Optimal Pedro/Sternguard lists?

[tedwin183]

So, lately I have been getting slightly bored of playing my Vulkan list over and over and am looking at potentially piecing together a Pedro/Sternguard/Drop Pod list. I have been reading about them and was appalled to see some lists running EIGHT combi-meltas per 10-man squad? To me, that is a complete waste of points. I've always considered sternguard infantry hunters, NOT vehicle hunters. I could see maybe 2-4 combi-meltas per 10-men incase of MCs, termies, a lone, annoying dread/vindi/whathaveyou.

 

So, that is my question. In a typical Pedro list, what are the loadouts for the sternguard? Also, this list will likely be made at 1500pts and 2000pts. I have seen a lot of lists using scouts as the troop choice and then filling up on 3x10 sternguard squads. I have read they need powerfists in all squads, but I am really having a hard time defining what else goes in there. I mean, that is already 310pts with just bolters, a PF and drop pod. I would think the intent of the list would be to drop down at a weak point in your opponent's army, rapid fire the unit out of existence and then try to survive the retaliation.

 

 

Thoughts?

[tedwin183]

Nothing?

[dreadmad]

You wouldnt need a powerfist if your running pedro with them, and i dont take one anyway for the same points you can have a power weapon, meltabombs and a combi gun

[derekbadger]

I've taken a few different "flavours" of sternguard, the most successful i've found is just a large squad with no upgrades in a rhino.

 

The thing i like most about sternguard is their versatility. They have ammo types for almost any occasion, and don't' forget they are not exactly slouches when it comes to assault. 4 attacks on the charge with Pedro near by!

 

They are still only as tough as regular marines though, so you need to look after them. This is why i'm not really a big advocate of the drop pod "suicide" squad. Unless you can drop them in and guarantee them some support I don't think it's worth it.

 

That's my preferred way of using them any how. Stick 10 in a rhino (pedro in tow if you wish) and pop them out to rapid fire into troops who's ride you just shot up hopefully!.

 

 

Thing's i've tried which didn't work so well :

 

attaching a librarian with gate of infinity : basically i don't have enough rhinos, so I gave them a librarian "transport" + force dome. It worked OK sometimes but GoI is a bit too unreliable

 

10 sternguard in a drop pod + 10 combi meltas : combat squadded upon arrival, take down two armored targets on turn 1. Great fun, but too expensive ^_^

[foster]

I usually just take a 5 man Devastator Sternguard unit with TLLC Razorback when I take Pedro, small but really effective when choosing between Plasma and Las Cannons for heavy weapons. Lately I find that this unit especially when equipt with Plasma always seems to be the target priorty 1 for deep striking terminators, so I prepare a nice counter attack accordinly.

 

I tend to think taking large multiple Sternguard units costs too much for what they do, so I usually rely on normal Tactical squads. They may not have the best ammo or 4 attacks on the charge when Pedro is near, but they can still rapid fire and they can still get 3 attacks on the charge, just as good an Assault Squad ;). Spending 230pts for basic weapons, a powerfist and a Rhino for each Tactical squad I find have lots of points to spend on other units, which I wouldn't otherwise have when using Sternguard. Tacticals die just as well as Sternguard but for cheaper the cost.

 

It's more of a personnal preference.

[Giga]

You wouldnt need a powerfist if your running pedro with them, and i dont take one anyway for the same points you can have a power weapon, meltabombs and a combi gun

Pedro might not always be walking with them, and Pedro can also be singled-out, whereas a powerfist sergeant is hidden inside the unit, and therefore much likelier to actually swing his power fist.

[foster]

My Pedro usually gets left behind inside the vehicle that transported them, be it a tactical squad from a Rhino or Terminator Assault Squad from a Land Raider Crusader. If there isn't anything that can pick Kantor off then he gets out to play. While the disembarked unit does it's business I usually don't move their vehicle for a turn, allowing Pedro to use his Orbital bombardment.

 

I always give the unit Pedro is with a power weapon/powerfist so I don't need to have Pedro with them, but still it's nice to have a choice to use the two sets for added killing power.

