Starting Daemonhunters

[ASDF_]

Hey guys, I'm starting to get into a new army, and one of the armies I was looking at were Daemonhunters. I play White Scars, and I was wondering, do Daemonhunters play a lot like Space Marines/White Scars? Or are they different enough to go for in starting a new army?

 

I also wanted to ask that if I were to get into DH, would you guys think it's better/more fun to go all GK's, or have a mixed inquisition with GK, WH, and Storm Troopers?

 

Any help would be very appreciated. Thanks.

[wizard12]

Well, if you take grey knights there is one thing you must know as a beginner.

 

DON'T play them like space marines, they will get slaughtered. you have to know when to advance and when to retreat. The main downside to grey knights is they lack anti - tank firepower. but they will compleatly kill any oppentent that has a weapon skill less than 4 and a strengh less than 4 in assault as they hit on 2's and wound on 2's.

 

Their main strengh lies aginst daemons but unless you know someone who plays them you are not going to fight them as often. I really have 3 tips for you

1) don't charge opponets or let oppents charge you with lots of attcaks/ rending attacks/ lots/ furious charge or high strengh power weapons unless you know for sure you can win. Example; unit of ten grey knights gets charge by a unit of genestealers with rending attacks. They don't get to retaliate cause they're all dead.

 

2) take terminators and a grand master as often as you can. They really make up their point cost example; brother captain and grand master get charge by a unit of ten chaos terminators with a chaos lord. the assault ends wiht one chaos terminator and the chaos lord left.

 

3) phycannons, phycannons, phycannons. tey are probably one of the best weapons in the daemon hunter armoury against daemons (most get 2 or three unsavable wounds a phycannon) and are pretty good against anything else. I don't own any cause I don't have money or time to spend on them but from what I've read on this forum and others you hould get some. under that incinerators kind of make a template shaped hole in daemons so their good if your fighting daemons.

 

apart from that all I can say is take some imperial guard with the grey knights togive them some AT fire power in a big game.

 

hope I helped

 

PS. on your question a mixed inquisition force is rather fun to play as storm troops can put more damage than you'ed expect from them and WH's perfectly ougment daemon hunters but if you want to use WH's I'd say make them your primary force and use GK's as allies. or take the terminators, teleport attack squads and heros to augment your white scars as you can ally GK's to space marines as long as the GK's are the allying force.

[Justicar Valius]

Well we play amzingly differently. We follow Silent requim's "the way of the water warrior" like space marines follow the codex astarates. The only difference is our version of the space wolves lose.

 

Read that but then consider it was 4th ed so add some IST with 2 meltas in a rhino.

 

ALWAYS take extra armour and if you can smoke launchers due to our ones being a lot better.

ALWAYS take a raier in 1000 points and up. I take one in 1000 (plus a rhino and chimera) and i take 2 in 1500.

 

There are many builds for taking an inquisitor. But the best one is:

 

Eites Inquisitor with psycannon, 2 servitors with heavy bolters, another one with a plasma cannon, 1 or 2 sages, 1 or 2 mystics. And if your facing daemons give your inquisitor sanctuary. A very good build right there.

 

That will give you acsess to assasins and please don't fall into taking a vindicare. Take a calidus or eversor.

 

Remember to keep your grey knights mobile and remember our troops cost loads so never commit them to a combat they can't win in 1 turn with average rolls.

 

A nifty little move is to have a squad with 2 incinerators (heavy flamers but ignore invulnerables) in a raider and tank shock. Then pop the squad out and you shoould find they all fit under the template nicely

[number6]

Welcome aboard! We have power-armoured troops, but Grey Knights are not space marines. (Though they do die just as easily. Heh.) Playing a DH army as if it were just space marines of a different color is the way to a quick defeat.

 

Do please check out the wealth of information stickied in our Online Resources topic at the top of the forum. There's some truly brilliant tactical information in there, specifically with respect to GKs.

 

IMHO, a pure GK force is not really all that viable as an army any more. It is a kick-ass rock to about 1/2 of the 40K armies' scissors, but a rather limited rock against the other 1/2 of the 40K armies' paper. The reason is because mechanized armies are incredibly strong in 5th edition 40K, must stronger than they were in 4th edition. A pure GK force is absolutely brutal on infantry but really struggles against armour. This has always been the case, so the superior qualities of mechanized armies under the latest 40K rules set makes pure GK forces that much worse against the foes that were always the toughest for us to battle in the first place.

 

However, the one thing the Inquisition codex have going for them, despite their extreme age, is extreme flexibility. There are still a number of excellent builds for the budding DH general, and still plenty of opportunities for getting that delicious GK goodness packed inside.

 

* A pure DH codex army is still very good. Take a couple of GKT units, stuff them in land raider crusaders, ISTs with meltas in Rhinos for Troops, maybe a PAGK unit (with psycannons) for Troops as well (points permitting), an Inquisitor with mystics and a multi-melta gun servitor in a Rhino for anti-armour and anti-deep-striking, and you're golden. Fully mechanized, fast, mobile, and packs a real whallop in both the shooting and assault phases.

