The bandwagon

[Wolf Lord Fenrir]

Not fussed about bandwagon jumpers to be honest. The more the army sells, the more likely we are to see improved minis in the future. New people is always interesting, as some of them will be good sorts and have an interesting take on thier armies. Stagnation = Death. So new players for an army is important

 

The worst thing that can happen, is that the tournament hardcore pick up on the book and spam it at the tournaments - tainting the long term players by association. Think DoC in fantasy - those of us who have used the army for years (even through the fallow period of having terrible rules in 6th ed, pre storm of chaos lists) get all sorts of abuse thrown our way, due to this very thing happening.

 

On the 13th company issue - I did say, quite a long time ago, that they wouldn't be in the new book.

 

And about the DA players using the Wolf codex - let 'em. I seem to remember some smugness radiating from those parts when thier codex was updated and ours was off the shelves. If they are not prepared to stand by their army, and (to use a terrible term) "keep the flame burning" as we did when using the pamphlet book - then they obviously are going to flake onto what ever the next alternative is. Try not to rub salt into their wounds, eh? Submitting to the Wolves and borrowing our codex is probably humiliation enough!

 

For those DA players who will stick with the current DA book - well done Gents, I doff my hat in your collective direction.

 

Oh, and how are Deathwing intending on teleporting in, if using the Wolves book?

[Thorgrim Blackwolf]

Ok, having had a PM conversation with Ominous I think a few lines have got crossed around here.

 

We have no problem, and have never had a problem, with new players joining the ranks of the Fang.

 

The crux of the "issue" which has been raised is of bangwagoneers - those who shift schizophrenically from one list to another in an effort to find the most powerful combination of the day and then use that exclusively. There is a bit of bitterness in the Fang that, having weathered 2 C:SM and 2 C:CSM updates before us that the primary topic of conversation on the internet is how our new ruleset might be used to benefit Salamanders, or Dark Angels, or World Eaters.

 

Either that, or "golly Borkemn SW :lol: was GW thinking OMG CHEEESEE!!!!" (I have no response to the accusation of beard. You have us there.) As far as I can tell, almost nothing has changed in the core units. So why now? Well, because we are new, and because the thought exists that we will somehow be "better" than the others. I don't think we will be.

 

Thats what this thread is about - perhaps it is unneccesarily bitter - but given the way C:CSM and the Orks have been used by the internet, can you blame us for being a little cynical and a little bitter? All we want to do is enjoy our new Codex and models - not put up with powergaming spam sandwiches.

 

Vassakov has summed up my feelings on this subject and what I have been trying to say in four posts in one. Cheers Vassakov, and have an ale!

 

Cheers

 

Thorgrim

[Decoy]

Submitting to the Wolves and borrowing our codex is probably humiliation enough!

 

For those DA players who will stick with the current DA book - well done Gents, I doff my hat in your collective direction.

 

Submitted for truth and agreement, respectively.

[Night Runner]

And about the DA players using the Wolf codex - let 'em. I seem to remember some smugness radiating from those parts when thier codex was updated and ours was off the shelves. If they are not prepared to stand by their army, and (to use a terrible term) "keep the flame burning" as we did when using the pamphlet book - then they obviously are going to flake onto what ever the next alternative is. Try not to rub salt into their wounds, eh? Submitting to the Wolves and borrowing our codex is probably humiliation enough!

 

For those DA players who will stick with the current DA book - well done Gents, I doff my hat in your collective direction.

 

Oh, and how are Deathwing intending on teleporting in, if using the Wolves book?

 

Well said, if you are really into an army, fluff and everything, you wouldn't dream of playing your greatest rivals army. Having said that I don't want the Deathwing and Ravenwing to be second to no one. I want my rivals to have an army as good as mine, otherwise what's the point in being rivals? They do need an overhaul, because let's face it, the way things are at the moment, our 'termie army' (for whoever wants to play SW like that, certainly not my style) is more convenient. I'm not making excuses for them, just stating facts.

 

So if a DA army asked me to play a game using the SW codex to field his Deathwing army I wouldn't mind, I wouldn't agree on fluff-principle, but I'd still play against the Dweed Angel.