[tedwin183]

See, I was considering 3 squads of 10 men, with a PF serg. and 3-4 combi-melta in 2 squads and 2-4 combi-flamers in the 3rd. I'd combat squad them so that there are 6 targets. I think this could be really great when fighting...well...pretty much anything. That is going to be 40 rapid fire rounds on the first turn, into something squishy (lootas, Eldar Path Finders, a HUGE squad of boyz, a HUGE platoon, etc.) I'm building the list primarily for 2000pts, but I'd like to make a trimmed down 1500 pt list as well. I have the list in the army list review section. I honestly don't see the need for everyone having combi-weapons. I can see the use of more than 2, definitely, but not EVERYONE. That just makes each Sternguard 30pts instead of 25...and unless you expend them ALL on the turn they come in, you're going to lose some of those points. Giving less than half of the squad combi-weapons mitigates the point loss a bit.

[tedwin183]

Ok, perhaps I should rephrase the question:

 

How do you typically equip sternguard squads? I have seen a lot of people making squads in drop pods with something like 2-3 combi-melta and 1-2 combi-flamer with a power fist serg. So my question is, when they come down and you combat squad, which models go where? I'd think you would want to keep all the meltas in one combat squad and all the flamers and powerfist in the other. So, how do you guys do this?

[foster]

It depends really when drop-podding sternguard what targets there are. If you land near a tank and a squad you would put all meltas in one squad for the tank and all the flamers in the other squad for the infantry squad. If there were two sets of tanks you would mix the two combat squads both with melta's.

[DevianID]

I think the point of the combi-weapon was lost...

 

Think about it this way, if the enemy is running armored company, how effective is your squad with 3 combi meltas? How much MORE effective is the SAME squad, for 35 points, with TEN combi meltas?

[tedwin183]

i just don't know if i could justify putting that many in one 10 man squad. at tat point it is 30 pts a model. I was considering 2 drop pods with 4 combi-meltas in each and 1 drop pod with 2 combi-flamers, all with powerfists. I am thinking this list probably will be weak against armoured column, but i can't bring myself to putting that many meltas in a squad. You think this will do?

[minigun762]

From a Chaos standpoint, Combi-Melta Sternguard can be played very similar to our Termicide squads (3 Terminators with 3 Combi-Melta).

These squads form one of the basic anti-tank units for Chaos, costing just over 100 points and it has a fair chance of knocking out even a Land Raider.

 

Without knowing the cost of Sternguard off the top of my head, I'd consider the Combi-Meltas to be most useful in 5 man squads in a Drop Pod with no other weapons. Basically you're spending those points to ensure a tank is destroyed.

 

The question is, is that squad cost effective at what it does?

 

That's my preferred way of using them any how. Stick 10 in a rhino (pedro in tow if you wish) and pop them out to rapid fire into troops who's ride you just shot up hopefully!.

Here is a smart man in my opinion, using Sternguard for what they really are, an Uber Tactical Squad.

[theredcorsair]

IMO, having a good mix of a few combi-weapons is pretty solid. Also, IIRC they can take special and heavy weapons. Finally, I agree above about the meltabomb, PW, Combi-weapon build.

[tedwin183]

I was definitely considering running 3 combi-meltas in a squad of 10, combat squadding them and using half the squad like termicide and the other half to shoot whatever comes out of it. I don't know if 3 is enough though.

[Giga]

I'm considering having pedro+9 sternies in a rhino, with two sternies having meltaguns.

 

I dont trust combimeltas... All those one-shot weapons tend to roll lots of 1s on their to hit rolls. :/

[DarkGuard]

I'm considering having pedro+9 sternies in a rhino, with two sternies having meltaguns.

 

I dont trust combimeltas... All those one-shot weapons tend to roll lots of 1s on their to hit rolls. :/

 

I'd have to agree with this. IMO the only combi-weapon worth taking is the combi-flamer, as you can't miss with it. Thing is, I just don't like combi-weapons in general, as you're only getting one shot out of them, they turn into a bit of a one hit wonder. Suicide Drop Pod squads are all well and good, but I feel there is so uch scope for Sternguard beyonder this.

 

When I use Pedro I'll normall use about 5 or 6 Sternguard with either 2 missile launchers or 2 plasma cannons, and I've also experimented with 2 heavy flamers, which can make an amazing squad for taking objectives (and are lethal if you have Vulkan instead).

[DerekLee688]

From a Chaos standpoint, Combi-Melta Sternguard can be played very similar to our Termicide squads (3 Terminators with 3 Combi-Melta).

These squads form one of the basic anti-tank units for Chaos, costing just over 100 points and it has a fair chance of knocking out even a Land Raider.

 

Without knowing the cost of Sternguard off the top of my head, I'd consider the Combi-Meltas to be most useful in 5 man squads in a Drop Pod with no other weapons. Basically you're spending those points to ensure a tank is destroyed.

 

The question is, is that squad cost effective at what it does?

 

Not even near the same costs. 125pts for a minimum of 5 men+35pts for drop pod+5pts. per combi shot.=175 without Terminator armor.

 

I've relized three things.

 

#1 If you don't think 5 man squads are taboo, five Sternguard with two vehicle poping weapons are cheaper and more versitile than their Devistator counterparts, but I would only take it if I didn't have the Heavy Support slot to take a Combi-pred(auto cannon/Lascannons). This squad is a must if your heavy slots are filled with Vindicators and Land Raiders, and as a alternative to Dreadnoughts.

 

#2 Plasma Cannons, Heavy Flamers, and Heavy Bolters(if static/objective guarding) are perfectly viable options to take when gearing your army against MEQ or anything with 4+ armor save or worse. Plasma cannons are a nice option if you don't want to lose 25% of your squad due to vengence rounds that may or may not wound. Heavy Flamers are a must if you are running down Tau or IG to get them to stop shooting you, or if Nids or Orks are running you down. Heavy bolters and Kraken rounds allow us to stand up to a Tau/IG gunline at max range or while guarding an objective, but not as good if you are using them as a mech. unit.

 

#3 If you take Heavy Flamer(s) and combi Flamer(s) Nids and Orks will HATE you, and are a must.

[tedwin183]

I think I am going to work a list out where I use 4 combi-melta and 1 combi-flamer and a PF per 10 man squad. I'll combat squad and use the melta to pop tanks/transports and then other combat squad to torch/shoot what is left. I also was considering perhaps a couple heavy flamers in one squad in order to swap out in case of hordes. I am thinking for the price, 5 combi's is the way to go. giving all 10 is stupid because you likely won't fire the special ammo...which is their upside. Plus, honestly, if you can't build a list that can deal with tanks without spamming combi sternguard...then you probably have a major problem on your hands that transcends just unit choices...

 

 

Also, in a Pedro/Sternguard list, is it unwise to take 2 sternguard squads instead of 3? I seem to be having some trouble fitting 3 in without sucking up basically all the points of a 2k list.

[joedj]

I'm considering having pedro+9 sternies in a rhino, with two sternies having meltaguns.

 

I dont trust combimeltas... All those one-shot weapons tend to roll lots of 1s on their to hit rolls. :/

 

True, but don't the Sternguard lose their special ammo without the boltgun portion of the Combi?

 

Melta-bombs eliminate 3 attacks from a Sternguard (in Pedro's sphere) when used on a assault, correct? Seems too much to pay.

[Ming]

I use al all-around stern quad -

 

10

PF

2 PCs

CF or CM

Razorback TLLC

 

In games where the opponent is not spamming on ordnance, I combat squad them.

 

Kantor goes with the sergeant and special weapon. They become his bodyguard, they all joyously fire out at anything that comes in range, but basically wait as sweepers and late game objective takers. They stay near the razorback.

 

The PCs go in another squad in cover with a good field of view. They act as killers, and late game objective takers.

 

Kantor only moves if he needs to be in better position.