Nobz... they are unkillable

[Smurfalypse]

You dont get FnP vs AP2 or less weaponry, so the amount that were killed would be a little more but not by a whole lot. When i play against them i do have a 10 man term squad with alot of plasma BUT it doesnt work wonders. I usually count on them killing 3-4 and nothing more, my buddy runs with invuln so he rolls 4+cover, then 5+invuln. Its a pain in the arse.

 

You sure you said that right Smurf?

He can only take a single save, normally the cover save as its better.

 

Plasma is pretty solid for killing them, wounding on 2's and they get a 4+ cover save normally (from the bike).

The problem is with the whole wound allocation issue when it comes to actually killing them, so Plasma will tend to wound alot but not kill.

 

I rely on BattleCannons, Melta and Power Fist. S8 for the insta-kills so there is none of that wound allocation crap. It gets hit, fails save and dies.

 

Meant OR...But im retarded and at work so :D

[Prot]

This is just one of the reasons I'm not a fan of the 5th ed wound allocation system.

 

I still think the Ork codex is the one which all others should be measured by in terms of flexibility as well as power. IG are pretty disgusting to take care of now too though.

[Askari]

Slaanesh daemon weapon lords and lash princes work best against them.

 

If you don't use these units there are a few other otpions, tank shock the hell out of them and try to bucn them up for defiler battlecannons, Oblit plasma cannons and vindicator plates. Unfortunately, they'll save half of these due to their permanent 4+ cover save. If they put a Warboss in the unit they may also allocate the S8-9 wounds to the warboss since he has T5(6).

[Drudge Dreadnought]

Nobz may actually motivate me to run a slaaneshi lord with a daemon weapon. That and crisis suits.

[Spacefrisian]

Khorne Lord on Juggernaut with deamon weapon could be an option. S5 with a possibility of a lot of attacks. Pair this up with a Lash prince to pull them through terrain and you will most likely get some Nob Bikerz killed.

[Drudge Dreadnought]

Khorne Lord on Juggernaut with deamon weapon could be an option. S5 with a possibility of a lot of attacks. Pair this up with a Lash prince to pull them through terrain and you will most likely get some Nob Bikerz killed.

 

Not really worth it. He's far too likely to eat his own face. A slaanesh daemon weapon will do a bettere job, or a warptime prince.

[Dràyhèn]

Khorne Lord on Juggernaut with deamon weapon could be an option. S5 with a possibility of a lot of attacks. Pair this up with a Lash prince to pull them through terrain and you will most likely get some Nob Bikerz killed.

 

Not really worth it. He's far too likely to eat his own face. A slaanesh daemon weapon will do a bettere job, or a warptime prince.

One guy does the trick: Abaddon. :)

[Askari]

Gift of chaos and wind of chaos both do terrible things to Nobs. Since gift tests against their base tougness of 4 and doesn't allow saves of any type, you'll have a 50% chance each turn of killing a nob. Stick the lord wih this power in the back of a large plague marine squadwith 2 meltas and a fist champ and watch the nobz get tarpitted and slowly chipped down. Deepstrike five termis with power fists and icon of khorne behind the nobs and then send them into combat. It's a lot of points in a few units but it could do pretty well.

 

But lash is still the best. Can anyone reccommend how to beat them with a normal take all comers IW list? So daemon weapon lord, two termicide squads with combi melts, defiler, dakka pred and 2 oblits backed up by 3 csm squads.

[the jeske]

. Stick the lord wih this power in the back of a large plague marine squadwith 2 meltas and a fist champ and watch the nobz get tarpitted and slowly chipped down.

you mean a sorc because lords cant have psychic powers and biker nobs are one of those units [thx to power clawns and the 2w redistribution of wounds] that actually do stomp pm units in to the ground.

Deepstrike five termis with power fists and icon of khorne behind the nobs and then send them into combat.

illegal . cant assault after deepstrike . termis land shot and nobz drive away .

[Drudge Dreadnought]

Gift sorcs are very clunky. Remember that gift is cast before movement, so it is very difficult to have them in a useful spot to use it.

[DuskRaider]

Alright, well tonight I kind of see where folks are coming from when talking about Nobz. I played a 1,000 pt game against my Ork friend again, this time with my World Eaters. He had a Warboss in a group of 7 Nobz and this was actually a big pain. They got the charge off on one of my 8-man Berzerker squads (hey, I play the sacred numbers, sue me). After a round I only had 3 'Zerkers left while I had managed to only dispatch 2 Nobz. To be fair, the Warboss did the killing, really. I was lucky and charged into them with a squad of 7 'Zerkers (one died in their pervious bout with Boyz). After 2 rounds and a loss of a further 5 'Zerkers, I managed to kill the Nobz finally. Nasty units, these are.

 

On a side note, I definitely had an MVP of the game. One of my Skull Champions had his unit charge into a mob of 20 Boyz, slaughtered them while only losing one, then charged into the Boss and his Nobz. He was the only one who survived that combat, taking out the last 2 Nobz and landing the killing blow on the Boss. He THEN managed to get into a combat with 10 'Ard Boyz who were ganging up on another one of my Skull Champs. The two wiped out the squad with the loss of my other Skull Champ. At the end of the game it was just him and my Terminator Lord left on the board. MVP.

[Askari]

I meant land the termies behind the noz while they're tied up in close combat and then charge them into the melee the next turn. And by large pm squads, i meant very large. Of course, this is just if you're trying to make a force tailored solely to biker nobz.

[eyescrossed]

And by large pm squads, i meant very large.

Removes all their strengths, which is taking 2 specials with less than 10 of them, AND their Toughness and FNP won't matter.

[honersstodnt]

your best bets against nob bikers are probably dreadnoughts, defilers, vindicators, and obliterator fire from long range. anything else is just a waste of points to throw against them.

 

unlike loyalists, you don't get your fancy 3+ invulnerable in close combat from stormshield hammer terminators, so chaos is really kinda lacking in ways to deal with nobs. you can't use anything other than power weapons to wound them, otherwise its pointless with their 4+ re-rollable save (armor + fnp), and you just don't have enough options in the chaos codex for infantry to stack enough power weapons into a unit to kill enough nobs before its steamrolled by their mass powerclaw attacks.

 

so the solution is walkers... if you can get even 2 of them to charge into a unit of nobs, you will mess enough of them up that they won't kill both on the return attack, and then you can whittle them down over a few turns.

[minigun762]

you can't use anything other than power weapons to wound them, otherwise its pointless with their 4+ re-rollable save (armor + fnp), and you just don't have enough options in the chaos codex for infantry to stack enough power weapons into a unit to kill enough nobs before its steamrolled by their mass powerclaw attacks.

 

Its actually one of those times that Khorne Terminators with Dual Claws are fairly useful. No armor save and at best a 5+ Inv save. S4 rerolling is basically the same as S5 so you're wounding on 50% of your hits.

 

If you hit them with a 5 man squad from a Land Raider, you're looking at putting 6-7 wounds on them before they strike, which isn't horrible really.

[Smurfalypse]

you can't use anything other than power weapons to wound them, otherwise its pointless with their 4+ re-rollable save (armor + fnp), and you just don't have enough options in the chaos codex for infantry to stack enough power weapons into a unit to kill enough nobs before its steamrolled by their mass powerclaw attacks.

 

Its actually one of those times that Khorne Terminators with Dual Claws are fairly useful. No armor save and at best a 5+ Inv save. S4 rerolling is basically the same as S5 so you're wounding on 50% of your hits.

 

If you hit them with a 5 man squad from a Land Raider, you're looking at putting 6-7 wounds on them before they strike, which isn't horrible really.

 

Agreed about the khorne termies with claws.

 

Had a game this last weekend with this exact situation. Defiler moved up, fleet of foot, assautled. 7 attacks on the charge i think it was (x2 extra DCCW), hit with 5 of them (higher than average), wounded four of them, he had no saves. Instant unit of 7 down to 3, which is a very managable number. Now dont get me wrong, the last three annihilated my poor defiler for his heroics, but 150 pts that took chunks out of other units during the game and then killed easilly his pts in models in this one assualt was definitely a win. I know i could have just as easilly hit with 2 or 3 hits, but the fact is even if he kills three hes making pts back and wittling a unit that is very hard for me to handle, down to a unit that is much much easier for me to get a grasp on.

[Master Of Malfeasance X]

Hmm... I sort of wish I was fighting the ork players you guys fight. This guy runs ten nobz with FNP, 4+/5++, 4x klaws, all different wargear, and Ghazkhull. It would be pretty manageable if it weren't for Thraka getting 7 power fist attacks on the charge with his 2+ invulnerable save.

[Smurfalypse]

Hmm... I sort of wish I was fighting the ork players you guys fight. This guy runs ten nobz with FNP, 4+/5++, 4x klaws, all different wargear, and Ghazkhull. It would be pretty manageable if it weren't for Thraka getting 7 power fist attacks on the charge with his 2+ invulnerable save.

