An Ambitious Idea...

[Ace Debonair]

Hello everyone. :D

 

After reading several of the stories on this forum, I'm been moved more and more towards trying something ambitious with the creation of my DIY chapter(s). Most of the ideas I've come up with have been done much better by other writers, so I'm trying for something new. I hope. ;)

 

But my knowledge of the 40K is far from complete, and I require the judgement of this idea.

 

The core of the idea is to create several chapters at once, who are currently embroiled in a somewhat stale conflict at the edge of the Imperium, and in such a fashion that they are forced to co-exist.

 

The other key point is that none of the chapters will like any of the others much. Not your actual hatred (yet), just a sort of general discord and plenty of choice insults exchanged over choice of tactics, beliefs, etc.

 

So far, the rough outlines for the chapters involved are as follows:

 

Red Lords:

An elitist, prideful chapter, that places little value on the lives of those who aren't Astartes. Early in their career, they were betrayed/failed by guardsmen, etc. They pride themselves that their marines must be the best possible soldiers. Their recruitment is slower than that of other chapters because of even more stingent tests for ability, purity, and so on. This means that the chapter recovers slowly from taking heavy losses, and they therefore strive to avoid losses completely, so they may continue to serve the purpose of the Imperium. Focus in combat is on bombarding enemies with artillery and indirect fire such as Whirlwinds and snipers long before closing in and letting the tactical/devastor/assault squads finish the job. The only chapter amongst the four to have Terminator armour, and even then not much. Argues often about the true purpose of the Astartes with the Infinity Knights. Reliance on sustained, long-range attacks makes for poor cohesiveness with the Black Bears and Steel Dragons.

 

Steel Dragons:

Probably an Iron Hands descendant, or maybe another chapter that deals with cybernetic replacement parts. The Steel Dragons love crashing into enemy emplacements with their dreadnoughts and tanks, and tends to use these vehicles to break enemies before following up quickly with an onslaught of space marines, often armed with flamethrowers for mopping up units in close proximity. Traditionally scornful of sneak attacks, very much in favour of massive, short-to-mid-range firepower. Have a dislike of the Black Bears for their scornful attitude towards tanks and heavier armour, and the Infinity Knights for their "reluctance" to incorporate dreadnoughts at the start of a battle.

 

Black Bears:

Possibly a Raven Gaurd succesor of one form or another. A rather typical stealth-over-brute-force chapter. Excels at surprise attacks with infantry. The Black Bears generally favour sabotage tactics, and will attack key points of enemy encampments with assault and scout companies (and others, of course) in order to sabotage the enemies' strengths, or to exploit weaknesses further, allowing their fellow Astartes to finish the fight quickly and efficiently. They are quite outspoken against excessive use of vehicles other than transports, claiming their lack of finesse creates as many problems as it solves. This causes friction with the Steel Dragons and Infinity Knights, who revere their vehicles. Conflict also arises between the Black Bears and the Red Lords because of such radically different combat doctrines.

 

Infinity Knights:

A rather zealous chapter who preach the popular creed that many Imperial citizens believe - the Emperor as a God. Their combat doctrine revolves around the idea that the Space Marines are a hammer to crash into the enemy without hesitation. They recruit from more than one place, meaning a potentially higher-than-codex-level of marines at times. Extremely important to this chapter are it's dreadnoughts, which they see not only as a key weapon of war, but as the potent symbol of the Emperor's death and coming resurrection. Only the most heroic are even considered as candidates for dreadnought-hood. They build much of their battle tactics around the idea of using the dreadnought as the keystone weapon, dedicating almost every action in battle to exposing a point for the dreadnoughts to strike. They dislike the "reckless" use of such scared objects at the start of combat, particularly favoured by the Steel Dragons. Argues also that the very purpose of the Astartes is to place their life in the hands of the Emperor and charge rather than sneak about or rely on artillery fire to do their job, meaning relations with the Black Bears and Red Lords are also strained.

 

 

Please bear in mind this is still a very early idea, and just a rough overview of the chapters concerned. I will happily change details that don't sit well, but hopefully the core ideals behind the chapters are workable.

 

All four chapters are essentially codex chapters, unless someone can give me a good reason to alter any of them. The way I see it, a good chapter is as much about how you use the things you have as what shiny toys you can play with.

 

The chapters would most likely be founded seperately, but probably fairly nearby to each other - maybe even in the same system for some of them - and that could well be where the stagnant war they currently fight in is taking place. I can work on the details such as the location and so forth, but before I do I'd quite like to see how many holes there are in the basic principle.

 

I have only vague ideas in place for the conflict - that'll be dealt later, assuming that this idea pans out.

 

If this process works out, I'll cheerfully write sperate IA articles for each chapter for neatness.

 

Please criticize, correct, and ridicule these ideas at your leisure.

 

Many thanks. :D

[Ferrus Manus]

So to summarise your going to create 4 chapters, effectively place them on a stalemated campaign, and then write about the campaign and the effects on each chapter?

 

An interesting idea, but what I'd like to know is how can a campaign involving 4 chapters no less be a stalemate? I mean Astartes are the stalemate breakers, any campaign involving one company generally ends quickly. So it would have to be one huge campaign.

 

Still, I'll be interested to see what you think and come up with.

[Forgefather Vulkan]

This is an interesting Idea as I have never seen it before and like Ferrus Mannus said it would have to be a REALLY big campaign, so you may want to go into detail with that Ie why are they fighting? Who are they fighting? Why were those chapters chosen? Was their rivalry known to those who chose them? Etc

 

Hope this helps

 

Forgefather

 

Ps check out my DIY chapter the Sons of Ares as I need some feed back on which geneseed best fits my chapter

[Telveryon]

An interesting idea, but what I'd like to know is how can a campaign involving 4 chapters no less be a stalemate? I mean Astartes are the stalemate breakers, any campaign involving one company generally ends quickly. So it would have to be one huge campaign.

