Blood Angels Squad Markings

[Brother-Chaplain Apock]

Attempted a forum search on this but not much other than the regular, its in the codex topics popped up.

Something I've noticed about 90% of the pictures of peoples army's over the years, including many of the pics on this forum, is that squad markings are left out.

Seems like most folks don't care much about applying them.

 

I've done some research on Chapter structure and company organization in preparation for applying some squad markings and vehicle markings on some mini's I've already painted up.

From what I gather in company structure, squads 1-6 are Tac, 7-8 are Assault, and 9-10 are Devastators, which to me seems very un-Blood Angel like as we put such an emphasis on our Assault Marines.

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g229/apokk/justsquadbadges.jpg

I don't know about you all, but I think the squad markings for 5th - 10th squad are Blah.

That being said, I'm a bit OCD about painting my Blood Angels with as much fluff accuracy as I can, I just hate those last few badges. And don't even get me started on the vehicle markings.

I know, I know, its sad but these are some of the things I consider before diving in.

 

So, anyways I think I'm going to do some personal re-structuring of the Chapters marking system using the same badges from in the codex. Tell me what you all think:

 

All on the right knee pad:

1st Squad: Assault - Black Pad/White Skull

2nd Squad: Assault - Red Pad/White Skull

3rd Squad: Tactical - Yellow Pad/Red Blood Drop

4th Squad: Tactical - Black Pad/Red Blood Drop

5th Squad: Devistator - Black Pad/White X

6th Squad Devistator - Red Pad/ White X

7th - 10th Squads: Tactical - BA Codex Markings stay the same, black & yellow lighting bolt and wings.

 

And for the Vehicles:

Squad Rhinos get squad markings instead of numbers that correlate with their assigned squad. So the rhino assigned to 4th tactical would have a yellow blood drop for the company and a black circle with a red blood drop next to it for the squad assignment. Pretty much what the Insignium Astartes says anyways.

Tank Markings I just figure I'll straight up follow the Insignium Astartes/BA Codex's

I know Land Raiders all get 1st company markings so that's easy, just numerical order.

 

So that's about it for now I guess, Just been mulling this stuff over for a few days thought I might get some other Blood Angel players opinions on this subject, or anything to add to the discussion.

 

EDIT: Also, I was thinking, maybe I should just wait to see if they change anything in a possible new codex, I mean the Space Hulk Terminator Iconography is a bunch of new color schemes, unless it's just personal heraldry.......see......WAY to OCD man.

[Morticon]

From what I gather in company structure, squads 1-6 are Tac, 7-8 are Assault, and 9-10 are Devastators, which to me seems very un-Blood Angel like as we put such an emphasis on our Assault Marines.

 

 

:cries:

 

Everytime I hear/read this I die a little inside :(

 

 

Ag :) its not thaaat bad, but it's maybe a BA ideal that I, personally cling too strongly too.

 

We're Codex adherent!!

 

We follow the rules of Gulliman, with only one major deviation* - Instead of our 1st Company getting TDA, we often get jump packs.

 

BA rules have allowed us to focus and field huge amounts of jump troops but fluff wise, these troops aren't from a disproportionate amount of assault squads in various companies, they're from the commanders request to make use of more of the 7th and 8th assault squads as well as the Assault Reserve companies! (Which I don't have listed on me at the moment - i think there are 2 of them? More? )

 

BA employ devastators (even though the players of BA dont :( )

 

They use them because, tactically, they're in accordance with the training they have received as Adeptus Astartes.

 

Anywayzle - just my oldie thinking. More thoughts from the floor!

 

 

* The other BA specific stuff we have are all variations on the theme of the established. Just tinkering on the edge of the outlined ruled- bending them, not breaking them. Outfitting our dreadnoughts for combat, or our predators for a support role as well as our Rhinos for speed for example!

[Brother-Chaplain Apock]

First off, SWEET A REPLY! :lol:

I'm sorry to have killed you a little inside Mort! Don't worry tho, it's not just you my sandpapery nature affects!

seriously tho,

I agree with the codex adherence to a degree. We do have a Codex based structure when talking about "Company Structure" and in many other areas of Chapter Organization.

Though I do personally think, from the perspective of the "Codex" Chapters that the Blood Angels are deviant from the codex. ( I've had this discussion with an Ultrasmurf....I mean Ultramarine buddy of mine)

 

Now the Black rage and the Red thirst arnt our fault, though in the new C:SM we are blamed for it due to our "unconventional and deviant gene-replication practices" but we as Blood Angel's know as the physic imprint of Sanguinius's death.. Which results in our 11th company.

