Space Wolf Tactica guide

[Toasterfree]

First I would like to say, that with the new codex we can create one of the NASTIEST home defense units in the game, just my opinion. But when you are trying to decide what special weapon you are going to place into your units, you need to think about what you want that unit to do, and what its role will be in your force.

 

So lets break down each weapon:

 

Melta Gun-

Strengths

A high strength, low AP assault weapon. Main purpose is close range anti-tank fire, with a secondary role that it can be used as anti-infantry. Good for assault against tanks or troops, does not get hot. Pretty much will kill what ever you are going to shoot at, and gets +1 to damage rolls.

Weakness

Low rate of fire (1). Very short range (12). Must be with in assault range of a tank/armor bearing model in order to maximize its armor penetration value.

 

Flamer-

Strengths

Good against horde armies, can cut a swathe in the enemy masses. No need to roll to hit. Comes in two different versions: light for foot infantry/assault units and heavy for terminators and dreadnoughts. Ignores cover.

Weakness

Very short range. Light flamer is the same profile as a bolt gun. Most effective against mass armies. Terminators get a save. Only good against the rear of enemy tanks, at least the heavy has a chance.

 

Plasmagun-

Strengths

High rate of fire, and high strength. Much like the melta gun you are probably going to kill what you shoot. has a very low AP value that cuts through terminators. Longer range then most other special shooting weapons for Marines. Can penetrate armor value 12.

Weakness

Gets hot. Rapid firing gives greater chance of getting hot. Rapid fire weapon, if fired means no charge.

 

So we see above that all of the weapons have a role. It is this that you must take into consideration when selecting a weapon to give to your unit. Being Space Wolves, we actually have the option (at max size for the unit) to be able to take two of these. Which sometimes can make the choice very easy, and again depending on the role of the unit which guns that you will be taking. Now we will define the roles of units, in a very generic fashion for these we will be assuming the selection of Grey Hunters, these principles apply to other units except for Skyclaws that may only have one speical weapon.

 

Assault-

A unit of Marines that are chosen as an assault force, should take weapons to maximize their ability to thin out the unit that they will be charging. Into this we look at what enemy we will be facing, and decide from that which weapon to take. For units that have a low armor save (meaning 3 or better) being able to take out a single man may be the difference. For this you would want a melta gun. If your enemy has a lot of transports then a melta is a great pick no matter what. If you are going to be fighting an army like say orcs, or eldar where their armor is weak (4 or worse) then a flamer might be in order. These forces usually have more models on the table, and being able to take out a large number of them in one shot seriously helps your survival. If a full sized unit of Marines is chosen (10 for GH and 15 for BC) then one of each a flamer and a melta should be chosen, this way you are flexible no matter the force that you will be facing.

 

Defense-

A unit of Marines that has been picked to sit back and defend an objective that is in their home deployment zone need to consider range and power more then anything. For this, the ideal weapon may be the trusty Plasma gun. However in a city fight scenario a Melta maybe more prudent. Again how ever, maxed size units (10/15) can take one of each and be equally ready. Having said this, the next consideration that a defending unit needs to take into account is the rate of fire. If you want to keep someone off of your home ground, you need to be able to put out enough fire, from both range and in close, that they will not want to get close at all. With this next criteria a plasma is the only real choice.

 

Mixed purpose-

Wolves being, in my own opinion, one of the most flexible Marines forces in the Imperium should be ready for all comers. A good balanced force on attack will be ready to both defend, and assault. The best special weapon load out for this is a plasma-, and depending on the opponent being faced, melta or flamer. Flamer for the massed forces, and a melta for those that have good armor. This will leave your units, again assuming that they are at a full size (10/15) ready for anything, and be able to do what they need to do.

 

Keep in mind that you replace your bolt gun with a plasma. So you can chance to the bolt pistol, fire that and go into assault. Leaving the plasma to use when you take the objective from the enemy and keeping your other assault weapon to fire as you move in for the kill.

 

I hope that this helps you newer players, and maybe even teach some of the older dogs newer tricks.

 

Toast.