[Wolf Lord Fenrir]

It wouldn't bother me in the slightest if someone pulled out the Wolf book for a different army. Bit of good natured ribbing at the "whatever army" player, but they spent the money.

 

Hardcore DA players will hunker down, get on with the book they have and find that something similar happens as happened around here - the players left with the army are all of a type, and will put something extra into the community. Wish they'd stop spamming the forums with complaints though.

[Night Runner]

You hit the nail on the head - with a thunderhammer - Wolf Lord Fenrir. I agree 100%.

[Nakuth]

I will admit that I am seriously considering 'jumping on the wagon' so to speak. Even if I don't, I will still get the new 'dex; I like to keep a collection as much for reading the fluff as for starting an army.

 

I have found it somewhat difficult to settle on an SM army. Flirting with the DIY stuff, to some GW chapters; I'm still yet to really get going. In the meantime, I have started up smallish (approx. 750 points) sized IG (yay!) & 'Nids (booooo!) armies. With me, it's not at all about the powerful combos. Whilst I will plead guilty to going "PHOAWR!" at some uber-units, I ultimately find myself going for units that are good, possibly fluffy, but more just fun to play. After countless late night discussions with a former work colleague and fellow 40k enthusiast, we both agreed that whilst a strong army is good, we both prefer 'fluffy' armies. I like to use the term 'cinematic'

 

With my 'Nids, I've gone for a full-blown invasion type force, lots of little critters, a couple of big guys, and some middle-sized bugs. All up, it has proved effective, not brilliant, but fun. The image of two or three big bugs stalking the battlefield whilst the little guys scurry at their feet appeals to me. It is very image drive.

 

So it is with the Wolves.

 

I've always felt that the Wolves are perhaps the elite of the elite when it comes to SMs. Virtually grizzled veterans upon induction. To me, I'm really starting to like the idea of one or two Lone Wolves (perhaps with some wolf pets) stalking the field; several venerable, irascible old Wolf Guard scattered throughout the company's squads. "Teaching the pups a lesson", as it were. All of this lead by an ancient Wolf Lord, who is no less aggressive for than he is long in the tooth. Indeed, the small information available about Bearclaw's (did I get it right? Forgive me if not) Great Company deciding to stay out on the Eastern Fringe after fighting the 'Nids. The fluff lover in me just knows this is going to be a small, but highly efficient, and battle-hardened force.

 

It is that which is calling out to me with the imminent release of the new 'dex.

[Darkangeldentist]

The size of the bandwagon is very much dependent on how potent or 'cool' the new codex turns out to be.

 

I hope the number of wolf players does pick up, it's good to fight different armies. I'm not going to touch them with a barge pole (although I will likely buy the codex) except to give them a good poke. I haven't seen a Space wolf player locally for...actually the last one was our shops previous manager and he never got them out! So bring on the band wagon. (It'll give me more to grumble about! :D )

 

Judging from the amount of discussion that's been going on I imagine there will be a number of power gamers pick it up for a bit. The way rune priests counter enemy psykers may well make them a favourite to counter Eldar and Chaos lash. (At least if what I know of them is accurate.)

 

Incidentally my Dark angels will be sticking with their codex. I don't care if it's not as good, it's mine!

[Hfran Morkai]

The size of the bandwagon is very much dependent on how potent or 'cool' the new codex turns out to be.

 

I hope the number of wolf players does pick up, it's good to fight different armies. I'm not going to touch them with a barge pole (although I will likely buy the codex) except to give them a good poke. I haven't seen a Space wolf player locally for...actually the last one was our shops previous manager and he never got them out! So bring on the band wagon. (It'll give me more to grumble about! :D )

 

Judging from the amount of discussion that's been going on I imagine there will be a number of power gamers pick it up for a bit. The way rune priests counter enemy psykers may well make them a favourite to counter Eldar and Chaos lash. (At least if what I know of them is accurate.)

 

Incidentally my Dark angels will be sticking with their codex. I don't care if it's not as good, it's mine!

 

Good man! Do you drink ale by any chance? Because I hear most other chapters aren't partial to it but I say you deserve one for sticking by your guns.