I agree with Ferrus Manus. A campaign involving no less then 4 chapters is by definition not a stalemate.

 

Ace Debonair, you might have 4 chapters in the same region if they are tasked to contain some external threat to the Imperium threat. In other words, you could have the chapters guard something akin to the Ghoul Stars or the Halo Stars. The threats emerging form that region might be so fierce that no one chapter can deal with them alone ergo interactions between the chapters and thus a reason for the frictions between them.

 

The chapters would most likely be founded seperately, but probably fairly nearby to each other - maybe even in the same system for some of them - and that could well be where the stagnant war they currently fight in is taking place.

No system can or should support more then one chapter. There are roughly 1000 chapters in the Imperium, having more then one stationed close to one another is a great waster of their potential, let alone in the same system. The above offered idea would fix this as well

 

As for the chapter concepts:

• Red Lords - There have been a few elitist chapters in the Liber not too long ago, but not that many. However I'm quite sure there is one right now that has "the not getting along with the Guard" idea. There is nothing wrong with taking your idea from other chapters, but it would be both nice and wise if you modify it a bit to make it your own.
  
• Steel Dragons - They smell a bit too much of Iron Hands, in my mind. Giving them more of a twist would definitely be an idea.
  
• Black Bears - Same as above but for the Raven Guard. Also the name could use a bit of a tough up, as it stands it sounds to teddy bear-ish. On a side note, radically different combat doctrine might actually allow two chapters to work together better as each chapter compensates the others' weakness.
  
• Infinity Knights - The most interesting chapter of the lot in my opinion. But you'll have to come up with a good reason why does the chapter see the Emperor as a god and why do they venerated their dreadnoughts.
  

[Ace Debonair]

I thought there'd be something wrong with the idea. I'm very glad I posted it in it's infancy now. :D

My thanks to everyone for your analysis thus far. :D

 

A lot of valid points have been raised, and I'm giving serious thought as to how to make this more realistic.

 

Thank you for pointing out the system structure stuff - I have to confess my knowledge on the actual planetary stuff is lame. I cheerfully bow to your superior knowledge on the matter.

 

With regards to the stalemate, the thought process behind it ran thusly:

 

*If it was a succession of great victories, you'd have heard of these guys before.

*You haven't heard of these guys before unless I've accidentally stolen a name. :D

*So they can't be winning. But by the same token nor can they be sat there doing nothing.

*Stalemated conflict seemed the obvious choice, but I'm not sure what sort of enemies would be best suited to the task.

 

I love the idea of having them guard a place rather than the stalemate. That's a much better idea. I'll just have to contemplate where, and against whom. Traitors would be my first choice, but part of me insists that logically a threat that large would have surely been covered by a more famous chapter.

 

Ah yes, the chapters... I must admit that within my original ideas there are many similarities to existing forces. The plan is to have the chapters work together, but have some of the chapters gall at the other's tactics. I'd focused on making the chapters different from each other... instead of making them different from everybody. I'll try to evolve some more distinctive traits for them later in this post.

 

The idea behind the different ideaologies is quite simply this: Different chapters can, and frequently do, work together well, and these chapters will have even done so on occasion. But none of them like the tactics employed by the others, and frequently (accidentally or deliberately, depending) their tactics will bruise each other's effectiveness, which of course gets right up the noses of the chapters concerned.

 

I quite liked the name for the Black Bears, but now you mention it it's a crap name for stealth chapter anyways. Bears don't really rely on stealth and cunning.

 

Let me see what I can do to freshen up the chapters:

 

Steel Dragons:

Dropping the cybernetic stuff. It'll be more interesting to make them tank-heavy variant on another chapter, such as maybe the White Scars; having the bikes and faster units flank an enemy while the armour rolls up the middle. But that might seem a bit too Alpharius. Opinions?

Reasons for the tank-heavy stuff could be simply as follows:

 

The Steel Dragons, as the chapter they descended from, excelled at breaking enemy formations with fast, powerful attacks with bikes and land speeders. The Steel Dragons would then follow this up with heavier offence, getting up close with transports and deploying marines to strike at the very heart of the enemy. But the Steel Dragons found themselves frequently losing troops in combat whenever faced with siginificant enemy armour, such as Tau Hammerheads or Ork looted tanks. What made things more difficult was the apparent adaptation of enemy tactics - most often the xenos would place their biggest guns in a position where they could easily retaliate against the initial, quick attack, causing the death tolls of honoured marines to rise exponentially in each conflict. The Chapter Master (no name yet, still early days) consulted the Codex for an answer to this problem. It came to him in a flash of inspiration. Rather than a straight-forward charge ahead of the other units, the bikes would remain behind the tanks, which would be the first line of attack. When the battle started, the bikes would race away and launch flank attacks on enemies, forcing open gaps in the defence, leaving the advancing tanks and marines behind them to tear through or trample enemy formations. The tactic worked well. The chapter scored many decisive victories against the Orks and Tau with this attack pattern, and it was quickly adopted as the signature approach of the Steel Dragons. However, a total reliance on one strategy is never an option, and the Dragons still to this day practice both the time-honoured bike charge as well as their modified approach. Enemies often cannot cover for both attacks, and scouts relay information allowing the commanders of the chapter to decide which approach would be more favourable for the battle at hand.

 

Does that sound better?