 

 

A following post by me will discuss the options for units.

[MadMonk]

Very good write up on the weapons! Ale on me! :D I like to run one squad that has flamers other squad that packs melta's and a couple of small squads with plasma rifles. That way I most of my bases covered

[Toasterfree]

thanks man! i did that in about ten minutes to. i may have to do one on which units to take in what role.

[Valerian]

First I would like to say, that with the new codex we can create one of the NASTIEST home defense units in the game, just my opinion. But when you are trying to decide what special weapon you are going to place into your units, you need to think about what you want that unit to do, and what its role will be in your force.

 

Good thread Toast. I'll provide a few comments below.

 

 

Melta Gun-

Strengths

A high strength, low AP assault weapon. Main purpose is close range anti-tank fire, with a secondary role that it can be used as anti-infantry. Good for assault against tanks or troops, does not get hot. Pretty much will kill what ever you are going to shoot at, and gets +1 to armor penetration rolls.

Weakness

Low rate of fire (1). Very short range (12). Must be with in assault range of a tank/armor bearing model in order to maximize its armor penetration value.

 

Good analysis. In addition, because the primary use of this weapon is to destroy an Armoured Vehicle, you will want redundancy. If you can take two, then take two to dramatically increase your chances of affecting the target.

 

Flamer-

Strengths

Good against horde armies, can cut a swathe in the enemy masses. No need to roll to hit. Comes in two different versions: light for foot infantry/assault units and heavy for terminators and dreadnoughts. Ignores cover.

Weakness

Very short range. Light flamer is the same profile as a bolt gun. Most effective against mass armies. Terminators get a save. Only good against the rear of enemy tanks, at least the heavy has a chance.

 

I recommend discussing the regular Flamer and the Heavy Flamer seperately. They are very similar (obviously), but have enough differences to warrant a division. The most obvious difference is that the Heavy Flamer isn't available to most of your units (as you stated Terminators and Dreadnoughts only), so the regular Flamer is the only real alternative to the Melta Gun and Plasma Gun for most of your units. Since the regular Flamer is AP 5, the only units that it works really well for is against Imperial Guard and Orks. One note about Imperial Guard is that they are considerably weaker in close combat, so you probably don't really need the help of a Flamer to thin them out before charging them.

 

An additional drawback for the Flamer is that Blood Claws, Swift Claws and Sky Claws have to trade in their Bolt Pistol to get it, so that model loses a close combat attack in the trade.

 

Plasmagun-

Strengths

High rate of fire, and high strength. Much like the melta gun you are probably going to kill what you shoot. has a very low AP value that cuts through terminators. Longer range then most other special shooting weapons for Marines. Can penetrate armor value 12.

Weakness

Gets hot. Rapid firing gives greater chance of getting hot. Rapid fire weapon, if fired means no charge.

 

Unlike 4th edition where Rapid Firing actually increased the Gets Hot outcome chances (because a roll of either a 1 or a 2 on the d6 resulted in the event), in 5th edition you only Get Hot on the roll of a 1 on the d6; therefore there is no longer an increased chance of getting hot per shot. There are increased opportunities to Get Hot, because you can fire more shots, but no increased chance (i.e. percentage of likelihood). The whole point of having the weapon is to shoot it, so I don't consider the fact that you can fire the weapon twice to be an additional weakness of the weapon.

 

 

Just my couple of cents, well done though.

 

Valerian

[Toasterfree]

Thank you again for tuning into this thread. It is my desire to try and help new and old players alike to try and find the correct options to fill their needs. This guide is written mainly off of my ten years plus of war gaming experience, as well as my studies in military tactics and strategy. Most real life tactics do not translate well into the table top, but the principles remain the same.

 

This next guide will run down unit choices for the beginning general. Some of the options that are in the new codex will not be discussed, as I would like to keep this somewhat basic to where a new player can see what is being discussed, and if they like that option to be able to walk into their local game store and buy said unit. Without further delay, Unit choice tactica will begin:

 

Troops-

Space Wolves have only two choices for their basic troop choice, Grey Hunters and Blood Claws. Both have their strengths, uses, and unique options. The first thing to consider for a new Lord is to define the role of each unit. What I mean by this is:

• Shock Assault-a unit of Shock Assault troops goes into the enemy and uses either sheer numbers of troopers, or a vast number of attacks. This may include special weapons, or just a lot of people lending in many attacks.
  