The reorganization of our Apothecary's into Sanguinary Priest's to tend to those stricken with the rage are a deviation.

The whole second edition codex thing about many believing that we form our scouts "not from new recruits, but instead from the most aggressive of the Blood Angels", not sure if that still applies tho. And the whole Honor Guard instead of a command squad. And you know the Mechanicum is a little peeved with us for fiddling(making better) with our Rhino engines.

 

Much of our believed breaches in Codex are a result of, well Sanguinius dieing really. I usually tell my Smurf buddy at least we don't keep our Primarch in a bubble in the basement. Boosh!

 

Either way there is always one thing that follows any description of our minor deviations from the codex, and I quote

"It is clear to any who study the martial record of the Blood Angels that they enforce the Emperors will with a fervor and zeal that equals or exceeds that of any other chapter. In fact these records point to the fact that the Blood Angels are responsible for many of the Imperium's successful actions and that the number of aliens and heretics they have killed in the name of the emperor is beyond count." Index Astartes II pg.37

 

Sooo, anyway lol back to the original post topic! I just figured because the Assault squad was the most sought after position in the Chapter that it would comprise the 1st and 2nd squads of the battle companies as well.

 

Would it then be correct of me to assume everyone ( I know Koyote does!) goes by the Codex squad markings and the Company structure of 1-6 tac, 7-8 assault, and 9-10 Dev?

[Mattsama]

Before clinging to the idea that the Blood Angels have a disproportiante amount of Jump Pack squads, please remember that this has only occured recently in the 4/5th pdf we have. No other Codex for BA puts such a rediculous focus on Jump Packs. It's new and fun, but this is college and we got drunk and exprimented and... no wait. That was something else...

 

But Mort is right, and the IA article backs it up. Blood Angels are Codex adherent.

[Vodunius]

Would it then be correct of me to assume everyone ( I know Koyote does!) goes by the Codex squad markings and the Company structure of 1-6 tac, 7-8 assault, and 9-10 Dev?

 

I do ascribe to the structure, but I have long wondered whether there was an editorial error with regards to the lightning & wing squad emblems: surely the wing should be for assault? (something entirely plausible - they managed to get the Angels Encarmine & Vermillions names the wrong way round, and the Dark Angels company heraldries all match up with the Codex heraldries for the same companies - except for the Tactical Reserve Companies which are the wrong way round)

 

That said I'm working on some 6th company marines and have been sorely considering making up my own squad heraldries and saying they are the sergeants personal heraldry.

 

The whole second edition codex thing about many believing that we form our scouts "not from new recruits, but instead from the most aggressive of the Blood Angels", not sure if that still applies tho.

 

I'm not sure if it ever applied. If it ever did it was 3rd edition fluff not 2nd (both BA and SW scouts were codex in 2e), but I've not seen an explicit statement about them not being rookies, merely that they are exceptionally aggressive.

[Brother-Chaplain Apock]

Before clinging to the idea that the Blood Angels have a disproportiante amount of Jump Pack squads, please remember that this has only occured recently in the 4/5th pdf we have. No other Codex for BA puts such a rediculous focus on Jump Packs. It's new and fun, but this is college and we got drunk and exprimented and... no wait. That was something else...

But Mort is right, and the IA article backs it up. Blood Angels are Codex adherent.

 

I don't think I ever mentioned Jump packs, What I was discussing was Squad Organization, Squad Markings, and Company Organization. And Mort said that Blood Angels Don't have a disproportionate amount of jump troops, he said

these troops aren't from a disproportionate amount of assault squads in various companies, they're from the commanders request to make use of more of the 7th and 8th assault squads as well as the Assault Reserve companies!

 

I think where you might be misunderstanding is I was referring to the fact that being in an assault squad is much sought after by a Blood Angel, and I was therefore wondering if the first two squads of a Company were Assault and also if, due to the mindset of a BA Space Marine if it would be more likely that Assault squads would be held in a higher "Rank Regard" considering the make-up of the 1st company being assault oriented and the skills you would eventually need to gain entry into that company.