[Wolf Guard Nostromo]

It wouldn't bother me in the slightest if someone pulled out the Wolf book for a different army. Bit of good natured ribbing at the "whatever army" player, but they spent the money.

 

Hardcore DA players will hunker down, get on with the book they have and find that something similar happens as happened around here - the players left with the army are all of a type, and will put something extra into the community. Wish they'd stop spamming the forums with complaints though.

Bam! I couldn't agree more. Your earlier comments about bandwagon jumpers is also very apt...

[The emperors chosen]

While I,m no grey hunter,I welcome all bandwagoners who stay with the wolves,because they are the future of the hobby. I also have a slight bandwagon problem, I am always switching between SM, BA and SW,this results in me switching codexes(and having many unpainted models), but with the new codex out,I will probably go straight wolf(and probably make a diy chapter for SM and BA...) anyway , welcome blood claws, I wish you luck

[Argon]

It won't be fun to tell my opponents that they have to use either codex: DA or codex: SM for their Dark Angels Green marines or the BA WD insert or codex: SM for their red marines. We'll see how many people try it.

How dare people try and paint their tiny toy soldiers however they want. I can't believe someone would stray from the awesome and euphoric paint schemes set forth by the almighty GW.

 

Indeed. Some are so awesome and euphoric they aren't used by many people or in some cases at all :( . I have yet to see a Claws of Lorek or a Death Knights army.

 

I really see no problem with people getting on the bandwagon. You're getting a shiny new 'dex, people are going to get it and build their own army of Wolves. Personally, I have a certain respect for the Wolves and considered (for a little while) going with them instead of Chaos. Obviously, I chose Chaos instead. Death to the False Emperor!

 

The only thing I can say is that I hope the Fang isn't invaded by power gamers and turn into what Chaos Ascendant has mostly become: A place where you cannot post a fluffy list made for a fun game with friends without having people call it inferior because you dared to include a unit that isn't all that great and is a waste of points.

[AdeptusDavidus]

For a number of years, I was vaguely aware of this "Warhammer 40,000" thing. I'd heard there were some guys in wacky armour called "space marines" in this "40k" thing. I was generally too busy or broke to take much note of it.

 

A few months ago, though, I finally jumped in, sort of. I thought Space Marines looked neat, so I bought an assault squad to tinker with - I built scale plastic models for years, and loved it, and thought Space Marines might be fun to build and convert - and before I knew it I had roughly a hundred tiny plastic and metal men awaiting the careful attentions of my knife and brush.

 

All the while, I cooked up my own fluff for my DIY Chapter, which went through a few variations on paint scheme and name before reaching its current state. Over the course of dreaming up my own little corner of the Imperium, I became quite settled in how I viewed my Chapter. The Blackfeather Raiders are a sometimes-irreverent, always-irregular asymmetric warfare force, their character shaped by their damaged gene-seed.

 

Now that I'm finally looking into actually organizing my toy soldiers into an army, and actually playing the game, I've been looking for a Codex that fits. I'm not concerned with building a powerful army - I wouldn't know one if it smacked me in the face - just with building one to suit the character of my DIY. I looked at C:SM, and if I was willing to compromise on having a ruleset that seems to meet the feel I set out to have. I looked at the Chaos Codex, too, and Blood Angels, and they just don't really do it.

 

So now I'm looking at Space Wolves. If that makes me a bandwagoneer or a Blood Claw or whatever, well, I'm guilty as charged.

 

All that said, the new models for the Wolves look really cool, and I don't find the fluff for the Wolves objectionable. I may yet build a Wolves force. B)

[Warhorse47]

Davidus, you are not in the "wagon" category. Those are the ones who just go with whatever is the new shiny or trying to just play a power game. They sre here because of whichever new codex is out right then. Those like yourself who are looking for the fluff, the history or the character of an army are welcomed [or should be] into whichever army they decide upon. Welcome to the Fang.

[Grey Mage]

For a number of years, I was vaguely aware of this "Warhammer 40,000" thing. I'd heard there were some guys in wacky armour called "space marines" in this "40k" thing. I was generally too busy or broke to take much note of it.