• Anti-tank-An anti-tank unit takes weapons that are designed to take out armor (see weapon tactica above). This can include special close combat weapons as well as special shooting weapons. But their main job will be the destruction of armor.
  
• Defense-A unit who's role is to defend is going to sit on an objective, and keep it at all costs. They will select weapons that are best suited to this role, and will be mainly shooting special weapons (see weapon tactica above).
  
• Multipurpose-A multipurpose unit will combine two, or more, of the unit role types listed above. While it is not advised to try and mix more then two roles into a unit, it is possible.
  

 

Now I will break down for you the unit types, and which roles they would fit into best. Keep in mind that these are just suggested roles, but with the stat lines and weapons selections available to each unit, they are educated choices for each unit.

 

Grey Hunters-

Grey Hunters are the second longest serving Space Wolf. They, out of the troop choices for us, have the highest weapon and ballistic skill. They come stock with choices that make them an already well suited multipurpose unit, but with special weapon selections can become any of the roles above, or even maintain their multipurpose capability.

Shock Assault-

To make a shock assault Grey Hunter unit, a lord should elect to have a Mark of the Wolfen inside each pack. This one trooper can lay down enough attacks to cover two of his friends, making their numbers felt a bit more. Plus in his savagery, he can drag down the opponent with out mercy. To help and swing combat in favor, if needed, a Lord can also stick a power fist in a shock assault unit, which will give them the limited ability to take down armor, as well as the monsterous creatures that roam the universe. A unit with a power weapon is still just as deadly, and will in most cases tend to fit better into the shock assault category.

Anti-tank-

Anti-tank GH should first elect to take a meltagun, and if there are ten GHs then your free weapon should be another MG. This will give you two shots at tanks, and will be rightly feared by your opponent. Any tank, or vehicle that has an armor value that gets anywhere near this unit, should consider it self lucky to move away. For assault, should you need to, your close combat special weapon will be a powerfist. Mark of the Wolfen in this unit can be taken, he can provide yet some more assault support.

Defense-

A defensive unit of Grey Hunters should be no less then 10. And their special shooting weapons should be plasma guns. Along with the two plasma guns, you should upgrade yet another one to receive a plasma pistol. This will give you a feared 5 plasma shots at 12 inches. I would not take a special close combat weapon here, but if you did I would take a power weapon. It is my opinion that a defensive unit does not need a Mark of the Wolfen in it.

Multipurpose-

A multipurpose GH squad should pick at least two of the options above. If it is going to shock assault and defend, then you should select the options that suit those roles that were given above. This also proves true for any combination.

 

Blood Claws-

Blood Claws are our youngest Marines. They are new initiates into the Fang. They come already equipped for the Shock Assault, with the special weapon selections that are available to them they can morph into any of the roles, but only a few really suit them well.

Shock Assault-Coming already geared for this, there is little modification needed to be done. The only special weapon selection here that I would make for shooting would be the flamer, and if the unit numbers 15 take two. For close combat I would take just your standard power weapon.

Anti-tank-Again like the GH this unit should take two meltaguns at 15, as well as a power fist.

Defense-This is the hardest role for the BC to fill. Their low ballistic skill keeps them from being a really good defensive unit. But you should still arm them in the same manner as the GH

Multipurpose-a multipurpose BC unit MUST be no less then 15 men. And again just like their GH brothers combine the best aspects of the two roles that you want them to fill.

 

This was just another tactica in my series for the new Space Wolf Codex, thank you for reading this section. Next part in the series will be over the elites section.

[Brother Dano]

I'm brand new to the game so articles like this are very helpful. I am working on ideas for my army and plan to post my list for comment soon. Keep the articles coming!