[Ace Debonair]

The third chapter: (They really do need a new name, formerly the Black Bears. I'm considering the Ebon Wings or maybe the Twilight Hounds unless either has already been used or is otherwise unsuitable.)

Writing even a quick story about them will be difficult without a name. I'll take out the reliance on assault companies, though. Perhaps a real focus on co-ordination, making things happen in different places on the battlefield simultaneously, although again that is more than a touch Alpha Legion in it's conception. Perhaps it'll work as half of a concept for a chapter, but I'm just waiting for another idea to hit me.

 

I bet this winds up being the chapter that needs the most work. :devil:

 

The Red Lords:

I couldn't agree more with the criticism made on these marines. The fact is that all the descriptions in my first post were little more than the shell of the chapter, designed to tell you what to roughly expect. And yes, they are inspired by every single arrogant chapter out there, all at once. That might make differentiating them a bit more tricky, but I'll try.

 

The Red Lords, upon their inception as a chapter, were assigned by the Lords Of Terra to the Rucio system to ward off the threat of possible corruption. Their approach was simple - nobody was to be spared their attention. Any heretical act would be judged, and none would be found worthy of forgiveness without the direct intervention of the Emperor himself. This was not done through any overwhelming piety - the Red Lords were quite simply utterly determined to do the best job they could. The Red Lords started at the heart of the rot - the farthest end of the system. They quickly found whatever chaos presence was at the far end of the system had retreated, leaving behind few traces. But the local faith there had grown to worship both the emperor, and a being known to the locals as Zecnat, lord of immortality. The chapter's Librarians quickly identified this as heresy, and the Red Lords brutally purged all traces of this 'Zecnat' from the world. His followers were executed and his temples destoryed utterly. There were large portions of the population,on the worlds of the Rucio system that suffered the wrath of the Red Lords - and the numbers grew as they drew closer to the edge of the system nearest the heart of Imperial space.. The local Imperial Guard general, who until this time had governed the system, grew increasingly nervous as the Red Lords moved closer and closer to his home world of Cestelion. The Red Lords had seen much horror as they drew closer to Cestelion. To their dismay, on many worlds they had found evidence of guardsmen who had subscribed to the beliefs of the Zecnat cult. They were ruthlessly eradicated by the chapter - and taken as evidence of the weakness of human minds to the influence of chaos.

 

The Red Lords arrived at Celestion, after a long, arduous journey. It was meant to be the jewel in the crown of the Rucio system, but all the Red Lords could see about them was evidence of treachery. Shrines to Zecnat littered the cities and towns. The Governor was confronted by the chapter master, before the magnificent temple of the emperor. The Governor was accused of allowing heresy to fester. As part of their mission to purge heresy from the Rucio system, the Red Lords stated simply that either all trace of Zecnat would be purged from the capital by sundown, or the entire city would be reduced to ash and rubble. As the nominal leader of the system, the Governor-General was offered this one chance to redeem himself. The Red Lords pulled back from the town centre, and watched the gates intently. They made certain that nobody was able to enter the town, or more importantly, able to leave it.

 

As the day wore on, Zecnat's temples were torn down, his statues destroyed, and those who clung to their heretical views were purged. But it was not the easy victory it should have been. At sundown, the chapter master of the Red Lords returned to the temple of the Emperor. The Governor was waiting, his citizens massed before him, the Imperial Guard stationed there lining the streets. The Red Lords' Chapter Master acknowledgd the Governor-General's success at purging the taint of chaos. But the people there, were sullen, and a well of fury in them was building, having been stirred for months by the insidious followers of chaos. Moreover, the purging of the Zecnat believers had not extended to all of the Imperial Guard stationed in the capital. The chief librarian of the Red Lords could taste the unholy presence in the air still, but had put it down as the death throes of a chaos energy routed. He realised all too late what was happening. The Imperial guard there attacked the Red Lords - firing upon the Astartes who, in their minds, had ordered the murder of so many citizens in the name of the Emperor, who was meant to protect humanity. The civilians joined the battle - rushing away only to return with crude weapons, fuelled less by the desire for revenge than by the twisted manipulations of chaos. Not all of the guard, however, had turned against the Astartes. The Governor-General and his most loyal followers fought with the Red Lords, firing on the traitor guardsmen and the insane civilians. The battle was fierce, but brief. The Red Lords and the loyalists triumphed. The Chapter Master and his men, however, saw this as a major failure - that chaos should take even the smallest of holds on an Imperial world was unforgivable. That what should have been the strongest bastion of the Emperor's will was subverted and destroyed, was an abomination. The Red Lords knew all too well now the fragility of the human mind, and how weakness of the mind could create more catastrophe than weakness of the body. The Governor-General and his men who had allowed this to occur were suitably punished for his weakness and inability to identify the threat of the great enemy. The bodies were buried under the decimated ruins of the city, which was, as the Red Lords had promised, reduced to ash and rubble by artillery/oribtal strikes.

 

From that time onwards, the Red Lords percieve themselves protectors of a fragile, foolish breed. Though the planet of Celestion was almost completely purged, a few bastions of people who followed the Emperor's truth remained, and it is from these that the new recruits of the Red Lords are now drawn. The Red Lords are exceedingly thorough in their selection of potential members. The tests run by the chapter last upwards of two years in total, meaning that recruitment is a slow process for the chapter.

 

I'll write more another time, filling in the gaps and so on. Are there any glaring problems with this story thus far?

[Ace Debonair]

Finally:

 

The Infinity Knights:

(The Infinity Knights are my favourite of the four too. :devil: )

 

The Infinity Knights believe in the Emperor as a God, unlike many of their Astartes brothers. It is recorded by the Imperial records that concern such matters that the chapter did not hold such beliefs on it's creation, but the precise point at which this belief became widespread is hard to pinpoint.

