That spell....

[lunchb0x]

Can someone please explain the Logic that if INFANTRY are effected, that jump INFANTRY would not?

 

Seriously guys...where is the logic in that ?

 

That aside...read the line again...

 

" The line may pass through terrain,Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test. "

 

It just says that the line for the JAWS can pass through the following, then stats that any MODEL touched must take an initiative test. The only clue to vehicles not being effected is in the fact that the line can not pass through vehicles, though the line would touch a vehicle if it stopped at it....so you could technically JAW a dread.

 

But wow, the more I read that line in the Codex, they seriously need to learn what commas and periods are.

[WG Vrox]

If your looking for fluff reasons why demons and hive tyrants with wings are not immune, consider the bulk that has to get itself off the ground. A 2 ton monstrosity takes a bit of time to get their wings to fill with enough air to lift off themselves off the ground, so it's up to their INT to save them. While jump jets/packs are instant from a push of a button.

 

 

It just says that the line for the JAWS can pass through the following, then stats that any MODEL touched must take an initiative test. The only clue to vehicles not being effected is in the fact that the line can not pass through vehicles, though the line would touch a vehicle if it stopped at it....so you could technically JAW a dread.

 

So you saying if the JoWW touches a vehicle it stops even if you still have 12" left to go?

 

WG Vrox

[Valerian]

Lunch,

 

In the rulebook Jump Infantry are not treated as a subset of Infantry, but rather a completely separate Unit Type. Because they are a different unit type, they are not affected by JotWW, because they are not included in the list of unit types that are affected. Simple.

 

Valerian

[Oldenhaller]

interesting query that....what is passing through and what is touching?

 

To be touched do you have to pass through something? If you pass the line through any of these things can you not draw the line at all in that direction? If your line stops becuase it touches something which it can't go through (ie a dread) does that then have to take an initiative test?

 

~O

[rahl02]

according to your thoughts it sounds very reasonable, but according to dex i can't recall anything mentioned excluding it ;) maybe i am wrong or it might needs a clarification :)

The spell lists what it affects. Monsterous Creatures. Bikes, Cavalry, Beasts and Infantry. No mention of Jump Infantry affected so Jump Infantry are immune.

 

Jump infantry are treated just like normal infantry they just get extra movement in the movement phase. They shoot like normal infantry and assalt like normal infantry. They don't alway have their jump packs, rockets, or jet packs on, they have to land at somepoint.

 

Yes it seems like they wouldn't be effected but they are, because they're still tagged as infantry.

[JamesI]

according to your thoughts it sounds very reasonable, but according to dex i can't recall anything mentioned excluding it ;) maybe i am wrong or it might needs a clarification :)

The spell lists what it affects. Monsterous Creatures. Bikes, Cavalry, Beasts and Infantry. No mention of Jump Infantry affected so Jump Infantry are immune.

 

Jump infantry are treated just like normal infantry they just get extra movement in the movement phase. They shoot like normal infantry and assalt like normal infantry. They don't alway have their jump packs, rockets, or jet packs on, they have to land at somepoint.

 

Yes it seems like they wouldn't be effected but they are, because they're still tagged as infantry.

No. Jump Infantry are a completely different category of model than infantry that just share a lot of rules. Jump Infantry are not infantry. The power does not list jump infantry as an affected group.

[WG Vrox]

Along with this line of thinking, if the line stops at a vehicle and there are troops inside do they all have to take a INT test? We know the line does not go through it but it still touches it when it stops.

 

 

Another question along those lines, can you cast the Joww looking out from a fire port within a vehicle such as a Rhino? Or because the line starts at a vehicle it automatically stops there since it can not past through it.

 

 

Vrox

[Vanger]

@rahl02:

 

In the BRB Infantry and Jump Infantry are two seperate unit types.

 

@WG VRox:

 

They are not affected (they are not present on the table), the vehicle does not stop the power and yes, you can fire it from a Rhino and the line is drawn from the firing point.

[JamesI]

" The line may pass through terrain,Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test. "

 

It just says that the line for the JAWS can pass through the following, then stats that any MODEL touched must take an initiative test. The only clue to vehicles not being effected is in the fact that the line can not pass through vehicles, though the line would touch a vehicle if it stopped at it....so you could technically JAW a dread.

 

But wow, the more I read that line in the Codex, they seriously need to learn what commas and periods are.

The error you have is that its a period after terrain.

 

"The line may pass through terrain. Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test."

 

Only those types of models are hit, vehicles and jump infantry and artillery (oddly enough) ignore it.

[rahl02]

" The line may pass through terrain,Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test. "

 

It just says that the line for the JAWS can pass through the following, then stats that any MODEL touched must take an initiative test. The only clue to vehicles not being effected is in the fact that the line can not pass through vehicles, though the line would touch a vehicle if it stopped at it....so you could technically JAW a dread.

