the jeske Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 you do understand that the khorn "steed" is not cavalery and it moves on foot like a normal footslogger and cant ride in LR on top of that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cargaden Posted September 23, 2009 Share Posted September 23, 2009 Oh, yes, I know. However, I find myself tempted to try this at least once, see about getting him up behind rhinos and see how close I can get to the max of 18 S5 I5 PW attacks. I'll get slaughtered, but I still wanna see it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moress Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 I don't want to derail the thread, but I had this question lurking in my mind for a while. I play IW's, and I was thinking about running my Warsmith as a counts as sorcerer with WT and MoS. I use to play him as a standard lord at first with a undivided DW, then I got tired of rolling 1's and then dieing to a PF, so I started running him counts as with twin lightning claws and MoK, but then I did the numbers on a Sorcer with WT and he's even better then the lightning claw sorc, and 5 points cheaper with just WT. Each set up I've used comes in at the same amount of points, 130, and they have the same exact stats except the lord is fearless and has +1 WS, but with Warp time, your hitting almost always, and against an IC with WS like the loyalist commander, he's gonna hit you 66% of the time, but you gonna hit him back 75% of the time! Assume the following scenario for each against MEQs on the charge CL with undivded DW that rolls a '4' (Slightly above average and ignoring '1s' which is pretty generous imo....) 8*2/3*2/3=3.56 Dead MEQs A lord with MoK and 2xLightning Claws 6*2/3*3/4=3 Dead MEQs Sorc with WT and MoS 5*8/9*3/4=3.33 Dead MEQs Mind you that the sorc also has MoS for the same points costs, so he will go before most enemy IC's, but what really makes this awsome is, I normally run my lord with a retinue of Berzerkers, so since he goes BEFORE the bererkers his PW attacks won't be wasted by stacking multiple PW attacks on the same model (When comined with the 30something attacks the berzerkers get on the charge and the new wound allocation rules). Even better, if you are in CC with a IC, you still get to go first, and you can choose not to use WT and try to force weapon him BEFORE he starts to maul your untis, which is sick if your sorc is in a unit that are I4 meaning they will all still get to attack since their I5 IC is now dead! The last awsome part of taking a sorc is I run him in a squad of berzerkers, so since they are fearless, they confer that special rule to the sorc, which means he's better in absolutely EVERY possible way I can think of TBH with you.... As for fluff justifications, he doesn't have to be a "sorcerer." I use my warsmith using the sorcerers rules, but if you read Storm of Iron, even the Warsmith had Psycic powers, and I like to call the Force Weapon a Daemon Weapon since it enhances his attacks, or he can focus the daemons will to deliver one concentrated blow that will knock the enemy out in a single swing, yet each time you access the daemons powers, it risks hurting you just like a normal DW, but even if it hurts you, you don't sit around like a dumb *** and get roflpwned by joe somebody weilding a powerfist.... So I guess what I'm getting at with my super long post is.... Is the Chaos Lord even worth taking? Statistically he absolutely suck compared to the other two options in the book, which is sad since a Chaos Lord is suppose to be a BAMF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cale Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 There's a 20 point piece of wargear that gives the Lord +1 Ws, +2 Strength, +1T, +1W, and +1A along with Eternal Warrior, and it makes him a Monstrous Creature and a Psycher to boot. It somewhat limits his other wargear options, but it's the best deal for 20 points you're likely to find anywhere. I call it "playing a Daemon Prince instead." :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 I think op said he didn't want a prince and was asking for the best gear to take with a Lord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cale Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 He was looking for suggestions for Wargear on a Lord, which is why I phrased it the way I did. He never said he didn't want a Daemon Prince, specifically. My point was to show that the upgrade from a Lord to a DP is better than any piece of wargear you can buy for the Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 He was looking for suggestions for Wargear on a Lord, which is why I phrased it the way I did. He never said he didn't want a Daemon Prince, specifically. My point was to show that the upgrade from a Lord to a DP is better than any piece of wargear you can buy for the Lord. He doesn't want a DP, he was specifically looking for Lord gears so he can run it for a video he's making. Also, point wise yes, tactically though you can just murder DP's like everything else. Don't start the DP>Lord/Sorc argument here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drudge Dreadnought Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 So I guess what I'm getting at with my super long post is.... Is the Chaos Lord even worth taking? Statistically he absolutely suck compared to the other two options in the book, which is sad since a Chaos Lord is suppose to be a BAMF Only if its a nurgle lord with a daemon weapon, otherwise the other two options win. With the warptime sorc you may also want to consider using a plasma pistol if you tend to shoot at all before you assault. Plasma pistols are normally overpriced pieces of crap, but with warptime its pretty much a guarunteed kill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnus Thane Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 Lord + Termie Armor + 2x Lightning Claws + Mark of Khorn. (sometimes personal Icon) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeller Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 Lord -terminator armor -tl-bolter -deamon weapon (lightning claw) -personal icon (the daemon weapon itself serves as his icon) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Possessed Marine Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Mark of Khorne, termie armor, combi-melta & chainfist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
40kChrista Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 I run 2 Lords in my list... Lord 1-TDA, DW, Combi-Plas Lord 2-Wings, PW, Personal Icon, Meltabombs Grim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 He was looking for suggestions for Wargear on a Lord, which is why I phrased it the way I did. He never said he didn't want a Daemon Prince, specifically. My point was to show that the upgrade from a Lord to a DP is better than any piece of wargear you can buy for the Lord. But it makes him a MC and allows anything that can see him to shoot him. I started this ed. of the dex using always a DP. After a few games of him kicking arse, the players in my group just started targeting it w/ hvy weops and plaz from the second it got on the board. After 3 or 4 games where my DP never saw CC (even w/ me using terrain and rinos to protect him the best I could), I started using a chaos lord, that can be transported or hidden and have been happy with him since. Now it's true that whatever hvy weops & plaz were shooting my DP were not stooting my other stuff, but it jsut didn't sit well with me that the leader of my army was reduced to bullet catcher and never saw CC much less survived the game, my chaos lord often leaves the game with a high body count and not haven taken a single wound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 and has +1 WS, but with Warp time, your hitting almost always, which means he's better in absolutely EVERY possible way So I guess what I'm getting at with my super long post is.... Is the Chaos Lord even worth taking? Statistically he absolutely suck compared to the other two options in the book, WT is a psy pwr and can be shut down. How many times have you tried your WT sorc against s/m w/ psy hood, or eldar, and now new SW's w/ rune weop ? You have to pass a PoW test (which you did mention, but you dodn't seem to be actually including it in your "statistics". IF you pass the PoW test, the above mentioned armies then have @ a 50% chance of shutting down WT, then you have a WS.5 guy w/ 4, str.4 PW attacks as opposed to a WS.6 guy w/ 3+d.6, str.5 PW attacks ! You seem to have neglected these facts altogether in your reasoning why chaos lords "suck". There are plenty of armies out there with anti psy stuff (ever played against BT's with your WT sorc ?), and most likely another on the way (DE). AS for you proving that "statistically he absolutely suck", you own mathhammer shows the undivided lord w/ D. weop adverages more MEQ kills then your WT sorc, did you forget that by the time you got to the end of your post ? Where/when did you prove "statistically" that he sucks ? And, like I said, that's with you failing to take in to account that several armies can shut down WT @ 1/2 the time (ignor that a D. weop can roll a 1 is equal to ignoring PoW test, so that's pretty much a wash). AT best a WT sorc is @ as good as a undivided lord D. weop (unless your fighting an army w/ anti-psy stuff then he falls far behind), please support you claim that the WT sorc is "better in absolutely EVERY possible way". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Nice one chillen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atheist Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 A cheap Daemon Prince that can be hidden in cover is a great asset for any army , simply because is an excellent contesting unit among other things . Should you be able to contest an captured objective in cover without charging do so if you can enter the cover by moving or running . The DP has no grenades . Most of the time I prefer the chaos lord HQ , mainly for fluff purposes . I find him generally underperforming for his points ( compared to a DP ) but he can be a solid unit if you stick him in a troop , and pick their battles wisely , to annihilate the enemy troop and avoid the powerfists . This is his main problem , he can no longer be immune to instant death and has no significant shooting potential ( with most builds ). This , I believe , is the reason more people like the Eternal Warrior winged fire magnet . Especially since they can field two of these guys , which is a " no-no " in my book ( " ..of fluffy armies ") . I don't care much about the sorcerer , any fool can mess with your psychics these days . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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