Also, if you're going to post an opinion, please back it up with actual rules, not just what you think. Fact : page 196 of the Apocalypse rule book, under heading WHICH TAKES PRECEDENCE? "some of the models covered in the IA books are also detailed in Apocalypse, leading players to ask which of teh two books takes precedence. the rules in IA are intended for use in actual game sof 40k. the datasheets provided in Apoc were written with really large games in mind, and therefore streamlined to speed up play. Player are encourrage to talk things over before teh game and agree which rules are in play" Fact ; my opinion is correct, you could choice to uses IA rules and use it as a flyer or use Apoc rule and use it as a 24"moving gargantuan. fact Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2053133 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferro Posted July 18, 2009 Share Posted July 18, 2009 @Satanaka: GC's only assault 6", not 12. I am among those who believe the Harridan is a GC and does not follow the rules for Flyers in any way. But lately I've come to the conclusion that the Special Rule: Flyer is meant to convey something a little more than just a 24" movement. The choice of the name "Flyer" and the use of the word "fly" in the description of the special rule implies to me a special kind of movement, which they failed to elaborate upon. I believe there should be another sentence or two there describing how the creature can "fly up to 24" per turn." The crux of my argument is the curious use of the word "fly" instead of just using "move." Looking at the model on the table, it's huge. It has massive wings. We know from fluff sources that Harridans soar over battlefields reigning death from above. There was some speculation that they may never actually land, ever (they have no legs or feet, no way to move ON the ground). So from a simple argument based on the model itself it's obvious and logical that it does not actually move on the ground like other models. (This does not therefore mean that it follows Flyers rules.) Yet, they can rake tanks and infantry with their claws (i.e. engage in close combat). The GC rules themselves prevent them from getting locked in CC for more than a turn at a time. They cannot be tarpitted; it would not make sense at all for a squad of marines or orks to HOLD the Harridan in CC. It can tank-shock itself away from anything in its path. It seems completely inappropriate to me for a Harridan to have to make difficult terrain checks for moving through/over some rocks, or trees or anything for that matter. Look at the thing... it can move 24" but got slowed down by that low wall?? Yeah right. I suggest that the Harridan is a Gargantuan Creature that moves as Jump Infantry, except the distance is 24" instead of 12". I believe that this (or something similar) is what's implied by the strange wording of the movement description. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2053754 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cypher 102 Posted July 19, 2009 Share Posted July 19, 2009 It seems completely inappropriate to me for a Harridan to have to make difficult terrain checks for moving through/over some rocks, or trees or anything for that matter. Look at the thing... it can move 24" but got slowed down by that low wall?? Yeah right. How would it make a difficult terrain test? There are no rules in place for that. Roll 2D6, pick the highest, and quadruple the result? The Harridan's flier rule doesn't say that it ignores terrain, but makes no sense otherwise. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2054231 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferro Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 Exactly. If it did have to test for difficult terrain, you'd multiply the highest die rolled times four. Though, GC's roll 3d6, not 2. Moot point anyway as jump infantry don't have to deal with it. Incidentally, I fielded the Harridan today for Lucky 13 and had a blast with it. My FLGS was unanimous about using it as 24" jump infantry GC, ignoring dangerous terrain tests. Turn one: I killed an Exorcist and took 2 structure points off a Stormsword, then charged the only unit I could reach and forced them to fall back. Bottom of turn one, enemy fired an Exorcist, a LR, and that same Stormsword back at me and killed the Harridan. 3+ saves and very difficult to get cover for that thing = fail. Fortunately, the Replacements (?) asset allowed me to bring it back on in turn 2. But I digress. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2054677 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cypher 102 Posted July 21, 2009 Share Posted July 21, 2009 Now I'm wondering how a harridan does a stomp attack fluffwise. Does it land on the enemy unit and then fly off? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2056326 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty the Pyro Posted July 21, 2009 Share Posted July 21, 2009 I suggest that the Harridan is a Gargantuan Creature that moves as Jump Infantry, except the distance is 24" instead of 12". I believe that this (or something similar) is what's implied by the strange wording of the movement description. Thats how I interpret "fly." On an aside, I consider IA rules to be pretty bad, generaly worse than GW rules. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2056536 Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyescrossed Posted July 21, 2009 Author Share Posted July 21, 2009 Now I'm wondering how a harridan does a stomp attack fluffwise. Does it land on the enemy unit and then fly off? ;) That's fun to imagine Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2056818 Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrike22 Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Fact ; my opinion is correct, you could choice to uses IA rules and use it as a flyer or use Apoc rule and use it as a 24"moving gargantuan.fact Fact: Flyer (the apoc one) is meant for APOCALYPSE so it wouldn't be used on an IA unit in a NORMAL game of 40K. Fact. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2061801 Share on other sites More sharing options...
zerg Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 It should be. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2065840 Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrike22 Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 It should be. Should be what? A flyer? You should state why it should be, not just your opinion, this thread requires rules to back up your opinion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2066274 Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyescrossed Posted August 2, 2009 Author Share Posted August 2, 2009 It should be. Should be what? A flyer? You should state why it should be, not just your opinion, this thread requires rules to back up your opinion. I don't think he means it like "It should be a Flyer, because it has wings!", I think he means it like "I think it should count as a Flyer". Not much difference, but I think he was just wishlisting things, basically. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172130-harridans/page/2/#findComment-2067760 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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