 

A few months ago, though, I finally jumped in, sort of. I thought Space Marines looked neat, so I bought an assault squad to tinker with - I built scale plastic models for years, and loved it, and thought Space Marines might be fun to build and convert - and before I knew it I had roughly a hundred tiny plastic and metal men awaiting the careful attentions of my knife and brush.

 

All the while, I cooked up my own fluff for my DIY Chapter, which went through a few variations on paint scheme and name before reaching its current state. Over the course of dreaming up my own little corner of the Imperium, I became quite settled in how I viewed my Chapter. The Blackfeather Raiders are a sometimes-irreverent, always-irregular asymmetric warfare force, their character shaped by their damaged gene-seed.

 

Now that I'm finally looking into actually organizing my toy soldiers into an army, and actually playing the game, I've been looking for a Codex that fits. I'm not concerned with building a powerful army - I wouldn't know one if it smacked me in the face - just with building one to suit the character of my DIY. I looked at C:SM, and if I was willing to compromise on having a ruleset that seems to meet the feel I set out to have. I looked at the Chaos Codex, too, and Blood Angels, and they just don't really do it.

 

So now I'm looking at Space Wolves. If that makes me a bandwagoneer or a Blood Claw or whatever, well, I'm guilty as charged.

 

All that said, the new models for the Wolves look really cool, and I don't find the fluff for the Wolves objectionable. I may yet build a Wolves force. :lol:

Sounds like a wonderfully fluffy Ravengaurd successor. Good stuff. Ooo or maybe a Whitescars successor if you want to be a bit more "tribal".

[AdeptusDavidus]

They're an RG successor, with geneseed damaged by Corax's meddling. I haven't posted a lot about them yet, since I'm waiting until I can put together a little IA-type bit on them, though I did start another thread in the SW subforum (here) about whether or not they'd get on well with the Wolves.

[Bran Scalphunter]

*sits in the corner of the feasting hall, stockpiling food and ale behind a razor-wire/assault cannon defense line*

 

Won't get me ale! *loads AP rounds into assault cannons*

 

 

Personally, I don't have a problem with people who actually enjoy the Wolves joining up and playing, it's the powergaming gitz, the annoying horde of snotlings and squigs (scratch that, that's demeaning to squigs) who think they know every thing, and the mooks that will swoop in and ruin the nearby gaming area for serious players. I'm almost a 10-year vet of Space Wolves (be a decade this Wolfmass) and I get a little hot under the collar when I think of what's going to happen. I'll go down to the FLGS with my Wolves and run into another 5 or 10 Wolf armies, each played by powergamers or people with ADOS* disorder. Then no one will be willing to play against my Wolves, since everyone's gonna assume that I'm just another guy using the new book to have the best army for the time. If I pay with my hard-earned money, I want to be actually able to enjoy my Marines dammit!

 

Sure the Blood Claws will show up, but I'm prepared. The Exterminatussock is in good condition, I'm borrowing the Ragnaroksock from DB, and I've trained the Thunderwolves to sniff out anyone trying to sneak into my lair. Just don't touch the ES and don't poke the Scalphunter and you'll be fine.

 

Don't expect any sympathy from me if you're playing a completely different army using the SW dex, ie the Wolfwing DA, Khorne Berzerker Wolves. You've all gotten at least 1 book before us, 2 for a lot of Marine *glares at C:SM & C:CSM*, you don't need another one, ya mangy zoggz.

 

 

ADOS* = Attention Deficit oooh shiny!

[Night Runner]

All the while, I cooked up my own fluff for my DIY Chapter, which went through a few variations on paint scheme and name before reaching its current state. Over the course of dreaming up my own little corner of the Imperium, I became quite settled in how I viewed my Chapter. The Blackfeather Raiders are a sometimes-irreverent, always-irregular asymmetric warfare force, their character shaped by their damaged gene-seed.

 

Now that I'm finally looking into actually organizing my toy soldiers into an army, and actually playing the game, I've been looking for a Codex that fits. I'm not concerned with building a powerful army - I wouldn't know one if it smacked me in the face - just with building one to suit the character of my DIY. I looked at C:SM, and if I was willing to compromise on having a ruleset that seems to meet the feel I set out to have. I looked at the Chaos Codex, too, and Blood Angels, and they just don't really do it.

