The Emperor's Champion Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Of course, its equally likely someone's gone 'oh, that looks cool, lets use Lupercal' without researching it I think believing anything other than this is giving GW too much credit. Any research at all and it would have been Lupercus instead of Lupercal. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2142274 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlmb_123 Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 I agree partly with the above two posts, however, it's worth bearing in mind that a lot of the staff who were working for GW when 40k and Warhammer were being formulated or filled out were/are interested in history. But, as you've said, the 'That sounds good' appraoch is most likely. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2142873 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 agreed. I think they just picked any noun that sounded nice and used it without researching at all. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2142908 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoebus Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 You're right, you don't follow. "Lupercal" is a proper name of the specific cave in which THE She-Wolf who raised Romulus and Remus lived. It's not just a noun referring to any old wolf's cave. Look, no offense, but, put quite plainly, Lupercal does not mean "cave of the she-wolf". It simply means wolf's cave. There's nothing in the terms Lupercal, Lupercus, Luperci, with grammatically feminine connotations. The only reason why Lupercal is understood to be a female wolf's cave, is because of the context provided by the legend of Romulus and Remus. Any Roman would have known that there might be many lupercals, but there was only one Lupercal--the one from the legend. It's like looking back at North American geography a couple of millennia from now and understanding that there were many "grand canyons", but to residents of the United States there was only one Grand Canyon. Anyways, brass tacks? Fact of the matter is this: 1. No, there wouldn't be anything weird about Horus' surname denoting that he hailed from a she-wolf's cave (see my earlier post again about Athens). 2. Even if there was, unless the Cthonians and/or Terrans visiting Cthonia in that far future were aware of the legend of Romulus and Remus (but were somehow conversant in Latin), they would not have thought of "Lupercal" as meaning a cave that is inherently attributed to a she-wolf; they would know it as a wolf's cave, period. I don't mean to start any sort of "forum war" or what have you. I only brought this up because one poster already brought up Horus being called "she-wolf" and then, later, you argued something along similar lines. I simply don't want to see any unnecessary confusion, is all. :tu: Cheers, P. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2143137 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 I was wondering how wolfy were the luna wolves? Did they have lots of wolf iconography like modern Space Wolves? If I was to make a Luna Wolves army would the new space wolf stuff be a good place to start? Also, along the same lines... were the Space Wolves really wolfy before the heresy? lots of icons? The "luna" part seemed to be more important then the "wolves" part to the LW's. The moon was used in their ceramonies, wolves, wolf iconography, wolf pelts, skulls, etc. seemed to have no role. They are definately not like the SW's in that reguard. No, the space wolf stuff would not be the way to go. The long hair, braided beards and moustashs (sp?), wolf pelts, wolf skulls, the whole feral, Viking thing, is VERY NOT LW's like. LW's would have been much more like a codex s/m army preheresy. They would have been and looked much more like UM's then SW's (just way kooler and way better :) ). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2143267 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Luprical (the lactating wolf) What the hell are you talking about ?? :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2143275 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Kezef Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Raven Guard - Edgar Allen Poe/Ninjas Edgar allen poe/ninjas That image made my day Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2143384 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlmb_123 Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 "This morning several ninjas were found dead or dying on the streets of Baltimore, several of those still able to communicate whispering the name 'Reynolds'. Police are holding part-time poet and noted drunk Edgar Allan Poe has been held by police for questioning, several eye-witness accounts suggesting that, in a moment of rather surprising lucidity, POe fought each and every one off individually." Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2144190 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Emperor's Champion Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 LOL :P :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2144234 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 soooo funny! :) then again the Night Lords did get the role of batman :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2144376 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whylie Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 LW not very wolfy at all, more Moony moons = bare arses by moonlight or Moon Units = Horus' real name is frank zappa ( if that don't go strait over your head, you ain't young enough) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2145296 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artemis360 Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 Guys, a big part of the wolf thing, particularly in Horus' alias being Lupercal, is lycanthropy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinical_lycanthropy . Which is a a kind of disorder leading to insanity. You know, Horus transforms, insanity/chaos ensues. A good old case of one howling at the moon. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2145366 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starblayde Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 You know, Horus transforms, insanity/chaos ensues. A good old case of one howling at the moon. As well as the Mournival not only representing the four humours or temperaments, but also four stages of the Moon. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2145397 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yogi Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 Iron Warrior - Greek (at least a little) Actually, I don't think the Iron Warriors are Greek inspired. I know you think that because their home planet is Olympia, but to me the IW always seemed to mirror the German SS Panzergrenadiers, at least in older fluff, though they may be trying to get rid of this now to sanitize the fluff. I think so because 1.) They both use a lot of heavy tanks supported by mechanized infantry 2.) The Battle of Tallarn is almost certainly styled after the Battle of Kursk as the BoT was specifically said to be the largest tank battle ever and the BoK was the real world largest tank battle ever and both occurred on a charred landscape that was left after the scorched earth tactics of the aggressor. 3.) The Battle of Maginot Four Zero when the IW circumvented and destroyed the "impenetrable" Cadian defense line which is obviously a reference to when the Germans circumvented the Maginot line in the beginning of the war 4.) The Death's Heads are a titan legion that works with the IW's and the Death's Heads was the name of an SS group that worked with the Waffen SS Panzergrenadiers. 5.) The general austere nature of the Iron Warriors seems very stereotypically Germanic to me So yeah, it's the blitzkrieg German army, though GW would probably now deny this as all of the fluff I pointed out is at this point pretty old, and arguably politically incorrect. Thats really interesting I had no idea.. OT I dont think the L wolves were supposed to be too wolfy, but Theres nothing really stopping you. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2149991 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vissah Posted October 13, 2009 Share Posted October 13, 2009 You know, Horus transforms, insanity/chaos ensues. A good old case of one howling at the moon. As well as the Mournival not only representing the four humours or temperaments, but also four stages of the Moon. And the Egyptian god Horus also had four sons. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2150333 Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 Guys, a big part of the wolf thing, particularly in Horus' alias being Lupercal, is lycanthropy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinical_lycanthropy . Which is a a kind of disorder leading to insanity. You know, Horus transforms, insanity/chaos ensues. A good old case of one howling at the moon. This is so stupid and unsupportable that I don't know how to respond to it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2154093 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loken of the 10th Posted October 31, 2009 Share Posted October 31, 2009 Iron Warrior - Greek (at least a little)Ultramarines - Greco-Roman/Spartan Luna Wolves - Roman Imperial Fists - Holy Roman/Ottoman Empire/Eskimos Space Wolves - Vikings/Werewolves Blood Angels - Dante's inferno/Catholic/Vampires Dark Angels - Dark Ages Black Templar - Crusaders Crimson Fists - Spanish White Scars - Mongols Iron hands - Paranoia and Technology Salamanders - Blacksmiths/Ring Of Fire cultures. Raven Guard - Edgar Allen Poe/Ninjas Red Corsairs - Pirates Thousand Sons - Egyptian Add any themes you think you know...I'm trying to complete the list for the 1st Founding Chapters. Actually since the IW were considered siege masters Id put them as Eastern Roman Empire or Byzantine Empire because they were were renowned(spelling?) for the ability in siege warfare BT would be the Knights Templar so basic idea there Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2170584 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoebus Posted November 1, 2009 Share Posted November 1, 2009 In what sense was the eastern Roman/Byzantine empire renowned for sieges? They are most famous for the final siege of Constantinople (Istanbul), in which they were the besieged party, and they lost. Western Europeans, during and after the Renaissance period, have a far greater record for siege warfare. :geek: The Black Templars are not a Knights Templar take-off. They more closely correspond to the Teutonic Knights (whose colors are almost identical!). The Dark Angels seem to be more similar to the Knights Templar, especially after the Lion's disappearance, when the mysteries of their Order really take front stage. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2171213 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loken of the 10th Posted November 2, 2009 Share Posted November 2, 2009 Touche Phobeus touche... But in the Siege of Jerusalem Part 1 and 2 they were on the attacking part of the sieges and they routed the Israelites in both times with out destroying to much of the city. And there were several other instances I did a research project on them last year so thats why I brought that up. And thats what I meant I was thinking of the knights form Germany but couldnt remember so I lumped them with the Knights Templar all I remembered was that there was a T in it Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2173145 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Emperor's Champion Posted November 3, 2009 Share Posted November 3, 2009 Imperial Fists are the Holy Roman/Byzantine/Carolingian/Ottomans (with a hint of Eskimo) :huh: The Iron Warriors really probably make the most sense as German. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2173160 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Tezdal Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I think GW mostly just went for rule of cool sounding names for the primarchs. As for Horus being egyptian themed name...I believe they wanted something that would sound good followed by Heresy. The Horus Heresy, not Gilber Heresy, or Ted Heresy, something that Flows. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2179499 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Novasry Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I think GW mostly just went for rule of cool sounding names for the primarchs. As for Horus being egyptian themed name...I believe they wanted something that would sound good followed by Heresy. The Horus Heresy, not Gilber Heresy, or Ted Heresy, something that Flows. i think the idea behind Horus is that he is the Polar opposite of Horus in the Egyptian legends... IIRC Horus was the Son of Rha and was also the name which denoted the Sons of the Pharaoh who would succeed the throne, and were eternily loyal to the Pharaoh... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2179801 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raulmichile Posted November 10, 2009 Share Posted November 10, 2009 I think GW mostly just went for rule of cool sounding names for the primarchs. As for Horus being egyptian themed name...I believe they wanted something that would sound good followed by Heresy. The Horus Heresy, not Gilber Heresy, or Ted Heresy, something that Flows. i think the idea behind Horus is that he is the Polar opposite of Horus in the Egyptian legends... IIRC Horus was the Son of Rha and was also the name which denoted the Sons of the Pharaoh who would succeed the throne, and were eternily loyal to the Pharaoh... ...until you catch and incapacitating flu that puts you in a so high fever that magically shows the error of your father's ways and show you the true path, receiveing a lot of power in the process. Shown in this way maybe I would become a polar opposite also. :devil: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2180075 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Masariel Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 they were wolfy like any roman legion was.. since the wolf is sacred animal for old rome..breeding their founders in their ancient legends.. I'd say..take it as any other roman legion..felix for example in the gladiator..they didn't wear any cat skin.. ^_^ Indeed..every pre heresy legion had some romanic taste in it..since that's the way the emperor wanted them from holy terra.. time running and legion splitting the chapters got influenced from other cultures.. In my mind luna wolves were wolves cause on terra when you think of moon you also think of a wolf howling at it.. :) I imagine space wolves legion to be quite romanic too..before they met russ the viking on fenris.. beside..it has always annoyed me that for 20 named legions the designers couldn't find something better than name 2 of them after wolf stuff.. B) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2181044 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blckbuster Posted November 14, 2009 Share Posted November 14, 2009 you really have to take alot of this with a grain of salt, the design process that led to the names and ideas you are reading today, came from what was nearly a humorous take on warhammer fantasy translated into a sci-fi setting, and once these names and Ideas were it, it's easier to do alittle retcon here and there than re-write everything, so something things get shoe-horned in, there's names that don;t make sense and culture mash-ups, just do what you like and have fun with it all in all I've heard lot more friendly discussions on things that are actually real and matter Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/180360-how-wolfy-were-the-luna-wolves/page/3/#findComment-2184423 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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