 

Pg. 35 of the Index Astartes, under the organization heading states

"Perhaps the most notable exception(to the Codex Astartes) that the Blood Angels exhibit in their ranks is a preponderance of close combat troops. The chance to become one of the Blood Angels's assault marines is much sought after, as it is in close combat that these Space Marines can exorcise the ghosts of their ancestral memory."

also, when talking about the 10th company end of pg. 35 and on to 36 it describes the 10th scout company as

"They work their way into forward positions, infiltrating enemy positions and

relishing

every opportunity they can take to close quarters and tear their enemies apart in a storm of blood"

Still in the newest codex, as with past codices, Blood Angels are an Assault driven Chapter,

Dante with the jump pack and special close combat abilities,

Corbulo and Lemartes geared towards CC

Blood Angel Psychic Powers are all CC oriented

Death Company: An all close combat "11th company"

1st Company fights as Assault Squads when not in Termie armor

I think the biggest indicator of this is that regular assault squads are apart of our regular troop selection in the most recent codex.

 

To me it just seemed like with all the Assault emphasis, the first two squads might be assault squads.

 

I'm not trying to be long winded here, or a jackass(tho I can come off that way),my point is that while yes we are a Codex based Chapter, we have much non-codex approved structure with-in our Chapter. In fact the IA article you are referring to Mattsama says that

"Although the Blood Angels share much of their organization with their brother Space Marines, adhering in many ways to the precepts of the Codex Astartes, there are notable exceptions."

 

I think one of the things that I have enjoyed most about the Blood Angels is that while we do follow much of the Codex Astartes we have our own unique Chapter because of a "flaw". Though we are based on the Codex Astartes I've never really felt that we were a Codex Chapter, however at the same time that doesn't mean we aren't as "Honorable" as a strict Codex Chapter. That we enforce the Emperors will with a fervor and zeal that equals or exceeds that of any other chapter and that such a "divergent" chapter is one of the most respected and feared and able chapters of the Imperium is very cool to me.

 

Either way, It's a game, a past-time, and a hobby, the great thing about my Blood Angels is they are whatever I want them to be, Just as Mort's Blood Angels are whatever he wants them to be. Just as long as we're not what James Swallow made us look like :P

 

EDIT:For me, I think that one of the best things about the Blood Angels non-Codex aspects is that our divergence was caused by the result of our Primarch knowing he was going to die, knowing what it would do to the chapter, and doing his duty anyway, quite possibly saving the whole of the Imperium. And that we, as Blood Angels continue to wreak our Vengeance upon those who seek to destroy what Sanguinius gave his life to ensure would prosper. It's the Honor aspect I enjoy most I think, a tale of unrelenting Honor in the face of doom.

 

SO, back to the Original Point of the thread....

SQUAD MARKINGS YAY! :)

 

Its funny that through all that I think I'm gonna stick with the BA codex was of squad markings and organization, as leafing through the "How to paint Space Marines" book it's the little chapter on Blood Angels that put it all together for me.

[Mattsama]

:) I sit corrected. Confused really.

[Brother-Chaplain Apock]

I'm not sure if it ever applied. If it ever did it was 3rd edition fluff not 2nd (both BA and SW scouts were codex in 2e), but I've not seen an explicit statement about them not being rookies, merely that they are exceptionally aggressive.

 

Ya I was totally and completely off on that one, I busted out the old Angels of Death codex and the 3ed edition one and they all basically said the same thing, that they are new recruits.

 

The 5th edition codex has a little snippit next to the scout section of the army list that says "All Blood Angels must prove themselves as Scouts before being inducted into one of the other Companies. Bound by their motto,“Be bloody, bold, and resolute,” Blood Angels Scouts are trained to work deep in enemy territory and use their superior combat skills to eliminate important objectives."

[Brother-Chaplain Apock]

:unsure: I sit corrected. Confused really.

 

:P Sorry Mattsama, wasn't trying to correct you! I was trying to explain my perception of why I had thought the Blood Angels might have their Assault Squads as the first two of the company.

 

Also, I guess I launched into a whole "How I see the Chapter" ramble. I get carried away sometimes.:woot:

Sorry if I came off as a Tool. :pinch:

[Mattsama]

No no, no worries. I actually enjoy reading other people's perception of the chapters and fluff on the whole (as long as it's not some blasphemous twisting of idealogy down to the very core of what is known...).

 

Really my "issue" was that when I read Assault Squads I inserted the idea of jump pack troops. When you take into account that very commonly do RAS chose to roll in Rhinos, your explanation is quite good actually.

[Brother-Chaplain Apock]

No no, no worries. I actually enjoy reading other people's perception of the chapters and fluff on the whole (as long as it's not some blasphemous twisting of idealogy down to the very core of what is known...).

cough::James::Swallow::cough:::Omnibus:::cough::::

 

Really my "issue" was that when I read Assault Squads I inserted the idea of jump pack troops.

I think that's a common thought process in the wake of the last year or so, what with 4th ed. being what it was. I've done it myself on a number of occasions! :devil:

[Nardo]

Hey guys, I was just looking at htis thread and I had my codex next to me, so I thought I would point this out. In the pdf codex for 5th there is a picture of a tac member in the army list. His knee pad is black with a white skull indicating 1st squad. So, I would assume that the answer is (1-6 tac)(7-8 Assult)(9-10 Dev)

[Isryion]

Didn't someone mention that there is information on 2nd Company's organization in Armageddon? I don't have the book, but there would be your answer. However, from what I've read, it's pretty much as Mort said, and the extra close combat troops coming from the reserve or that our vets are simply more likely to fight that way (no Stern). Not to mention that the death company is all close combat:P Though I don't think that is what they are referring to! Of course, this discussion could be made moot in April.

[igor]

Much of our believed breaches in Codex are a result of, well Sanguinius dieing really. I usually tell my Smurf buddy at least we don't keep our Primarch in a bubble in the basement. Boosh!

I like the way you think! ;)

[Losfer Werds]

I think the Assault heavy reputation has been created by us, players of blood angels, because that is where they excel the most; in the thick of the fighting. The Chapter tries to adhere to the Codex as much as possible, with a few detours here and there.

That being said, the 5th C:BA pointed out that among the First Company there are far more Vanguard than Sternguard veterans. Demonstrating a predilection for the assault position that we all so love.

[Brother Nathan]

dosent the codex say we have the company structure the same as the codex lays out. assault squa entry somewhere in the codex says about us not having anymore assault marines than other chapters, but that they are always in the thick of the fighting and that members of other squads are always voulentering to fill losses in the assault squads. so the ssault squads rarely have spaces. that dosent mean they have anymore prsedence over the other squads but that they are always in the thick of the fighting.

[Ruthven]

dosent the codex say we have the company structure the same as the codex lays out. assault squa entry somewhere in the codex says about us not having anymore assault marines than other chapters, but that they are always in the thick of the fighting and that members of other squads are always voulentering to fill losses in the assault squads. so the ssault squads rarely have spaces. that dosent mean they have anymore prsedence over the other squads but that they are always in the thick of the fighting.

 

The entry for the assault squads inspired me to make a compromise with my army. The 5th and 6th Companies I am modeling up as my "on foot" Assault squads, while the 7th and 8th squads remain jump troops. I will eventually make up Tactical versions of the 5th and 6th squads as well, however, for the time being they are going to be my way of representing the Blood Angel's heightened desire to be right up in the thick of the combat. Its a long term project indeed, but that is half the fun of the hobby, is it not?

[Hrvat]

"unconventional and deviant gene-replication practices"

 

Well this is true. No other Space Marine bloodline makes their marines in just a year in a Sarcophagus. :)

[Brother Chris]

I'm sure the kneepads for the last 4 squads are the wrong way round. They obviously intended the devastators to have thunderbolts and the assault squad to have wings. In fluff this mistake was probably made 10,000 years ago and now enshrined in BA lore.

[Vodunius]

In fluff this mistake was probably made 10,000 years ago and now enshrined in BA lore.

 

Specifically it was made back in Codex: Angels of Death, where they also named the vermilion coloured successor the Angels Encarmine and the carmine coloured successor the Angels Vermilion, got the Blood Angels Lexicanium and Codicier marines/banners mixed up as well as the Dark Angels company markings..

 

edit: d'oh I said that last year

[Quixus]

My take on this is the following:

- Squads 1-6 are Tacs

- Tacs can swap their Boltguns for Chainswords

- Tacs can take Rhinos or Razorbacks

There you go 6 assault oriented squads per company besides the RAS.Argh confused BA with SW again.

 

The question that remains is how much micromanagment actually is included in Guiliman's book. Can assault Tacs get one special weapon and two if full strength or do they only get the options from the rulebook for Tacs. I doubt Guilliman would have written such a restricting manual and that it would not have been revised over the last ten millennia.

[Quixus]

Double Post, please delete.