 

So now I'm looking at Space Wolves. If that makes me a bandwagoneer or a Blood Claw or whatever, well, I'm guilty as charged.

 

That does not make you a bandwagoneer, it makes you a creative and valid addition to the hobby. Just don't get carried away and become a power player. Then you'll make us wolves look bad and I'll have to treat you like a Thousand Son :angry: .

[Lord Howland Greywolf]

Remember, it is a hobby, and not everyone rolled out the womb yelling praises to Russ and holding a stein in their hand.

I was borne just before breakfast was served and have a wolf as my inner animal, does that count?

 

Anyway, I have been on this forum for a little over a year and I would call everybody here a freind. If I were to meet any of you in a pub I'd buy a round for you all. And then since we are all lords of mighty great companies (Read: All callosal Nerds) we would talk of our sagas long into the night till the last drop of ale is drunk.

 

And that is what seperates new bloodclaws from the power gamers. They have a bit of wolf in our hearts, ale in their vains and they'll roleplay more than anyone else on this forum.

[Greyhunter77]

Though I've only just joined B&C I've been a Wolf since 2nd Edition so I'm not sure if that makes me a Grey Hunter or Long Fang :D . I joined because of the fluff and have stayed loyal because of it. Bandwags will always be around when a new dex comes out. If some stick around great I'll welcome them to the Fang with an ale. Those that leave well they probably aren't that great a loss as they won't add anything to the great community I've found here.

 

Each of us has a Saga of our army. Mine have stood with me through thick and thin (last battle was taking on 3 corrupted titans with allied chapters) I've always worked with the rules we've got. Its been frustrating watching others get updates (especially the SMurfs) when we've been left longing, but as a Wolf you make the best of it. A true Wolf doesn't waste time whinging that the SMurfs have got better rules we just smash any that get in our way.

 

However I can fully understand why older Wolves like Decoy get so frustrated with Blood Claws who just want the best rules or the shiniest models. They are the kind of people just don't get what the Wolves are actually about. I for one would appreciate a few more local SW players as my local model shop stopped stocking our stuff (They are getting the new stuff in though)

 

I guess only time will tell which of the new Blood Claws will make the grade as true Wolves and earn the respect of those who reside in these hallowed halls.

[Karack Blackstone]

My two cents is that we will have quite a few facing the trials of our Brotherhood and some will not be so well off...

 

That being said, new blood is rare to have around my store, I'm the only Wolf who plays there it seems. Other than two people that have expressed interest, no one seems to want to play them since there seems to be some overpowered-ness to our new Codex.

 

After reading it, I have to say it's pretty hard on the points to value system.

 

Back on Topic, my instinct is that the two people I have spoken to are both slight power gamers, but may become interested in us if they can take in the fluff and see that's where the substance of our Chapter is.

 

I may steer them here, and then we can get a better measure of their senses as Sons of Russ. Keep the Wolf Priests ready, it's going to be interesting.

[Vash113]

*sits in the corner of the feasting hall, stockpiling food and ale behind a razor-wire/assault cannon defense line*

 

Won't get me ale! *loads AP rounds into assault cannons*

 

So that's where those assault cannon's got too.

 

You know you'd probably be better off with tenis ball throwing machines. :D

[Bran Scalphunter]

*sits in the corner of the feasting hall, stockpiling food and ale behind a razor-wire/assault cannon defense line*

 

Won't get me ale! *loads AP rounds into assault cannons*

 

So that's where those assault cannon's got too.

 

You know you'd probably be better off with tenis ball throwing machines. :pirate:

 

Yeah but I need something to keep the Thunderwolves entertained. Russ help me if they get bored... :whistling:

[Vash113]

Yeah but I need something to keep the Thunderwolves entertained. Russ help me if they get bored... :pirate:

 

Ah true, well just remember to clean the young Claws blood off of the cannons before you return them to the armory in a few months, the Iron Priests are crotchety enough. :whistling: