Lousy design or lousy materials?

[Shoitaan]

Hi guys

 

I'm just about frustrated enough to consider punching a baby right now. Thankfully I don't have a baby otherwise that would be very bad.

 

I'm trying to assemble my penitent engine. The plan was to assemble then paint but it fell apart (after I glued it). I decided painting woudl be better with it in pieces and did everything including details. Now I'm ready to assemble...

 

I can't tell if its because the model itself is designed so freakishly terrible (the join bits not the look of the model, the look is awesome) or its the problem with the glue I'm using. I'm using the official overpriced GW glue (I have this from when I started the hobby, literally nothing else is theirs :)). Is it the glue thats crap or are other people struggling to keep this model in once piece? I'm just about at my wits end. While I was typing this, I picked up my model to see if one of the "shoulder blades" that I repaired was sticking properly when... the other shoulder blade fell off (but the arm on it stayed - thank god).

 

One of the legs broke. Like... the metal rod that goes into the legs hoop stayed in the hold and the rod itself broke off the main body... I had to drill a hole and put in a paperclip as a stabilising joiner. This leg now has a stronger grip then any other part of the model... WHICH KEEPS FALLING APART.

 

So in summary... glue or model? Or is it just me and my large hands :(

[The Holy Heretic]

Pinning is always a good idea - especially for larger metal models. Secondly the GW glue is just plain crap, go for epoxy if you really want the stuff to stick or at least a non-GW glue :)

[Grand Master Caloth]

Pinning is the BEST skill to have when working with ANY metal models, trust me!

[Empty Bolter Clip]

I feel your pain.... i originally wanted 3, but gave up on that after the first. I do kind of think the model has issues as a metal model due to piece weight. (Plastic version may solve it) I even had the same spot you mentioned with the leg/foot break on me as well. I was using a super glue gel, which works great on everything else, so I doubt your glue was the issue.

 

That said, I'm gonna echo everyone's statement. Pinning is a must! I also found that using a bit of greenstuff in certain trouble spots (like the ball join of the foot) really helped solidify it. If you are unsure as to what specific parts will be a future breaking issue then I would suggest handling the model a bunch or in a friendly game before painting it. After a couple post-handling fixes you should hopefully have a sturdy model.

 

Best of Luck!

[Dragons]

I'm going to echo what everyone else has said.. PINNING is incredibly important.

 

The other thing. Don't use glue on larger metal models. Though it sounds wierd, after you have cleaned it up and drilled it and have your pins in place, use a 2 part epoxy.

 

Just a dot (like you would if you used glue) and a dot of Superglue to hold it while it sets (it'll take a day). But it'll be PERMANANT.

 

I personally use J B Weld .. It's ROCKIN. and after it sets up it's STRONGER than the models it connects.

 

I've dropped from shoulder hight large metal models in the past (accidentally) and they bent a bit but didn't break (3rd ed. Hive Tyrant), and had numerous large metal models survive lesser 'issues' that would have broken anything else. (the old Bloodthirsters wings ended up being HANDLES to pick up the model and move it about)

 

 

Sereously.. 2 part epoxies are the way to go with the larger (and heavier) metal models.

 

-Dragons

[avatar8481]

pin everything, all the time. I'll pin plastic if the pose is awkward and I can't get styrene glue on a good joint.

[Brother Captain Kezef]

The penitent engine is GW's way of telling you to embrace wisdom through pain.

[WarriorFish]

Try a gel super glue. Since it's not all runny you can blob it on quite thickly and it makes it easier to use as well. Combine with pinning and you'll get a solid fix that won't break any time soon!

[Vash]

Not to sound like an echo... but pinning... piiinning... pinning...

After I have assembled 9 of these suckers, I acctually learned a thing or two on the way.

 

Never pinned models before... but now I do it all the time. Doesnt really take that much time and strengthens the model so much more.

[Dezartfox]

Metal and GW glue just don't go, some girl from my store has been having a problem with her Lictor's arms falling off since she bought it, I cleaned it up, put a dot of Poundland super glue on and it stuck instantly. GW's glue is like saliva and water mixed with tears.

[calypso2ts]

Penitent engines are a massive pain to assemble as the other posters have noted. A penitent was actually the fourth model I ever bought and was well beyond me at the time (the third was a Throne of Judgement...)

 

Regardless, To assemble it I used a combination of Epoxy, Gorilla Glue (be careful with this it expands when it dries) and pinning. Overall, you do not "need" to pin the model, but it does help. I found the best way to approach it is to assemble the "core pieces" and pose the model as you like first. This means using some clamps to keep things in place or the hands of a significant other...

 

The core pieces are...Legs/feet, Main body (3 pieces I believe the penitent, and two "engine" csings) and finally the arms with side panels.

 

For each core piece:

Legs/Feet - Put epoxy in the hole, a little bit of glue and pressed the foot into the position I wanted. I shaved off the extra epoxy.

Main Body - Glue all three pieces together

Arms - Glue works fine for these as well

 

Once you are ready to assemble start by setting the legs about how you want and pushing one leg's feet into some epoxy on the base. This gives you some flexibility to move the model. Next, align up the axle and slightly score the inside of the leg where the axle goes in. Put some epoxy in and "press in" the axle to get a snug fit. You can remove it if you are careful apply some glue too or you can let it cure and it should stay for you. Finally, repeat the process to press in the second leg. Let it all cure/dry overnight. At this point you will need a break anyways.

 

Next you need to put themain body onto the axle. It is possible to glue this, but I highly recommend pinning it in place. Simply drill the now "solid" base you ahve made, insert a pin and mark a spot to drill the body. Glue the body down. For each arm I put a thin layer of epoxy on the side panel and "pressed" it against the model to leave an indentation. Be a bitliberal with it because you can shave off the remainder. Let it cure until it is fairly stiff, apply glue and clamp it down. Repeat for the other arm.

 

This is how I assemebled my first penitent about 4 years ago and it has not broken or needed to be repaired since (I also have not dropped it yet!). This may not be the best approach, I am a novice when it comes to this, but it has good results.

 

The second I did this summer and I magnetized the main body and arms to make it easier to transport.

 

Remember, how you pose the arms will have a big impact on the way the model balances on the table top (tippiness) and how easily it breaks apart. Putting the arms far out in front puts alot of torque on the connection between the engine body and the axle.

[Shoitaan]

Thanks for the tips guys. I've somehow managed to cobble the thing together with my current crappy glue bit its clearly not strong. I'm going to take your advice and play test it and see how it breaks before I repose it with stronger glue. I'll pin any metal models I do from now on before painting. I'm still extremely annoyed with the model's design. Certain parts have very few contact points with the rest of the body while having to support an enormous amount of weight. Hopefully when GW's gets around to looking at WH in 11 years time (:tu:) they'll improve the contact points of the model. Or maybe even make it plastic, who knows.