Level Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Hi all While putting together a list, I came accross something that I'd like to get some opinions on. In the wargear entry for Wolf scouts it says that you can equip the entire pack with meltabombs for X points per model. What happens however, if I put a MoTW in the pack too? basically it would mean having to pay the points for the wulfen to have a piece of equipment that they will never use, because in CC they don't use wargear. To further clarify something, do models with Mark of the Wulfen act as normal marines up untill assault when they use claws and teeth over any weapons, ie. can they shoot bolters with the rest of their battle brothers, or are they wolf like creatures that don't use any wargear at all? sorry if this has already come up somewhere Any help is much appreciated thanks Level Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 In CC they dont get extra attacks or the benefits of weapons, but Id argue that against a non-walker theyd get to use their grenade. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2130748 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanger Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 What Grey Mage said. Also a model with MotW acts normaly in every way except in CC, even then only his attacks change and that he has rending instead of any special weapon he might have. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2130751 Share on other sites More sharing options...
clanfield Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 also melta bombs are x points per model not squad Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2130757 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 also melta bombs are x points per model not squad This is my point. But it says that you have to equip the entire pack with meltabombs so you cant't just buy for half of them. @ Grey Mage I would also like to argue that he would be able to use his grenade against a non walker, however, I'd like to know what the grounds for your argument are. If you assault a non walker, does it not count as close combat? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2130816 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 also melta bombs are x points per model not squad This is my point. But it says that you have to equip the entire pack with meltabombs so you cant't just buy for half of them. @ Grey Mage I would also like to argue that he would be able to use his grenade against a non walker, however, I'd like to know what the grounds for your argument are. If you assault a non walker, does it not count as close combat? Well its this: Grenades have to ber clamped or placed so as to inflict enough damage, so each model using them can only ever make one attack, regardless of the number of attacks on their profile and any bonus attacks. Against vehicles, grenades have the following armor penetration: *snip* This sounds, to me, as if grenades attacks are a special attack that takes place outside of the normal WS vs WS of other attacks. An interesting note: if grenades cannot be used by the model in CC, then the Wulfen will also not get the benefits of frag grenades when charging into cover. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2130828 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 Grenades have to ber clamped or placed so as to inflict enough damage, so each model using them can only ever make one attack, regardless of the number of attacks on their profile and any bonus attacks. Against vehicles, grenades have the following armor penetration: *snip* Ok, so that's how grenades work. nothing there about whether assaulting a vehicle counts as CC or not This sounds, to me, as if grenades attacks are a special attack that takes place outside of the normal WS vs WS of other attacks. I agree that that is what this seems to be saying. An interesting note: if grenades cannot be used by the model in CC, then the Wulfen will also not get the benefits of frag grenades when charging into cover. It doesn't say that the Wulfen can't use grenades in CC, but rather that he uses his claws and teeth to attack rather than any wargear. so for example you would not be doing well to give this guy your power fist as he will merely throw it on the ground as he charges in and start chewing on some guys head. Really I just want to know if you think it would be justified for me to not pay for his meltabomb when I buy them for everyone else in the scout pack, (I'd much rather give my wolfguard a combimelta thankyou very much). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2130845 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Sadly I dont think you can get away with not giving him meltabombs. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2130881 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hfran Morkai Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 I don't know, I've always thought that it's similar to someone taking a ten man scout pack andgiving four of them sniper rifles, you don't have to equip the whole squad, but this is only my intepretation of the entry Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2130935 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corver Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Does that mean that i have to give my wulfen bolters, BP and CCW to make them Wysiwig? I just stuck a jump pack on a normal wulfen for my skyclaw. At least having D6+2 rending attacks has a chance against most vehicles. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2131014 Share on other sites More sharing options...
volfbjorn Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Hold on a sec when it says that "you can equip your entire squad with ... etc etc " i read it as that i can take 4 melta bombs and give another one MOTW , it is not a must, it says you can . if it was a must shouldn't the codex say the same as it says for Long fangs ? there it clearly says that you must equip all of them with heavy weapons . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2131024 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 Hold on a sec when it says that "you can equip your entire squad with ... etc etc " i read it as that i can take 4 melta bombs and give another one MOTW , it is not a must, it says you can . if it was a must shouldn't the codex say the same as it says for Long fangs ? there it clearly says that you must equip all of them with heavy weapons . I see what you are saying Volf. The way I am reading it is: If you are going to take meltabombs then the entire pack has to take them and you pay for each model in the pack Please tell me I'm wrong :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2131057 Share on other sites More sharing options...
volfbjorn Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 maybe you are right. Besides my mother language is not English but i am confused . if it is the way you say it why does it have the melta bomb separately for each model and not for the whole squad ? . i mean it is meant to be all or nothing then what is the meaning of having separately the cost ? Just a thought Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2131067 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 maybe you are right. Besides my mother language is not English but i am confused . if it is the way you say it why does it have the melta bomb separately for each model and not for the whole squad ? . i mean it is meant to be all or nothing then what is the meaning of having separately the cost ? Just a thought Packs can number from five to ten models so you pay for each model in the pack because it can vary. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2131077 Share on other sites More sharing options...
volfbjorn Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 good point so we have to waste 5 point on a melta bomb , that it can never been used while you have Motw ... unless you get a WG as leader . but then wouldn't the scout unit lose the Behind the enemy line ability ? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2131084 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toasterfree Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 he entry and i quote The entire squad may take... that means you would HAVE to get your MoTW guy a MB, and since he cant use special attacks in CC the MB is a special attack (wargear) so he would chew on the tank. and no, with a WGPL you would not lost the OBEL. it is conferred onto him, he just cannot lead them in TDA. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2131235 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Level Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 Thanks Toaster Damn, bit of a waste of 5 points but hey chewing on tanks is more fun than meltabombing them anyway. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180002-wulfen-melta-bombers/#findComment-2131860 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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