White Hunter Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 I was just wondering about their role in a wolf army. There is a healthy distrust of teleportation, jump packs, and anything else that takes the feet of the wolves off the ground, so I was wondering what everyone thought about how they fit in the fluff. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Kezef Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 What happens when Blood Claws never really let go of their love for high speed, high altitude high jinks? I think Land Speeder squadrons are made up of Grey Hunters who where once a skyclaw pack. They are now older, wiser but can't let go of their love for high speed, flying strikes. However they now understand proper tactics and strategy so they take to the skies in Land Speeders, flanking the enemy and attcking them in high speed, hit and run strikes. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146129 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaveriK Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 I was just wondering about their role in a wolf army. There is a healthy distrust of teleportation, jump packs, and anything else that takes the feet of the wolves off the ground, so I was wondering what everyone thought about how they fit in the fluff. Their role... mmm, I dunno?! maybe fast attack?! :P have you even read the codex? especially on sky claws? how wolfy are land speeders? well then, that depends on how much wolf totems and fur you add on to it! there's your answer! now have an ale on me! while your at it, try the search function opps stinkenheim I said I wouldn't bother anymore with that ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146132 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolf Guard Dan Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 What happens when Blood Claws never really let go of their love for high speed, high altitude high jinks? I think Land Speeder squadrons are made up of Grey Hunters who where once a skyclaw pack. They are now older, wiser but can't let go of their love for high speed, flying strikes. However they now understand proper tactics and strategy so they take to the skies in Land Speeders, flanking the enemy and attcking them in high speed, hit and run strikes. Good explaination here. I think theyre pretty wolfy, what pooch doesn't love sticking their head out of the window during a car ride? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146143 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Amarel Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 Personally, I think they're very non-SW (and in the current Codex they really feel like they were thrown in with little to no real background for them). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146163 Share on other sites More sharing options...
maznaz Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 Good explaination here. I think theyre pretty wolfy, what pooch doesn't love sticking their head out of the window during a car ride? I like that. I think you should only field one if you have a wolf in the back with it's head out the side and it's tongue out. Actually, now I have to do something like that. Does anyone know of any head in any range that would suit a space marine with its tongue out? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146170 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Kezef Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 Personally, I think they're very non-SW (and in the current Codex they really feel like they were thrown in with little to no real background for them). tbh a Land Speeder tornado with a multi-melta and assault cannon is 150 poinst cheaper than a land raider, they are my main anti-tank so they have a real place in the army. As to non-sw, I don't think so, we;ve had Speeders since 2nd ed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146181 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vassakov Posted October 10, 2009 Share Posted October 10, 2009 There is no reason why not - after all, they are just another SM vehicle and thus perfectly valid in a Wolves army. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146182 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Amarel Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 tbh a Land Speeder tornado with a multi-melta and assault cannon is 150 poinst cheaper than a land raider, they are my main anti-tank so they have a real place in the army. As to non-sw, I don't think so, we;ve had Speeders since 2nd ed. I know that SW have had them in some form for a long time, but as I said I personally don't think they're very 'Wolfie'. If they were crewed by Blood Claws, then yes, but not a Grey Hunter; it doesn't make much sense (as we're seeing from people retro-fitting a reason for them existing onto them in this thread) As I said, in this Codex (particularly) it feels like they were left in / put in just to provide another cheap heavy weapon option but no real background text was added to describe them (unlike just about everything else that *does* feel like it belongs). As such I wouldn't use one as I think it's thematically wrong, but that's just my opinion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146189 Share on other sites More sharing options...
pchappel Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 'course, by that logic the Whirlwinds and Predators would be crewed by Long Fangs... Eh, I've used my grey and blue/grey speeders since the RT days, and despite the magical revelation in the 3rd edition Codex that the Legion specializing in rapid planetary assaults now fears teleport and jump packs... Glad I can field my jump troopers at least without feeling like I'm giving away a bunch of points... :P But just my opinion as always... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146193 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 I was just wondering about their role in a wolf army. There is a healthy distrust of teleportation, jump packs, and anything else that takes the feet of the wolves off the ground, so I was wondering what everyone thought about how they fit in the fluff. A fast moving, hard hitting flaking force ? That circles the enemy, running it down and striking at its heals constantly? Or springs forward and pounces on its kill? Yeah... I cant imagine how that would be wolfy at all :P. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146197 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaveriK Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 I know that SW have had them in some form for a long time, but as I said I personally don't think they're very 'Wolfie'. If they were crewed by Blood Claws, then yes, but not a Grey Hunter; it doesn't make much sense that's a little contradicting, you personally think its not very 'wolfie' to have land speeders, yet if they were crew by Blood Claws then its 'wolfie' :P why would you say a fresh whelp such as a Blood Claw would have more patience and experience using a land speeder than a Grey Hunter? why is it acceptable to have a land speeder crewed by Blood Claws than suppose a more experienced warrior? in real life scenario, would you rather have an experienced doctor work on you on the operating table or a recent graduate with no actual surgery experience under his or her belt? its like telling a private to hop inside a tank or fighter jet and say go from point a to point b, while killing and maneuvering over/on enemy terrain. Vassakov & Brother Captain Kezef explained it best! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146204 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heimdal Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 I know that SW have had them in some form for a long time, but as I said I personally don't think they're very 'Wolfie'. If they were crewed by Blood Claws, then yes, but not a Grey Hunter; it doesn't make much sense (as we're seeing from people retro-fitting a reason for them existing onto them in this thread) I beg to differ. As a Wolf Lord I would not let Blood Claws crew my ancient and prized skimmer vehicles. They have a tendency for youthful antics that eventually would leave me a smoking crater in the ground. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146503 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Amarel Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 I know that SW have had them in some form for a long time, but as I said I personally don't think they're very 'Wolfie'. If they were crewed by Blood Claws, then yes, but not a Grey Hunter; it doesn't make much sense that's a little contradicting, you personally think its not very 'wolfie' to have land speeders, yet if they were crew by Blood Claws then its 'wolfie' :) why would you say a fresh whelp such as a Blood Claw would have more patience and experience using a land speeder than a Grey Hunter? why is it acceptable to have a land speeder crewed by Blood Claws than suppose a more experienced warrior? Contradictory how? Blood Claws are the high-risk speed freaks, by the time they reach Grey Hunter status they have grown out of it. It's not a case of who a Wolf Lord would entrust technology to (because if that were the case he wouldn't risk Jump Packs or Bikes on Blood Claws, would he?) it's a case of who would actually use the technology (as the fluff states the GH have a wish to keep their feet on the ground). in real life scenario, would you rather have an experienced doctor work on you on the operating table or a recent graduate with no actual surgery experience under his or her belt? its like telling a private to hop inside a tank or fighter jet and say go from point a to point b, while killing and maneuvering over/on enemy terrain. In real life Space Wolves don't exist. The amount of flaws thrown up trying to equate a real-life example to a fantasy space combat game set in the future are many and varied and hardly a solid basis for a discussion. @Heimdal - Again, from my point of view it's more a case of who would actually use the technology for the Space Wolves, rather than who would be allowed to use it. That's always been one of the driving forces behind the Space Wolves since they first became more than just a colour scheme. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146659 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amornar Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 Can't remember which book it was but the part where Ragnar and Co. steal an orc buggy pretty much sums up how Wolves feel about speed.... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146666 Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeslikethunder Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 But your feet are touching the floor of the speeder so that sensation is not a problem otherwise drop pods, thunderhawk gunships and space ships would also be problematic for Space wolves. but drop pods space wolves seem to speak about with great enthusiasm in some of the fluff. Remember its not having your feet on the floor not the feeling of flying that is the problem. The number of times ive had non space wolf players tell me space wolves dont fly at all rather than just jump packs. Then how do we leave fenris? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146671 Share on other sites More sharing options...
maznaz Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 Personally, for me, land speeders are more mobile fire support than fast attack. Effective usage requires discipline, whereas bikes and jump packs are essentially tools for closing ground fast and getting the riders/users to grips with the enemy as fast as possible. Hence it makes perfect sense for grey hunters to pilot land speeders rather than blood claws. Marek Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146688 Share on other sites More sharing options...
fearlessgod Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 In reality, whether speeders are a "wolfy" choice or that their piloted by Grey Hunters or Blood Claws matters little to me. They have a place in our dex, so they will have a place in my arsenal. ~fearlessgod~ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146702 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 Contradictory how? Blood Claws are the high-risk speed freaks, by the time they reach Grey Hunter status they have grown out of it. A what does liking high speed has to do with flying a skimer and B in the fluff SW dont get specialies training[drivers , tank gunner ,pilots for thunder hawks etc] till they make Grey hunter. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146723 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilhelm Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 It's in the codex. It's wolfy. ;) And anyway, what is space-wolfier than careening across the battlefield at high speed while trying to pop the top on a tank with your big fat multi-melta? Especially when you've been drinking. And you know there's room for for a cooler somewhere on that thing! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146729 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Amarel Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 A what does liking high speed has to do with flying a skimer I reckon skimmers probably travel at a fair rate of knots myself <shrugs> As I've stated a few times, I personally do not think Land Speeders are very 'wolfie' and I have given my reasons for feeling that way, many of you don't agree (which is the point of a discussion after all), but that doesn't make my opinion wrong. You can disagree with my reasoning as much as you like, and you are, of course, more than welcome to your own opinions, but you're really not going to change how I feel about them in a SW army - I just don't think they fit and think they're a slightly habitual inclusion, rather than one added because they fit the flavour so well. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146736 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodunius Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 'course, by that logic the Whirlwinds and Predators would be crewed by Long Fangs... Actually the example Space Wolves Predator in Imperial Armour volume 2 has Long Fang Pack Markings on its sponson casings and turret guns. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146748 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Kezef Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 People forget an rather inportant thing. The STEREOTYPE of the Space Wolf is a Marine who doesn't like technology, doesn't like flying and hates things like teleporters. The stereotypical Englishman is a tea drinking ponce. The stereotypical American is an overweight, rather simple, capitalist The stereotypical Frenchman is an arrogant, cheese eating, surrender monkey. These are not accurate representations but each have a grain of truth, enough to build the stereotype from. In general, Space Wolves, the vast majority of them, don't like stuff along the lines of jump packs and land speeders. But there are enough of them who DO like them to form the land speeder squadrons. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146769 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Ariman Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 Besides we all know the run on alcohol so if it does get shot down the pilots can have a last drink. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2146774 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaveriK Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 Contradictory how? Blood Claws are the high-risk speed freaks, by the time they reach Grey Hunter status they have grown out of it. It's not a case of who a Wolf Lord would entrust technology to (because if that were the case he wouldn't risk Jump Packs or Bikes on Blood Claws, would he?) it's a case of who would actually use the technology (as the fluff states the GH have a wish to keep their feet on the ground). Contradict verb (used with object) 1. to assert the contrary or opposite of; deny directly and categorically. 2. to speak contrary to the assertions of: to contradict oneself. 3. (of an action or event) to imply a denial of: His way of life contradicts his stated principles. 4. Obsolete. to speak or declare against; oppose. –verb (used without object) 5. to utter a contrary statement. as I said I personally don't think they're very 'Wolfie'. If they were crewed by Blood Claws, then yes, but not a Grey Hunter I only say you contradict yourself because of your own statement. Its contradicting that you believe in general that land speeders aren't 'wolfie' yet you utter a contrary statement by saying if they were crewed by Blood Claws then, its 'wolfie' in real life scenario, would you rather have an experienced doctor work on you on the operating table or a recent graduate with no actual surgery experience under his or her belt? its like telling a private to hop inside a tank or fighter jet and say go from point a to point b, while killing and maneuvering over/on enemy terrain. In real life Space Wolves don't exist. The amount of flaws thrown up trying to equate a real-life example to a fantasy space combat game set in the future are many and varied and hardly a solid basis for a discussion. I find it funny how you confuse my example by just throwing out the 'In real life Space Wolves don't exist' thank you for pointing that out, but I'm sure the majority of us already knew that. But I was just giving an example outside the whole warhammer 40K, fantasy, table top gaming element to go into a 'real life' example to extrapolate more on the subject. But like you said, you have your own ideology of the subject, its your own opinion while others have theirs. Theirs no point of going back and forth with people if their mindset is already set on something they believe to be right. We are just trying to better educate ourselves by finding whats reasonable and whats not. Have an ale on me! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/181280-how-wolfy-are-land-speeders/#findComment-2147070 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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