 

The cause, however, is far easier to identfiy.

 

The Infinity Knights homeworld of Sharius is a parched, desert world. Much of it's land is scorched, wind-scoured earth, inhabited by dangerous creatures. The few human tribes that live there are of a feudal background, but have records, form long before the Imperium claimed it, of great beings that could ascend to the stars themselves. (Librarians deduce the most likely explanation of these tales stem from Eldar encounters.) In any event, they readily converted to the beliefs of the Imperium, as taught by the devout chapter who claimed their planet.

The Infinity Knights recruit their potential battle-brothers from the hardy desert cultures, where an early training in survival against both the harsh landscape and the fearsome wild creatures that roam the sands form a solid background for the difficult training exercises that candidates are put through. The tribes are fiercely devout in their worship of the Emperor - an aspect that inevitably filtered through to the ranks of the chapter.

 

After some time, another aspect of the tribal beliefs began to show itself in the way the chapter worked.

 

Dreadnoughts are, according to the tribes of Sharius, one of the Emperor's greatest miracles - a way that his holy warriors can surpass even death. The Astartes who are recruited into the chapter have had the same idea firmly planted into their minds, and as a result, the entire chapter treats the Dreadnoughts with a reverence that borders on the extreme. They are used frequently in battle - that is their reason for existance, after all - but entire battle strategies are modified to protect the holy machines until they can be deployed into the heart of the enemy - which they can then tear out, as He intended.

 

 

 

 

That's all my ideas so far, but it's late at night, so please forgive me if they seem feeble. I'm sure I can improve on them later.

 

Do any of them sound more workable? I know there's a lot of detail left to write in, but that's semi-intentional because it will make changing things easier.

Would it be plausible for the Infinity Knights to have one or more venerable dreadnoughts? Or is that foolish?

 

I've just realised how incredibly long this post was. I've changed it to three smaller ones which I fervently hope are more manageable and not against the spirit of the forum.

 

I welcome your comments, criticisms, support and mockery.

 

Thank you all for your support and help so far.

[FireFist]

Ace thanks for the help on my chapter. I'll try to help you here. I would like to see the color schemes for the chapters. if it's not too much to ask. but other wise some nice ideas. i'll put a more detailed post later.

[ChaplainMathreyn]

Whew... This is gonna be alot to comment on... -Cracks knuckles- Ow! Dag nam- Anyways...

 

I like the Red Lords... Are these the "anti-hero" Hero sort of guys? They defend the Imperium... even against it's own citizens by wipeing them out... Or am I reading the story wrong? Pull some things from the Blood Angels here... And add a splash of Black Templar zealousness, too...?

 

The Steel Dragons are... Could they be "Mankind is fallible, the machine is not" sort of ideals?... ie, They are relatively aloof, some whisper, jerks, around other beings of mankind, but spend an inordinate amount of time with their machines and the spirits of them...? Other than that, I like the idea of vehicle heavy, although you may be treading into Aurora Chapter territory too... Unless I'm reading it wrong. ;) Sometimes, I hate wearing glasses >.<

 

I liked the Black Bears!... Maybe stick with something along the lines of 'Dark' Bears... Shadow Bears... Smoke Bears... Storm Bears...?

 

I could see these guys working very well inter-Chapterly. They are trained in... 'Cub Packs', while they undergo the transformation from normale human to demi-god, and these strong ties born amongst the Packs carry on through the Marines existance...?

 

I like the Infinity Knights too! (Gawd, my fingers hate you... Ow ow ow ow... :lol: )...

 

Would these guys be sort of "haughtier" than th eother Space Marine chapters?... ie. Since they worship the Emperor so ferventy, they are... More Blessed, than the others?...

 

I LOVE the idea... But lord are you going to have Alot of stuff to write up for it all... FOUR Chapter articles... Something on the overall campagin (Where they defend, why they defend it, notable battles, etc). But I so Like it.

 

... I need to go and do some wrist and finger stretches now... Ya meanie... :D

 

Good luck! B)

[commander alexander]

I could understand it being a stalemate if they were trying to stop a huge waaaggghhh! in a system. But ya its a cool idea, althoguh it sounds somewhat unexciting unless you plan to throw some good twists in it.

[Ace Debonair]

In response to what FireFist asks, the colour schemes are still kind of a work in progress.

A rough description, however, is easy.

 

Red Lords: Red with either white, grey or blue for details. Undecided as of yet.

Steel Dragons: Either half-grey-half red or possibly a more ecclectic mix of grey and red. The grey used for the main colour will almost black.

3rd chapter (still not convinced black bears will work) Probably actually going to make these a dark, dull brown, with black or dark, dull green for trim and so forth.

Infinity Knights: Definitely the brightest colour scheme. Currently thinking sort of sandy-beige and light blue.

 

I have to admit, I'll still learning the ways of the forum. Once I create the colour schemes, I may not be able to post them as I haven't sussed out how it's done yet. ;)

I'm working on it, though.

 

Thanks ChaplainMathreyn for reading between the lines with the Steel Dragons. I'd not even thought of that sort of approach, even if that's what comes across in the writing. I suppose having them slowly adopt the idea of the tank as a sort of combined shield and hammer could work.

I must admit, when you started talking about the Aurora Chapter, I had no idea what you were talking about. This is my fault- I failed to articulate a vital point.

The chapters, (all four of them), at this point, do not deviate from the codex regarding ammounts of units. If others think it might be better for one chapter or another to do so, I'll go with it. But the reality is that I'm uncertain of being able to write good reasons for the deviance.

 

So, to finish, the Steel Dragons don't have more tanks or bikes (yet) than a regular codex chapter. They're just very agressive in their use.

 

The Red Lords have wound up with anti-hero stamped on their faces. I think that thier cynical approach to the people they defend will irk some of the other chapters.

 

You raise a great point also with the Infinity Knights. I had it in mind for them to consider themselves no better than their brother Astartes, but they'll not be happy with the way the Red Lords behave towards IG regiments, how the Steel Dragons "recklessly" use their sacred dreadnoughts as a sort of crowbar for prying open defences (admittedly I didn't write that bit in yet) or how the 3rd chapter prefers covert action to pitched battle.

 

I'll need to make the Bears' strategy somehow less compatible with the other chapters. And yes, there is a whole lot of work to be done regarding the big conflict.

 

I'll try to limit myself to smaller posts next time. I don't want people's fingers getting hurt on my account.

Thank you both for your comments. :o

 

Edit:

I think I may drop the stalemate. Thank you Alexander for reinforcing the point made by earlier comments - it's rather more viable to have them permanently on guard in an area. I just need to decide on the enemy there. I'll look into it, but would a large-scale Chaos threat of some sort be out of the question? Part of me thinks that another, more famous chapter would have been along to seriously prod buttock on a chaos force by now...

[Ace Debonair]

OK, now I'm worried. ;)

 

The entire forum has had all day to tear my ideas apart, and there is no way in heck that my story so far is flawless. Is there? :o ;)

 

I must also apologize pre-emptively for those of you whose fingers get sore after typing a response to long posts. I've written up some more details for the community at large to frown upon. These were written late at night for the most part, and I know there are still gaps in the story. But flaws aside, I hope you at least enjoy the general idea!

 

-=-=-=-=

The Shroud Stars:

-=-=-=-=

The Shroud Stars are a large cluster of planets formed around six bright stars, near the western-most edge of Imperial territory. The name for the area comes from the thick, grey-blue clouds of interstellar gases that surround both the planets and the stars. It was held by Imperial forces for well over four millenium, and was largely ignored during the great crusade. By the time of the sixth founding, however, it had become apparent that all was not well in this sector. Ork warbands had been a perrenial problem, but nothing that the regiments of Imperial guard could not contain. Suddenly, however, there was another threat - one that was not, at the time, truly recognized for what it was. It was much, much later when news arrived at the relatively nearby Rucio system of Chaos activity, thanks to a small knot of refugees who had fled the Shroud Stars.

 

It was later still that the High Lords of Terra heard of this threat. There were more pressing threats to the Imperium, however, and little attention was paid to the problem until the time of the seventh founding. Amongst the many chapters comissioned at this time were two chapters in response to this (and other) threats.

Firstly, the Red Lords, a chapter founded on the gene-seed of the illustrious Ultramarines Primarch Roboute Guilliman. They were assigned to the Rucio system to deal with the whispers of spreading corruption, and of course to bring the Emperor's Judgement to the Shroud Stars.

The second was the Twilight Talons chapter, who by order were sent to the Raen system to the galactic north of the Shroud Stars. The Twilight Talons were intended to commit their entire strength to the purging of the Shroud Stars. In combination with support from the Red Lords, the threat would be quickly and efficiently neutralised.

-=-=-=-=

However, even the greatest of plans can encounter the most unexpected drawbacks.

-=-=-=-=

The Red Lords, arriving at the Rucio system, found clear evidence that the taint of Chaos had spread. They threw themselves into expunging all traces of heresy, as was their duty. Cleansing the system would prove a difficult, laborious task, made all the more problematic by the seemingly impossible reoccurences of cults on planets previously purged. The Red Lords struggled on with their foremost duty - cleansing the Rucio system, and paying little attention to the Shroud Stars.

 

The Twilight Talons were the second chapter, also created from the genetic stock of Guilliman. They quickly claimed the world of Pellin in the Raen system as their home. It was an idyllic, forested world, and the people there were easy to convert to Imperial creed. The Twilight Talons launched many careful excursions into the Shroud Stars, and found no evidence of a Chaos presence on the worlds they visited, although what they found was equally un-nerving. The cities, built by Imperial forces and manned at one time by entire Imperial Guard regiments, were deserted. Not destroyed, as such, but clearly the desolate lands had been abandoned for quite some time. The Talons were putting together the final stages of a plan to re-conquer the planets of the Shroud Stars when disaster struck. Planets in their system were coming under rapid attack by Eldar forces. The Twilight Talons had to delay their plans and fight defensively against the invasive Eldar. The war was long and difficult, often multiple planets coming under attack simultaneously. The Twilight Talons were forced to spread their forces thin and drastically adapt their tactics in order to hold their ground against the cunning Eldar.

-=-=-=-=

At the time of the eighth founding, the High Lords comitted a further two chapters to the cause, with the intention of reinforcing the beleagured chapters and cleansing the Shroud Stars and returning them to Imperial control. The system was a concern, but the resources of existing chapters was still to stretched to reinforce the Red Lords and the Twilight Talons sufficiently.

 

The first of the chapters created for this role were the Steel Dragons, a chapter created in the image of the White Scars, and bred from their geneseed. The Steel Dragons' homeworld was the furthest from the Shroud Stars, in the Vorlian system, which was (galactically speaking) directly below the Shroud Stars. Like many progeny of the White Scars line, the Steel Dragons favoured fast attacks, which they used to great effect to rout the few Ork warbands in the system. However, the Orks proved a more tenacious threat than first expected - returning time and time again under the leadership of Warboss Brok 'ead'itta. Warboss Brok had adapted his gameplan drastically - focusing on repelling the quicker attacks and cutting down the quicker vehicles of the Steel Dragons. The Dragons, frustrated, were now forced into a war of attrition.