 

But wow, the more I read that line in the Codex, they seriously need to learn what commas and periods are.

The error you have is that its a period after terrain.

 

"The line may pass through terrain. Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test."

 

Only those types of models are hit, vehicles and jump infantry and artillery (oddly enough) ignore it.

 

I see jump infantry as infantry they just have an extra word infront of them. They still have to land and assalt like normal infantry. Plus when you sit and think about it, if the JotWW can open a hole big enough for a Carnifex, Hive Tyrant or even a Dred, what makes you think that jump infantry couldn't be swallowed up like infantry.

 

They'd still have to take an I test to see if they trigger their jump pack, just like the Carnifex, Hive Tyrant and even Dreds. Funny that.

[WG Vrox]

Since we are on this subject, I was looking at my Rune Priest that I modeled about 2 months ago and feel like I might get grief for it.

 

http://i435.photobucket.com/albums/qq71/WG_Vrox/IMG_1099.jpg

 

 

As you can see I mounted him on a base that raises him about an inch off the ground. before it actually worked against me as he could be seen over vehicles, now since he has powers I know I will get accused of trying to give him a better LOS. all I can say is that I he was like that before the new dex came out. grrrr just can't win.

 

Has anyone seen any rules that sets a limit on basing a model's height?

 

Vrox.

[JamesI]

" The line may pass through terrain,Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test. "

 

It just says that the line for the JAWS can pass through the following, then stats that any MODEL touched must take an initiative test. The only clue to vehicles not being effected is in the fact that the line can not pass through vehicles, though the line would touch a vehicle if it stopped at it....so you could technically JAW a dread.

 

But wow, the more I read that line in the Codex, they seriously need to learn what commas and periods are.

The error you have is that its a period after terrain.

 

"The line may pass through terrain. Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test."

 

Only those types of models are hit, vehicles and jump infantry and artillery (oddly enough) ignore it.

 

I see jump infantry as infantry they just have an extra word infront of them. They still have to land and assalt like normal infantry. Plus when you sit and think about it, if the JotWW can open a hole big enough for a Carnifex, Hive Tyrant or even a Dred, what makes you think that jump infantry couldn't be swallowed up like infantry.

 

They'd still have to take an I test to see if they trigger their jump pack, just like the Carnifex, Hive Tyrant and even Dreds. Funny that.

Sorry, not how the rule works. Plus it can't swallow a dread. Vehicles aren't on the list.

 

Remembe, you have another power that hurts jump infantry, jetbikes, skimmers. JotWW hurts the list given above, the other power hurts the stuff this one misses. You don't need 2 powers that really hurt jump infantry.

[rahl02]

" The line may pass through terrain,Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test. "

 

It just says that the line for the JAWS can pass through the following, then stats that any MODEL touched must take an initiative test. The only clue to vehicles not being effected is in the fact that the line can not pass through vehicles, though the line would touch a vehicle if it stopped at it....so you could technically JAW a dread.

 

But wow, the more I read that line in the Codex, they seriously need to learn what commas and periods are.

The error you have is that its a period after terrain.

 

"The line may pass through terrain. Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test."

 

Only those types of models are hit, vehicles and jump infantry and artillery (oddly enough) ignore it.

 

I see jump infantry as infantry they just have an extra word infront of them. They still have to land and assalt like normal infantry. Plus when you sit and think about it, if the JotWW can open a hole big enough for a Carnifex, Hive Tyrant or even a Dred, what makes you think that jump infantry couldn't be swallowed up like infantry.

 

They'd still have to take an I test to see if they trigger their jump pack, just like the Carnifex, Hive Tyrant and even Dreds. Funny that.

Sorry, not how the rule works. Plus it can't swallow a dread. Vehicles aren't on the list.

 

Your correct on the Dread, thought he was a vehicle that counted as infantry. That still doesn't change the fact that it can swallow a Tyrant and Fex, but not jump infantry. If it says infantry it's infantry that inclused all types. But that's just me, we'll have to get a rulling from Kelly.

[lunchb0x]

" The line may pass through terrain,Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test. "

 

It just says that the line for the JAWS can pass through the following, then stats that any MODEL touched must take an initiative test. The only clue to vehicles not being effected is in the fact that the line can not pass through vehicles, though the line would touch a vehicle if it stopped at it....so you could technically JAW a dread.

 

But wow, the more I read that line in the Codex, they seriously need to learn what commas and periods are.

The error you have is that its a period after terrain.

 

"The line may pass through terrain. Monstrous Creatures, beasts, cavalry, bikes, and infantry models that are touched by this line must take an initiative test."

 

Only those types of models are hit, vehicles and jump infantry and artillery (oddly enough) ignore it.

 

You are correct...I zoomed in on my xerox copy, I thought it was a comma. my bad.

