Natanael Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Alright. I've been thinking about how I'm going to make my army effective with what I got, without adding to much stuff. I am aiming for a 1750-point army, because that is what we run at our tornaments in our local club. Anyway, on to the list: This is what I got (models): Logan Grimnar Wolf Lord/WGBL (SS, FB) Dreadnought w/ Plasma cannon, CCW (can have missile launcher or AC) 6 Scouts (2x PP, 2x PW, 1x Melta) 5 Terminators (4x Combi-Plasma & PW, 1x AC & PF) 3x7+1 GHs (Squad 1 - Plasma gun & PW, WG - TH & Combi-Melta) (Squad 3 - Plasma/melta /not glued yet) gun & PW, WG - TH & Combi-Melta) (Squad 3 - Plasma/melta(not glued yet) gun & PF, WG - FB/PW (take your pick) & Combi-Melta) Land Speeder Typhoon - 90 points This is not a compleate army list, but it is what I have, and it needs transportation. What do you guys suggest that I take? Rhinos? Pod? Land Raiders? I was thinking of either going with 1 pod, and three rhinos, or 5 pods (GHs, Terminators & Dread). But what do you think? What do I need to add to make a 1750 force that is effective and cheap (money)? :devil: Any suggestions would be great. And if a mod feels this have to be moved to the Army List Section, please do so, even if I'm not looking for a compleate army list, just suggestions about what may work best for the models I already have. Thx. - Natanael Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forseti Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 1 Pod is kindof bad since it must come down 1st turn and if you put them far back, they're going to be all by themselves and will be an east 1st target. It's kinda hard for me to say which would be best >.> as I think it depends on the rest of your list, 2-3 rhinos will get shot down fast if they're the only tanks on table. So if you're not going to mechanize a lot of your list I'd probably go for pods. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2113668 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vassakov Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 I have run a list with 3 Grey Hunter Packs in Razorbacks (6 men in each.) Come the new Codex, I'm rounding up to 3 10 man squads, 2 in Rhinos and one in a Pod. The plan would be to let them go first, and deploy the Rhinos in cover aggressively. That way, on an average board their front troops should be with 18" of the Rhinos and I can deploy and Rapid Fire using the Rhinos. The pair of Meltaguns in the Pod can be used to tank hunt and then hopefully survive retribution. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2113694 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nadir Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 I would take Rhinos for GH, Drop Pod for termis+lord, and foot slogging dread. In that way, you shoot from your dread at turn 1, rush your rhinos, and when they are near opponent lines your termites and scouts should arrive. That will give lots of threatfull targets to the opposing forces. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2113698 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decoy Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Along this vein, and as I've not really used transports in... quite a long time.... Is it possible to run a Saturation-Tank list? Six Rhinos, three Razorbacks, a Land Raider or two, and have any of the above survive? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2113700 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnars Claw Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Yes. Rhinos are incredibly tough in 5th, much more so than 4th. Same goes for all vehicles really. I don't understand why people think rhinos will get popped easy, my experience tells me they don't. In fact with the drop pod assault rule i wouldn't take pods if you paid me anymore. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2113796 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natanael Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 Thanks for your input, brothers. I was just thinking, what about getting 3 pods for my GHs, and a Land Raider Redeemer or Crusader for Terminators+Lord? That way I at least get 2 packs coming down turn 1, and an AV14 transport zooming 12" first turn, while Dread and LS take pot shots at enemy? I could put grimnar in the LRC/LRR, and have a nice killy unit of terminators. Or I could always just by a lot more marines, and start running! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2113946 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dublindawg Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 I have found a combination of drop pods and rhinos work well with a C:SM force. I generally place 2 dreads in pods along with a squad of sternguard. This allows me to drop a Dread and combi-melta heavy force behind enemy lines on the first turn. This then allows my tactical to move up in rhinos to take firing positions. The final drop pod comes in later to re-enforce any weak points. Without having seen the new codex yet (hopefully at lunch today) I am considering using a simular tactic of placing GW's, a Dread and a GH pack into drop pods and then have 2 additional packs of GH in rhinos supported by some fast claws. Finally I will be fielding at least 1 LF squad in a razorback for that long range punch and split targeting power they have. Now if the description of the drop pods in the new dex is the same as C:SM then they can carry 12 models, 1 dread or HFC. It doesn't matter if the 12 models are tactical marines or termies. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2113953 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nadir Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Now if the description of the drop pods in the new dex is the same as C:SM then they can carry 12 models, 1 dread or HFC. It doesn't matter if the 12 models are tactical marines or termies. It does matter. Termies are count as 2 regular marines. And our transport capacity for drop pods and rhinos is 10, not 12. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2113991 Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnlyInDeath Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Along this vein, and as I've not really used transports in... quite a long time.... Is it possible to run a Saturation-Tank list? Six Rhinos, three Razorbacks, a Land Raider or two, and have any of the above survive? As a long time mech player, I can tell you a "yes". The mobility and survivability of mech lists has caused them to be much, much more popular in 5th, and for good reason. You only take wounds on the unit inside if it's destroyed on a 6, pinning isnt automatic anymore, and you can even stay embarked on an immobilized transport (great for holding objectives). Now, with all of the "capture enemy objective" missions out there, the mobility of a mech army relaly comes in handy. burst forward 12" with your rhino, and then you have the option next turn to disembark without moving, so that your GH can charge if you want, or you can rush forward to take objectives. Just be sure to give yourself some nice heavy firepower to back up a list like this. Personally, my 1850 list comes with a WW, vindi and LRC. I am really curious to work out the points with the much cheaper rhinos and GH's to see just how much more bang I can fit into my lists. Especially now that RB's are truely vanilla marine prices. I cant wait! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114011 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeddon Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Not to mention that come October our Rhino's will be coming with a stormbolter already attached at no additional cost! By the way, anyone else notice that the new wolves come out right at Octoberfest...hmm Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114033 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natanael Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 Thing is that a mech army is what everyone runs. But I know it's good, and I have played my fair share of them. Maybe I'll go mech, with some pods at higher point levels. After all, you can get 6x10 GHs w/ Rhino/Pod for 1000p, and that is really nice. Gonna have to buy more regular marines then :rolleyes: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114064 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quillen Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Heck even in 3rd and 4th mech lists won. I have always ran a Mech list. Well, way back no, but now it's almost all I run. I do have an 8 Drop Pod list. Which is a blast in and of it's self. A pack of Blood Claws in a LRC with a heroe can't go wrong. I have used this for 2 years now. It can swamp the first thing it hits, and usually take out 2 to 3 times it's cost in enemy units. Now of course it's down to one fist in the pack, but you can chunk a WGBL in there and it's almost back to it's old self. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114077 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harald sternmark Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 gotta say i have always sworn on razorback/rhino combos... i know razorbacks get bad press but for the pointage now they really can be useful... i always use at least 4..2 with h,bolters and 2 with lascannons..grey hunters in each...then it was 2 rhinos chock full of blood claws.. probably not the cheap option your after though ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WG Vrox Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 gotta say i have always sworn on razorback/rhino combos... i know razorbacks get bad press but for the pointage now they really can be useful... i always use at least 4..2 with h,bolters and 2 with lascannons..grey hunters in each...then it was 2 rhinos chock full of blood claws.. probably not the cheap option your after though I would suggest something along the same lines. 1 DP 1or2 RB, 1 Rhino and one LR your choice on varient depending on tatcial play. The reason that RB will now be a main component of my army is we can have 5 GH and a WG ride together. I can now see a TW HF and TL AC as viable move 6" and fire vehicals. I love my 1 DP, the trick is to use it effectively and ensure you get support to it asap. Hit a flank or cause a distraction, use it to bait your enemy to spread out. The DP in itself can force the enemy to reroute squads around it or to block line of sight from a dev squad, on and on. The first turn DP is a huge tatical advantage that is well worth its cost and risk. Now that we can take two special weapons firing two melta from the hatch of a rhino is an effective combat tactic that chaos players have been using for some time now. And in all this don't forget our now cheap fast units that we can send down the table. A potential move of 24" is a beautiful thing. WG Vrox. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114192 Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedMoon Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 i have a buddy that actually runs 2 land raider crusaders full of blood claws and 2 pods full of grey hunters plus the charicters in 1850 and i want to say a dread or 2. then in 2000 he runs 2 preds with it. actually works really well for him. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114238 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhorse47 Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Something to keep in mind when planning your force is that pods and Rhinos are transports first, weapons second. Razors are transport with some fire support. Preds and Land Raiders for firepower and in the LR's case transport. Keep these things in mind when you are planning, that way you use the best tool for the job. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114325 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Along this vein, and as I've not really used transports in... quite a long time.... Is it possible to run a Saturation-Tank list? Six Rhinos, three Razorbacks, a Land Raider or two, and have any of the above survive? A good rule of thumb is for every model below AV 12 have one above AV 12. For instance in a "Mech" list Ill run 1 Landraider, 2 rhinos, 1 Whirlwind, 1 Predator/vindicator, 1 Dreadnaught and a Landspeeder at 1750pts. Dont let the ration go over 2/3 If you can help it.... though thats just a rule of thumb. Things with Higher AVs in SM armies tend to be scarier, and Landraiders and Vendreads can really soak some firepower.... often leaving your rhinos untouched until the late game. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114335 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natanael Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 My main concern with rhinos is that they are so fragile. I mean, ppl always talk about LRs and stuff like that soaking fire, but in 90% of my games, I go for their weak transports first. Sure, he has a land raider with a killy squad inside it, but it's much more worth it to take out the mobility of those 3 other squads, and make them walk, instead of MAYBE taking out the AV14 monster. A lot of my friends play the same way, focusing on transports as #1, and then heavy stuff (unless it's really necessary to take out that vindicator/LR or whatever). Thats why I am thinking of going pod heavy. Sure, I loose mobility when on the ground, but I'm already at the enemies doorstep. @ WG Vrox: Whats on your 1 DP? Cause I wonder if I'm gonna have termies or GHs or a dread, If i play that way. Maybe I should try some RBs... 75 points for a transport with moderate firepower and weak AV seems like a waste tough. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114437 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WG Vrox Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 WG Vrox: Whats on your 1 DP? Cause I wonder if I'm gonna have termies or GHs or a dread, If i play that way. Well it used to be a WL in TDA and WG in TDA both with SS and a full 8 man squad. now I am rethinking the idea to put in all WG with a Rune Priest in TDA, keep em cheap but effective. Like Grey Mage said, you don't want to take just Rhinos, make your enemy priortize his targets and make sure those targets are protected with cover saves, it's cover saves that rule the day in 5th for a mech force. As for tactics using a mech force, remember to keep those vehicals moving at all times as you should play as if you expect to get assulted on every turn. Once you get to mid board you play what I like to call jack in the box surprise. This is when my enemy can no longer ignore my melta and PP shots (in the new dex it will be 2 meltas) and attempts to destroys my transport, when he does out pop 10 space wolves, who usually get assulted and they counter assult and well it almost always ends poorly for the heritic. WG Vrox Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114468 Share on other sites More sharing options...
And a Barrel of Ale Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 i was thinking of running 3x rhino's stocked full of meltas and Nijal in 1 of them, with Pred Anihilator, WW and longfangs with Skyclaws & Wolfpriest as the assault vangaurd... would that be too easy to shutdown? (im kinda annoyed how storm caller dsoent affect Vehicles anymore) cause i thought the heavy fire of the Predator(combined with smart use of the AV facings rule to give my Pred a cover save), and longfangs, and the whirlwind to keep infantry based heavy weapons pinned(i get remarkable scatterdice luck) would do alright while the Rhino's cruised forward undersmoke (and with Nijals handy -1 to enemy BS) and all his other cool powers for him to get right up in there sitting inside his rhino just casting like mad and generally making a mess of the enemy plans. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114522 Share on other sites More sharing options...
wookie2533 Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 new codex i will probably be running with 3 DP's a vindi and a pred and probably another 2 rhinos Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114707 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WolfLordLars Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 Dont discount the 1st turn DP. I will regularly use a pack of GH's in a pod right in the middle of the enemy formation to give them something to pay attention to while I move up. Its all about who has control of the flow of the game. He can have the best set-up, but a DP full of GH's will tend to mess with that a bit. While he is reacting to me, I control the flow of the battle, and can direct him where I want him. An opponent that spends the whole game reacting to what your doing has a name... usually, they are called "the looser" Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114714 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natanael Posted September 17, 2009 Author Share Posted September 17, 2009 Yeah, alright. Right now I'm thinking of doing something like this: Dread in pod/on foot 9+1 GH in pod (WG for added combat power) 5+1 GH in RB 10 GH in Rhino 5 Terminators in LR Then I got the other stuff running around on foot (scouts, LS) Hopefully the LR will soak fire (but we'll see) and the Rhino/RB can make it forward to support the podding GHs. Gonna have to make an amry list with this setup I think. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2114920 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dublindawg Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 Remember, the number of drop pods that can drop first turn is 1/2 the total number of DP rounded up. So if you use 3 DP's then you get 2 on the first turn and the remaining one enter play as using re-enforcement rules. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178701-what-to-get-for-army-with-new-dex/#findComment-2115130 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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