 

The other chapter, the Infinity Knights, were the only chapter able to conquer their adoptive home system without much grief. Galactically south of the Shroud Stars, the planets of the Saias system were subjugated by the zealous Astartes, and brought into the Imperial fold. The Infinity Knights were, as intended, in a position to help the other chapters quell the disquiet in their systems.

-=-=-=-=

The Infinity Knights did what the Emperor required of them - flew to the aid of the three chapters surrounding the Shroud Stars. They assisted the Red Lords in their re-purging of many of the tainted colonies on the worlds of Rucio. Those few civilisations that were spared were encouraged to grow, to help compensate for the low numbers of even potential recruits for the Red Lords.

 

But the Astartes of the Infinity Knights saw fault with the distant, merciless Red Lords, who had gone far beyond all reasonable force in their purging of the taints - often levelling entire nations if even a risk of future taint was detected. The Infinity Knights protested that the duty of the Astartes was to preserve the loyal subjects of the Emperor, but the Red Lords were adamant that thier way was the only way to prevent future failure of the clearly fragile huamns. The battle strategies of the Red Lords also palled the Infinity Knights. While the Knights' preferred tactic was to fight the foe at mid-to-close range, the Red Lords would invest a great deal of time and energy into suppressing and pulverizing enemies with artillery before closing any distance. When the real battles begun, a large emphasis was placed on ranged combat, and in particular on the use of Devastator squads to kill enemies at the longest possible range. The reasons given for this approach was simple. Those pure enough to become Astartes were few and far between in the Rucio system, and as such the loss of a battle-brother was treated as the most unacceptable of failings. If the survival and continued purity of the chapter meant excessive reliance on ranged combat, that was the path the Red Lords would walk. It was the Red Lords who would be the second chapter to truly subjugate their home system.

-=-=-=-=

The Twilight Talons had adapted a strategy to counter-balance their elusive Eldae foes. The Talons' librarians had, over the years, pressured themselves into the role of divining the moves of the Eldar. This practice was relied upon heavily - allowing for the detailed deployment of Twilight Talon counter-attacks. The chapter had now become specialists in simultaneous attacks, often dedicating squads to seemingly seperate actions that would have far-reaching consequences. They would strike several blows against Eldar positions simultaneously, striking with assault and veteran scout units to eliminate key targets, disrupting Eldar strategies and allowing the main force of the chapter to strike almost unopposed at their wily foes.

 

However, these tactics were abhorrent to the Infinity Knights who came to assist the chapter. While of course scouts, and even covert attacks were sometimes an essential part of warfare, such heavy reliance on multi-pronged attacks, even in retaliation, was a frightening closeness to the tactics of the traitors. The reliance on Psychic divination was also too close to sorcery for the comfort of the zealous Infinity Knights.The chapter masters of the two chapters argued bitterly for much of the time they worked together.Even though the Eldar presence was repelled from the Raen system, thanks to a combination of Twilight Talon lightning-fast surgical strikes and the Infinity Knights' straightforward, overwhelming attack, by the finish the two chapters felt more embittered than elated.

-=-=-=-=

Lastly were the Steel Dragons, who had also adapted to battle their foe. Warboss Brok 'ead'itter had proven both elusive and resourceful - his almost constant use of heavy armour to neutralize the threat of a lightning-strike attack had evolved a new tactic in the Astartes chapter. They relied on a wall of advancing armour to break apart the heavier weapons of ork formations, rushing the sides of the enemy formation with attack bikes and transports loaded with marines. The chapter had adopted heavy use of the flamer as a means of dealing with the massed Ork infantry ranged against them.

 

The leading figures of the Infinity Knights had secretly hoped that the machine-reliant Steel Dragons would prove to be a close ally. But their attitudes to warfare were, perhaps, the most abhorrent to the zealous chapter. In particular, a great conflict arose between the two concerning the use of Dreadnoughts. To the Infinity Knights, the dreadnought was the most sacred of weapons - a living, potent symbol of the Emperor's power, and his conquest over death. They were, to the Knights, at one and the same time a sacred mystery and the keystone of their army. To the Steel Dragons, however, Dreadnoughts were merely an additional shock weapon, something to fracture further the lines of the enemy. Often they were used at the start of a conflict to break Ork defences, or deep-striked via drop pods to cut off escape routes. The Steel Dragons agreed that the dreadnought was useful as a machine of war, but no moreso than the tanks or attack bikes of the chapter. The Dragons' eventual favour of the 'Metal before manpower' approach to warfare had brought with it the belief that although the Astartes was the Emperor's ultimate weapon, the Astartes' ultimate weapons, in turn, were his vehicles. The two chapters had many disputes, the Knights calling the Dragons' use of dreadnoughts "reckless and disrespectful", and the Steel Dragons branding the Infinity Knights' reservist attitude towards the dreadnought "a waste of firepower" and "overly cautious".

-=-=-=-=

 

 

 

 

I've not written in the location of the Shroud Stars. I know it's a big deal, but I'm hoping to take soundings as to where it would be best placed. Opinions very, very welcome. ;)

Same with the precise 'when'. I'll cheerfully change any time-related stuff to suit the wider universe.

I've yet to identify if a Chaos force, perhaps even one of the original Traitor Legions, could be responsible for the damage done in the Shroud Stars. So I've kept details on that to a minimum, merely so I have to change less stuff if my idea is flawed. :D

 

I'm going to go and get some sleep. I positively and thoroughly encourage you allto tear into my ideas while I recover from all this thinking. :D

Thank you for reading.

[Donkey Kong]

I've got to comment after seeing how much you put in.

 

First, I assume the Black Bears are now the Twilight Talons. I insist on hints at vampire-ism just for some tongue and cheek. Maybe drinking the blood of enemies.

 

For colors, I'd actually say that the Red Lords should be the brightest.

Also, there should be some focus on apothecaries.

 

With the Eldar it seems almost forced. I know they're xeno, and they don't think like humans, but they still need a motive. In a system full of Orks and Chaos, and if you're feeling adventurous, I recommend, Chaos Orks. Maybe if a colony was digging and happened upon some ruins, the Eldar would be interested and you could add another campaign around that.

 

The Steel Dragons seem kind of forced with their Dreadnought "abuse." Dreads are supposed to be entombed heroes, an attitude more in line with "Our heroes can handle themselves!" would be better than, "Hey glorious ancient bro, you're gonna be breaking the line without support in a middle of orks :3 kay!" The "Waste of firepower." is a nice touch though.

 

Advancing with combined arms seems like such a simple tactic it's insulting to hear it being new. Maybe have them be stubborn, marching up the middle with armor and getting torn apart, then switching to the speed tactic.

 

The Infinity Knights need some Chaplain input. I could imagine some really interesting debates between them and other Captains.

 

I'd like to hear some more of your ideas. Hope my input helped.

[Brother Argent]

I have been reading through your ideas here and I must say I like them so far. It reminds of a project I was going to (sort of did) start in regards to a large number of Chapters (12 Actually) swearing an oath of brotherhood after fighting together on some distant world. Has actually inspired me to perhaps put a little more work back into the idea, maybe post it when I actually get a draft done.

 

Anyway, keep going with this and I look forward to seeing it develop. Oh, and in regards to images (for colourschemes) simply copy the URL from the Painter and when you post there is a handy button above where you type for inserting images. Past the URL in there, getting rid of the http: that already appears. Then Voila, instant sharing of colour scheme. Go ahead and give it a try. Lookijng forward to it.

[Ace Debonair]

Thanks KingHongKong and Silver Phoenix for your input.

Yes, after much internal debate I settled on renaming the Black Bears the Twilight Talons and completely omitted to tell anyone. :D I'm really not sure how I forgot.

Red Lords making a big deal with apothecaries is a good idea - they make a fuss about preserving the life of Astartes anyway (so they can serve His will in other, greater battles) so that'll work great.

Valid points also with the Steel Dragons. The idea I meant to convey was the tactic was almost completely alien to them; highly mobile charges had really done all the work until then, and having to even contemplate a slower approach was something the stubborn Dragons were unwilling to do. I admit this completely failed to come across. :D

The Eldar were originally going to be Tau. Then I realised that would seriously predate the first contact with the Tau, so they became an Eldar presence. I will work on motivations for the Eldar's presence - somehow Chaos Orks, while good, don't strike me as wraithlike, elusive foes that would prompt the Talons to adapt drastic new measures.

Chaplains! :eek Great idea. It was pretty late when I wrote all that stuff, and I forgot completely about chaplains. That's going to be fun. Expect some colourful discussions betwen the chapters! :D

As regarding colour schemes, here's the basics:

Red Lords Space Marine

Steel Dragons Space Marine

Twilight Talons Space Marine

Infinity Knights Space Marine

Thanks to Silver Phoenix for telling me how this works! :D

Twelve chapters is going to be tough, but it sounds very cool - I'll look forward to readig about it one day!

There could be other chapters with identical or very similar schemes to the ones I've devised - I'll happily change mine, but don't have time to look for those chapters myself just now.

Any other problems anyone can spot?

And any advice on Where or When this conflict ought to be set?

Thanks for all the help thus far!

[fudal78]

Good ideas and well written so far.

 

Do I detect the faint hint of Chaos seeping into the Red Lords (Khorne) and the Twilight Talons (Tzeentch)? Could these Chapters turn traitor and turn disdain into outright civil war?

 

I look forward to reading more :rolleyes:

[Ace Debonair]

I've finally come up with a potential 'where' for the Shroud Stars. I'm thinking the near-side of the Eastern Fringe, out past the Ghoul Stars, in what on the starmap is called the Centaurus Arm of the galaxy.

If there's big problems with this, Please tell me before I get carried away detailling the places.

 

You might well detect the subtle workings of chaos. ;)

 

'Twas a sort of subconscious intention to have ticklings of potential heresy written into the chapters.

But, if I may give the wheels of paranoia a further spin...

 

The Steel Dragons find fault with the more conservative approach of the other chapters, preferring to wade into battle immediately instead of faffing about with fancy plans, artillery, or witholding the heavy weapons. Perhaps the Dragons, of course, are too agressive...?

The Red Lords are extremely prideful, more than bloodthirsty. The heavy use of artillery will, when I write it, suggest more that the opposition is not worthy of the glorious death a battle with Astartes would offer them.

The Infinity Knights could see corruption in the other chapters - perhaps seeing them as the true threat to the Imperium with their unholy, dishonourable and distasteful tactics...

The overt use of divining an enemy's next move via librarians, does of course taste tangily of Tzeentch. But I'm sure the Talons can give it up at any time they want...

 

But of course, they are all loyal to the cause of the emperor. They'd never betray their brother Astartes like that. Right? :rolleyes:

EDIT:

Also, quick question to our veteran reviewers - I think I can start writing the IAs for the individual chapters, but what about the sort of 'overview' I've drafted earlier; is it worth mentioning bits and pieces of it in the IAs, or should it be a seperate thing?

[Apothete]

I'll try to come back to the topic in a while and give you a more thorough response, but something did occur to me that might let you differentiate the Steel Dragons from the Iron Hands without having to change much of what you have here.

 

Quite simply, make them a siegebreaker Chapter that specializes in a hybrid tactic that combines Steel Rain with armor dominance. You would have an opening wave of podding Dreadnoughts, deep striking Assault Marines and/or Vanguard dropping from seat-of-the-pants flown Thunderhawks that lay down a withering wave of fire before scattering their payload over the walls and bastions, with podding Tacticals and Devestators coming down behind the first line to lay fire support and cover for the Thunderhawk Transporters that are bringing down Vindicators and Whirlwinds. Toss in a couple of podded Thunderfire cannons in that second wave and you have yourself a Dreadnought-loving Chapter which doesn't just copy the boys in black.

 

This gives you the freedom to maintain a constant assault and still use the resources available to a Chapter, while the more bloodthirsty of the Brothers can be in the first wave and constantly in the thick of things. The fact that they're willing to charge in under the guns of their brethren, especially the heavier artillery like Thunderfires and Vindicators, could be a testament to their fervor and a part of why others view them as being a little too zealous for their own good.

[Moonsword]

I think "a little" is a bit of an understatement. Willingly charging into your own shelling time and again falls under the heading of "Darwin Award in progress".

[FireFist]

one word: Sweet :D

anywho i still need to get my head around some things before i speak more.

[Donkey Kong]

I like the hints of Chaos.

 

Though, I'm not a fan of the color schemes you've chosen.

The Steel Dragons are currently my favorite,

 

and, may I suggest a scheme?:

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/smsbeta...&blt=A8A8A8

[Ace Debonair]

Thank you all for your great ideas.

 

 

Apothete, you're a genius. :rolleyes: That could work, although I'll have to think over how precisely to make them adopt that approach.

 

Moonsword, thanks for pointing out a potential flaw with the "all-guns-blazing-everyone-hit-them-at-once" approach. I'll certainly bear that in mind when thinking of the Dragons.

 

KingHongKong, I take it the scheme you did was for the Steel Dragons. One word: Nice. :)

 

FireFist, I'm glad you like what you see so far.

 

Does anyone have a favourite out of these chapters yet? :)

I'm going out today, but please keep the criticisms coming. I'll look forward to seeing my work picked apart later.

Thanks again for all your input.

[happe]

well, where to start....

 

I like it! I honestly have no complains/ concerns over the whole idea.

 

That, said I would rate my fluff knowledge at about average so dont call me the best source.

[Apothete]

I think "a little" is a bit of an understatement. Willingly charging into your own shelling time and again falls under the heading of "Darwin Award in progress".

 

If this discussion was about Imperial Guard then I'd probably agree with you. However, since we're talking about Astartes instead...

 

What I envisioned was not some round-pumping nightmare barrage from the tanks and heavy weaponry that will be ranking up behind the spearhead, but rather a combined-arms approach where the Dreadnoughts and some melta-and-hammer armed jump troops would be exploiting the havoc caused by the Thunderhawks. While they're tying up particular spots where breaches have been made already, the big guns behind them start coming in and opening up new holes in the defenses so that the second wave can advance. Part of the Tacticals remain in place as a support gunline that's picking off whatever they can see on or in the fortress, or coming out of it, while the rest swarm the newly created entrances.

 

For their part, the Thunderfires, Vindicators, and Whirlwinds would be suppressing whatever wasn't immediately engaged or shattering the defenses so that friendly troops could poor in. These are extremely highly trained soldiers with access to a pervasive communications network, so I think they might just be organized enough to pull the tactic off.

 

Does anyone have a favourite out of these chapters yet?

 

I'm sucker for the Sons of Ferrus, so I'm backing the Steel Dragons.

[Donkey Kong]

With Apothe's suggestion, I'd like to add my own, or just throw out my idea since I might be a little behind:

What currently stands, as far as I know:

- The Chapter uses speed and lightning attacks: what I infer to be bikes, land speeders, jump packs, and Thunderhawks.

- The Chapter gets whooped and decides to use armor

- The Chapter goes to specializing in siege operations

and in all of them they're zealous nutjobs.

 

Now I know that telling someone to scrap and idea is rude, but the lightning attacks seem out of character for a stubborn chapter.

So, maybe have them starting out with Apothete's tactics, and then have them lose to Orks due to the Orks flanking armored lines and what not (Orks go fast, steel death moves at it's own pace).

Then have them adopt more swift units. Even having them go out as to use Ork bikes would show just how truly courageous, zealous, and insane they are.

 

With signs of Chaos, I know you don't want to make it obvious, but having a Chapter fall would be really cool, or I think so at least:

my vote goes to the Red Lords, by the way. They just scream Slaanesh so much now:

- Big guns so that I don't have to bother with you

 

Unfortunately, that seems to be your only idea with them, though. Maybe have them train more than they pray. Have Apothecaries experiment with making the marines more survivable. I know it's almost a rip off of Bile, but it's very fluffy for the Red Lords to do. Add to this by having different perspectives, with the Red Lords having the biggest marines. Maybe they have extra thick black carapace. Don't go with taking enemy attributes and including them, just upgrade Astartes ones. Maybe give them more stylized power armor. Also, have them use whoever they can, maybe Imperial Guard Regiments and just send them on death charges. Kind of like Word Bearers and their zealots.

 

Be pliable now, and it'll fit together in the end ;) .

 

KHK