[JamesI]

Your correct on the Dread, thought he was a vehicle that counted as infantry. That still doesn't change the fact that it can swallow a Tyrant and Fex, but not jump infantry. If it says infantry it's infantry that inclused all types. But that's just me, we'll have to get a rulling from Kelly.

 

Jump infantry are seperate from Infantry in the rulebook. They are seperate unit types.

 

It may not make sense, but lots of rules don't make sense. This is the rule.

[lunchb0x]

Jump Infantry = Infantry

 

I dont care what kind of screwed up logic you try and apply to this...infantry is infantry.

 

Think of how much that can screw up our Wolf Priests if you can do infantry but cant effect jump troops....

 

Page 5 of the rule book :

 

"Jump infantry can move like normal infantry or activate their jump device to make a high-speed move, leaping over intervening terrain and models."

 

and holy crap Page 52, even lists that they shoot and charge like normal infantry!!!

 

If it shoots like infantry, charges like infantry, can move like infantry , it must be jump troops. :)

[JamesI]

Jump Infantry = Infantry

 

I dont care what kind of screwed up logic you try and apply to this...infantry is infantry.

 

Think of how much that can screw up our Wolf Priests if you can do infantry but cant effect jump troops....

 

Page 5 of the rule book :

 

"Jump infantry can move like normal infantry or activate their jump device to make a high-speed move, leaping over intervening terrain and models."

 

and holy crap Page 52, even lists that they shoot and charge like normal infantry!!!

 

If it shoots like infantry, charges like infantry, can move like infantry , it must be jump troops. :)

Thanks for proving my point.

 

It says Jump Infantry can move like not are. If Jump Infantry were Infantry that line would not be needed.

 

By the rulebook:

Infantry = Infantry. Jump Infantry =/= Infantry.

[lunchb0x]

Yup, just took me a bit of actual reading...man that really makes you have to think when bringing a wolf priest thats for sure.

[JamesI]

Yup, just took me a bit of actual reading...man that really makes you have to think when bringing a wolf priest thats for sure.

Thats a good thing. If you had a psychic power that was a no brainer to use, it would probably be overpowered. Better to have good choices than one obvious superpower.

[rahl02]

Jump Infantry = Infantry

 

I dont care what kind of screwed up logic you try and apply to this...infantry is infantry.

 

Think of how much that can screw up our Wolf Priests if you can do infantry but cant effect jump troops....

 

Page 5 of the rule book :

 

"Jump infantry can move like normal infantry or activate their jump device to make a high-speed move, leaping over intervening terrain and models."

 

and holy crap Page 52, even lists that they shoot and charge like normal infantry!!!

 

If it shoots like infantry, charges like infantry, can move like infantry , it must be jump troops. :rolleyes:

Thanks for proving my point.

 

It says Jump Infantry can move like not are. If Jump Infantry were Infantry that line would not be needed.

 

By the rulebook:

Infantry = Infantry. Jump Infantry =/= Infantry.

 

You've just proven my point, that anything that affects infantry affects jump infantry.

[JamesI]

Jump Infantry = Infantry

 

I dont care what kind of screwed up logic you try and apply to this...infantry is infantry.

 

Think of how much that can screw up our Wolf Priests if you can do infantry but cant effect jump troops....

 

Page 5 of the rule book :

 

"Jump infantry can move like normal infantry or activate their jump device to make a high-speed move, leaping over intervening terrain and models."

 

and holy crap Page 52, even lists that they shoot and charge like normal infantry!!!

 

If it shoots like infantry, charges like infantry, can move like infantry , it must be jump troops. :rolleyes:

Thanks for proving my point.

 

It says Jump Infantry can move like not are. If Jump Infantry were Infantry that line would not be needed.

 

By the rulebook:

Infantry = Infantry. Jump Infantry =/= Infantry.

 

You've just proven my point, that anything that affects infantry affects jump infantry.

How? Just because something can move like Infantry does not make it Infantry.

[SamaNagol]

I can't believe people who don't even own the codex are trying to rules lawyer.

 

:rolleyes:

[lunchb0x]

I can't believe people who don't even own the codex are trying to rules lawyer.

 

:blush:

 

 

I own the codex...do continue.

[Kastellan Kong]

Jump Infantry = Infantry

 

I dont care what kind of screwed up logic you try and apply to this...infantry is infantry.

 

 

So by extension a jetbike is just a bike for the purposes of this spell too then? Yeah that makes sense :blush:

 

If there wasn't any difference between Jump Infantry and Infantry there wouldn't be a distinction in the rule book at all. If they wanted the power to work on everything they could just have left it at "all models" instead of specifying...

[SamaNagol]

You are correct...I zoomed in on my xerox copy, I thought it was a comma. my bad.

 

:blush: