Rhellion Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 I'm trying to think of the best strategy to attack a daemon army in Planetstrike. I'm wanting to counter attack his counter attack, but there is really no way to not guarantee that my entire army doesn't come in on turn 1 and gets deep struck onto by his daemons. I Just plan on only having 1 turn of shooting before being in close combat? Spread out and try to maximize the area covered, hoping for mishaps on his deep striking units? I do know that he won't be taking any Bastions, so he'll be using some sort of other objectives, possibly with or without automated guns. I also can't think of any useful stratagem to use. He'll have nothing on the board for me to effect, possibly not even bastions. I guess just Ground Observer or Planetary Convocation. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 I haven't played Planetstrike yet, but I have some thoughts with Daemon in general. 1) Focus on short range, multi shot weapons. Assault Cannons, Heavy Bolters, Flamers etc etc 2) Daemons tend to have problems dealing with armor, especially AV14. They almost have to rely on their MCs to crush it. This means that Rhinos, Razorbacks, Dreads and Land Raiders are all useful. 3) Daemons don't have any problem tearing up Marines or even Terminators with the exception of TH/SS ones, which are actually the best bet against their MCs and Bloodcrushers. The best way around this is being mechanized (see point 2) If it was me, I'd probably bring a mix of mechanized Marines with a few Drop Pods for support. Tacticals in TL Heavy Bolter Razorbacks with Heavy Bolters/Missile Launchers and Plasma/Flamer TH/SS Terminators in a Crusader/Redeemer IronClad or Assault Cannon/Heavy Flamer Dreads in Pods Maybe even some BP/CCW/Shotgun assault Scout squads, for counter-assaulting. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2114161 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhellion Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 Tacticals in TL Heavy Bolter Razorbacks with Heavy Bolters/Missile Launchers and Plasma/Flamer I like this, but then I have to figure out what to do with 2 5 man squads of marines... walk them on or deep strike them to be eaten alive by demons? I don't want to give up kill points in case the mission is a tie. Otherwise I have speeders with heavy flamers, and I think I will add more troops or maybe Sternguard to get the Razorbacks in there. His army will be all Nurgle, with one Bloodthirster, at 2500 points. He will have 4 monstrous creatures on the board, 2 greater demons, 2 demon princes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2114208 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 His army will be all Nurgle, with one Bloodthirster, at 2500 points. He will have 4 monstrous creatures on the board, 2 greater demons, 2 demon princes. Thats useful to know. If he's only going to use 1 Bloodthirster, the other MC will be a Great Unclean One. They excel at absorbing firepower with lots of wounds and FnP. The Bloodthirster is very dangerous and will often tear apart your vehicles as it will have S8/9 on the charge depending on upgrades. If he's good, the 2 Daemon Princes will be Winged Nurgle DPs with Noxious Touch, Cloud of Flies and Iron Hide and maybe Breath of Chaos. This means they're T6 MCs with a 3+/5+ save and lots of killing power against infantry. If he's going all Nurgle, he'll probably fill in the rest with Beasts, Nurglings and PlagueBearers, none of which are that killy but they're all fairly durable. However I wouldn't be surprised if he brings some Bloodletters along, as S5 power weapons hitting on 3's is very killy. Against Nurgle, you'll want Plasma/Melta/Power Fist to get through their high T and FnP. Hellfire Rounds or Sniper Rifles can also work here, but they'll still have FnP saves. Tanks, Speeders and Dreads will all be damn helpful. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2114332 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hellios Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 how broken do you want to be? Inquisitor (ally) land on objective... he then uses sanctuary and sits there for the rest of the game... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2114365 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Mount up in rhinos- and just come onto the board carefully. Leave the dreads at home. Move in 12" towards the objectives and wait for him to come down- he might pop a few. Disembark, and then just keep firing while you move towards the bastions. On the other hand you might try DPing into the field and then using your "run" moves to get into the bastions with some heavy weapon teams- plasma or lascannons preferably. And dont forget a Librarian with that obnoxious power that causes you to reroll invulnerable saves *cant find my book at the moment* Its priceless against daemons. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2114496 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhellion Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 Mount up in rhinos- and just come onto the board carefully. Leave the dreads at home. Move in 12" towards the objectives and wait for him to come down- he might pop a few. Disembark, and then just keep firing while you move towards the bastions. On the other hand you might try DPing into the field and then using your "run" moves to get into the bastions with some heavy weapon teams- plasma or lascannons preferably. And dont forget a Librarian with that obnoxious power that causes you to reroll invulnerable saves *cant find my book at the moment* Its priceless against daemons. You cannot run into a Bastion, same as you cannot run into a Rhino in the shooting phase. Plus, he won't be using Bastions. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2114524 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhellion Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 This is what I'm looking at now. I'm thinking about dropping a unit of terminators for another Razorback mounted Tactical Squad. I would use Sternguard if I had a total of 10. Otherwise I was taking the advice of earlier posts and including lots of dakka. Librarian: epistolary, terminator armor, null zone, vortex Captain: artificer armor, digital weapons, storm shield, relic blade Dreadnought: assault cannon, dccw w/ heavy flamer, drop pod w/ locator beacon Ironclad Dreadnought: chainfist w/ heavy flamer, hurricane bolter, 2hkm's, drop pod Sternguard: 6 man, 3 combi melta, sergeant w/ power fist, razorback w/ heavy bolter Terminator Squad: 5 man, cyclone, chainfist Terminator Squad: 5 man, assault cannon Terminator Assault Squad: 5 man, LRC (below) Land Speeder: heavy bolter, assault cannon Land Speeder: multi melta, heavy flamer Land Speeder: multi melta, heavy flamer Land Raider Crusader (transport): multi melta Predator: autocannon, heavy bolters, Chronus Vindicator Whirlwind 2450 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2114526 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 I think you need some sort of counter-assault force. With Daemons, you have to think of them like Orks or Tyranid. At some point they're going to get you in HtH combat, so you might want to be prepared for it. The Terminators are good, but they're only 1 squad. I guess I'd like to see some kind of squad where you can actually use your HQ units. Maybe a Command Squad or Assault Squad. I normally like Whirlwinds, but I'm not sure how useful they're going to be. I think I'd rather have another Dakka Predator instead. I'd lose the Chronus upgrade or put him on the Vindicator instead (where not being stunned matters even more). More Speeders would be good. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2114657 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted September 17, 2009 Share Posted September 17, 2009 Hows he not using any Bastions if its planetstrike? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2114897 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhellion Posted September 17, 2009 Author Share Posted September 17, 2009 Hows he not using any Bastions if its planetstrike? You don't have to use Bastions to play Planetstrike, you just need objectives. This way he avoids me dropping down turn 1 then walking in turn 2 before he can do anything about it. Btw this is also for a league, the opponents play each other 2 weeks in a row alternating attacker/defender. I won our game last week as defender, which is the reason I generally know what he will be taking. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2115054 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhellion Posted September 17, 2009 Author Share Posted September 17, 2009 The Terminators are good, but they're only 1 squad. I guess I'd like to see some kind of squad where you can actually use your HQ units. Maybe a Command Squad or Assault Squad. I normally like Whirlwinds, but I'm not sure how useful they're going to be. I think I'd rather have another Dakka Predator instead. I'd lose the Chronus upgrade or put him on the Vindicator instead (where not being stunned matters even more). More Speeders would be good. Captain is with the Assault Terminators in the LRC, and the Librarian is with the Terminators. Librarian would prefer not to get into close combat, and the Captain wants to be there. The Whirlwind is a S5 template vs T5, in place of not actually owning another Dakka Predator. I think I'll probably drop a Terminator Squad for either an Assault Squad or Tactical and Razorback. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2115060 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatEscape_13 Posted September 18, 2009 Share Posted September 18, 2009 Point out that the bloodthirster in an otherwise all Nurgle force is a bit beardy. Count the seconds it takes him to respond. If there are 3 or more seconds, then he... like you... is legitmately feeling bad about the inclusion. Play the game, abuse him a bit for it, but have fun. If he responds immediately? Then he's clearly rationalized that jerky combination. Choose to instead play a game against someone else. We need to patrol our chaos brethern better people. Don't enable their abuses! Cheers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2116308 Share on other sites More sharing options...
I AM THE AWESOME Posted September 19, 2009 Share Posted September 19, 2009 Point out that the bloodthirster in an otherwise all Nurgle force is a bit beardy. Count the seconds it takes him to respond. If there are 3 or more seconds, then he... like you... is legitmately feeling bad about the inclusion. Play the game, abuse him a bit for it, but have fun. If he responds immediately? Then he's clearly rationalized that jerky combination. Choose to instead play a game against someone else. We need to patrol our chaos brethern better people. Don't enable their abuses! Cheers. Apologies, but that's quite possibly the silliest reasoning I have ever heard. Firstly, why does how long he waits have anything to do with it? I could respond immediately with, "yeah, I probably shouldn't have it in my army," and you'd still say I'd rationalized it? Seriously? Secondly, a Bloodthirster in a Nurgle force that doesn't even pack Epidemius is hardly beardy at all. Even the super hard Daemon builds (like Fatecrusher) can't even hold a hair to most beardy lists. I've seen much worse, and Daemons need it. For example, I know that I play in most games with Fateweaver, a Bloodthirster, Flamers, Plaguebearers, Bloodletters, and Nurgle Daemon Princes, and you know what? Even that combination isn't beardy. If you're calling Daemons beardy, I think you need to play them much, much more. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2117563 Share on other sites More sharing options...
wizard12 Posted September 19, 2009 Share Posted September 19, 2009 one unit for fighting that blood thirster in my opinion. Stern or a grand master (with grimore of true names) with a terminator retinue. the blood thirster then only hits on 4+'s and is going to get munched. add a phycannon and those daemons will really feel pain but, other wise, dakka is probably your best bet against those daemons. Grimore of true names. The only useful piece of anti - daemon wargear in the daemon hunter armoury Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2117593 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhellion Posted September 24, 2009 Author Share Posted September 24, 2009 I ended up winning by getting an attack bike through dangerous terrain to touch the second objective on the final turn after he blew up my LRC that was camped on it. I had an Ironclad drop pod onto the first objective and hold it throughout the game. He took 3 Great Daemons, 3 Daemon Princes, and 2 Soulgrinders while defending. Tough Daemonzilla list but I took lots of firepower to combat what I assumed would be a monstrous creature heavy list. But what I didn't expect was him splitting it up. No Epidemus this time, only half was Nurgle, and the other half was the "reinforcement" force of the remaining 3 Chaos Gods. I split up my Landspeeders, got an Attack Bike squad with heavy bolters, and had smaller squads of marines and Sternguard in Razorbacks with heavy bolters. My TH/SS Terminators tied up a Soulgrinder and 7 Beasts of Nurgle for a few turns, eventually destroying them all with only one Termi remaining (even my Captain died to the Soulgrinder). His only remaining large models were a Slaanesh Daemon Prince and a immobilized Soulgrinder. minigun762's advice really worked to help me win the game. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2123435 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhellion Posted September 24, 2009 Author Share Posted September 24, 2009 This was my army list. The Librarian wasn't around all game like last time to really harass him, he died third turn early. Captain was insta killed by a Soulgrinder. Assault Squad tied up a Daemon Prince for 3 turns and dropped him to 1 would, after getting shot up by a Lord of Change. Captain: relic blade, storm shield, artificer armor, melta bombs Librarian: terminator, null zone, vortex Dreadnought: assault cannon, dccw w/ heavy flamer, drop pod Ironclad Dreadnought: siesmic hammer w/ melta gun, dccw w/ storm bolter, 2 hkm's, drop pod Sternguard: 6 man, 3 combi meltas, sergeant w/ power fist, razorback w/ heavy bolter Terminator Assault Squad: 5 TH/SS, LRC (below) Terminator Squad: 5 man, assault cannon Tactical Squad: 5 man, sergeant w/ power sword, razorback w/ heavy bolter Attack Bike Squad: 3 heavy bolters Land Speeder: heavy bolter, assault cannon Land Speeder: multi melta, heavy flamer Land Speeder: multi melta, heavy flamer Assault Squad: 10 man, 2 plasma pistols, sergeant w/ power fist Land Raider Crusader: multi melta Vindicator Predator: autocannon, heavy bolter sponsons 2500 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2123439 Share on other sites More sharing options...
thade Posted September 27, 2009 Share Posted September 27, 2009 Great work, man. =) Go, marines. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/178713-attacking-vs-daemons-in-planetstrike/#findComment-2126837 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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