Sanctus Nerpus Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 I don't know if this is the right section to post this question, but does the Company Champion still gain his bonus attack for having the power weapon and bolt pistol or is it just stuck with 2 base attacks? Every time I upgrade a veteran with Army Builder to the champion he loses his bonus attack and I just want to know if this is as intended or a bug? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honersstodnt Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 in the codex it says a champion has a power sword and combat shield. it doesn't say he removes any other wargear.... so he keeps his bolt pistol. this also means you can give him a thunder hammer / stormshield and THEN upgrade him to a champion, to give your squad a WS5 hammer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 this also means you can give him a thunder hammer / stormshield and THEN upgrade him to a champion, to give your squad a WS5 hammer. That wouldn't work. It is not a matter of sequence. If the models is supposed to be a Company Champion, then it cannot get certain options from the list. Back when Veteran Sergeant upgrades were optional (for SW they still kind of are) you also could not just equip one Marine with a lasercannon and THEN make him a Veteran Sergeant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingo Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 this also means you can give him a thunder hammer / stormshield and THEN upgrade him to a champion, to give your squad a WS5 hammer. I don't think it works quite like that. The Company Champion's wargear of power weapon and combat shield is part of the upgrade itself; the codex clearly states this. Edit: beaten to it... too quick for me, Legatus! :pinch: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wizard12 Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 as I read ANY veteran can replace their weapons for a thuder hammer and storm shield. Now you ave to ask does the chapmion still count as a veteran after being upgraded to the chapion. Well I have no Idea :pinch: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnarRedsun Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 I don't think that at that point he counts as a veteran anymore, but as a specialist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingo Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 Yeah; he is upgraded to champion; i.e., he becomes something else. Besides, the upgrades for veterans says that they can replace their chainsword and/or bolt pistol with a thunder hammer etc. The champion already has been given a power weapon and combat shield and therefore cannot replace them. I guess you could argue that as written in the codex, it does not explicitly state that the power weapon and combat shield do not replace the bolt pistol and chainsword the veterans came with, especially as the miniature has a bolt pistol attached to the shield. However, how much wargear can one guy carry? He'd need a caddy. Still; you'd have to convince someone that the champion still counts as a veteran. Personally, I don't agree, and I don't believe that was GW's intent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 I don't know if this is the right section to post this question, but does the Company Champion still gain his bonus attack for having the power weapon and bolt pistol or is it just stuck with 2 base attacks? Every time I upgrade a veteran with Army Builder to the champion he loses his bonus attack and I just want to know if this is as intended or a bug? Army builders 40k files is made by an unofficial group of volunteers- who have their own lives, agendas and opinions. It can fail, and people whos interpretations are disagreed with will be left out in the cold. Armybuilder is simply wrong in this case- one reason I dont use the program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temprus Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 GW does not set the order that options/upgrades are taken. You can have the vet buy/swap his wargear, then upgrade to the champion where he retains all his wargear since the CC upgrade does not swap out anything. The Apothecary is currently out of luck though, since he was "never" a vet to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pingo Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 Has anyone ever asked GW directly about this? That would probably close the debate. Seems that there is an argument for both interpretations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 GW does not set the order that options/upgrades are taken. You can have the vet buy/swap his wargear, then upgrade to the champion where he retains all his wargear since the CC upgrade does not swap out anything. It is not a matter of sequence. Army list creation does not happen "step by step" according to some rule system. Units are not performing the action of being equipped. There is no order in which equipment is chosen and applied. If you want your command squad to include a company champion, then your command squad will only consist of 3 veterans. The veterans can get certain equipment, the apothecary and the company champion cannot get some of those items. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Ming Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 page 42 of the BRB answers this. It's a bug in army builder. He gets the bonus attack and they're all with the power weapon stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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