 

I am aiming at eventually building a 2000 point Space Wolf army, inspired by the one in the latest White Dwarf (on page 56-57), although instead of all the special characters I might go for some special transport for the troops, like drop pods or Rhinos.

[Toasterfree]

your welcome! the elites one should come in the next day or so, and i may even include some pics in it

[Toasterfree]

Installment three in the series of Space Wolf tactica brings us to the elites section. As promised I will begin this section, however since there are two different types of units here, really three if you think about it, I am going to split it up into three sections. The reason for this is I feel that the Wolf guard deserve one of their own, since they are a very unique unit to the game, then we have Dreadnoughts, and the scouts and lone wolf.

The first unit that I want to tackle is the Wolf Guard. Everyone loves this unit! They are the most flexible unit in the Space Wolves arsenal, and as such have the most options that they can use. To start with this unit, I will continue from the last installment of infantry roles, just because they can be taken as an infantry unit.

 

Wolf Guard -

Wolf Guard are the veterans of the Wolves forces. From here one could rise to become a Wolf Lord or a Battle Leader if they are selected for that honor. Being the cream of the crop in power armor, the WG have been given the best selection of gear of all the units. Such variety is their panoply that they have access to even the revered Tactical Dreadnought Armor (TDA). Along with the Grey Hunters, the Wolf Guard can fit any of the infantry roles, and even bolster a unit in theirs, bringing either better armor and weapons to the fight, or both. For your shooting weapon on the shock assault, assault cannons and heavy flamers for your TDA wearers.

Shock Assault -

As a shock assault unit they can have the best of all power weapons, the rightfully feared frost blade. But can also be armed with wolf claws, power fists, thunder hammers, and even storm shields to provide the best of protection from both shooting and the enemies attacks in melee. You could upgrade one to receive the Mark of the Wolfen, but you would be hampering his effectiveness. And upgrade to Arjac the Rockfist would make any unit of Wolf Guard rightfully feared on the assault. Be warned however that this unit with full close combat kit would be very pricey on the army list, but would surely take out any other unit that it met in combat. Of course the entire unit in TDA would bring fear right away.

Anti-tank -

In the anti-tank role, you could arm every Wolf Guard with a combi-melta. Which if you did would provide you with not only bolt guns still, but also a melta on each and every Guard. This however may not be the most prudent choice, as an upgrade to Arjac would be a very useful tool with a strength 10 shooting attack. A good amount (I would say between 2 and 4 combi-meltas) will bring fear to the enemy. For your close combat special weapons, Thunder Hammers and Power fists are what you would want to bring, and again I would say use the same guidelines for your combi-meltas. I would also consider bringing in a 10 man unit two Guard in TDA with cyclone missiles.

Defense

Again my suggestion for defensive units is high strength and rate of fire weapons. Much like in the anti-tank role, you could bring everyone with a combi-plasma. Which probably would be a good choice, but you would not want to fire them all in one turn. But I would not bring ten combi-plasma in one unit, 3 or 4 here would be optimum. Much like in the anti-tank role you can bring two Guards in TDA, for defensive fire the Assault Cannon here is great. For a defensive unit, Arjac would not be a good choice, he is much better suited to an attacking role. For special close combat weapons I would load down the same numbers that have your plasmas with wolf claws or power weapons. This idea follows much of the same principle as the Grey Hunters.

Multi-purpose -

A multipurpose Wolf Guard is very easy to do. Since you are not limited to the combi-weapons that you can take, in a 10 man unit I would take at least two of each between melta and plasma. I would upgrade two to wear TDA and give one an assault cannon and one the cyclone missile launcher. Arjac here is a very solid choice. His high strength on the assault lends him very well to gain an objective and then maintain it. For the troopers that do not have and special shooting weapons, and even if they did, you can upgrade the rest to carry a variety of special close combat weapons, an even distribution of frost blades, power fists, and thunder hammers here gives you a wide range of ability in combat.