 

* You can build something similar to the above, but relying more in inducted IG platoons. There are so many excellent options here that it would be impossible to list them all, the new IG platoons are just that good. For starters, just think about putting a squad of GKs with psycannons in an IG Chimera and you've got an incredibly potent mobile firebase there that also packs a great counter-attack punch.

 

* Although it is beyond the scope of the B&C (so please don't ask about making army lists this way), you can take that last idea to its logical conclusion and build an IG army with allied GKs. You'll probably have similar amounts of GKs involved in the end result, so all you're really doing is trading in DH heavy support options (primarily land raiders) for the wider scope of options available to the IG.

[ASDF_]

Thanks guys for all the nice and detailed replies :lol:

 

I was searching the DH army lists on B&C, and I saw an all GK 1500 point list with 3 LR's that seemed like it would be fun, and has a good amount of anti-tank. It contained:

 

Brother Captain with 4 GKT's in a LRC

7-man PAGK Squad with a Justicar and 2 Incinerators in a LR

7-man PAGK Squad with a Justicar and 2 Incinerators in a LR

 

It seems like a fun list, even though it's 19 guys :D, but from your guys' replies, is seems like you wouldn't suggest this list as it doesn't have any IST's, which you guys seem to really like as they are a good unit. But, it seems like this list may pack punch on the table with the look of 3 LR's and 4 TL-LC's for some Anti-tank, if that's any good :P And at the place that I play, there's only really I think one list that has an AV14 vehicle, which is a monilith that I could just ignore and have it phase out, plus the guy sucks with the army :P

 

But, I was also browsing the web and saw an Inquisition army at 1750 points, which I found on yesthetruthhurts.com. He has:

 

1 Inquisitor Lord w/ 3 Warriors, a Penitent, a Gun Servitor, a Chirurgeon, and an Excruciator

1 Brother Captain with 3 GKT's

2 GKT's with a 3rd GKT upgraded to a Brother Captain

Another Inquisitor Squad like the 1st one

1 Inquisitor w/ 3 Warriors, a Gun Servitor, and 3 Mystics

2x 5-man IST's with 2 Meltaguns

1 Infantry Platoon

2x 11-man Sister's Squads

 

The only thing is doesn't have is mech.. but it has some laspistols, and Meltaguns which could deal with mech, but I'm actually interested in an all GK mechanized DH force, or what number6 suggested, some GKT's in LRC's, IST's in Rhino's, and an Inquisitor with Mystics and a MM gun-servitor in a Rhino.

 

Do these lists look good, or do you guys have any other suggestions? Thanks.

[number6]

That last army list you posted is like the kitchen sink of the Inquisition. It's kind of difficult for me to wrap my brain around and figure out how it would work. :lol: Looks like a hybrid list, with the ISTs and Sisters providing mobile meltas while you have a bunch of meat sitting on your homebase -- with autocannons, I would presume -- sending lots of fire downrange. It does have psyker defense and deep-strike defense, and two units of GKTs for counter-attacking (plus psycannon dakka, I would presume). Would take a while to get good with, but it looks pretty competitive to my eyes.

 

The pure GK list you posted is exactly the kind of conundrum with pure GK I was talking about. It will be capable of totally annihilating some armies (e.g., Necrons, Tyranids, Orks) but will, in return, get absolutely smashed by others (e.g., any of a dozen truly potent IG armies, mech Tau, Vulkan Marines).

[ASDF_]

Hmm ok, I see. Thanks for the advice. What I'll probably do is try out numerous amounts of DH armies on the program Vassal 40k, and see how each one does :tu:

 

Thanks again.

[Mattsama]

And, take targetters. At 1 point for free measures, they are worth it.

[ASDF_]

After looking at the 'Way of the Water Warrior' thread and other things on the web, I think I might want to go with a pure GK army, using LR's as transports. At 1500 points, I've come up with this list:

 

HQ:

 

Brother Captain: 92

-Psycannon

-Targeter

 

ELITES:

 

4 GKT's: 209

-Psycannon

 

1 Land Raider [For GKT's]: 258

-Extra Armor

-Smoke Launchers

 

TROOPS:

 

7 Grey Knights: 211

-Justicar with Targeter

-Incinerator

 

1 Land Raider [For Grey Knights]: 258

-Extra Armor

-Smoke Launchers

 

7 Grey Knights: 211

-Justicar with Targeter

-Incinerator

 

1 Land Raider [For Grey Knights]: 258

-Extra Armor

-Smoke Launchers

 

Points: 1497

 

Does this look good, using the Water Warrior Army fighting Style?

 

Some things I was thinking about: Meltabombs/Frag Grenades on Justicars, Dozer Blades on LR's to quickly get into cover if needed, if any Phycic Powers on the Brother Captain are needed, and if a Grand Master is recommended at this point level.

 

Thanks.

[SamaNagol]

There's a long list of things that it looks like you 'need' to deal with various different things. Unfortunately when you are paying 750+ pts for Land Raiders you can't afford them.

[jeffersonian000]

For the last list posted, I'd advise that if you are going to transport your GKT's, the Psycannons are not going to be as useful to you as Incinerators would be since Land Raiders do not have fire ports. If you are going to walk your GKT's, you can afford to drop one of the Land Raiders for other units that many be more effective (btw, Brother Captains cannot take Targeters). A strong build for walking GKT's is an HQ BC w/ Psycan + an Elite GKT squad with 2 Psycans; this will give you 9 S6 attacks are 36", which allows Shrouding to have a chance of actually working (31.5" sweet spot). If you intend for your GKT's to charge out of a Land Raider, a Grand Master is a better buy, as well as using a Land Raider Crusader with smoke launchers to deliver him and his retinue.

 

As to Inquisitors, I've been having great success was a single elite Inquisitor w/ Psycannon attacked to a small PAGK troop selection with 2 Psycannons. Again, 9 S6 attacks at 36", which makes a great objective holder when in cover.

 

However, in a Tri-Raider list with 3 Godhammers, I've been doing well with this build against all but horde Ork:

 

Brother Captain w/ Psycannon

 

;)

Brother Captain w/ Psycannon + 3x GKT w/ 1x Psycannon

 

:blink:

Justicar w/ melta bombs + 5x PAGK w/ 1x Incinerator

 

:)

Justicar w/ melta bombs + 5x PAGK w/ 1x Incinerator

 

GK Land Raider w/ Extra Armour, Smoke, Light

 

GK Land Raider w/ Extra Armour, Smoke

 

GK Land Raider w/ Extra Armour, Smoke

 

Totals: 1500pts even, 20 models, 8 kill points

 

I either pair up an empty LR with one with a troop in it and leave other LR + troop on its own, or place everything in the 'Raiders and drop off the GKT's where they will help out best. The issues with this build is that the GKT are more fragile in close combat than normal, so I try to avoid any assaults unless I know I can win it or at least survive until my next turn. However, I can still deep strike the GKT's and have them be effective the turn they arrive, just walk them and use them for counter assaulting, or have them ride and pop out as needed to whittle down hard targets at range.

 

SJ

 

*edited for formating

[ASDF_]

Ok, thanks a lot :jaw: I will definitely try this list out and see if it suits me :cry:

[Spacefrisian]

What about taking the IA vol 2 Landraider? I found out that Forgeworld has made an update for it in form of an errata.

 

The bonus for landraiders are.

-can carry 12 models

-smokelaunchers and search light for free.

[avatar8481]

@Spacefrisian

 

Because it's not a tourney legal model in 90% of the tournaments out there.

[ASDF_]

Do GK LR's have the power of the machine spirit? Sorry, was just unsure and wanted to clear it up.

[JamesI]

Didn't the FAQ give them the same POTMS as in codex Space Marines?

[avatar8481]

yes, GK landraiders were all faqed to have 5th ed marine POTMS.

[ASDF_]

ok, cool. Thanks :)

[Son of GAR]

i completly agree w/ everone here.

but if you are going to play a inquisitorial army, its VERY differnent.

If your going to use IG or SM's as allies, (i prefer SM's)

you might want to think about using some Deaomon host,

as they are brutal if you can roll fours and fives.

but, as you play White Scars right now,

you shold use some DH allies with then, i suggest some GK termis. :)

[ASDF_]

I've decided to go with a pure GK army though, like I stated before, if I start DH's. It's between them and Tau... o.O

[SamaNagol]

Will you be using Inquisitorial Stormtroopers as well, or just the big silver guys?

[ASDF_]

Just the Grey Knight Silver Guys. :P I'm very into a tri-raider list, so Im going to go with that.

 

Just wanted to ask though, Would you guys suggest (in a tri-raider list) three PAGK squads, or two PAGK squads and a GKT squad?

[SamaNagol]

We were trying to have a discussion about that very thing in the Army Lists forum

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=175762

 

I have seen a number of people championing 2 units of GKT in Raiders and then taking 3 rhinos with Meltagun armed Stormtroopers for anti-armour/objectives. I however, like you, am stubbornly going for pure big silver guys. Cannot decide between the 3 troops choices or the 1 unit of GKT in my 3 Raiders.

[ASDF_]

Hmm.. This is a hard decision >.<

[avatar8481]

I've had success with the tri-raider pure GK list with two PAGK squads and one GKT squad. You can also do it as three PAGK for a few more bodies, but either way it's pretty hardcore to run triraider at 1750 (which is what I woudl say is the minimum to be able to bring GKT instead of a 3rd PAGK. You may find nobody will play you unless you de-mech a little and run some dreads or foot squads, but from your perpective the list won't be nearly as good/efficient.