 

 

lol yeah...thats a bummer. When we were practicing for ard' boyz last year my buddy an ork player decided to go with a grand total of a 32 model army. It was litterally two full nob biker squads, two warbosses on bikes, and i wanna say a battlewagon or something else random. First turn was always the same, turbo boost in my face. My turn would be to unload everything at a single unit, and not usually be able to kill it though i would get it down to a small amount or even wipe it. The other two units would then slam into my lines and just annihilate everything. They were to fast to out maneauver, to tough to out last, and hit harder and more often than anything could possibly have in melee :woot:

 

The bright side to the whole thing is in a 1500 pt game is hes running a full 10, then he doesnt have a whole lot outside of that unit.

[Moonsword]

Hmm... I sort of wish I was fighting the ork players you guys fight. This guy runs ten nobz with FNP, 4+/5++, 4x klaws, all different wargear, and Ghazkhull. It would be pretty manageable if it weren't for Thraka getting 7 power fist attacks on the charge with his 2+ invulnerable save.

 

Bury him in pie plates would be my response.

[Smurfalypse]

Hmm... I sort of wish I was fighting the ork players you guys fight. This guy runs ten nobz with FNP, 4+/5++, 4x klaws, all different wargear, and Ghazkhull. It would be pretty manageable if it weren't for Thraka getting 7 power fist attacks on the charge with his 2+ invulnerable save.

 

Also if he has thrakka in there it means they arnt biker'd up and are a pile slower. Kill the transport and make them crawl across the board would be my answer to that.

[Moonsword]

I can't remember off-hand, but I think they should still be vulnerable to instant death. Vindicators, conversion beamers shooting from longer distances, lascannons, and meltas will all cause instant death and ignore his armor and FNP, and plasma weapons will ignore FNP and his armor saves. A Master of the Forge can also punch their transport out all on his own, too, and that blast from the beamer will keep things "interesting" for the rest of the Boyz once he's done pot-shotting Tharka's little mob. Granted, any wounds dropped on Ghazghoul won't kill him outright, but wounding that tough nut of a greenskin before he can get into arm's reach is probably at least a moral victory to begin with.

[Lothar_Bubonicus]

I wouldn't say they were unkillable - Last night Ghaz and his retinue did fall after two rounds of Close combat. Ok they took out 7 Plague Marines when they charged but they were left exposed so they took hits a round of shooting from a land raider a second PM squad armed with just flamers who charged in with support from a daemon prince. Powerclaws are powerfull but slow.

[the jeske]

Ok they took out 7 Plague Marines when they charged but they were left exposed so they took hits a round of shooting from a land raider a second PM squad armed with just flamers who charged in with support from a daemon prince. Powerclaws are powerfull but slow.

well they arent falcons in 4th which could take fire from a whole army and still live.

remember you used a DP [140+pts] 2 pm squads[~500pts] and a LR to kil them[200+] a mob with ghazgul wouldnt cost more then 500 pts , even if it was totally overgeared.

[Lothar_Bubonicus]

Yes that was a lot of fire power - but i'll make a couple of points

He traded Ghaz, the nobs, and the transport for just over 200points of plague marines. I don't have an Ork codex so I'm not sure what the trade off is - but I think its fair.

When he ploughed into my line he had a battle wagon with a mob of 20(ish) orks in support which were pulled apart by the DP and the second plague marine squad.

There was nothing else for me in range or LOS to shoot at. The LR was over kill, but actually all it did was chip one wound off with a HB - (It wasn't just the land raider that was posessed! Dice hatted me!)

Taking down Ghaz was one of two huge psychological blow he didn't recover from. The other being seeing two big mobs charge my second DP only to get sucked into three rounds of close combat. - End result one squad routs of the board and the second routs out of charge distance.

 

On a side note another blow was charging a rhino he thought was empty had 7 PMs that dropped 3 flame templates on his mob. 33 Auto hits 19 bbq'd boyz!

[the jeske]

nope he traded ghaz +nobz for 1 unit of pms dead . and DP and a LR and a pm busy for one turn. one turn your not killing scoring units . also wiping out a unit of waaghed Nobz in 1 turn of combat is very very lucky . a DP does 5 wounds on nobs [and then they do bioniks] after that pms [i3 so just as fast as nobz] should do 2 more wounds . that with ghaz wound allocation should be one maybe 2 actuall nobz dead . and then he hits backs. sure you probablly will win this fight [thats unless you get hit by the second biker mobs with the second warlord] , but you will probablly lose 2 scoring units while the ork player loses 0. kill points wise its the same. hurt dp and hurt pms +one pm dead is more KPs then single ghaz with bodyguard.