 

Those would be the way that I would build units to fit into the standard infantry roles that I described in the last edition. And how you can bolster the units that you created out of the troops it to take a small number of Wolf Guard, and attach them to those units (and any unit that they may allowed to attach to, see the codex for a list of units). Keep in mind that you can still field a wolf guard infantry unit even after splitting them off to others, and to fit in the roles here you would need to add the number of weapons that you are going to lose, i.e. if you were going to split some wolf guard off to a defensive Grey Hunters unit you would need to add 1 combi-plasma to your wolf guard unit to compensate for this loss.

[Toasterfree]

Space Wolves Tactica insallment- Dreadnoughts

Thank you again for those that are following this section. Today I bring to you a rundown of dreadnoughts. This will be the first time I include and special characters because I feel that mentioning Bjorn here is worth the note, as well as presenting the tactical choices that can be made with him.

I want to start by saying that Dreadnoughts need to be thought more of when selecting the role that they will play in your army even more than most of the choices that you have. They can fit very similar roles to your infantry based units, as well as providing heavy weapons fire, and hard to beat hand to hand combat ability, which is where the choices come in at. The roles I like to think of my dreadnoughts in are:

 

Anti-tank (heavy)

Anti-tank (light)

Anti-personnel (close assault)

Anti-personnel (ranged)

 

Much like the other roles that units can play in you can outfit your dreadnought to fit a multiple set of roles, however this is possibly the first unit that you will see where using that multipurpose role will actually hurt some of the effectiveness that it may have. The only example where you can maintain close combat effectiveness will be illustrated in each role, save the heavy anti-tank role which you will see below.

 

Anti-tank (heavy)

 

For this configuration to take maximum advantage of a heavy anti-tank role lascannon and missile launchers are in order. This gives you heavy fire from range, and allows you to punch a hole into even the thickest of armors. If you were to drop your dreadnought in, your heavy anti-tank weapon is the multimelta. The short range nature of the multimelta however would place your mobile fire support platform in danger of being assaulted, or even hit with a multimelta its self. If you had a high profile heavy tank, such as a Land Raider, that would give you problems this would give you a quick solution to it, but again you would possibly lose a valuable unit fairly quickly.

 

Anti-tank (light)

 

For the light anti-tank role, which due to the nature of the weapons on it can also fill an anti-personnel role, is a very flexible choice. The main right arm weapon for this would be twin-linked autocannons. This gives you anti-tank capability up to armor 13, but you are most effective against light amor (no higher than 12) and a left arm weapon choice can remain a missile launcher. However you can also put on another twin autocannon to provide massed fire against transports as well as infantry. If you chose to leave the close combat weapon, the storm bolter is a better choice here, as you’re not going to want to get this close, and that gives you an anti-personnel weapon choice.

 

Anti-personnel (close range)

 

For the close ranged AP role, assault cannons and heavy flamers on your dreadnought CCW arm are best. And the best way to get your dread this close to be effective is to put it in a drop pod and drop it in front of a large body of troops, or even a light transport. If no drop pod then you should move it through cover. To take maximum effect of its close combat abilities, give it a Wolf Tooth Necklace so that it may also take out high weapon skill units with ease.

 

Anti-personnel (ranged)

 

This load out can be very similar, and in fact pretty much the same, as the light anti-tank arms. But the main difference is to maintain the best effective method of being anti-personnel is to have close combat effectiveness, so for this you want to leave on your CCW. The choice between the heavy flamer and the storm bolter is yours to make. For the ranged aspect I would leave use auto cannons as the assault cannon has a much shorter range, but if you like the fact that it can take out guys without a save then go with that, but I think that you would find that the extra shot or two of the auto cannon would be more effective.

 

Here is your dreadnought basic load out tactica. With that being said, the choice between a venerable and a regular dreadnought is yours to make. If you have the points for a venerable, then take it for the higher stats, otherwise stay with the lower stats and cost regular dreadnought. If you are going for fluff the choice is simple, take the venerable as the Space Wolves are the original creators of it.

[El Scotcho]

Very good. I think this should be stickied. It'll save on all of the new(er than me) pups questions.

[Baru]

Good call, even though most of it ain't that hard to think of yourself after some experience it's good for the newer players to read this so they will have less questions later on. I do have a few things to add though, but I'll post it later in the evening when I've read the whole thing more thoroughly. Maybe we should also expand also advice to how certain units work best in certain play style's. A pred in a drop podding army for example a no go. And even though wolf scouts have a good choice of options only a select few are really handy if you want them to be effective.

[Toasterfree]

wait till all the sections are out. the fast attack is going to be a detailed one as well as heavy support. after i have all the unit selection choices out, i will be a army tactica that will link all of them. C&C for now in individual sections is welcome. and yes this is meant for a beginning player, and beginner wolves alike, since i am a wolf player I am centering this mostly around them, but all the principles can be applied to ANY army in the game.

[Master Commander Ajax]

Thanks for the great articles toasterfree. Im a beginner when it comes to space wolf lists and your writings are helping me out a lot.

[Toasterfree]

Great! your the reason that I am doing this, friday you should see a double post (maybe) for the rest of the elites and the beginning of the fast attacks. FA and HVY will be split much like the elites have been. final elite will cover the IP scouts and LW

[Vlk]

excellent work, toaster

[DapperDave]

Melta Gun-

Strengths

A high strength, low AP assault weapon. Main purpose is close range anti-tank fire, with a secondary role that it can be used as anti-infantry. Good for assault against tanks or troops, does not get hot. Pretty much will kill what ever you are going to shoot at, and gets +1 to armor penetration rolls.

Weakness

Low rate of fire (1). Very short range (12). Must be with in assault range of a tank/armor bearing model in order to maximize its armor penetration value.

 

I think you may be confusing this "+1 to armor penetration rolls" with the +1 to the vehicle damage chart for being ap 1.

[Redbaron997]

I would say the cyclone launcher would be a superior weapon for wolf guard in TDA over the assault cannon, for the reason that it can also target tanks, in addition to hordes, and has a longer range (also you get to keep your storm bolter)

[Toasterfree]

I would say the cyclone launcher would be a superior weapon for wolf guard in TDA over the assault cannon, for the reason that it can also target tanks, in addition to hordes, and has a longer range (also you get to keep your storm bolter)

in a defensive roll to force your opponent back the assault cannon i feel is a better choice, it can take out multiple targets, and against a horde army will take out more on the average then a cyclone. and you cna mix and match them to fit into another unit like say GH to give them flexiblity. While I am not ruling out cyclones, I am fitting them into a more specific roll. taking a full size WG unit you can always take both to fill the multipurpose roll.

 

Melta Gun-

Strengths

A high strength, low AP assault weapon. Main purpose is close range anti-tank fire, with a secondary role that it can be used as anti-infantry. Good for assault against tanks or troops, does not get hot. Pretty much will kill what ever you are going to shoot at, and gets +1 to armor penetration rolls.

Weakness

Low rate of fire (1). Very short range (12). Must be with in assault range of a tank/armor bearing model in order to maximize its armor penetration value.

 

I think you may be confusing this "+1 to armor penetration rolls" with the +1 to the vehicle damage chart for being ap 1.

thank you and fixed.

[WG Vrox]

Nice work Toaster, very handy info for all wolf brothers.

 

Vrox

[Volth]

Since the regular Flamer is AP 5, the only units that it works really well for is against Imperial Guard and Orks.

I don't think so, flamers can be valuable against Marines also. Well, my English sucks and I am not very eloquent that early in the morning, so I let the math do my talking:

 

Flamer against MEq (hitting 3): 1/2 (chance of getting a wound) * 1/3 (chance of getting through armour) = 9/18 (overall chance of gettig the kill) = 50%

 

Plasma Gun against MEq: 2/3 (chance of getting a hit) * 5/6 (chance of getting a wound) = 10/18 = 55,6%

 

Flamer against MEq (hitting 4): 1/2 * 1/3 = 12/18 = 66,7%

 

Plasma Gun against MEq (rapid fire): 2/3 * 5/6 * 2 (number of shots fired) = 20/18 = 111%

 

Flamer against MEq (hitting 7): 1/2 * 1/3 = 21/18 = 116,7%

 

 

I tried to show it as clear, as possible, but ..questions?

 

Ps: And ..really neat work Toasterfree! May your jar never dry!

[Toasterfree]

Since the regular Flamer is AP 5, the only units that it works really well for is against Imperial Guard and Orks.

I don't think so, flamers can be valuable against Marines also. Well, my English sucks and I am not very eloquent that early in the morning, so I let the math do my talking:

 

Flamer against MEq (hitting 3): 1/2 (chance of getting a wound) * 1/3 (chance of getting through armour) = 9/18 (overall chance of gettig the kill) = 50%

 

Plasma Gun against MEq: 2/3 (chance of getting a hit) * 5/6 (chance of getting a wound) = 10/18 = 55,6%

 

Flamer against MEq (hitting 4): 1/2 * 1/3 = 12/18 = 66,7%

 

Plasma Gun against MEq (rapid fire): 2/3 * 5/6 * 2 (number of shots fired) = 20/18 = 111%

 

Flamer against MEq (hitting 7): 1/2 * 1/3 = 21/18 = 116,7%

 

 

I tried to show it as clear, as possible, but ..questions?

 

Ps: And ..really neat work Toasterfree! May your jar never dry!

My intent is not to discourage other from taking the weapons that they want, but to illustrate that there are weapons that are many times more effective. Its not an attempt to say that flamers cannot kill marines, just that plasma and melta guns do it a lot better. i think your math is a bit wrong, as I have flamed10 marines before, and only got 1. i never trust statical figures when playing a game that has random results every game, you COULD kill all 7 with a flame shot, talking about marines of course, or you know you WILL kill two with plasma/melta guns and then dump in bolter/bolt pistol fire on top of this and have a bigger impact as there are greater chances then that you will drop more then one prior to an assault.

 

and let me also breakout some mathhammer here for your 7 hit by a flamer example.

with a flamer there is no need to roll to hit=6

you wound on a 4+, so 3 sides will give you a success=3

the die, so you fail, on 2 sides=2

result is (6*3*2)/216=.166*7=1.16 (the seven there is the number of hits)

 

rapid plasma

marines hit on a 3+, so four sides give you success=4

you wound on a 2+, so 5 sides give you success=5

marines do not get a save, so fail 100%=6

(4*5*6)/216=.558*4=2.222 (the 4 is the number of shots you fired)

 

so it seems that the plasma is still the better weapon, as you are going to drop most of the time two marines, if not all four, where with 7 hit by a flamer, you may kill 1

[Mammon]

Agree. Statistics can predict the odds but not the outcomes. A notion that experience constantly reinforces in my mind. If you hit the marine, you will likely wound the marine with the plasma/melta, if you wound him you are assuredly going to kill him if he isn't in cover, even then he will have a 4+ save or worse as opposed to a 3+.

[Toasterfree]

Agree. Statistics can predict the odds but not the outcomes. A notion that experience constantly reinforces in my mind. If you hit the marine, you will likely wound the marine with the plasma/melta, if you wound him you are assuredly going to kill him if he isn't in cover, even then he will have a 4+ save or worse as opposed to a 3+.

there is a lot to say when you can tell your opponent, hey 3 guys are DEAD! D-E-D dead! (endless ale for someone who can tell me the movie reference)

[hilander]

there is a lot to say when you can tell your opponent, hey 3 guys are DEAD! D-E-D dead! (endless ale for someone who can tell me the movie reference)

 

spawn: I love the smell of burning asphalt in the morning....

[maznaz]

Agree. Statistics can predict the odds but not the outcomes. A notion that experience constantly reinforces in my mind. If you hit the marine, you will likely wound the marine with the plasma/melta, if you wound him you are assuredly going to kill him if he isn't in cover, even then he will have a 4+ save or worse as opposed to a 3+.

 

I'm sorry but that's just nonsense. Your gut feeling about what's likely to happen is clouded by factors that statistical probability rightfuly ignore.

 

Of course statistics don't give accurate results every time, but to say your instinct gives better results than statistical probability is just being ignorant.